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  1.    #1  
    Any Treo-teers out there have any comments or observations on the competition? Specifically the upcoming Danger device and the new Pogo device currently on sale in europe?

    I've seen the new iPaq GSM/GPRS sled from Compaq and it's a pig. Three times the size of the treo and $399 minus service. I'm not sure of the benefits other than color.

    I've been watching the Danger and Pogo devices but have heard very little about them. The browser compression technology over normal GSM services looks interesting but then again GPRS speed hasn't impressed me one bit. Maybe we just have to wait out for an explosion in the builkd out of public WiFi networks.
    it's an endless search of temporary joys
  2. #2  
    well, i've no experiencew with the danger device, but ive read literally everything available on the internet about it, and talked to someone who's used it.

    the guy who i talke to said that web browsing was "just fine" (said as if it were quite good in fact). he said it looked great as was going to buy one as soon as they came out.

    because the danger hiptop uses proxy browsing over gprs, the speed should be thoretically quite good. the proxy servers will be owned and run by your cellphone company. dollar for dollar, the danger looks a lot better than the treo on paper. th big deciding factor for me will be how good it's pim functions are, and thats something no one has said or written anything about yet.
    -thorin

    I have a webcomic. You should read it, or I may do something rash. <b><a href=http://driveby.keenspace.com/>Drive-by Loitering</a></b> is updated every monday, wednesday and friday.

    <!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks."><img src=http://www.frontfly.com/vcsig.gif ><!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks.">
  3. #3  
    At this point, I am re-considering the BlueTooth Phone
    with BlueTooth PDA.

    After playing with the Treo 180g today, while the size is nice,
    I think the blue tooth solution is going to better meet my demands.

    A small phone like the Erricson T39 for those times when
    I just don't need to lug the PDA....

    And the PDA when I need both.

    And frankly, If I want MultiMedia, my desktop is better for that.

    Part of the problem, is this:

    GSM service gives me the ability to switch devices on demand via the SIM card.... when I don't want to be a geek, I can use the small phone.

    Sprint, however, as better phone coverage (granted, analog is
    expensive, but when you NEED it you NEED it!).....

    If the CDMA version of the Treo is both color and dual band,
    that would probably be the winner for me. But, having a second handset with Sprint makes it more expensive since you can't reprogram the phone as easily.

    Besides, isn't claire sexy?

    My -0.02 cents of rambling.
    -henry
  4. #4  
    Blazer has been using server based compression since it started - this is not a differentiator for Danger unless Dangers solution is faster.

    I am looking forward to the Treo 270 - all the color of a Prism with phone and pda and GPRS....mmm!

    I think the Hiptop device is likely to get lots of press but it does not look like a useful phone to me. The keyboard looks tiny and reminds me of the old Timex personal computers of the early eighties with plastic bubble keyboards. I also have little hopes for any downloadable software. It does not seem like they have been courting developers like the Palm powered world does.
  5. wshwe's Avatar
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    #5  
    I prefer the carrier independence of the Treo. In theory I can switch cell carriers by simply replacing my SIM card.

    The Danger is fine if you only need voice calling, web surfing, instant messaging and email. As far as I know, the Danger can't do anything unless connected to their servers.

    The chief concerns I have with the Ipaq are battery life and device weight. Color screens are great, but battery drain is killer. It sounds like the GSM/GPRS sled weighs as much as a standalone cell phone. The Treo 180 is lighter than the Visor Prism and is easier to view outdoors.
  6. #6  
    the most important points(which i think everybody is missing) are the following:

    -danger is designed from the bottom up to be a mobile internet device and phone

    -danger costs about a zillion times less than the treo.


    these are the selling points of the danger. why are treos so freaking expensive? 1000 dollars canadian. there is no reason why such a slow cpu, such a small amount of ram, and such an establish technology as gsm cellphones should be 1000 dollars. maybe because they cater to the "corporate market"?

    as for the keyboard, i dont want to knock it till i try it. after all, everybody seems to like thumboards in general...

    also, the danger has 16mb of ram. thats gotta be good for something.
    Last edited by thorin; 04/05/2002 at 12:30 AM.
    -thorin

    I have a webcomic. You should read it, or I may do something rash. <b><a href=http://driveby.keenspace.com/>Drive-by Loitering</a></b> is updated every monday, wednesday and friday.

    <!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks."><img src=http://www.frontfly.com/vcsig.gif ><!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks.">
  7. #7  
    Everytime somone mentions the "Danger" device, all I can think of is "Lost in Space." Just an observation.
    The light at the end of your tunnel has been disconnected due to non-payment. Please remit funds immediately for restoration of hope.
  8. #8  
    Treo 180 has 16Mb RAM too and that is very usable RAM by comparison to other OS like PocketPC with its bloated data files and temporary RAM files.

    Danger looks like a good device - most reviews say it is big but quite usable. It is still an odd phone shape for people to get used to. Shades of the VisorPhone for face grease on the screen. It is definitely a youth phone. No conservative business folks will go near it.

    The big test for Danger will be stability of the radio firmware, usability of the interface(a huge one) and whether there is any extra software that is useful available. It is hard to discount the fact that Palm OS has thousands of applications available and effectively an Open development platform. Symbian and Java based OS for phones are essentially closed off for additional software until they reach a critical mass of good tools and ready information.
  9. wshwe's Avatar
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    #9  
    Cingular is selling the RIM 957 for $300 and the 950 for $250. The cheapest price I've seen for the Palm i705 is $350. I can't recall if AT&T has announced a price for their GSM/GPRS RIM handheld. The same would hold true for the upcoming Nokia Communicator. In my area Cingular sells the Siemans S40 World Phone for $140 or the Motorola V60g for $350.

    It'll be interesting to see if the hiptop is indeed available for $200. Danger is the underdog, so it must undercut the competition.
    Last edited by wshwe; 04/05/2002 at 05:34 PM.
  10.    #10  
    Okay Since I started this, so what about Pogo?
    It's been out longer than the Treo and it's also based on GSM..
    www.pogo-tech.com

    The danger device is still vaporware to the actual marketplace.
    it's an endless search of temporary joys
  11. #11  
    i dont think you can call it "vaporware" untill its passed the released date.

    the pogo only works in europe, it appears. north america uses 1900, and the pogo only works in the 800/1800 band.

    http://www3.carphonewarehouse.com/pogo/spec/index.html
    -thorin

    I have a webcomic. You should read it, or I may do something rash. <b><a href=http://driveby.keenspace.com/>Drive-by Loitering</a></b> is updated every monday, wednesday and friday.

    <!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks."><img src=http://www.frontfly.com/vcsig.gif ><!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks.">
  12. #12  
    Originally posted by thorin
    i dont think you can call it "vaporware" untill its passed the released date. [...]
    Nope, if they're promoting a product that doesn't exist yet, it's vaporware. Until real production units are available, it qualifies.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  13. #13  
    well, i prefer to call it "hopefulware"
    -thorin

    I have a webcomic. You should read it, or I may do something rash. <b><a href=http://driveby.keenspace.com/>Drive-by Loitering</a></b> is updated every monday, wednesday and friday.

    <!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks."><img src=http://www.frontfly.com/vcsig.gif ><!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks.">
  14. #14  
    Originally posted by thorin
    well, i prefer to call it "hopefulware"
    You do realize of course that creating such a word can have dire consequences on our universe. I'm waiting for vendors to start using it any day now to refute vaporware accusations.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  15.    #15  
    Okay, looks like a US Pogo is out, although their browser screen shots look great, and the hiptop is seems too "dangerous" a subject for discussion prior to its actual release.

    So how about this;
    for the money $99 vs $399 and under the current functionality and offered carriers, is the second generation Kyocera Palmphone a better proposition than the Treo 180.

    Other than size, I don't really see the compelling difference and more users in this forum seem to prefer Sprint. The keyboard on the outside flip down versus the keyboard on the inside and flip up. Which is better?

    Having never own the Kyocera, are there any actual users on either model that can speak on the functional difference.

    In all honesty I really the hate the often tap and key mix on the 180 and sometimes wish I just got the 180G but then I remember how much I hated the constant cleaning of the Visorphone/Prism screen from cheek smudges.

    Is the Treo really that much better a palmphone device than the Kyocera without the future promise of GPRS?.
    it's an endless search of temporary joys
  16. #16  
    Originally posted by burn

    Is the Treo really that much better a palmphone device than the Kyocera without the future promise of GPRS?.
    The upgradibility to GPRS, or more generically 2.5G, alone is worth it. One of the major attractions for me is the ability to navigate the web at fast speeds while I'm out and about. With the kyocera, you don't have the option of upgrading to 1xRTT. Heck, it might even be worth it in the long run with all the minutes you'd be saving downloading pages on a faster network.

    Also, always-on email isn't important to me, but for those who do find it important, the kyocera won't be able to achieve this without a 2.5G upgrade.

    So I think the ability to surf the web at much faster speeds with a more compact device is definitely worth it. And for me personally, the color screen (and hopefully, any other goodies or enhancements from the 180 they decide to add on) is worth $599. Although that price is on the edge of my comfort level, I think I can live with it. Maybe Sprint will have some promotional deal going when it debuts. [Still torn between 1xRTT and GPRS. 1xRTT is faster than GPRS, but it's use is restricted to the US and Japan.]
  17. #17  
    what about the sanyo colour one? this one: http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/artic...d,68794,00.asp
    -thorin

    I have a webcomic. You should read it, or I may do something rash. <b><a href=http://driveby.keenspace.com/>Drive-by Loitering</a></b> is updated every monday, wednesday and friday.

    <!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks."><img src=http://www.frontfly.com/vcsig.gif ><!img src=http://www.frontfly.com/myrouter/vcsig2.gif alt="Soundsgood is too elite for the punks.">
  18. #18  
    Originally posted by thorin
    what about the sanyo colour one? this one: http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/artic...d,68794,00.asp
    That's actually a Samsung. The I300 is also not upgradable to 2.5G. In addition, isn't it about the same size as the Kyocera, maybe a little smaller, but definitely larger than the Treo? It also doesn't have the keyboard I'm looking for. The screen is exposed to the elements in your bag or pockets unless you bother to slip it into a protective sleeve once you're finished using it. Also, it only has 8M of RAM as opposed to the Treo's 16M. And finally, for $100 more you can get the color Treo.

    The one thing that the I300 has that I would have loved on the Treo is the removable battery. But I understand that the designers had to walk a fine line between form and functionality. I guess if they added a removable battery, they would have had to add capacitors, which probably increased the size of the Treo to something that you couldn't comfortably fit into your pocket.
  19. #19  
    Originally posted by uncledrunkle
    That's actually a Samsung. The I300 is also not upgradable to 2.5G. In addition, isn't it about the same size as the Kyocera, maybe a little smaller, but definitely larger than the Treo? It also doesn't have the keyboard I'm looking for. The screen is exposed to the elements in your bag or pockets unless you bother to slip it into a protective sleeve once you're finished using it. Also, it only has 8M of RAM as opposed to the Treo's 16M. And finally, for $100 more you can get the color Treo.

    The one thing that the I300 has that I would have loved on the Treo is the removable battery. But I understand that the designers had to walk a fine line between form and functionality. I guess if they added a removable battery, they would have had to add capacitors, which probably increased the size of the Treo to something that you couldn't comfortably fit into your pocket.
    The Samung is definitely smaller than the Kyocera, but not the Treo. A screen protector and Sprint's $4/month insurance keeps the screen safe. Also, $500 is not an accurate price for the I300. Even though it lists for that on Sprint's website, the I300 can be had for as low as $300 depending on the current promotions by Circuit City, Best Buy, etc. Most people are buying their I300s for around $380 or so. So for the same price as a Treo (which is overpriced for a monochrome device), you can get a smartphone with a color screen. What you have to decide is is if color or form-factor is more important to you (although the I300 really isn't that large, roughly the size of a Nokia 61xx). The I300 also uses a virtual graffiti area. Because of this, people have been able to engineer hacks to take advantage of this extra real estate. For instance, someone just released a hack to allow Blazer to utilize this area. How cool is that! This smartphone also has a top LCD so when it rings, simply look down at it resting on your belt and you can decide if you want to answer it or not. Finally, even though the I300 lacks a hard keypad, I don't miss it much. With the hardware voicedial and Sprint's voicedial, I rarely use the virtual keypad anymore.

    What I find ironic about the Treo is how HS markets it as a "communicator" yet it can't even function as a wireless modem with a laptop, something even the most basic cell phones can do. And what good is the Treo if the battery runs out? At least with the Samsung, you can replace it with a freshly charged one.

    I think the Treo has great potential, it just has some major issues to work out (mainly battery life). I will probably end up replacing my I300 with the 3G CDMA 270 if HS can increase the battery life.

    Marty
  20. #20  
    Mmm that virtual Grafiti would be a nice feature for a future Treo model
    <IMG WIDTH="200" HEIGHT="50" SRC=http://www.visorcentral.com/images/visorcentral.gif> (ex)VisorCentral Discussion Moderator
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