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  1.    #21  
    Originally posted by gmaugham
    Messages sent using your phones e-mail address are NOT shortmail.
    By my phone's e-mail address, do you mean phonenumber@messaging.sprintpcs.com? If so, and these messages are not ShortMail (and I believe that they are not), what are they called?
  2.    #22  
    Originally posted by gmaugham
    Treo300SMS DOES retrieve the shortmail messages from the Sprint server. It doesn't have anything to do with messages that are sent to your phone using its e-mail address or from the Sprint messaging website
    So, ShortMail is different from messages sent using the phone's e-mail address, Right?

    And if I didn't have Treo300SMS, I would have to go to a web page to read my ShortMail, Right?
  3. #23  
    Originally posted by BillFugina


    So, ShortMail is different from messages sent using the phone's e-mail address, Right?

    And if I didn't have Treo300SMS, I would have to go to a web page to read my ShortMail, Right?
    No. The message may appear on the web page, but these messages are sent directly to your phone by Sprint, not by TreoSMS.

    Only the messages sent from the treo go to the TreoSMS server run by PDA apps.

    I receive SMS on my TREO and I do NOT have TREO SMS installed.
  4. KKenna's Avatar
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    #24  
    I think you need to highlight the fact that there are two types of text messages (Let's forget the SMS .vs Short Mail for now). There are one-way text messages and two-way text messages. All the Treos are designed to be able to receive the one-way vareity. If they couldn't, you would have no voicemail indicator as this feature is used to turn it on and off. When someone choses to leave their callback number rather than a voicemail when you don't answer, the one-way text message service is used as well.

    Two-way text messages are a different story. On the Sprint system, these are really closer to e-mail than text message. If you go to your manage site, login and go to the messaging section, you will see that you have a Short Mail Inbox. The process of getting a two-way text message to your Treo goes like this:

    Someone sends you a two-way text message.

    It gets delivered to your Short Mail Inbox on Sprint's servers.

    Sprint's servers then send a custom one-way text message to your Treo which triggers a fetch of the new message off the web site to your phone.

    The message arrives on your phone.

    Now, depending on where the message originates you are receiving either a one-way or two-way text message.

    Treo300SMS does absolutely nothing to assist in the retrieval of either one-way or two-way text messages. It only enables the Treo to send PCS Short Mail from the Treo by using the PDA Apps SMS proxy server.

    Clear enough ?
  5.    #25  
    Originally posted by Smartphone Fan
    No. The message may appear on the web page, but these messages are sent directly to your phone by Sprint, not by TreoSMS.
    That's interesing.

    I uninstalled Treo300SMS and sent a ShortMail message to my phone and I did inded get a pop-up on my phone, but the pop-up says to go to http://smwl.uc.sprintpcs.com/sml/wap.do?alert=true to read my message.

    Later, I re-installed Treo300SMS and send another ShortMail message and the pop-up came up, but after the pop-up, SMS proceeded to download the message automatically.

    It seems that your system works differently than mine. Perhaps it is because you are in a different part of the country.

    I am in Dallas, and here only messages sent to MyPhoneNumber@messaging.sprintpcs.com (which I believe are not the same as ShortMail or SMS but something completely different) are sent as a pop-up.

    ShortMail on the other hand goes to a place that can only be read from a web page. When a new ShortMail comes in, I do indeed get a pop-up, but that pop-up only says to go to the web page to read my message.

    However, Treo300SMS not only lets me send messages, but it will intercept the pop-ups and get the ShortMail text from the web page and put it into the SMS program on the Treo.
  6. #26  
    Originally posted by KKenna
    Treo300SMS does absolutely nothing to assist in the retrieval of either one-way or two-way text messages. It only enables the Treo to send PCS Short Mail from the Treo by using the PDA Apps SMS proxy server.

    Clear enough ?
    Clear, but wrong. If you are sent a shortmail (not one-way message) to your Treo 300 and don't have Treo300SMS installed, you receive a notification that you have a message and a URL where to get it.

    With Treo300SMS, this message and URL are intercepted by the program and the message is retrieved. You will find it basically impossible to get two-way (shortmail) messages on your Treo 300 without Treo300SMS, since Blazer can't even work with the URL that is sent by Sprint's shortmail servers.

    I think everyone will agree that it would be a lot simpler for all of us users if Sprint just switched to true SMS and joined the rest of the world. I understand that's not expected until later this year.

    Geoffrey
  7. #27  
    Originally posted by gmaugham


    Clear, but wrong. If you are sent a shortmail (not one-way message) to your Treo 300 and don't have Treo300SMS installed, you receive a notification that you have a message and a URL where to get it.

    With Treo300SMS, this message and URL are intercepted by the program and the message is retrieved. You will find it basically impossible to get two-way (shortmail) messages on your Treo 300 without Treo300SMS, since Blazer can't even work with the URL that is sent by Sprint's shortmail servers.
    That is entirely true.
  8.    #28  
    Originally posted by gmaugham
    With Treo300SMS, this message and URL are intercepted by the program and the message is retrieved. You will find it basically impossible to get two-way (shortmail) messages on your Treo 300 without Treo300SMS, since Blazer can't even work with the URL that is sent by Sprint's shortmail servers.
    Geoffrey,

    Thank you for putting it so clearly. This is exactly what I've been thinking.

    1. One-Way Messaging is what was broken on my Treo. Up until a little while ago I didn't know what this was called and was confusing it with SMS and ShortMail. I do believe others are making the same mistake.

    2. I called Sprint for help, but being uninformed, asked them to help me fix SMS and ShortMail.

    3. Sprint told me that they do not support SMS or ShortMail on Treo300 without third party software in which case they don't support it anyway.

    4. I fixed my one-way messaging by removing a hack.

    5. It is true that Sprint does not support SMS or ShortMail in any way (sending or receiving) on the Treo 300, but One-Way messaging should work fine as long as you don't mess it up with a hack.

    6. If you install Treo300SMS on your Treo, not only will it allow you to send SMS messages, but it will allow you to receive SMS messages without having to go to through a web browser.
    Last edited by BillFugina; 03/29/2003 at 03:21 PM.
  9. #29  
    Originally posted by BillFugina


    Geoffrey,

    Thank you for putting it so clearly. This is exactly what I've been thinking.

    1. One-Way Messaging is what was broken on my Treo. Up until a little while ago I didn't know what this was called and was confusing it with SMS and ShortMail. I do believe others are making the same mistake.

    2. I called Sprint for help, but being uninformed, asked them to help me fix SMS and ShortMail.

    3. Sprint told me that they do not support SMS or ShortMail on Treo300 without third party software in which case they don't support it anyway.

    4. I fixed my one-way messaging by removing a hack.

    5. It is true that Sprint does not support SMS or ShortMail in any way (sending or receiving) on the Treo 300, but One-Way messaging should work fine as long as you don't mess it up with a hack.

    6. If you install Treo300SMS on your Treo, not only will it allow you to send SMS messages, but it will allow you to receive SMS messages without having to go to through a web browser.
    This is really confusing because one way messaging is the receive only part of SMS. On my TREO 300 it works perfectly. I do not receive any link to the web site.

    When I originally received the TREO, SMS was broken. Sprint had to reconfigure my account to get it working again.

    Now, I can receive a SprintPCS Short Message or SMS, either from their web site, or from email to "phone number"@messaging.sprintpcs.com.

    When I had TREOSMS installed, It allowed me to send or respond to a SMS.
  10. #30  
    Originally posted by Smartphone Fan
    Now, I can receive a SprintPCS Short Message or SMS, either from their web site, or from email to "phone number"@messaging.sprintpcs.com.

    When I had TREOSMS installed, It allowed me to send or respond to a SMS.
    As I stated earlier, when sent from the web site or with the "phonenumber@messaging.sprintpcs.com, it is not shortmail. This is why you can receive it without Treo300SMS.

    If it is sent from a Sprint phone using the shortmail function or a non-Sprint phone using SMS, you will get the link quoted earlier and be unable to read it, unless you have Treo300SMS.

    Geoffrey
  11. #31  
    Wow.. lots of good info here...

    I find it interesting, though... not using Treo300SMS, if I try to go to the URL in that message sent with Blazer, it doesn't load.

    Doing an nslookup on the server name returns a 10.x.x.x IP address, which is private network, and likely only accessible either with a certain Sprint proxy, or within a certain Sprint network.

    Thoughts? Ideas?

    - Mike
  12. #32  
    Originally posted by Smartphone Fan


    1) yes they are the same. The only difference is that with SMS you have received the message on the phone and had an alert go off on the phone to communicate that a message is ready to be read.

    2) That is correct. TreoSMS only automates the sending of messages from the Treo300. THis is a function built in to the SMS messaging app, but not active. TreoSMS activates the send message function, and uses the PDAapps proxy server as the send message server. The Treo 180 and 270 have bidirectional SMS with the built in handspring application, but uses the GSM network.

    I want to specifically state that I completly am impressed with TreoSMS and am very happy PDA apps found a market and filled it. THe problem is that SprintPCS should provide this service and the caution over how can PDA apps stay in business with out having to charge for renewal in the future...
    Here are the facts from the developers of Treo300SMS:-)

    First let's get some terminology right-- Sprint supports one way-text messages which can be sent to your phone from a variety of ways. The most common are the <your-10-digit-phone-number>@messaging.sprintpcs.com and the "guest" messaging web page on Sprint's website (messaging.sprintpcs.com). Sprint has supported 1-way text messaging for a long time including on non-vision devices.

    Sprint also supports shortmail. You can send and receive shortmail by going to your messaging portal at the Sprint "manage" site. Shortmail is not "pulled"/"pushed" to any Sprint phone. Instead, a notification is "pushed". On devices with a "mini-browser" that can talk to Sprint's WAP/HDML gateway, you can access this shortmail by going to a HDML version of the messaging portal. When you send shortmail to a non Sprint phone, it gets converted to a (set of) SMS message(s). When a non-Sprint phone sends you SMS (addressed by phone number), it gets converted to Sprint shortmail. When a non-Sprint phone sends you email-via-SMS, i.e., using the <number>@messaging.sprintpcs.com mechanism, it gets converted to a simple 1-way text message.

    The Treo can receive 1-way text messages (without Treo300SMS or any other application) if everything is configured right on their accounts. Unfortunately, Sprint has a bug in their provisioning software which has been very hard to track down, which causes the 1-way text messaging thing to break for many Treo and I330 users periodically. This usually happens when you make changes to your service plan or at the end of your billing cycle, or when Sprint does "software upgrades" to their messaging infrastructure.

    As of today, the Treo cannot receive or send shortmail natively. Contrary to what has been said here by some people, there is no logic (disabled or otherwise) in the Handspring SMS application to send or receive shortmail, atleast none that we have been able to find. When you receive shortmail, the shortmail servers send you a 1-way text message ("shortmail notification") with a URL for the WAP/HDML version of the shortmail portal. You can only access this web page from inside Sprint's network (which your Treo is, incidently) but only via Sprint's WAP/HDML gateway for which your Treo is not provisioned and for which you would need some WAP/HDML browser. Although Blazer does WAP and HDML, it cannot talk to Sprint's WAP/HDML gateway because Blazer itself uses a proxy that lies outside Sprint's network and because your Treo is not provisioned at the Sprint's WAP/HDML gateway.

    What Treo300SMS does is that when you get a "shortmail notification", it notifies the PDAapps proxy server which fetches your new message from the shortmail portal and delivers this new message(s) to your phone via a 1-way text message. On the send side, when you send a SMS message using Treo300SMS it is send to the PDAapps proxy server which then sends it to the Sprint shortmail portal. When you send email-via-SMS, the PDAapps proxy server sends it directly to the email address you specifiy using vanilla SMTP.

    The Treo300SMS functionality is (from a UI standpoint) folded into the Handspring SMS application. This is on purpose because we wanted to give you a simple interface where you sould send and receive 1-way text messages, shortmail, and email-via-SMS messages. The way this is achieved is via a set of operating system patchs which modify the behavior of the SMS application causing Treo300SMS code to be executed when certain UI events occur. When you click on the new button in the Handspring SMS application, you are really now in the Treo300SMS application although you do not see it explicitly. All of this is done behind the scenes for simplicity of user experience.

    PDAapps
  13. #33  
    Ok, now I am frustrated...

    I am currently testing a Cingular SonyEricsson T62U, TDMA, GSM, AMPS.

    I have some problems with the Cingular Network. Some areas in my region are Roaming, sometimes within the same building.

    Now, in it's base area, with GSM, it has fantastic SMS.

    I sent a SMS from the T62U to my SprintPCS number.

    On the SprintWeb site, I can read the message. I can reply from the web site and get the message on the T62U.

    THis is how SMS should work.

    The frustration appears when I move to my Treo.

    On the TREO, I can now confirm that a web link appears in the Message application, not the actual message.

    Please help here, without using TREOSMS, how do I retrieve and read the message on the TREO?

    I have tried to access the SprintPCS web site using Blazer and Eudora Web.

    With Blazer, the SprintPCS link for messaging does not allow or have a choice that brings me to the two way short message area.

    There also is not a choice to manage my SprintPCS Web Mail either, just the business connection, which I do not subsribe to.

    I also could not log on with Eudora Web.

    How do I get access to the Short Message site at SprintPCS with my TREO? (again, without TreoSMS, using Blazer or Eudora Web?

    Note, that I have full access to my email at Sprint and at my ISP with Eudora.

    So, I confirm other posters frustrations.

    One general question. There are other SprintPCS Vision phones other than our favorite Smartphones. Do any of these phones (Samsung A500, N400 or LG 5350) have:

    1) access to email (Sprint or other ISP)?

    2) two way short messaging.

    SprintPCS keeps my business becasue of the cost of service and unlimited Vision. THe problem is that Vision is not providing the service I need. Blockage of the Kyocera 7135, Difficult SMS and the removal of support for the use of the phone as a computer modem link to the Vision Network are prime examples of problems with Sprint.

    ATT has the coverage I need, but it is TDMA or GSM not both. The GSM coverage in my region is great, but ATT will not sell me GSM service, only TDMA service and ATT does not have a dual TDMA/GSM phone.

    Cingular has a multiple network phone (TDMA/GSM/AMPS), but it roams onto the ATT network, but charges me roaming rates. I have read that ATT and Cingular have just lowered the rates they charge each other for roaming use of their networks, but the lowered rates are not being passed on to ATT or Cingular customers.

    Cingular and ATT are jointly building out their GPRS/GSM networks but they are not making things easy for their customers to use these networks.

    TMobile is GSM only. No AMPS backup or TDMA.

    I am sure most other users have similar problems. Anyone with any ideas?
  14. #34  
    Originally posted by PDAapps


    Here are the facts from the developers of Treo300SMS:-)...

    The Treo300SMS functionality is (from a UI standpoint) folded into the Handspring SMS application. This is on purpose because we wanted to give you a simple interface where you sould send and receive 1-way text messages, shortmail, and email-via-SMS messages. The way this is achieved is via a set of operating system patchs which modify the behavior of the SMS application causing Treo300SMS code to be executed when certain UI events occur. When you click on the new button in the Handspring SMS application, you are really now in the Treo300SMS application although you do not see it explicitly. All of this is done behind the scenes for simplicity of user experience.

    PDAapps
    Thank you for a fantastic explanation.

    Not really a quesiton for PDA apps, but the messaging application for the Treo 180/270 is two from the phone. Is the messaging app different on the 300 because of the Sprint/GSM differences?
  15. #35  
    This is for the poster with the Sony Ericcson device.

    Once again, without Treo300SMS, you cannot receive those shortmail messages, which are how the SMS from you Cingular phone come through.

    Please review my previous posting on this subject, along with the one just prior to yours for further clarification.

    Geoffrey
  16.    #36  
    Originally posted by Smartphone Fan
    How do I get access to the Short Message site at SprintPCS with my TREO? (again, without TreoSMS, using Blazer or Eudora Web?
    This is what I've been trying to get across.

    You cannot access Short Mail (a.k.a. SMS) on a Treo without Treo300SMS. Sprint doesn't support SMS or Short Mail on Treo 300.

    Only One-Way Messaging works on Treo without third party software. Sprint will support this, but you have to be sure to call it One-Way Messaging when you call for support.

    If you call Sprint and ask for help with Short Mail or SMS, they will tell you that they cannot help you.

    If you want to send or receive Short Mail or SMS on a Treo 300, you should get Treo300SMS; it is well worth it.
  17. #37  
    Originally posted by BillFugina


    This is what I've been trying to get across.

    You cannot access Short Mail (a.k.a. SMS) on a Treo without Treo300SMS. Sprint doesn't support SMS or Short Mail on Treo 300.

    Only One-Way Messaging works on Treo without third party software. Sprint will support this, but you have to be sure to call it One-Way Messaging when you call for support.

    If you call Sprint and ask for help with Short Mail or SMS, they will tell you that they cannot help you.

    If you want to send or receive Short Mail or SMS on a Treo 300, you should get Treo300SMS; it is well worth it.
    Yeah. PDA Apps in the post above clear explains why. The Browser is not tuned to the task. We all know of the limits of the Messaging app.

    I guess the answer really is TREO SMS from PDA apps or abdonment of Sprint. From my previous post, Sprint's competition all have problems also.

    I thought the ongoing debate between Sprint and Verizon users and the anger about the availability of the Kyocera 7135 was bad. THe fundimental problem is the different companies and the limits of their networks.
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