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  1.    #1  
    So as you all know, originally I was completely against a standard-res treo. Then I began to see that it really doesn't matter all that much in a smart phone. Then I was in Fry's today to buy some wireless networking gear (which works beautifully--I'm writing this on a notebook from my living room), so of course I had to take a look at the PDA's. For the first time ever I was more impressed by Palm's offerings than Sony's but that's for another thread. Bottom line: the screens on the Tungsten C and the Zire 71 are absolutely beautiful! Unbelievable. And to think that I may be forcing myself to go yet another generation without the benefit of such a gorgeous screen. Another fantastic feature which will be solved with the new Treo is the wonderful speed. These things fly! Press a button and BAM! (heheh, Emeril-esque) it's there. I snapped a picture with the Zire 71, beamed it to my Treo (pretty nifty in and of itself, I may add), and then put them to a race to open them up. Needless to say it wasn't even close.

    In the end i was left longing for the speed of the new Treo, but all the while feeling sad about using a non state of the art (though perhaps still completely usable) screen.
  2. #2  
    KRamsauer

    That is the point I have been trying to make all along. The Treo 600 is extremely impressive! It will be great, but the thing that excites me so much is that the 600 is a prelude for what is to come. As I said in another thread, nothing would make me happier than to only have the Treo 600 for six months. In my personal opinion the future of Palm is looking excellent (Pun intended)

    Jake
    There is a great difference between knowing and understanding. You can know a lot about something without understanding it. —Charles Kettering
    -------------------------------------------------
    Treo 600: Love at First Sight by Jake Ehrlich

    Thoughts on the Future of Handheld Computing: A 5 Part Series by Jake Ehrlich
  3. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #3  
    you want to pay $500 bucks plus service for 6 months to own a "prelude for what is to come"?

    why own the prelude when you can own the actual thing to come at cheaper price?

    Things to come, Christmas.
    TI phone
  4. #4  
    KRamsauer... the way I figure, I would rather have a phone size device with a great, bright, clear, phone sized screen (which they say that the 600 screen is very crisp, partly because it is small) that fits in my pocket well. (I don't carry my PDA in a belt pouch!)

    Another thing I would like to see, especially if Handspring has gotten the form factor as good as the reviews say, is continued upgrades in the same form factor. (like better cameras, networking/bluetooth, maybe a higher rez screen, maybe even a version with a flip lid face cover, all utilizing the same basic package.) This might make for cheaper devices, more accessories available, and more developer support.

    And BTW, I do think Sony has lost its way with the palm PDAs right now...
    MTT
    Handspring Visor, Palm V, HS Treo 180, HS Treo 90, P1 Treo 600, P1 Treo 650, Palm Treo 700p... still hanging tough with Palm OS
  5. #5  
    If you get a chance, take a look at the NetFront Browser on a T|C, if you haven't done so already. It truly uses all the hardware, and puts any low-res screen to shame with the excellent page renderings. That's the impression I got in less than 5 minutes of playing with it. Having said that, the T|C is bulky, and doesn't have a built-in phone. I'll stick with a low-res smartphone if Blazer 3 is fast and will do half the job that NetFront does.
  6. #6  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    you want to pay $500 bucks plus service for 6 months to own a "prelude for what is to come"?

    why own the prelude when you can own the actual thing to come at cheaper price?

    Things to come, Christmas.
    TI phone
    Yes, I would be happy to pay 500 bucks to have the Treo 600 for six months. When a better product comes along ...as it inevitably will...I will sell the 600 on ebay and recoup 80% of what I paid for it...and on and on and on...
    There is a great difference between knowing and understanding. You can know a lot about something without understanding it. —Charles Kettering
    -------------------------------------------------
    Treo 600: Love at First Sight by Jake Ehrlich

    Thoughts on the Future of Handheld Computing: A 5 Part Series by Jake Ehrlich
  7. #7  
    Originally posted by purpleX

    Things to come, Christmas.
    TI phone
    Uhh...you do realize that's just a reference design right? LOL! Yeah, come back and remind us...er, maybe in 6 months when there's some actual OEM's willing to make that thing!

    Originally posted by KRamsauer
    So as you all know, originally I was completely against a standard-res treo. Then I began to see that it really doesn't matter all that much in a smart phone. Then I was in Fry's today to buy some wireless networking gear (which works beautifully--I'm writing this on a notebook from my living room), so of course I had to take a look at the PDA's. For the first time ever I was more impressed by Palm's offerings than Sony's but that's for another thread. Bottom line: the screens on the Tungsten C and the Zire 71 are absolutely beautiful! Unbelievable. And to think that I may be forcing myself to go yet another generation without the benefit of such a gorgeous screen. Another fantastic feature which will be solved with the new Treo is the wonderful speed. These things fly! Press a button and BAM! (heheh, Emeril-esque) it's there. I snapped a picture with the Zire 71, beamed it to my Treo (pretty nifty in and of itself, I may add), and then put them to a race to open them up. Needless to say it wasn't even close.

    In the end i was left longing for the speed of the new Treo, but all the while feeling sad about using a non state of the art (though perhaps still completely usable) screen.
    Well, that's exactly my initial rxn to news of the rez on the Treo600. What i really want to know is: was it technically possible for Handspring or not to include a higher rez screen? And if so, what were the exact tradeoffs necessary to achieve this? For example, I would really like to know how much reduced battery life would have resulted. In the end, the screen is not the fatal flaw of the device, fortunatley. But it certainly gives ammunition to the trolls who want to deride it...
    Last edited by Gaurav; 07/06/2003 at 09:51 AM.
  8. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #8  
    Originally posted by gfunkmagic
    Uhh...you do realize that's just a reference design right? LOL! Yeah, come back and remind us...er, maybe in 6 months when there's some actual OEM's willing to make that thing!
    hmm, miss the news it got picked up by an OEM last month eh?
    http://www.msmobiles.com/news.php/938.html
    link to digitimes

    It'll be out by year end (tho' I got a feeling it'll be late) But we'll see.

    This device is going to cream every highend smartphone with 3 trannsceivers built in. Tho' not sure how the OMAP 1510 is going to perform for wireless device, this is the first device to use it on the phone. If the schedule hold, this device will only be 3 months apart from treo 600 launch.
  9. #9  
    Yes, well then please provide a link? There's been an alpha release since April, but I've not heard of any OEM picking it up yet... Also, of course TI going to use their OMAP chip in their reference design! Do ya think they woudl use Intel?

    Eidt:

    Umm.. sorry but that link you provided does not say clearly who this OEM is except who makes the wifi modules. Anyway, if you really love this device, then go get the alpha...Oh I forgot you dont' use smartphones anyway...
  10. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #10  
    could be NDC, but who knows. Too bad the XDAII only has BT, it would be the ultimate gadget with WiFi and optional CF sleeve.

    otherwise maybe Samsung will finally release second generation i700 complete with that TV reciever. That will be a neat toy too.
  11. #11  
    Originally posted by purpleX



    This device is going to cream every highend smartphone with 3 trannsceivers built in. Tho' not sure how the OMAP 1510 is going to perform for wireless device, this is the first device to use it on the phone. If the schedule hold, this device will only be 3 months apart from treo 600 launch.
    It has no keyboard. There is no chance in hell I'd consider a new pda without a keyboard now a days after seeing how nice it is to use a thumbboard.

    /v
  12. #12  
    Originally posted by gfunkmagic
    What i really want to know is: was it technically possible for Handspring or not to include a higher rez screen? And if so, what were the exact tradeoffs necessary to achieve this? For example, I would really like to know how much reduced battery life would have resulted. In the end, the screen is not the fatal flaw of the device, fortunatley. But it certainly gives ammunition to the trolls who want to deride it...
    I was actually just reading a post about this not too long ago; apparently, the screen tehnology, while certainly usable and nice, can't handle resolutions much higher than 160x160, and at 320x320, it just flickers and "ghosts" more than anything else. Wish I could remember what thread it was in, though...

    But it does make sense...CSTN is an old technology, and while I'm glad it's still getting use (and saving us battery life), you do have to respect that it's got it's limits. Ultimately, it really isn't a "fatal flaw" of the device, and I think that people will more than likely be pleased enough with the screen, hi-res or not. I know it's fine by me...
  13. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #13  
    If the point of "PDA" is to digitally assist hence display information, then putting bad quality screen is a fatal mistake. People are going to use smartphone to browse web, look email and docs, do PIM, play game and watch movie even....

    the screen is not a caller ID on steroid or mini organizer. How many PDA die because of bad screen and why do advance phones come with bigger and bigger screen?

    treo 600 screen is a bad compromise.

    The battery requirement excuse is completely nonsense since we know there are handheld with bigger screen/higher res, but still compact and have decent battery life.

    SO505i
    http://k-tai.impress.co.jp/cda/artic...top/14295.html
  14. #14  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    If the point of "PDA" is to digitally assist hence display information, then putting bad quality screen is a fatal mistake. People are going to use smartphone to browse web, look email and docs, do PIM, play game and watch movie even....

    the screen is not a caller ID on steroid or mini organizer. How many PDA die because of bad screen and why do advance phones come with bigger and bigger screen?

    treo 600 screen is a bad compromise.
    Purple/Blue, you realize that this is a smartphone forum right and not a PDA forum?! The number one thing I use my treo300 on a daily basis is as a phone! Thus, most of us all already willing to compromize certain pda functionalities in order to have a good convergence device. Hence the smaller screen to fit smaller form factor and etc. You're soo focused on what you think is a good pda that you obviously have no idea what people want in a good "smartphone"! Heh...you obviously have never owned a smartphone at all. The compromises in the Treo600 were made so that it could be used as an every day phone first with robust pda funcitonality built-in. Is the screen rez a dissapointment? Yes, IMHO it is, but does that make the whole device bad? The answer is no b/c of all the other features it includes like the thumbboard, size, expansion etc. Of course you will deride every single spec/feature of the Treo600 as inferior (It is the nature of the troll ) but you have not mentioned even one single alternative out there that combines all these features in a smaller package and also includes an integrated thumbboard which if you haven't noticed is why people like the treo not-withstanding anything you have to say. All you got is the un-gawdly G1000 which is soo big I could even use it as a weapon to slug you with! No one in their right mind would be satisfied with that thing as their primary mobile!


    The battery requirement excuse is completely nonsense since we know there are handheld with bigger screen/higher res, but still compact and have decent battery life.

    SO505i
    http://k-tai.impress.co.jp/cda/artic...top/14295.html
    Wrong again, the SO505i only has a 262X144 color screen. Yes it is a semi-transparent poly-silicon TFT, but hardly high res. However, I like the rectangular shape of the screen, for greater viewing area, and the unique slider mechanism. If this had a thumboard instead of numeric keypad, this woudl be my dream phone! But it doesn't and its only for NTT DoCoMo, hence will never come to NA. Also, you do realize this is a SE phone right and not some M$ smartphone/PPCPE? I thought you only promoted M$ brands?

    P.S If you want to some truely nice pics of te SE SO505i, check out these pics from Mobil.Burn
  15. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #15  
    -SO 505i, 256×320, 2.2 inch . (the point? oh look, bigger screen on a nice phone! how do they do that? Handspring say it's impossible to do)

    -I am sorry, I keep forgetting Palm is not a PDA, it's just an organizer. Treo 600 is just a phone with organizer, not a PDA phone/smartphone.

    -G1000 is dead, get over it.
    try killing i700 or compare treo with Wanda or SPV2 if you can. (oops.... dead treo)

    -babelfish is not hard to use really.

    PS. I thought you are a treo fanboys. what are you doing reading mobileburns
  16. #16  
    DO NOT REPLY TO THIS "F............G" TROLL!

    Purple X has so far suceeded in making this forum an irritating place to visit.

    JFunk & Jake - you both are feeding him good!
    Ed
    Visor Deluxe, Prism, Visorphone, Treo 270, Treo 600, Treo 650, and am eagerly waiting for the next generation Treo...but wait...is that the iPhone????
  17. #17  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    PS. I thought you are a treo fanboys. what are you doing reading mobileburns
    Ska/bue,

    Hey, I could be ask you the same question! Actually I have an idea. Why don't you grace your presence over at smartphoneforums? There's a whole bunch of SGH-i500 fans over there that don't know about you yet! In fact, they're all under the illusion that the SGH is the best thing since sliced butter! Maybe you should go over there and...er...stay there huh? Anyway, I'm a "smartphone fan" for your opinion. Furthermore, I actually use the devices I like, unlike you!

    Anyway back to topic: Why do persist on comparing "non-comparables" so to speek? The 505i's are jp mobile's we'll never see in NA, so who cares. The TI wanda, i700 etc are all huge pda-phones which have totally different purpose than Treo600. Try to find a comparable mobile equal to or less in size to at least Treo300. Anything bigger, and no one will want to use it as a primary phone. You don't seem to understand that Handspring is targeting the mobile market, not pdacentic or large pda-phone market. Thus if you look at the alternatives like Sereis 60 (176x208 pixels), SPV screen and other M$ smartphones (220 x 176) , they all have relatively comparable standard screen rez. The only notable exceptions of course are P800/P810 (208x320) and SGH (324x352) which leads me another point. Symbian and M$ smartphone (soon to be M$ mobile 2003) both have standard set-in-stone screen resolutions just like PPC. For years PPC fans like you continuoulsy crowed about the superiority of your platform specifically b/c of the screen. Well, as PalmOS adapted and allowed flexibility in this regard, M$ stagnated and remained at 240x320. Well guess what, all M$ is doing the same thing again with smartphones! At least the SGH proves you can have higher rez screens on a PalmOS smartphone! Can you be so sure that M$ will increase the standard rez?! In the same vein Series 60 always have the same rez. That's why SE chose UIQ so it wouldn't be stuck making a Series 60 clone (as well as paying lisencing fees to Nokia). In comparison, various palmOS smartphones have various resolutions: GSL Zircon/Onynx (176 x 240), Treos, SPH-i500 (160x160) and aformentioed SGH. Thus, it totally conceivable that Handspring may eventually include a higher rez screen in the "Treo600 family" later on. But that isn't necessarily so with M$ mobile is it? I predict just like PalmOS superceded PPC in screen rez, so will PalmOS smartphones in time! Anyway that's my take...obviously positively slanted but resonable IMO.
    Last edited by Gaurav; 07/07/2003 at 02:45 AM.
  18. #18  
    Originally posted by Treo Rat
    DO NOT REPLY TO THIS "F............G" TROLL!

    Purple X has so far suceeded in making this forum an irritating place to visit.

    JFunk & Jake - you both are feeding him good!
    yeah, sorry about that. I agree, I need to stop....
  19. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #19  
    The treonistas are busy whacking people I see.

    that's the only way to protect pathetic product. If people start talking and comparing treo 600 against other product and knows the truth. mmm.

    We must protect the survival of the product. The survival of the world must be protected, the truth cannot come out.

    viva la treo.



    (Let's face it pal, if the product is that good, you wouldn't need to worry about people talking about bad screen non replacable battery, no BT, or pathetic net capability)
  20. #20  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    The treonistas are busy whacking people I see.

    that's the only way to protect pathetic product. If people start talking and comparing treo 600 against other product and knows the truth. mmm.

    We must protect the survival of the product. The survival of the world must be protected, the truth cannot come out.

    viva la treo.



    (Let's face it pal, if the product is that good, you wouldn't need to worry about people talking about bad screen non replacable battery, no BT, or pathetic net capability)
    PurpleX,
    Please stop your tolling behaviour, I know you can do better than that.
    Regardless of the quality of a product, if you start bashing it you'll get reactions like that... If I start bashing PPC (and trust me that is just as easy as trashing Palm) you'd react the same way too.
    There really is no point doing it except for attention seeking.
    If you want attention start a singing/acting carreer, but dont do it here.
    TC is known for its friendly atmosphere and we like to keep it that way.
    You are welcome to discuss things, providing you behave yourself..
    Consider yourself warned.

    Gfunk etc:
    Dont feed trolls, you all know better than that..
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
    Do files get embarrassed when they get unzipped?
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