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  1. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #21  
    Originally posted by Insp_Gadget
    However, you say that the Palm OS is incapable of doing it. I take exception to that statement. How do you know? Are you a programmer? Are you a developer? Have you designed any part of the Palm OS? You say it as if you are some kind of authority on what the Palm OS can do.
    Simple, nobody has produced anything resembling video conferencing tool for POS after all these years. Most of video conferencing tool for PPC cited APIs and com layers that doesn't exist in Palm. And they are all research project instead of commercial. So this is not something easy to do or commercially viable product yet.

    http://www.evl.uic.edu/cavern/continuum/vvp/report.htm
    http://research.microsoft.com/~jiang...rait/tech.aspx

    Does it mean nobody can add the missing OS piece to implement video conferencing tool to OS 5.0? Probably not, but so far nobody seems to bother doing it to prove me wrong. It would be nice to know how one is going to implement audio/video concurency with such limited threading option provided by OS 5.0. PSG should hire him to write the next OS if he exists and fires everybody else.

    As far as "simple video streaming" is concerned, yes, the Palm OS can do it. In fact, there are products out right now that do it:

    FireProducer
    congratulation. you find a proprietary codec that no one else uses and only can deliver silent video. (I didn't know simple video in Palm means something THAT simple)


    If you don't like the Treo, that's your choice. Buy something else. It's one thing to offer constructive criticism.
    you mean how come I don't do cheerleading and tell rosy story? And have the nerve saying video conferencing is not going to happen in treo 600/or OS 5.0.

    okay I am sorry, I should have say treo 600 is a big leap forward in PDA marketing. (now isn't that the truth)
  2. #22  
    Treo 600 is just a product that either matches one's need or does not. purplex, why wage an apparently what looks like to me a crusade against the Treo 600 in this forum? I only encountered this kind of heated, prolonged, sustained exchanges in Internet newsgroups where participants can go down to more baser language, to them the better.

    When Treo 600 comes out and succeeds, what would it matter to you then? You'll probably just lead your life the way you have been mostly doing it. If it fails, there probably won't be any TreoCentral to go to anyways. Would you feel better if you go out ranting 'I told you so' folks here then?

    The market place is the final "battlefield". So much can change quickly. Just like in basketball, the breaks can break any game. You thought you're a loser then the breaks go your way.

    You already have your say, let each one of us figure it out for ourselves. Give us respect here.

    Bashing the next Treo is becoming an obsession for you. Isn't that rather unhealthy mentally?
  3. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #23  
    awee... you broke my heart.

    okay everybody, buy more Palm and say nice thing about treo.
    if you dont' buy Palm God will kill a kitten.

    Save the poor kittens.




    PS. It's a product. If it sucks, it'll still be one even if I spin it as "the greatest design man ever produced and all the kittens in the world love it"
  4. #24  
    bottom line here is that it's going to get very interesting in the 'convergence' area in the next couple of years, which we all expected. treo will obviously not be the only choice, each unit will have its strengths and weaknesses, and the competition will keep everybody on their toes!!

    i can't wait!
    Change is a challenge to the adventurous, an opportunity to the alert, a threat to the insecure.
  5. #25  
    You imply that Palm OS creators are dying to put video conferencing in their OS but can't. I think this is ridiculous. If this were a goal, it would be done. You are giving things like video conferencing so much weight. IMO, it is at a toy level at this point and its utility is very low. Plus the networks are so far behind in supporting it in the US and Europe that it is just not worth the investment at this time. Do you honestly think that with the current ARM processor speeds it's not possible to do video conferencing because the name of the OS is Palm OS? If you choose to answer this, please don't pick one sentence out of what I said; answer everything I said.

    Also, you didn't answer whether you have a Treo, used one or ever owned or used a Palm device. Using doesn't mean trying it out for a short period of time, but rather carrying one long enough to experience it. One of Palm OS's biggest draws is its high usability. You can't just dismiss that without really testing the claim of good usability by carrying a device long enough to see whether it fulfills that goal.

    I haven't used PPC or its derivatives much at all, so you don't find me making such categorical or authoritative-sounding statements about it. Even if I did, I would find it quite silly to hang around PPC boards to just tell them things like "PPC sucks".
    Last edited by silverado; 07/16/2003 at 03:10 PM.
  6. #26  
    It's happening again. Don't feed trolls.
  7. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #27  
    You imply that Palm OS creators are dying to put video conferencing in their OS but can't. I think this is ridiculous. If this were a goal, it would be done. You are giving things like video conferencing so much weight. IMO, it is at a toy level at this point and its utility is very low. Plus the networks are so far behind in supporting it in the US and Europe that it is just not worth the investment at this time. Do you honestly think that with the current ARM processor speeds it's not possible to do video conferencing because the name of the OS is Palm OS? If you choose to answer this, please don't pick one sentence out of what I said; answer everything I said.

    Also, you didn't answer whether you have a Treo, used one or ever owned or used a Palm device. Using doesn't mean trying it out for a short period of time, but rather carrying one long enough to experience it. One of Palm OS's biggest draws is its high usability. You can't just dismiss that without really testing the claim of good usability by carrying a device long enough to see whether it fulfills that goal.

    I haven't used PPC or its derivatives much at all, so you don't find me making such categorical or authoritative-sounding statements about it. Even if I did, I would find it quite silly to hang around PPC boards to just tell them things like "PPC sucks".

    -first of all I don't believe video conference is something the public wants (yet?).

    I am saying treo 600 and the next version of treo if it is using OS 5.0 won't be able to do video conferencing. Somebody could start writing something, but so far nada. I don't think video conferencing is something that can be implemented overnight in OS 5.0 assuming the hardware is capable. The creator of treo COULD NOT write a video conferencing if their life depends on it. (These are the guys who still finding excuse not to put BT on their advance phone because they say it's difficult to put the program together. And now we want to have video conferencing? with graphic, sound, networking socket, etc? the complexity is a magnitude larger than making BT work)

    T|C certainly has enough power and the wireless bandwidth to do video conferencing. But so far.. zilch. The OS can't do it without a massive hack.

    -144 OMAP is not fast enough to implement descent speed common video conferencing protocol without turning the video into sort of a slide show the size of postage stamp. And I certainly don't think anybody has enough time writing a new video codec just for POS, knowing POS has no video hardware whatsoever except Veo, Z71 with unknown camera API, and still vaporware treo600. but who knows right?... they say POS can turn dragonball 66mHz as fast as a supercomputer. not.

    -no I don't have POS for extended period of time. and no the 'usability' issue is another overhype item in the level of "Treo 600 is the holy grail of communicator design" comment. Prove me wrong.

    -and go ahead, post in PPC forum and say PPC sucks. Say for eg. your assesment about "UI" ease of use, and try to defend that POS is easier. See if your basic idea of PPC and fundamental believe of POS is justified.
    But better bring a very concrete proof instead of airy marketing claim. You won't be the first person who will make that attempt. People can't even convincingly argue on POS behalf inside home turf and now you want to argue POS superiority in PPC forum? hmmm...

    (PS. how can you know POS is easier if you never really compare them, or even consider the possibility? I at least have poked around a little and count the tap or see the consistency of the claim. plus in case you haven't notice my claim are mostly basic claims (price, size, capability/features) Everybody can check those instead of convoluted fluff such as the holy grail of communication or ease to use.. whatever that is.)
  8. #28  
    Your response shows either deliberate or unintentional glossing over the real points I was making. If it's unintentional then it says that you really aren't paying much attention. In either case, I will choose not to waste more of my time and effort writing what I think are thoughtful responses if they won't be responded to in the same manner.
    Last edited by silverado; 07/16/2003 at 04:24 PM.
  9. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #29  
    whatever you want to say. Obviously you didn't check the link to notice that the microsoft portrait is also working on smartphone albeit in severly anemic manner. The basic concept work, but there isn't enough power for better quality.

    so yeah, so much for thoughtfull reply.
  10. #30  
    Children: remember, if you give a troll a cookie.....

    The real answer to all this nonsense it - "Who IS doing videoconferencing and streaming video?" Answer - no one because even Wifi speeds are lame for this purpose, much less 3G (or 2.5G if you must).
  11. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #31  
    RTFA.

    Video conferencing is definitely functional over WiFi, it is more than functional as one way video viewer ala vic. And it is semi functional in MS smartphone.

    who cares if anybody needs it or not since the point is platform capability to execute said app.
  12. #32  
    Purplex,

    Your obviously-knowledgable posts are appreciated by some of us out here - please continue to make them no matter how many times you are personally attacked (interesting - I don't see you attacking people, just devices! What a commentary on the "other side" of the aisle!).

    Your last post is perfect - you've pointed out and backed up with considerable real information that video conferencing isn't there on the TREOs in direct response to someone postulating about video conferencing on TREOs, and then the response is "So what? Who does it anyway!", then you perhaps-too-subtlely point out that the topic is capability of platform for video conferencing not presence of video conferencing.

    There are folks reading and understanding you. Please continue.
  13. Iceman6's Avatar
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    #33  
    Originally posted by SeldomVisitor
    Purplex,

    Your obviously-knowledgable posts are appreciated by some of us out here - please continue to make them no matter how many times you are personally attacked (interesting - I don't see you attacking people, just devices! What a commentary on the "other side" of the aisle!).

    Your last post is perfect - you've pointed out and backed up with considerable real information that video conferencing isn't there on the TREOs in direct response to someone postulating about video conferencing on TREOs, and then the response is "So what? Who does it anyway!", then you perhaps-too-subtlely point out that the topic is capability of platform for video conferencing not presence of video conferencing.

    There are folks reading and understanding you. Please continue.
    I beg to differ. Purplex mixes useful commentary with put-downs. Check out his recent post on the Hitachi thread, where he defends voice commands by dissing people who disagree with him as "treo fan-boys"
  14. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #34  
    I am pointing out how his hypothetical show stopper situation is a fantasy. The Hitachi is able to receive comman to call same person home/work number. The VD is designed to be able to call number in those category.

    PS. are you expecting me to play benevolant and polite miss manner. get real. I bite back.
  15. njchris's Avatar
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    459 Posts
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    #35  
    These forums used to be fun to come to. Even with people complaining, most of them were constructive.

    Now it's turned into feeding the troll. I don't have that same excitement coming to read these messages any longer. It boggles why people who obviously dislike PALM OS and see no merit to it, come here.

    It's sad.
  16. #36  
    Originally posted by njchris
    These forums used to be fun to come to. Even with people complaining, most of them were constructive.

    Now it's turned into feeding the troll. I don't have that same excitement coming to read these messages any longer. It boggles why people who obviously dislike PALM OS and see no merit to it, come here.

    It's sad.
    That is 100% on target. I know I don't hang out at churches singing the praises of Judaism or go to sports bar and chant negative things about the home town team. Neither do I crash Corvette parties with tons of pro Dodge Viper material. When someone's sole purpose is to bring down the spirits of others I can't help but think they have problems far beyond those of differing opinions.

    There is no need to ruin someone's playground because you don't like their slide. Use a different playground.
    Last edited by KRamsauer; 07/18/2003 at 11:42 AM.
  17. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #37  
    No this is more along the line of nailing heretical declaration on the church door.

    That the hype around the message is questionable, probably entirely corrupt and doesn't jibe with real life.

    Live with it, 'Treo 600 is the second coming' isn't a dogma.
  18. #38  
    Well I'm going to have to put the biggest part of the blame on the mod's and admin of this site. There are several ways to permanently block a user from a board like this. You can also delete posts. If the admin doesn't have time, we have daily users here that could help. I am a mod/admin at another smartphone board now and we wouldn't tolerate this.
  19. #39  
    I just put him on my block list.

    Geoffrey
  20. #40  
    Originally posted by gmaugham
    I just put him on my block list.

    Geoffrey
    i agree. we all have the power to simply block folks whose posts we do not care to read. they can only annoy us if WE let them
    Change is a challenge to the adventurous, an opportunity to the alert, a threat to the insecure.
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