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  1. purpleX
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    #41  
    Originally posted by gfunkmagic

    M$ dominate the world you say?! Well they haven't successly done so in pdas, smartphones, or game consoles have they? The truth is that none of the ancillary divisions of M$ besides the Windows of Office unit make money for M$. Yes, they got $40 B in cash so they can be patient. But that doesn't mean the competition will lie down and surrender! Btw, Nokia has a pretty big stash as well FYI...
    Nokia might give a good fight, but Palmie1 and HS are goners. It's just a matter of when. In fact I have to say your idea about Palm jsut give up and roll over is pretty good one. lol.

    Also, of course M$ can find asian ODM whipping boy for its uses! But every freakin body uses these ODM's to manufacture handsets! That's not original and the ODM's don't have necessary brand that M$ craves to do battle with Nokia. The point is M$ wants to treat these ODM's like PC clone makers which struggle to make margins while BG rakes up profits in OS monopoly. This standard wintel model won't work on mobiles b/c the market is to stratified and segmented and handset OEMs don't need M$ OS to run their phones while wireless providers don't want to give M$ control on content delivery.
    what's wrong with PC clone maker? In fact company like Acer, chi mei, Asus etc are deeply tied to PC clone business. They understand the margin, and they survive on those harsh environment. Making handset in fact is a better business than the regular PC industry grind. It's absolutely nonsense to say that PC desktop model won't work in phone business. Handphone is just another general purpose computer with radio attached to it. Why should Nokia make all the phone when Asus can make better phone?

    Read it again. Sendo lawsuit was specifically targeted against intell claims on Stinger. Yes, Sendo and M$ made a settlement afterwards, but I never said the $40B wasn't useful to them. And oh yeah, M$ never steals intell ideas from others!
    gah, the lawsuit is still on going, who knows how it'll end up. You can believe all you want, but it's the court that will hand the judgment.


    Rumors shumors. There's only confirmation of the SGH, that's the point of rumors! Btw, my rumors are just as good as your claims! LOL! Btw, don't get to uppity cuz M$ finally got Motorola! Sheesh! It's just ONE Oem afterall. Lets see how many M$ smartphones they release vs. linux and UIQ. They already said their focus is on cross platform Java implementation long term. What runtime envirionment will M$ use on smartphone anyway?...
    Hah! my rumor is always better than yours pal.. (well okay most of the time ) But seriously, I have no idea what's the Motorola story, I think it has something to do with cross investment and tech cooperation too. Motorola has been hurting pretty bad in the past years, they need a new block buster desperately. With the way Symbian is going, Motorola will never win against Nokia. So yeah, I think Microsoft timing with Motorola is pretty incredible. Moto reportedly to have a group of product instead of one product line, including PPC. That's pretty mind boggling to me. But will Motorola turns exclusively to Microsoft OS? I doubt it, they are big company with huge product portofolio. But I suspect from now on Motorola will be Microsoft's point man in US smartphone market. What dell does for microsoft enterprise computing, will be what motorola is for microsoft phone strategy in enterprise.

    Let's just say, treo is pickled already in enterprise market.

    Yeah, I agree they need more lisencees in the future but why U smackin the small lisecnees. Please, M$ has it's Alaska Cove's and Dolphins as well. Motorola used to be PalmOS lisencee back in the day, but that was a long time ago. Maybe SE in the future? Who knows... [/B]
    Motorola never made any POS product, get real, their development collapsed. Then they decided to go symbian.

    Sony Erricson doing POS phone? yeah right.... I'll eat my short if it ever happens.
  2. #42  
    Originally posted by mcyang


    I think that you are talking about the OS4 and old processors. The Palm OS5/6 ARM Xcale processor PDAs are actually outperform the PPC based on the same processors.
    Actually that was my point. Speed and memory size are not that important on Palm OS, especially with the newer versions and expanstion memory.

    PPC needs to keep getting faster because its apps are so freakin' big and resource hungry. My Docs to Go, Hours Pro and Big Clock run just fine on OS 3.5. I don't use my Palm as a Gameboy so I don't miss the ARM too much.

    That said, I am so anxious to get the 600 that I am about to wet my pants.
  3. #43  
    Nokia might give a good fight, but Palmie1 and HS are goners. It's just a matter of when. In fact I have to say your idea about Palm jsut give up and roll over is pretty good one. lol.
    If the great tech meltdown, the virtual halt in IT spending, m$ deep pockets and determination, and the recession didn't bring "Palmie1" down, they aren't going down IMO. Particularly with their strategic re-alliance with Handspring. With the interest in the new Treo, consumer confidence and spending on the rebound, the holiday season approaching, and an improved stock market, Palm1 will see a much brighter future going forward.

    ...just one guy's opinion....
    "I refuse to answer that question on the grounds that I don't know the answer."
  4. #44  
    Originally posted by Cyril


    Samsung's already got a Palm OS phone coming up, and Sony makes dozens of Palm OS PDAs, so is it really that hard to use some imagination.

    All our phones now are science fiction if you were living in 1998!
    You said "All our phones now are science fiction if you were living in 1998!"

    That is really true and a profound point!!!

    Jake
    There is a great difference between knowing and understanding. You can know a lot about something without understanding it. —Charles Kettering
    -------------------------------------------------
    Treo 600: Love at First Sight by Jake Ehrlich

    Thoughts on the Future of Handheld Computing: A 5 Part Series by Jake Ehrlich
  5. #45  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    Sony Erricson doing POS phone? yeah right.... I'll eat my short if it ever happens.
    Have to agree with purple on this one. Remember Sony and Sony Ericsson are two different companies. Sony Ericsson is a major shareholder in Symbian.
  6. RStall's Avatar
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       #46  
    Originally posted by gfunkmagic


    WHAT!! Please don't post if you don't know what you're talking about. Real has a free PalmOS mp3 player for months now and why they heck should Palmsource force a "unified" mp3 player down the throats of all uers?! Furthermore, there's about a dozen differrent options out there besides Treomail. If you'ld done a simple search you wouls ave known that. Secondly, why are you comparing a push email solution to pocket outlook anyway? That makes no sense period! Sheesh!
    i see someone is getting a bit defensive!! LOL dont know about you but i like the idea of my OS being able to play AV multimedia instead of me having to download software. Furthermore, if you had pocket outlook, you wouldnt need another mail client. Plus who the hell said there wasnt other email clients out there?? We all know about snappermail. Oh by the way how much is snappermail compared to pocket outlook?? LOL Plus im comparing an email solution to an email solution period.

    Bottom line man, the smartphone 2002 is turn key with quality software. I can take it out the box and immediately start syncing mp3s, and recording videoclips...
  7. BNelson's Avatar
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    #47  
    Originally posted by RStall

    Bottom line man, the smartphone 2002 is turn key with quality software. I can take it out the box and immediately start syncing mp3s, and recording videoclips...
    Yes, you can immediately sync MP3's and video's with Smartphone 2002, but the usability is barely there. MP3's play great on my SPV, but Windows Media usually takes about 15-20 seconds to open.

    Video playback on Smartphone 2002 Windows Media (and third party MPEG players, as well) is a joke. The quality is so bad it shouldn't even be used. This was the problem with PPC2002, as well; Windows Media sucked, basically and bluntly.

    Now, Windows Mobile 2003 is another story...video playback is great in Windows Media. I have no idea about the quality of Smartphone 2003 video playback.

    Smartphone 2002 devices have some very great qualities, but don't start spouting off about things that are merely "on-paper" features without including the usability benefits.
  8. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #48  
    >>>>Video playback on Smartphone 2002 Windows Media (and third party MPEG players, as well) is a joke. The quality is so bad it shouldn't even be used. This was the problem with PPC2002, as well; Windows Media sucked, basically and bluntly.
    <<<

    huh? WMP, pMVP and pTV are all working on Smartphone 2k2. Playback quality depends on rip set up. But as you can read yourself in pTV forum, one should be able to get smooth .mpeg. SPV after does have ARM CPU.
  9. #49  
    Originally posted by IcYPLaYa21


    shes just jealous that she cant get one til the welfare check comes in...thats why shes actin like that
    No need to start insulting people... that goes for everybody...


    Keep it civilised or I'll close this thread..
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
    Do files get embarrassed when they get unzipped?
  10. RStall's Avatar
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       #50  
    Originally posted by BNelson


    Yes, you can immediately sync MP3's and video's with Smartphone 2002, but the usability is barely there. MP3's play great on my SPV, but Windows Media usually takes about 15-20 seconds to open.

    Video playback on Smartphone 2002 Windows Media (and third party MPEG players, as well) is a joke. The quality is so bad it shouldn't even be used. This was the problem with PPC2002, as well; Windows Media sucked, basically and bluntly.

    Now, Windows Mobile 2003 is another story...video playback is great in Windows Media. I have no idea about the quality of Smartphone 2003 video playback.

    Smartphone 2002 devices have some very great qualities, but don't start spouting off about things that are merely "on-paper" features without including the usability benefits.
    what are you playing the media on?? i can use my old maestro and play MP3s all day long. I also had an old compaq c2015 and it could play wav files instantly and it was only 75mhz. come on man, you know something is wrong with a unit if it takes 15-20 secs to load an app.
  11. BNelson's Avatar
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    #51  
    Originally posted by RStall


    what are you playing the media on?? i can use my old maestro and play MP3s all day long. I also had an old compaq c2015 and it could play wav files instantly and it was only 75mhz. come on man, you know something is wrong with a unit if it takes 15-20 secs to load an app.
    Come on man, read my post. I didn't say I couldn't play MP3s. I said that my SPV takes at least 15 seconds to load Windows Media. Ahh...no...it's not a faulty unit. It's the slow processor and the OS.

    Listen, I'm not a MS basher. Quite the contrary, I have owned about every Pocket PC ever made. I decided to try Smartphone with the SPV, and it just has many problems to be used as a phone. The OS is dog-slow for use as a phone. If I want my calendar in front of me, I should be able to push a button and it instantly pops up. If I want to listen to music (if that feature is available to me), the Media Player should instantly pop up and be usable instantly.

    I'm only discussing Smartphone 2002 OS. It is not optimized for phone use, unfortunately. Purple X said it best about usability when he asked if you gave some girl a phone in a coffee shop if she'd be able to make a call and use the interface right away. Smartphone may have a start in navigation, but MS's famous spinning wheel would get in the way too much...again, not optimized for phones.
  12. #52  
    Originally posted by BNelson

    Come on man, read my post. I didn't say I couldn't play MP3s. I said that my SPV takes at least 15 seconds to load Windows Media. Ahh...no...it's not a faulty unit. It's the slow processor and the OS.

    Listen, I'm not a MS basher. Quite the contrary, I have owned about every Pocket PC ever made. I decided to try Smartphone with the SPV, and it just has many problems to be used as a phone. The OS is dog-slow for use as a phone. If I want my calendar in front of me, I should be able to push a button and it instantly pops up. If I want to listen to music (if that feature is available to me), the Media Player should instantly pop up and be usable instantly.

    I'm only discussing Smartphone 2002 OS. It is not optimized for phone use, unfortunately. Purple X said it best about usability when he asked if you gave some girl a phone in a coffee shop if she'd be able to make a call and use the interface right away. Smartphone may have a start in navigation, but MS's famous spinning wheel would get in the way too much...again, not optimized for phones.
    Bnelson:

    What do you think about the Treo 600?

    Jake
    There is a great difference between knowing and understanding. You can know a lot about something without understanding it. —Charles Kettering
    -------------------------------------------------
    Treo 600: Love at First Sight by Jake Ehrlich

    Thoughts on the Future of Handheld Computing: A 5 Part Series by Jake Ehrlich
  13. BNelson's Avatar
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    #53  
    Originally posted by JakeE


    Bnelson:

    What do you think about the Treo 600?

    Jake
    If it was available right now, I'd buy it. It sounds like the perfect device for my particular uses.

    I can't edit Office files on my SPV, which I'd be able to do on the Treo 600. I want what at least a lot of users on this forum want...a full PDA/Multimedia device in the smallest form factor possible...and with a thumb keyboard!

    If it's marketed right, the 600 will be a hit IMHO.
  14. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #54  
    treo 600 does multimedia? do tell us how you can do that. (and no mmplayer isn't it)
  15. BNelson's Avatar
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    #55  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    treo 600 does multimedia? do tell us how you can do that. (and no mmplayer isn't it)
    Wow, you're so swift, purpleX...

    Let me swing it back to you: Smartphone 2002 does multimedia? How? MP3? Video? Games?

    The jury is still out on how well the Treo 600 will do all of these, but please quit giving us the "on-paper" features of Smartphone 2002...real use of all of these features can be done on the Treo. It is OS 5, so I'd assume emulators, music (bundled, the way it sounds), and video will work.

    All you can give us for Smartphone 2002 (that is the only version available to us right now, right?) is demographic information on what MS sees as the phone buyers of the world. If you talk about the true usability of Smartphone 2002, though, you must admit that it isn't optimized very well...just not good phones.

    Nobody, except a handful of Europeans and 5-10 Americans (yes, me included unfortunately) that have to import the phones from the UK, are buying MS Smartphones...haven't you heard? You're a master with sales data...I'm surprised...

    Don't talk about Smartphone 2003 with me. It isn't out in Europe, and there is zero Smartphone penetration in the US. Yes, I know Motorola is coming to AT&T, but it's not available today. Talk to me about short term...not what MS fantasizes about in the long term.
  16. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #56  
    The jury is already giving verdict.

    -Multimedia: downloadable/available apps. Not some imaginary "multimedia support"

    Audio/multimedia:
    Smartphone 2k2:
    -WMP, pMVP, PTV (Divx, AVI. WMA, WMP, .mpeg, .mp3)
    -2 voice recording apps, (answering machine, full feature voice recorder)

    treo600: supporting something... (assume will work)

    Games:
    Smartphone 2k2:
    -SNES, GB, NES, various top selling native port.
    http://www.smartgamer.org/forums/news.php

    treo 600: anybody? somebody...? (I am sure air hockey and bejeweled are killer game)

    Sorry to blow your bubble, Smartphone is ahead in gaming and multimedia. Right now, you can taut the 19,000 other applications in different category, but not gaming and multimedia.
  17. BNelson's Avatar
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    #57  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    The jury is already giving verdict.

    -Multimedia: downloadable/available apps. Not some imaginary "multimedia support"

    Audio/multimedia:
    Smartphone 2k2:
    -WMP, pMVP, PTV (Divx, AVI. WMA, WMP, .mpeg, .mp3)
    -2 voice recording apps, (answering machine, full feature voice recorder)

    treo600: supporting something... (assume will work)

    Games:
    Smartphone 2k2:
    -SNES, GB, NES, various top selling native port.
    http://www.smartgamer.org/forums/news.php

    treo 600: anybody? somebody...? (I am sure air hockey and bejeweled are killer game)

    Sorry to blow your bubble, Smartphone is ahead in gaming and multimedia. Right now, you can taut the 19,000 other applications in different category, but not gaming and multimedia.
    This is getting funny...

    Do you even own a Smartphone 2002 device? Again, you give a full spec sheet of the "on-paper" features of Smartphone 2002. I thought you'd be sharp enough to get what I'm talking about...usability of those fine features. As an owner of a SPV, I can tell you that it doesn't live up to the feature list...especially as a phone, let alone all those famous MS "rich multimedia experiences."

    No, I'm not one of the Palm zealots that will drivel on and on about the 19,000 apps available for the Treo. It's my understanding that OS 5 has emulators available, video players; the Treo may have a MP3 player bundled with it.

    It can also do business with Office files: Editors, not just viewers.

    Oh, man...I'm not going to sit here and spit out all the things we all know. You just didn't respond to me in an intelligent way...you gave me the MS way...spout off a spec sheet of features, not telling me what you've found in real use of the devices.

    BTW, do you even own a Smarphone 2002? You know so much...
  18. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #58  
    no, but I have used 1.6. And it is useable. Nowhere enar 10-15 second load time.

    It is my understanding you have no experiance with treo 600 multimedia capability.

    And yes. mpx et all only have clearvue at the moment, able to open natively office file, but not edit. XDA is generally prefered for full PDA feature.

    PS. please show treo 600 and gaming capability knowing you have great intelligent insight about SPV and treo 600.
  19. BNelson's Avatar
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    #59  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    no, but I have used 1.6. And it is useable. Nowhere enar 10-15 second load time.

    It is my understanding you have no experiance with treo 600 multimedia capability.

    And yes. mpx et all only have clearvue at the moment, able to open natively office file, but not edit. XDA is generally prefered for full PDA feature.

    PS. please show treo 600 and gaming capability knowing you have great intelligent insight about SPV and treo 600.
    I guess before the moderators shut this thread down due to our back-and-forth, I'll remind you that I've stated that the jury is still out on the capabilities of the 600.

    Yes the jury is in on Smartphone 2002 (European version, anyway) and I know what kind of phone/device it is from 4 months of use.

    I'm just speculating that an OS 5 device will be able to do almost anything any other OS 5 device can currently do, albeit the 160x160 hinderance.

    You imply that Smartphone does all multimedia beautifully out of the box right now. Yes, the features and multimedia software is there, right now, I know...you're exaggerating to real usability of those features, to say the least, though.

    No offence is intended, but I've never seen more of a walking MS feature list billboard/demographic marketing jargon diplomat on a message board than you. This is actually more of a compliment in some ways...you're very good at your purpose here. Wow.

    BTW, with your MS contacts, don't you have some way of getting me an early Treo 600...no, I don't have one.
  20. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #60  
    don't make story, speculation or hypothetical musing. Show us the goods. Existing and running softwares are infinitely more usable than "I speculate".

    and no I do not imply. I know.
    http://forum.pocketmovies.net/viewto...7361d8358254a3
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