View Poll Results: would you like to see handspring release a 270g?

Voters
70. You may not vote on this poll
  • yes, i think that is important

    24 34.29%
  • no, i think keyboard rules

    37 52.86%
  • i don\'t really care

    9 12.86%
Results 1 to 19 of 19
  1.    #1  
    what about a graffitti version?
    nothing on handspring.com to imply that such a device will be released.

    anybody have any information with regard to this?

    thanks
  2. #2  
    Handspring has said there will be no "g" version.
    Felipe
    On the road to 5,000 posts
    Life is what happens between Firmware releases.
  3. #3  
    I am a long time graffiti user..fairly proficient at 33 WPM....but I will never go back to graffiti again. The keyboard on the device makes the Treo a pleasure to use. The graffiti model I had was ugly and did not look like a real phone or communicator device.
  4. #4  
    I agree with Yardie. I started using the palms from the original pilotpro (The USRobotic one ). I even write my shorthand notes using grafitti (that's paper & pen people ). Extremely proficient with Grafitti. That being said, I will NEVER get another device, specially if I'm going to be emailing someone or calling someone that does NOT have a keyboard. I already ditched my RIM device. It IS that much better!. International characters are a breeze now. Now it is backlit, so, of course it rules!
  5. #5  
    Any attachment I have for Graffiti at this point is sentimental. The keyboard is clearly faster in my case, and I don't even have a Treo. I played with a 180 for about 10 minutes at CompUSA over the weekend, and was already at 80% of my Graffiti input speed (~30 wpm). It would probably take a day or two of practice to match or exceed the speed I've developed over the last four years with the pen.

    That was also my experience moving from the alleged HRW of the Newton 110 to the character recognition of the Palm III. Theoretically, handwriting recognition should be better, but for me it isn't.

    Playing with the 180, I also liked the fact that I almost never had to pull out the stylus or touch the screen. While the jog dial hasn't quite reached Sony's level of functionality, with a third party solution we should before long be able to work with the jog dial and keyboard almost entirely.

    But the reality is that while half of Palm users polled say they want Graffiti, the 180k has outsold the 180g 10-to-1, according to a Handspring rep at a PUG. The migration from Graffiti must have some significance considering that it was instigated by its inventor and patent holder.
  6. #6  
    Bought the 180---and hated it.  Returned it for the Graffiti model.  An important part of what I do with my PDA is taking notes while observing the object I'm transcribing.  I can take notes on the 180g without looking at the Treo --- impossible with the 180.

    Everyone will disagree with me on this, but I think the keyboard is a step backward in the evolution of PDA's.  I had expected that true handwriting recognition would one day surplant Graffiti, but now it seems most companies are headed in the direction of tiny keyboards.  Although, I suppose tiny keyboards are a better means than Graffiti when it comes to easing people into PDA acceptance.  

    On a side note --- the best PDA I ever owned was my Newton 2000 MessagePad. It's handwriting recognition was far superior to both Graffiti and Jot.  Too bad it was the size of a VHS tape.
  7. #7  
    I had the original Pilot 1000, then upgraded the memory to the equivalent of the 5000, had 2 of the Palm III (after one stolen) and currently have a Vx. After serious frustrations with my Graffiti skills (constant re-writing) I bought a small Targus keyboard but found having another piece of hardware too inconvenient. So thank goodness for the 180 and 270.

    I assume the decsion on no-270g is based on the relative sales performance of the 180 vs. 180g. Graffiti was a great idea when the amount of inputting was minimal, but with SMS and e-mailing, it's just too slow... for me.
    Last edited by vcvet; 06/10/2002 at 03:17 PM.
  8. #8  
    The keyboard is nice to use, but you still need two hands very often, while HS argument for not making a grafitti version is the ease of use with one hand.

    Sorry HS, this is no argument.

    HS has proven with the Treo 180 that a grafitti version is not more expensive or dificult to build than the keyboard version.

    Fact is that if there would be a 270g, HS could still sell 5 to 10% more units.
    Very usefull if HS is trying to be the market leader.
  9. #9  
    Its not useful for Hanhdspring to waste time, space and resources when everyone is buying teh keyboard model. The 10 - 12% that you count does not take into account the folks that are willing to switch (like me) or the folks that bought the Graffiti version and wish to get the keyboard instead. i originally bought the Graffiti version and sold it to buy a keyboard version.
  10. #10  
    Look at the poll, people.. Grafitti is almost as popular as the keyboard. As for me, I was only waiting for color with grafitti before switching. At this point, I don't even want a treo. Just to get to the apps you have to use shift and some button. To choose which text field you want to write in you have to hit a button a few times or try to juggle the stylus and the keyboard. The whole reason I like palms is that I can whip them out and get to the info I want in a couple strokes. Now you're looking at juggling buttons and keys and a stylus. It's clunky and a joke. I've tried the treo with the keyboard and I feel more comfortable with a pocketpc. It just annoys me.
  11. #11  
    Originally posted by scstraus
    Look at the poll, people.. Grafitti is almost as popular as the keyboard.
    Most PDA users don't subscribe to this poll. It's hardly a statistical cross section of PDA users represented in the polls. I am sure that HS made the decision only with good market data and also with historical data from the 180g and 180.
  12.    #12  
    unless handspring scratches the 180g from its current offering, and stops producing them, i really don't see what the big deal is in offering a 270g. looking at it in terms of supply chain and so forth, it really makes no difference, since they already have to deal with whatever suppliers they do deal with to build the 180g and the regular 270.

    besides, companies often need to offer a complete set of products to pls its customerbase, especially when you talk about something as personal as a palm. graffitti might not be everybody's favorite and might not be as fast as keyboard (i personally perfer graffiti to keyboard), but it is part of the Tao of Palm and the legendary OS.

    frankly the way things are going now, i think palm os might be in serious trouble. the info i seem to get certainly suggests that it is losing ground to PPC (although it is still far ahead). with palm's moves since the release of os 3.5 or 4 (i cannot recall), and its attempts to be the microsoft of the pda world, one can smell trouble. the ingeniously usable os could become the macintosh of pda's and the world of handheld devices. the phonepda combo by handspring is a must-do-to-survive-and-compete move, but i am not sure if dropping graffitti out the picture helps. has anybody seen kyocera's phonepda combo. the best of all worlds if you ask me. a graffitti area and regular 'big' keys for quick dialling and typing while you drive and need to feel your way around the keyboard (12 buttons is a lot less than the treo keyboard has, especially that you can actually press them with ease - maybe i just have big hands).

    just some thoughts.
    Beblawi
  13. #13  
    I've ordered the 270 and plan to run RecoEcho on it so I'll soon get a chance to see which of the two I like best. I expect to find myself using both quite a bit.

    But one thing that a lot of people seem to be ignoring in the Keyboard vs. Graffiti debate is that a lot of popular hacks require a swipe across the Graffiti area to activate. I use App/DA Launcher a lot and will have to replace it with something else since App/DA Launcher works by splitting up the Launcher silk screen button into four areas. I'm thinking maybe DA Launcher + Switcheroo + Phlegm Hack. I'll need three hacks driven by three different keyboard combinations to replace App/DA Launcher on the Treo 270.

    There are a lot more of these hacks out there. It will take a while to find keyboard driven replacements for them. Several of them are running on my Treo 180g right now: AsciiPop, DiddleBug ScreenCap, PocketWatch+, ScreenShot, and XMSwitchSet. I'm willing to put up with the hassle of replacing or losing a lot of Graffiti area driven hacks with keyboard equivalents but not everyone else who uses a lot of these hacks will follow suit.
  14. #14  
    beblawi wrote:
    has anybody seen kyocera's phonepda combo. the best of all worlds if you ask me. a graffitti area and regular 'big' keys for quick dialling and typing while you drive and need to feel your way around the keyboard (12 buttons is a lot less than the treo keyboard has, especially that you can actually press them with ease - maybe i just have big hands).


    I own one, while waiting for a CDMA Treo to hit the market. The hard buttons were the main reason for choosing it over the Samsung I-300. It's a great phone, especially at today's blowout prices (~$130).

    But I'm still waiting for the Treo. The size of the Kyo leaves something to be desired, for starters. But its main Achilles' heel is Graffiti. Whenever I needed to write longer entries on the Visor, I'd use the Stowaway (which has only now become available for the Kyo); I'd use Graffiti primarily for single-line entries. Writing a 200-word email in Graffiti is not fun. More often than not I'd just call to avoid pulling out the stylus.

    I don't dial or talk on a cell while driving, but the Kyo and the Samsung have the Treo beat hands down on that score. They use voice dialing.
  15. #15  
    Originally posted by DarthRepublican
    But one thing that a lot of people seem to be ignoring in the Keyboard vs. Graffiti debate is that a lot of popular hacks require a swipe across the Graffiti area to activate.
    Actually the keyboard model has a "swipe" button right above the SMS/mail button or two to the right from the spacebar.

    You'll probably be as surprized as most of the other "G" users that are now sold on the keyboard. At least I hope it works out that well for you

    Rod
    "Happy are they whose sins are forgiven, whose wrongs are pardoned"

    Romans 4:7
  16.    #16  
    i was referring to the new kyocera palm os phone.
    it is not on the market yet, they only announced it and gave little details. it is a small phone, might be color screen, might even have an expansion slot, plus the graffiitti area and real phone buttons bit i spoke about.

    the problem is that this is what ppl are speculating from images that were posted on some pda website earlier this month, but have now been removed. there is no official word out about them yet. will wait and see i guess
    Beblawi
  17. #17  
    Originally posted by Veloslave


    Actually the keyboard model has a "swipe" button right above the SMS/mail button or two to the right from the spacebar.
    No, the keyboard model has a "command stroke" ( :menu: ) button. It can't replicate a swipe from the Menu silkscreen button to the Find silkscreen button or a swipe from the top right corner of the Graffiti area to the screen or any of the myriad strokes that can be used to activate Graffiti hacks. It will be interesting to see if I can remember as many keyboard combinations as I can swipe across the Graffiti area.

    You'll probably be as surprized as most of the other "G" users that are now sold on the keyboard.
    I certainly hope so! There should be no reason why I couldn't learn to use the keyboard as well as Graffiti.
  18. #18  
    beblawi wrote:
    i was referring to the new kyocera palm os phone. it is not on the market yet, they only announced it and gave little details. it is a small phone, might be color screen, might even have an expansion slot, plus the graffiitti area and real phone buttons bit i spoke about.


    The color screen, the smaller form factor and the possible expansion slot would change things a little, but it wouldn't fundamentally alter the usability if it uses the same T9 numeric keypad and Graffiti for text entry like the Kyo 6035 (a Palm OS phone) already does. It's great for writing down names and numbers, but isn't so great for writing emails longer than a sentence or two.

    When I'm using a PDA and stylus while standing, I find that the hand holding the PDA doesn't have sufficient leverage for sustained writing, which is what makes the thumb keyboard a more attractive solution.

    Still, I really like the 6035 and look forward to seeing the newer model.
  19. #19  
    I love the keyboard on the Treo - even with my big old clumsy thumbs. I guess my bug with Graffiti stems from my inability or lack of interest to learn all them strokes

    I've been Microwriting for years on a very old AgendA organiser. It's fast and really easy to learn. Microwriting uses a chord based system on (mainly) five keys to type letters - all punctuation and numbers etc can also be input. Bellaire Electronics recently released CyKey, an IR Microwriting keyboard. I use Documents To Go from dataViz and do a lot of text entry. I can now input text at twice my handwriting speed... impossible with Graffiti or a thumb 'board.

    So, for mass text entry, I have found no substitute for Microwriting - it's completely wireless (uses IR) and it looks so wierd when you're doing it.

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