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  1.    #1  
    i have a t-mobile sidekick, and it's nothing but a useless toy. i also have phone service with sprint.

    i wish to cancel service with one or the other and switch to the treo 600.

    my question is: what are the pros/cons of getting the treo 600 on sprint vs. t-mobile?

    i really would like one device. if possible and network speed, and network reliability are my main concerns.

    thanks.
    Usual Suspects Entertainment
    We make the crowd move.
    www.djnyce.com
  2. #2  
    Originally posted by franknitty69
    i have a t-mobile sidekick, and it's nothing but a useless toy. i also have phone service with sprint.

    i wish to cancel service with one or the other and switch to the treo 600.

    my question is: what are the pros/cons of getting the treo 600 on sprint vs. t-mobile?

    i really would like one device. if possible and network speed, and network reliability are my main concerns.

    thanks.
    This subject has already been beat to death here. The net is that the choice depends upon where you want to be able to use it. Choose Sprint if they have good signal in your home area and you do not travel internationally. Otherwise choose T-Mobile.
  3. #3  
    Originally posted by franknitty69
    if possible and network speed, and network reliability are my main concerns.
    I would choose the GSM version, though I haven't yet seen a review of it. I'm not impressed with the Sprint 600's battery life. From what I've been able to ascertain it is nearly the same as the 300, about a day with good signal levels.
  4. #4  
    Originally posted by potatoho

    I would choose the GSM version, though I haven't yet seen a review of it. I'm not impressed with the Sprint 600's battery life. From what I've been able to ascertain it is nearly the same as the 300, about a day with good signal levels.
    I'm a very loyal Sprint customer. And moving to DC for my new career, unfortunately, my Treo300 can't even get a signal in the building. I wonder if T-Mo will be any different. When the first pics of the Treo600 came out, I was in love with the silver version. The Sprint black is only OKAY. But hey, potatoho, why do you think the battery life on the Sprint 600 is the same as the 300 and that the T-Mo version is better?

    Honestly, I think if number portability was in effect NOW, I'd make the switch. Because MANY of my contacts depend on my number. But this law isn't in effect, right? When does it come into effect? Seems like no one knows. That's not very good.
  5. #5  
    Originally posted by strongbad



    Honestly, I think if number portability was in effect NOW, I'd make the switch. Because MANY of my contacts depend on my number. But this law isn't in effect, right? When does it come into effect? Seems like no one knows. That's not very good.
    Number portability for cellular goes into effect next month.

    I am both a Sprint customer and a T-mobile customer. I will buy the GSM version, unlocked. While I like the idea of CDMA, I am not impressed with the implementation. I like both the idea and the implementation of GSM.
  6. #6  
    Originally posted by strongbad
    But hey, potatoho, why do you think the battery life on the Sprint 600 is the same as the 300 and that the T-Mo version is better?
    Lots of reasons:

    My friend has one for his work (CDMA version), and he says it lasts about a day. I don't think they use it all that much either.

    So many screenshots of the Sprint version have the battery icon at least at half-way drained. Many of the screenshots have a time of day on them and they are either AM or barely into afternoon.

    The Sprint 600 has an Airprime radio. Call me superstitious but my 300's Airprime radio is a wad of junk. Yeah it's a later radio version in the 600, but come on, you know it has some flavor of the same firmware or code authors. These are the people who can't fix the 300's turbo drain etc. I vote "no confidence" in that team.

    I also have a GSM phone (t-mobile sidekick) and despite its horrible reception, it has never ever given me pause about battery longevity. I think GSM is almost immune to turbo drain due to coverage, whereas CDMA has been just awful in all of my phones/devices; i.e. You put the phone in your pocket and it gets real hot or something. Plus, I had 4 calls the other day where I could hear them, but they couldn't hear me.

    I could go on and on. Too much drama on this thing. Recently I've been getting the 0x1102 errors, and for 3 hours tonight I couldn't connect. I'm thinking that may get worse and worse due to congestion in my area and a rickety tower or something, and no way would I want a 600 with 0x1102 errors.

    And I've had it with that darned radio eating my keypresses. Somewhere in their stupid firmware they are doing a delay loop and eating events that they shouldn't be. I actually have to turn off the radio to play a game! And I've had several 300's, they are all like that, it's endemic to the signal recovery algorithm they use.
  7. #7  
    > ...Somewhere in their stupid firmware they are doing a delay
    > loop and eating events that they shouldn't be...

    Event-based programming with all its accompanying critical sections et al is one of the harder things to get right anywhere - they aren't necessarily doing a busy-loop, they simply could be locking out one event during another event's processing.

    But in any case, loss of event IS the result!
  8. #8  
    Originally posted by SeldomVisitor
    Event-based programming with all its accompanying critical sections et al is one of the harder things to get right anywhere - they aren't necessarily doing a busy-loop, they simply could be locking out one event during another event's processing.

    But in any case, loss of event IS the result!
    At first I thought it might be losing the keys, like a missed interrupt or something. But then I noticed strange behavior during games that makes me believe they are simply handling the events when they shouldn't; i.e. running an event loop during background processing. The event loop is only for the foreground app in the Palm architecture.

    When the 300 goes into network search, i.e. the light starts flashing red, or just prior, I usually notice a little "stall" in whatever I'm doing. And about 4 out of 5 times if I am IM chatting or making a memo entry, it will drop a character. That could be explained by a missing interrupt or something.

    But check this out.. if I am playing a game which uses the hard buttons for movement, for example Boxer (a Sokoban clone), it will wind up performing the regular hard button function rather than the game movement at those "stall" times. So in the middle of a game it will launch another app etc. That is handled in SysHandleEvent().

    The normal design for an app that uses hard buttons, is to watch for them and make sure they don't get passed to SysHandleEvent(). Since Boxer works fine without the radio on, I am making the assumption that one of the radio's network search routines is doing a mini event-loop and passing events into SysHandleEvent().
  9.    #9  
    sorry if this topic has already been touched on. i thought that since the treo is so new that there would be limited discussion on this topic.

    but thanks for all your replices. i think i'll keep both, when the number port act goes into effect i'll take my number with me to t-mobile and get a gsm treo 600 (price will hopefully be down by that time).

    thanks.
    Usual Suspects Entertainment
    We make the crowd move.
    www.djnyce.com
  10. #10  
    It looks like the Treo 600 CDMA will be out for a little while before the GSM version. This should be enough time to get a lot of feedback on the battery. It's definitely a bigger battery and it's rated better at 7 days of standby time. I'd be surprised if you didn't get 3-4 standby with a little use.

    You can't tell from the trade show pictures. First you don't know when they are charged. Second you don't know how much they are being used. I'd assume that they are used almost 100% of the time. I wouldn't be surprised if that's 2 hours of talk/data time by noon.
  11.    #11  
    the suggested stand by times are better than my t-mobile sidekick. after a full nights charge, it's on 3/4. (and that's with no phone calls, just aol, send/receive email, and sms.

    i've read that the cdma networks are faster while the gsm provides better battery life.

    i just wish the treo was available so that i could get a first hand look.
    Usual Suspects Entertainment
    We make the crowd move.
    www.djnyce.com
  12. #12  
    Originally posted by franknitty69
    i wish to cancel service with one or the other and switch to the treo 600.

    my question is: what are the pros/cons of getting the treo 600 on sprint vs. t-mobile?

    i really would like one device. if possible and network speed, and network reliability are my main concerns.

    thanks.
    It looks like you live in Columbus. I would recommend T-Mobile over Sprint in Columbus. We recently did a competitive analysis there, and T-Mobile did much better than Sprint. The analysis was of the voice network only, not data, and included coverage, call quality and dropped calls.

    In our Columbus test:
    Verizon>Cingular TDMA>T-Mobile>ATT GSM>Sprint>Cingular GSM

    We did not test Nextel, and I believe ATT does not have their own TDMA network in Columbus (roam on Cingular?).
  13. jngai's Avatar
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    #13  
    What it really comes down to is how good is the service in your own house. I have the tmo sidekick for over 1 yr now and I must say the service is terrible in my own house. I thought tmo was the prob, so I got another phone from at&t. But it was the same result. Now I know for sure its GSM. I live in NYC and GSM usually is ok w/ several dead spots (outdoors, not because of inside buildings). But the fact that I get zilcho reception in my house means I have to drop it for good. Good thing the tmo contract is just up and I think I can switch to TDMA for AT&T.


    I had Sprint b4 all this and I must say their service was pretty good. Got decent coverage in my house, although the voice quality is not "all digitial" like they claimed. I gave that fone to my mom but now I will have to switch the AT&T w/ her. But it seems Sprint is not giving much discount to existing customer, so I might have to drop Sprint and just ask my sister or a friend to use their name to sign up for Sprint to get the new customer discount.

    I might just wait for LNP in November because I want to keep my #s. Sprint might also changed their mind on giving discount to only new customers. I also don't want to be a guinea pig like I was w/ the Sidekick. They promise the world and simply didn't deliver. Not to mention the tons of bugs. The Treo 600 is definitely a refined product, but I don't think it can hurt to wait a month for some other ppl test out the product first.

    The only thing bad that can happen is if they ran out. But from my experience w/ the SK, they don't run out that quickly. It is a niche product. And considering how the SK went (initial shipment cleared out, but 2nd shipment came within 2 weeks, with every tmo store only getting a 5 - 10 in initial shipment, but 25+ in 2nd shipment. The tmo stores had a hard time moving them out the 2nd shipment, w/ many sitting around for 2 months+. It wasn't until early April that they were either moved out or shipped back in anticpation for Color Sidekick.) its even less likely that the Treo 600 will run out since its price point is 3x (4x of orig compusa sidekick sale).

    Unlike some other ppl that complain about price, I have no prob in paying $600+. I saved up since Cebit America when they first shown the product (I saw it in person). But to pay such a steep price w/ no guarantee from HS that this is their final product and they are not releasing a Hi-Res model several months from now can be devastating.

    Just think, pay $600+ (device + tax + shipping) only to find out that HS is releasing a Hi-Res model in Q1 04 for the same price while they drop current model to 1/2 price. If someone is willing to pay $1200+ for both current and minor upgrade, be my guest. But I can see that money better spent elsewhere.

    One thing I learned from having a Sidekick and following the Treo 600 is that the wireless providers dictate how the fone will turn out. That was the reason why the color sidekick came out. Danger never thought of releasing color so soon but the wireless providers insisted. So if the wireless providers insist on a Hi-Res model, I can guarantee you that a Hi-Res model will be out in under 6-8 months.




    P.S. For ppl that are worried about battery life, did u forget about the battery pack add-on? I would give anything to have service over battery life. What good is a fone w/ no signal (GSM in my house)? So if anyone is considering giving a green light to GSM even though u know the signal is shoddy in your neck of the woods, You should seriously reconsider....
  14. #14  
    Originally posted by jngai
    P.S. For ppl that are worried about battery life, did u forget about the battery pack add-on? I would give anything to have service over battery life. What good is a fone w/ no signal (GSM in my house)? So if anyone is considering giving a green light to GSM even though u know the signal is shoddy in your neck of the woods, You should seriously reconsider....
    I sorta fit into that category. It's a tough decision.. with Sprint I do get a signal at my house, but it is too marginal for voice usage. With GSM and the sidekick I get a very weak (still unusable) t-mobile signal and a stronger at&t signal. I have had others with GSM phones come here and they are able to make calls, so with the Treo 600 GSM it may work just fine.

    For me it boils down to how well the phone handles weak signal areas. I've had enough of Sprint, in that when signal fades all of the phones seem to go nuts and can be dead within a short time. I've had that happen a lot on my Treo 300 and it is unacceptable.
  15. #15  
    i really would like one device. if possible and network speed, and network reliability are my main concerns.
    Broadly speaking, if network speed (I take that to mean data) is a top priority, you should probably get Sprint.

    The key is - does it work where you go the most? If you have a Sprint phone already, you should have a good feel for this. Does it work at your house, at your office and in between? Does it work at your favorite bar, restaurants where you hang out, the local Best Buy?

    If so, Sprint is hands-down the winner. If not, you'll have to do some comparison shopping.

    Assuming that all carriers provided a strong signal everywhere, Sprint would be your best choice, since it has the best data service. $15/month gives you unlimited data at up to 144 kbps anywhere there is a digital Sprint signal in the U.S. (Real-world speeds will probably be less than 144, but still faster than the competition.)
  16.    #16  
    [QUOTE]Originally posted by jngai
    [B]What it really comes down to is how good is the service in your own house.QUOTE]

    i wish i was able to tell. my only exposure to t-mobile has been the sidekick and i refuse to use that as a measurement of t-mobile service.

    i love sprint's coverage, i get a signal 93% of the time, and i'm a mover and a shaker. i just want to keep my options open for the treo 600 because i have t-mobile and sprint.

    every phone that's not a sidekick seems to have better battery life than the sk. i'm just concerned with the cost of the data plans and service (signal).
    Usual Suspects Entertainment
    We make the crowd move.
    www.djnyce.com
  17. #17  
    Originally posted by jngai
    Good thing the tmo contract is just up and I think I can switch to TDMA for AT&T.

    .
    All carriers are going to have holes in their network, but I question the logic of moving "backwards" to a TDMA device. As far as I know, TDMA is dead and none of the carriers are building out TDMA. The TDMA carriers (Cingular and ATT) and all switching to their "next generation" GSM network. So hopefully you will see improved GSM coverage in the future. Also, I dont think TDMA supports data (at least ATT in ATL did not support data). And the Treo600 will never work on TDMA. I think that ATT & Cingular have a few phones that are TDMA/GSM combo phones, but none are very cool and none are the Treo600.
    Carl
  18. #18  
    Originally posted by potatoho

    For me it boils down to how well the phone handles weak signal areas. I've had enough of Sprint, in that when signal fades all of the phones seem to go nuts and can be dead within a short time. I've had that happen a lot on my Treo 300 and it is unacceptable.
    I also live in a marginal Sprint signal area. However, none of the GSM carriers can get ANY signal in my house. (funny cause I live in the middle of a large metro area, but I also live in the shadow of a small mountain and I guess all the towers are on the other side). I can get a Sprint signal, but I can not move around the house too much. However, I never expereince the same issues you describe with weak signals (with my Treo300). In the evenings or weekends, my phone is more of a pager anyway and I just need to know if a customer needs some support and I can receive text message just fine.
    Carl
  19.    #19  
    speaking of att, why do they have like 97 phones on their website? sprint only have like 10, and t-mobile and verizion about 20.

    i was kinda impressed. i don't have any experience with them as far as service is concerned so should this topic have been sprint vs. t-mobile vs. att?

    thanks.

    btw, i am really getting alot of useful information from your replies.
    Usual Suspects Entertainment
    We make the crowd move.
    www.djnyce.com

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