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  1.    #1  
    any thoughts on this? who is the ideal w consumer? and who is the ideal treo consumer? any are we all better off with a telephone focused pda?
  2. #2  
    My opinion is that the W is targeted at the Blackberry, not the Treo. It is focused on data, not voice.

    From a data standpoint, it is GSM/GPRS instead of the CDMA/1xRTT of the Treo 300, which means it is a little slower. It also, though, means real SMS, for what that is worth. Judge for yourself as to the coverage of these systems in your area.

    As for voice, the W views it as an after thought. You have to use a hands free kit with it. The didn't even integrate Bluetooth in a meaningfull way, as you can't use a Bluetooth-integrated hands free kit like the Jabra with it. (No, not even with the Palm Bluetooth SD card, it doesn't support the headset profile.)

    That being said, it supports PalmOS 4.x, is expandable with both SD/SDIO/MMC card slot and a Palm Universal connector. The Handspring Treo connector isn't inferrior to the Universal Connector; there just aren't as many gizmos for it.

    In conclusion, if you need the unit as a phone, and you aren't one of those people with a headset dongle surgically implanted in your ear, it may be worthwhile.

    As for me, the Treo has less compromises, it is good as a phone, and has best of class data speeds. The W seems a little weird to me. It has the best talk time in the industry, but they make it so that you won't want to use it for voice. It seems more data centric, but they chose GPRS to showcase it.
  3.    #3  
    I think I am beginning to understand the nuance-differences but not from a techie standpoint. what exactly is GSM/GPRS and "real SMC"?

    My ideal use for the palm/phone
    -palm os
    -remote web access for my groupwise account, ideally using palm query application (supposedly free with groupwise 6)
    -emailing clients
    -checking voicemail
    -calling into the office
    -managing my contact list (huge)
    -calling from my palm address booklet
    -keeping memos
    -dialing and talking on the phone while driving (ideal voice activated calling)
    -decent battery. Sometimes I'm out of the office for a week, and won't be able to be at my desk, recharging. I'd like to leave the phone on all day, and check my voicemail and email all day long without needing to recharge
    -web access for mapquest, financials, etc.
    -affordable data access
    -fast data access (via the web and changing among different applications)

    there are aspects of the t|w (i.e, 10 hours), that I find appealing. But I am concerned the ATT is going to gouge on the phone plan mmode for data access, whereas Spring treo has unlimited access
  4. #4  
    Here are my thoughts...

    Tungsten W Pros:
    1) I really like the idea of a 320x320 screen. I also wasn't super-impressed with the quality of the Treo screen. Color saturation seems a good deal better than on my Samsung i300, but I'd imagine that the Tungsten W's reflective screen will be better still.

    2) SD slot (though, as has been mentioned, it doesn't seem to be SDIO).

    Cons:
    1) Navigation pad instead of scroll wheel. IMO, using the device one-handed to make a call will be much easier using the scroll wheel on the Treo.

    2) "Data-centric". I personally think this word is another way of saying "it makes a lousy phone." Just as Palm was announcing the Tungsten W a while back (which had been modeled after RIM's first voice-enabled Blackberry which also required a headset), Blackberry was announcing their next-gen model which had a microphone and speaker built-in. Once again, Palm was a step behind.

    Some other nit-picks:
    * I like the way Handspring put the numbers on the thumbboard in a numeric keypad layout. The Tungsten W puts them all along the top (like a traditional QWERTY keyboard). This is another little thing that makes it a better phone.

    * I dislike how both Handspring and Palm have all of the keys tilted in the same direction. Take a look at the Blackberry devices. The keys on the left half of the device are tilted in the opposite direction. This makes it easier to thumb-type with both hands. Palm and Handspring's designs would lead me to believe that they expect people to thumbtype with one hand (the right hand).

    One unknown is how the monthly data plans will be priced. I'd be willing to bet that Palm hasn't negotiated an affordable unlimited data plan with AT&T, so this would be another area where the Treo 300 would win out.

    My ideal device would probably be something along the lines of a Treo 300 with OS5/ARM, a 320x320 screen (reflective or transflective), an SD (preferably SDIO) slot, and removable battery.

    Scott
  5. #5  
    <quote>I think I am beginning to understand the nuance-differences but not from a techie standpoint. what exactly is GSM/GPRS and "real SMS"? </quote>

    GSM is a standard for cell phone communications, as is the CDMA used on the Treo 300. As an FYI, the Treo 180 and 270 both use GSM. Although you could argue the technical merits of both (it has a tendency of being a bit of a religious issue), which one to choose really comes down to geography. Outside the U.S., you almost have no choice, you need to go GSM. CDMA is only used in the U.S. and Korea.

    In the U.S., the carriers Sprint and Verizon (and a handful of small others) use CDMA. Cingular, T-Mobile and AT&T (currently in the process of migration) use GSM. Check local coverage, and that would help a decision.

    Now, having said that, GPRS is the data service that runs on top of GSM. The data service used on CDMA is 1xRTT. Although both of these standards have higher data rate potentials than I am about to quote, currently carriers that offer GPRS max out at around 28kbps and 1xRTT maxes out at around 56kbps.

    SMS is "Short Messaging Service". It is a standard for sending quick text messages from one phone to another. The Treo 300 is more crippled out of the box than most Sprint PCS phones, in the fact that it can only receive messages, and cannot send them without 3rd party software. With most Sprint phones, you can use your WAP browser to log into Sprints web site to send a text message.

    When I described "real" SMS, what I mean is support for the SMS standard. With "real" SMS, you can use one of many dozen SMS applications out their for the Palm. You can create messages off-line, and only connect to the net when you want to send them (which was a lot more handy when you were being billed for "per-minute" rather than being charged "by-the-byte", or even the current "unlimited" plans now being offered by Sprint.)

    Other carriers are advancing rapidly to enhance SMS, and many support a standard now called MMS (multimedia messaging service). This allows you to send graphics and sounds along with your short text message. Sprint is now playing "catch up" because it decided to do things in a non-standard way.
  6.    #6  
    Okay. Now I think I am beginning to understand...

    odd that tungsten|w is using GPRS (which is technically slower) than CDMA bc t|w is supposed to be "data centric"

    I don't plan on using the phone out of the country any time soon. if on vacation, i prefer to be unreachable. So the GPRS is not that attractive... though I will check ATT's coverage area compared to Sprint

    I have no use for SMS bc I don't intend to send messages to another phone, I'll just email that person instead.

    The treo is sounding pretty good. The clincher for me will be whether I can remotely access my groupwise account at work. It seems that the tungsten|w has some application to assist in this respect. I'd rather log into the system and have access to all my documents, etc. than merely forward messages via POP. Though I am getting confused b/t the Palm Query Application ("PQA") and IMAP. Are they the same thing? Is one preferable. Shall I take the easy route and just have work forward my emails to a yahoo account. But then, I am concerned with security. I wish my IT people were as excited as I am about this. But I think they're too busy with other projects...
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    #7  
    I agree with revious
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    #8  
    I agree with previous on the data centric nature of the T- W it is a shame that Palm did not go for a full PDA/Phone device. However I need to say that I LIKE certain things about the T-W:
    1) The antenna.
    2) Not having the cover.
    3) Like scrolling pad
    4) The screen
    5) The SD option.

    Hopefully the next TREO if it comes could resolve the following:

    1) Current Os
    2) Screen for outdoor use.
    3) SD Expansion
    4) Chipset
    5) SMS
    6) System Volume ( i.e Speaker )
  9. #9  
    Originally posted by Scott R

    * I dislike how both Handspring and Palm have all of the keys tilted in the same direction. Take a look at the Blackberry devices. The keys on the left half of the device are tilted in the opposite direction. This makes it easier to thumb-type with both hands. Palm and Handspring's designs would lead me to believe that they expect people to thumbtype with one hand (the right hand).
    I never noticed that before! Interesting. I have a Blackberry pager, 857, and a 5810. The pager style keyboard is bigger than the rest, and the handheld style is about the same size as the Treo.

    Though I'm actually faster on the Treo than the others. Weird huh. I believe it's because the Treo keyboard's rows are slightly tighter, which makes for quicker thumb travel.
  10. #10  
    Originally posted by sparkky


    <snip>

    odd that tungsten|w is using GPRS (which is technically slower) than CDMA bc t|w is supposed to be "data centric"

    <snip

    Not that odd at all if you look at it from a marketing standpoint. Approximately 82% of the world's portable phones are GSM. In other words, more opportunity to sell the devices in Europe and Asia.
  11.    #11  
    You might find this interesting re GSM v. CDMA

    http://www.mcommercetimes.com/Technology/95



    But I'm still spinning re t|w versus treo300

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