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  1. #481  
    Originally posted by jbronner
    I have been a Treo user for a long time and have been very pleased with the device overall but desired many of the improvements that seem to be all made in the new Treo except one. A voice recorder. For my practical business use I can make it without a high resolution screen especially since it is now visible in sunlight. I was talking with another manager in my company about the new Treo and how pleased I was with it. I told him there was only one missing feature that I would practically use on a regular basis especially in a business environment, he told me that would make him buy it and I should suggest it to Handpring.

    I am certain they will read this newsgroup so I will list it here and you all can comment on it.

    Imagine having an mp3 recorder built into the Treo 600 that used the existing speakerphone mic. I just bought a Ripflash recorder that does this. I'm not just talking about a regular voice recorder like some other phones have, the MP3 recorder would record it in a format that would be compatible with PC's and some car and DVD players. All managers have to have meetings with their employees, imagine the ability of sitting your Treo 600 on the conference room table and recording the entire meeting with your Treo in MP3 format. Then when you get back to your office, you sync it with your PC and name the file according to the meeting with the date in it. Imagine a commercial showing managers that. This could also be used for recording idea notes, songs off the radio, lecture notes, speeches, and getting phone #'s, or driving directions audibly from someone.

    This feature may not require any hardware alterations and could possibly be done using the existing mic and have the software where it can access that mic. This could even record phone conversations in MP3. For business users (as the price range would draw) the MP3 recorder would be of much greater use than the camera.

    Could anybody else use this feature?
    I'm sorry dude, but keep dreamin'. Here's why:

    1. MP3 encoding takes a LOT of CPU power. It takes about a Pentium 120 to PLAY mp3, but encoding takes much more (I am thinking at least 450 MHz)

    2. Looking at my Treo 180, it doesn't look like the mic is connected to the Palm CPU. i.e. the mic can only be used in the cell phone part of the device.

    What this means is that we'd have to do some changes with the circuit board of the device in order to feed the mic to the CPU, and record voice not using mp3, but something that offers less compression. It's probably too late in production for something like this to be implemented...

    Out of curiosity, does anyone have any clue if the speaker will be connected to the PDA component? There's a lot of speculation of mp3 playing ability using palmOS5 and the faster processor, but all this hinges on if the Palm CPU chip gets a speaker AT ALL... so far, the only things I've heard from my Treo 180 are beeps... : (

    Oh, and here's my suggestion for the new treo. They should add the ability to put on an optional lid, like the HP devices I have seen. They should add two notches to the case, one on each of the sides near the top. This would allow a lid (although a little flimsy, but at least replacable) to be added.

    There are two advantages to this: this gives you a switchable casing (ok... so only half of the case). This allows third parties or themselves to add some colorful accesories for the case cover (make a couple bucks). Another advantage is that as I scratch the cover (like I have with my Treo 180) I don't have to worry, cuz I can go out and buy another cover and pop it in.
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    #482  
    Originally posted by conflagrare


    Although screen resolution is important, we also have to keep in mind that as resolution goes up and screen size stays more, the dpi raises. With a color, touch screne LCD, this would mean that we're jacking up the price by quite a bit, maybe enough that it's not economically feasible to be used in the new Treo...
    Well the Treo 90, 180 and 270/300 are examples of sliding "economic feasability". Whey don't they make both kinds and let US decide which one is more important to have. I just know I have had it trying to access the web with 160x160... it just doesn't cut it.
  3. #483  
    Originally posted by Appleman


    I don't think Palm/Handspring will be targetting Joe Consumer for quite a while yet. Joe Consumer still has to take some sort of interest in a phone with a lof of features, nevermind a PDA, or a smartphone. These devices only appeal to consumers that already have a cell phone and a Palm. Or at least want something that can do what a smart phone can. The average person does not need email on the road, does not care to surf the web. All they want is a phone they can punch some numbers into when they need to. Joe Consumer is meant to have a cheap cellphone, and if anything a Palm Zire, and even that is a big leap.
    Exactly!! If you read my two previous posts, you will see that this is exactly what I was trying to point out! Someone said that HS was trying to market this device to Joe Consumer (hence the reason for the 160x160 screen) and I tried to point out why that wouldn't be possible (price for one reason). I believe that this device will not appeal to that market (for the same reasons you listed) and that it is meant for the higher end consumer. My whole point was that if this device isn't for Joe Consumer but yet lacks the 320x320 that so many of the higher end consumers want (and who are HS's target audience), then that will only limit the potential market for this device.
  4. #484  
    Originally posted by Appleman


    Hmmm, re-read what you just quoted me saying.

    And I guess the average person is dealing with this? I don't think so. You just came up with a very specific situation to address the average Not logical.
    This "e-mail stress" was felt by up to two thirds of regular e-mail users or something like that. It was a funny bit of news and many people can relate to that. I think I even read that news in a women's magazine. I think 'average' people really are anxious to read that e-mail from that special person (and are willing to buy a phone for it, it's the basis for the SMS-success). Whereas nerds don't suffer from e-mail stress, they just spend their days typing and sending out messages ;-)
    ReindeR
  5. #485  
    Few comments on the 160x160 debate:
    Some mentioned a 2"x2" LCD. I believe the T600 screen is significantly smaller than that. T300's screen is already 1.875"x1.875". If we believe reports from people who saw the T600 compared to the T300, the T600 screen would be even smaller. Let's say 1.7"x1.7".

    A valid comparison would be then to print a 320x320 screen shot so it fits in a 1.7"x1.7" square, and print the 160x160 screen shot in the same size.

    And then see if you really think that at this size, 160x160 is a showstopper.


    Screen size becomes more important than resolution as someone else said here. At this size, seeing 4 times as much "information" can make the "information" useless because it may not be readable anymore...
  6. #486  
    Originally posted by Marty1781
    Exactly!! If you read my two previous posts, you will see that this is exactly what I was trying to point out! Someone said that HS was trying to market this device to Joe Consumer (hence the reason for the 160x160 screen) and I tried to point out why that wouldn't be possible (price for one reason). I believe that this device will not appeal to that market (for the same reasons you listed) and that it is meant for the higher end consumer. My whole point was that if this device isn't for Joe Consumer but yet lacks the 320x320 that so many of the higher end consumers want (and who are HS's target audience), then that will only limit the potential market for this device.
    Marty, I agree 100% and this was the point I was making far earlier in this thread. Handspring wants to have its cake and eat it, too. They're all set to price this thing for the high-end consumer, but they aren't equipping it satisfactorily, IMO.

    As I've belabored already, the Nokia 3650 has a higher res screen, camera capable of taking videos w/sound, has a multitasking OS, and Bluetooth. It's more phone-centric due to the lack of a thumbboard and the small size (and small physical screen, though note again that the resolution is higher than 160x160). And it can be had for free after rebates. It compares poorly to the Treo (for my needs) because of the limited app library (though it's growing - it's Symbian and has free development tools). It also lacks the thumbboard which is a big issue for me.

    The Danger Hiptop goes somewhat to the other extreme, catering to the email/IM crowd. It, too, has a higher res screen than the Treo (240x160 landscape), a bigger more comfortable thumbboard. It has an optional camera but from what I've seen the pictures are poor. We don't know yet whether the Treo 600's pictures will be any better. Again, 3rd party apps are limited (non-existent at this point) but Danger's trying to encourage development. It's also lacking in that it lacks MS Outlook syncing, though they keep promising that it's coming eventually. The color model just came out and sells for $300, but I expect that price to drop by the time the Treo 600 comes out.

    IMO, unless Handspring plans on getting this device out the door for under $200, who will buy it? Palm OS power-users will be disappointed in the low-res screen. People who aren't married to the Palm OS will be more attracted to devices like the Nokia 3650 due to the tremendous price difference (among other things).

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  7. #487  
    Any news of Blutooth on the 600?
  8. #488  
    I really hope that Handspring/Palm has some representatives that monitor this discussion board. If something like screen resolution is enough to change the minds of many Treo supporters about the new product (myself included), then maybe having someone here to actually listen to some of the ideas and concerns about a product that could make or break them would be extremely useful. I am very disappointed to hear about the 160x160 screen resolution and will not purchase the new Treo if this is the resolution after release. These communicators are aimed at high end users because how many average Joes are willing to shell out $500 for a cell phone. With 160x160 resolution or higher, the Treo 600 will still be over $400-$500. So why not construct a product using the very best that technology has to offer while catering to the wishes of Treo 300 owners willing to pay for a top-of-the-line product. Higher screen resolution has been discussed on this board for the next Treo as long as I've been here. You would think something like this would be a trivial topic, but as many of you have expressed, it would be a shame to release a product we have been waiting for for a year (seems like forever) that does not live up to our expectations because of something as simple as higher resolution. Lesser devices have better displays. Why not the best for the best?!!!
  9. #489  
    Well in case they don't monitor this board, is there anyone you/we can write to? I'm not so much worried about what the screen will look like, as I am concerned with whether or not I'll be able to run newer software on it.
  10. #490  
    Originally posted by Scott R
    IMO, unless Handspring plans on getting this device out the door for under $200, who will buy it? Palm OS power-users will be disappointed in the low-res screen. People who aren't married to the Palm OS will be more attracted to devices like the Nokia 3650 due to the tremendous price difference (among other things).

    Scott
    Maybe they are targeting:
    • Palm OS users who are not "power users" who have had a monochrom palm for sometime and now see what to them is a whiz-bang color palm/phone that does all sorts of interesting things and they think of upgrading.
    • Palm OS users (power or not) who can live with the compromises of the device because of the convenience.
    • New users who have always wanted a palm but never gotten one and having it combined with a phone and web access finally entices them to do it...

    I think I can come up with more.

    So how is this different from the previous Treos? Why didn't it happen with the previous models? Because the previous models looked very geeky, not like normal mobile phones. That adds a big barrier to making the decision to buy them. Hopefully with this out of the way, those types buyers would find it easier to make the decision.

    Now I'll try to stop talking about this issue because IMO we have beaten it to death despite the fact that most of the discussion is based on hypotheticals because we don't know the exact specs and we haven't seen the device(s).
    Last edited by silverado; 06/08/2003 at 07:40 PM.
  11. #491  
    Originally posted by ATreoUser
    Any news of Blutooth on the 600?
    I this point, no. But again, all we have are the rumored specs.


    Guys, It is my feeling, that Handspring is creating their new phones for the carriers. So, wouldn't it be upto them to decide what they want in the phones.

    I'm sure Handspring went to the carriers and said this will be our next product, this is what it has and this is what it can do.

    If the carriers wanted a hi-res screen, don't you think they would of asked?

    For all we know Handspring went to them with a hi-res screen and it was rejected.
    Felipe
    On the road to 5,000 posts
    Life is what happens between Firmware releases.
  12. #492  
    For all we know Handspring went to them with a hi-res screen and it was rejected. [/B][/QUOTE]

    Ha....
  13. #493  
    does this new treo even have bluetooth or wifi? how does it compare to the sony p-800? i have both the treo 270 and the p800 and prefer the treo.
    what about the ability to use all my current accessories instead of having to buy more (e.g. my car chargers, head sets)?


    thx
  14. #494  
    Originally posted by gadwg
    does this new treo even have bluetooth or wifi? how does it compare to the sony p-800? i have both the treo 270 and the p800 and prefer the treo.
    what about the ability to use all my current accessories instead of having to buy more (e.g. my car chargers, head sets)?


    thx
    life should be led like a calvary charge-tally ho!

    jack cashin
  15. #495  
    I think the new Treo is going to be amazing and I will buy one no matter what, but if you are listening Handspring, I would really prefer 320x320 over 160x160 and bluetooth would be great for syncronizing and for using with a bluetooth headset.

    The most important feature for me is the camera!

    Jake
  16. #496  
    Originally posted by gadwg
    does this new treo even have bluetooth or wifi? how does it compare to the sony p-800? i have both the treo 270 and the p800 and prefer the treo.
    what about the ability to use all my current accessories instead of having to buy more (e.g. my car chargers, head sets)?
    thx
    The is no integrated BT or wifi; however, there is an SDIO slot. The only problem is that there are currently NO OS 5.x drivers for the BT SD card! in fact, its been reported on Brighthand that PSG has no plans on ever releasing one. This of course has been extremely madenning to owners of OS 5.x devices like the T|C etc. Luckly though, there is hope with forthcoming Hagiwara SD BT and wifi cards that should be available later this year. There is also anticipation for SanDisk'c combo 256 MB + wifi SD cards as well. Both of these should hopefully work on the Treo 600...
  17. #497  
    Somebody earlier in the thread was wondering if handspring followed our conversations.

    I asked them and got this response;

    Hi []. Thank you for sending us the TreoCentral link about the disclosure of the new Treo product at the Sprint user conference. We're glad to read what TreoCentral members think of the product we've been working on -- 26 pages (and counting) of valuable feedback and ideas. We're very excited, and delighted to hear about the positive buzz the device has been generating. I've forwarded the link to other Handspring decision-makers who will take the comments in the thread into consideration, including feedback about the screen and other hardware features. Of course I cannot spill the beans about future products including the new Treo (Handspring does not comment on undisclosed product plans), but we truly appreciate the feedback. Thank you.

    Cheers,
    Bonnie
    Web Site Feedback
  18. #498  
    Is technology really at a point where people have to beg for things?

    like, why isnt this advertisied everywhere?
    why do we have to FIGHT to pay $700 for this garabge?


    technology is out of control, we are doing anything we can and the corperations are doing everything they can to cut corners.



    they should be advertising not making some guy draw a sketch of what he remembers it looking like
  19. #499  
    Looks like no bluetooth is a deal killer for me. I currently have a Treo 300 and Apple Albook. I guess I"ll be going with the new Sony Ericson that has the bluetooth.
  20. #500  
    Originally posted by quake8
    Is technology really at a point where people have to beg for things?

    like, why isnt this advertisied everywhere?
    why do we have to FIGHT to pay $700 for this garabge?


    technology is out of control, we are doing anything we can and the corperations are doing everything they can to cut corners.



    they should be advertising not making some guy draw a sketch of what he remembers it looking like
    If what you're asking for were easy to make and/or made good business sense, someone would have made it. Heck, many would have made it.

    I have posted a few times regarding my suspicion that making a 320x320 screen that's less than 2x2" is either prohibitively expensive or not possible using today's technology. I wish someone with insight into LCD technology could illuminate us.

    Just ranting (begging?) that you NEED this much resolution in this size screen isn't going to make it happen.

    Let's start by trying to understand if it's possible and how much it would cost. No one that I know of has this kind of pixel density in any cosumer device. Not even the highest end laptops have this pixel density.

    Lastly, it's a company's proragative when to advertise a new product. This has no bearing on the "state of technology" today.

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