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  1.    #1  
    I just saw FileMan 1.1 released recently. Could anyone tell me what is the REAL different between it and FAFileMove (by Kopsis)? I currently use FAFileMove 1.4.2 for my Platinum with the InnoPocket SplashPlus. Thanks in advance for your input.
  2. #2  
    Actually, I prefer FileMan over FAFileMover. FM support Move, where as there is no Move feature in FAFM (although the name suggests it does). That means move is a two step process with FAFM. FM also has a much more polished user interface. I have this other issue with FAFM where is doesn't "remember" the sort info between invocations.

    The good thing about FAFM is it is part of the package you already own, and, it works without VFS support loaded. The second point is somewhat moot since that is where the FA utils are moving anyway.

    As soon as I register FM, FAFM is coming off my device. David does a much better job at the low level drivers than he does user interface issues.

    Just my opinion....

    (I even prefer TealPoint's TealMover over FAFM)...
    Bryan Nystrom
    Natara Software, Inc.
  3. #3  
    Originally posted by bnystrom
    Actually, I prefer FileMan over FAFileMover. FM support Move, where as there is no Move feature in FAFM (although the name suggests it does). That means move is a two step process with FAFM. FM also has a much more polished user interface. I have this other issue with FAFM where is doesn't "remember" the sort info between invocations.

    The good thing about FAFM is it is part of the package you already own, and, it works without VFS support loaded. The second point is somewhat moot since that is where the FA utils are moving anyway.

    As soon as I register FM, FAFM is coming off my device. David does a much better job at the low level drivers than he does user interface issues.

    Just my opinion....

    (I even prefer TealPoint's TealMover over FAFM)...
    No offense, but a good bit of misinformation in the above. First of all, after files are moved from RAM to media, they are automatically deleted from RAM. Secondly, if you go into the FAFileMover menu/options/preferences and uncheck the "No sort at start-up box, sorting will be performed automatically on start-up.
  4. #4  
    I have the latest copy of FAFileMover, and I beg to differ that is actually "Moves" files from ram to CF. It copies them, and then you have to select "del" to delete them. No where in the FAFM user interface does the word "Move" even exist. Just "Copy". Is there somethimg I'm missing?

    You are correct about the sort. I never realized that was an option. Thanks for pointing that out.
    Bryan Nystrom
    Natara Software, Inc.
  5. #5  
    Currently, FAFileMover does not move files... the 2-step Copy then Delete is what's required. In Dave Kessler's defense, however, I believe he has stated that the Move function would be added sometime in the future when the app became more stable. The timetable on that has undoubtedly slipped since he began working on the VFS driver but I'm sure he'll add the functionality at some point.
    .
    .....
    MarkEagle
    .....<a href="http://discussion.treocentral.com/tcforum/index.php?s=">TreoCentral</a> | <a href="http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/index.php?s=">VisorCentral</a> Forum Moderator - Forum Guidelines
    .....Sprint PCS Treo 650
    .....God bless America, my home sweet home...
  6. #6  
    Originally posted by bnystrom
    I have the latest copy of FAFileMover, and I beg to differ that is actually "Moves" files from ram to CF. It copies them, and then you have to select "del" to delete them. No where in the FAFM user interface does the word "Move" even exist. Just "Copy". Is there somethimg I'm missing?

    You are correct about the sort. I never realized that was an option. Thanks for pointing that out.
    I am using the latest beta - 1.4.3 - and it does "automagically" delete programs from RAM without user input. No need to select delete, the action is completed after the move has taken place. It is exceptionally stable (at least, for the past 3 days I've been using it). Before I started using my FlashPlus card, I had about 2.4meg left on my Prism; I now sport 5.85meg without any ill effects. To name just a few, I'm running WordSmith, Action Names, TinySheet, SplashPhoto, BibleReader, Filez, and many more without incident. Again, I never have to manually delete anything. No, there isn't a labelled move option, but it happens just the same.
  7. #7  
    OK, I've also got 1.4.3(764). (I've been playing with the beta since the start, and had 1.4.3 installed since 7/27/01).

    Mark file NeoCal.
    Select "Copy".
    FAFM returns "Complete".
    NeoCal still shows up in the RAM section.
    NeoCal is still check marked.
    Return to Palm launcher.
    Guess what, NeoCal is still there in RAM.
    Run Filez. NeoCal.prc shows up in both RAM and CF.

    I'm not running any extensions to run apps directly from CF, so only apps in RAM are presented. I'm not sure how or why your files are being removed from RAM, but I'm pretty certain that is not the intended behavior of the current version. Perhaps you are confused by what Launcher is showing you. If there are multiple copies of the same app, only one might be shown to you in your launcher program, and that is most likely the one on CF if you have one of the external memory aware launchers or an extension loaded. I've requested move to Dave a couple of times, and his response is as Mark pointed out... Move is slated for a futrue release. My main objection has always been that the name of the app, FAFileMOVER, contained the work mover, when in fact it copied and didn't move. His main focus right now is on VFS, which is really great because it allow other 3rd party apps such as FileMan to work on the Visor.

    I also have no problem with the stability of FAFM.
    Bryan Nystrom
    Natara Software, Inc.
  8. #8  
    I deleted my demo of FileMan, because when I used it to move programs from my Prism to the /Palm/Launcher directory on my CF card, it changed them to a .pdb extension and they couldn't be run by Launcher with VFS support. I have not had this problem with FAFM.
  9. #9  
    From the FileMan 1.1 update list:

    + Fixed problem where programs were incorrectly being given extensions of .pdb.

    A program called "McFile" looks pretty good also. I haven't tried it, so I'm not sure how well it works with the Kopsis VFS drivers. Anyone have comments on it? It looks similar to FileMan.
    Last edited by bnystrom; 08/15/2001 at 12:52 AM.
    Bryan Nystrom
    Natara Software, Inc.
  10. #10  
    I was just looking for a file program this morning. I have been having problems with WS choking upon start and they suggested I get "filez" to delete a couple things when this happens. Since I have a flash adapter on order I'll be using FAFileMover, but from the looks of this thread maybe there are other options.

    What seems to be the most reliable and feature laden as well as supported?

    Filez is free and deletes the file I want. In reading the docs on FAFM I see it can set the CF card to read/write fast or slow (I thought this was pretty cool feature), plus Dave seems to be on top of things and close to his customers so that has a value worth paying for... but I'm curious to hear what others think.

    James
  11. #11  
    Just so you know/understand. Regardless of if you use FAFileMover or another program, you still need the Kopsis utilites. FAFileMover is just one piece of it.

    In order to use the "alternative" file managers such as Filez, FileMan, or McFile, you need the VFSHelper driver that Kopsis is currently working on (yes, the relase version of the Kopsis tools will not allow the useage of these other file managers. VFSHelper is still in beta at the moment). VFSHelper adds VFS support to your visor. That is the driver that all the other File Managers use. FAFileMover, on the other hand, talks directly to the Kopsis FA drivers and currently doesn't use VFS.

    I guess what I am saying is that regardless of if you choose to stay with FAFM, or use FileMan or Filez or whatever, David still gets paid the same<g>. You just can't do without the Kopsis drivers....
    Bryan Nystrom
    Natara Software, Inc.
  12. #12  
    The beauty of VFS is that it gives people choices Software is always a compromise. Developers have to juggle size, speed, and features and also balance support and development costs. Not to mention getting out timely releases. I'll be the first to admit that the balance we chose for FAFileMover may not be right for everyone. Don't worry, I'm not going to be offended if someone likes FileMan better than FAFileMover.

    FAFileMover doesn't have a move function - you have to copy then delete. Move is on the todo list when we get VFS finished. And the UI in FAFileMover definitely isn't as fancy as some of the other solutions. In it's defense, FAFileMover is faster than the other VFS based file managers. And at under 31KB, it's also considerably smaller than FileMan (67KB) and McFile (92KB). We have a lot of great ideas for ways to improve FAFileMover (many from our users) and once we get VFS released, we'll be taking a look at what we can do to make a better file management solution.
    <ul><li>Dave Kessler<br>President - Kopsis, Inc.</li></ul>
  13. #13  
    Originally posted by dkessler

    FAFileMover doesn't have a move function - you have to copy then delete.
    I am using the beta of Launcheriii as well. Since my files are being deleted automatically, is it Launcher that is doing it?
  14. #14  
    Hey Dave!

    Thanks for chiming in.... The thing I like most about the FA "suite" now is the VFS compatability. That just opens a whole new world of possibilities to developers (like us) who need to support off-line memory devices. Without it, I'm afraid the CF options on the visor would be left out. Adding the VFS standard compatibility was really a smart move.

    FAFM: I agree with you on the speed and size. Is that due to the fact that you don't have to go through VFS? Is it that VFSHelper has some room for improvement with regards to speed? And, will FAFM ever migrate over to being a VFS application?
    Bryan Nystrom
    Natara Software, Inc.
  15. #15  
    Originally posted by bnystrom
    VFS compatability.
    I hate to expose my ignorance in the broad light of day, but it certainly won't be the 1st time.<g> So..........

    What is 'VFS' (??Virtual File System??) and why should I care about it on my VDX?

    A Cliff Notes explanation would be much appreciated.
  16. #16  
    Originally posted by bnystrom
    FAFM: I agree with you on the speed and size. Is that due to the fact that you don't have to go through VFS? Is it that VFSHelper has some room for improvement with regards to speed? And, will FAFM ever migrate over to being a VFS application?
    FAFM's small footprint is partly a result of keeping its functionality to a minimum and partly due to writing "tight" code. Kopsis has been developing software for embedded systems (often with far less memory than the Visor) for years. That kind of experience teaches you a thing or two about optimization that PC developers never really get a chance to learn. A VFS version of FAFM would be even smaller since some of the things that FAFM has to do are handled in the VFS library.

    As for speed, not having to go through VFS definitely helps. The native FlashAdapter API is far better suited to the Visor than VFS. The VFS API was designed to make life easy for the developer. The native FlashAdapter API was designed to make things easy for the Visor

    As for a VFS version of FAFM, we'll have to get VFSHelper released before making a decision on that. But it is certainly under consideration.
    <ul><li>Dave Kessler<br>President - Kopsis, Inc.</li></ul>
  17. #17  
    Originally posted by SassKwatch

    What is 'VFS' (??Virtual File System??) and why should I care about it on my VDX?



    A Cliff Notes explanation would be much appreciated.
    VFS (Virtual File System) is a part of the specification for Palm OS 4.0. It defines a standard way for applications to access memory cards (CF, MMC/SD, SmartMedia, etc). VFS is currently supported by the Palm m500/m505, the Sony Clie line, and the new HandEra). We are beta testing a version for Visors with Matchbook or Innopocket (or home-built) CF adapters.

    In a nutshell, VFS on the Visor allows you to use programs originally designed to work with the MemoryStick on the Clie or the MMC/SD card in the m500/m505. This includes VFS enabled launchers, file managers, JPEG viewers, document readers, medical apps, bible readers, and more ... and the list grows every day
    <ul><li>Dave Kessler<br>President - Kopsis, Inc.</li></ul>
  18. #18  
    Is it just me, or should something as basic as a file management software be standard issue with the Palm OS? This reminds me of when people bought Xtree to use with DOS.
  19. #19  
    I just started in on this memory card game, so I'm using the VFSHelper beta before I actually have anything to mess up! I have a few questions...

    1. Visors cannot update the OS to 4.o, hence the kudos for VFSHelper. As I understand, this will make software recognize my Visor as VFS-enabled, for lack of a better term. Correct?

    2. If software sees my Visor as VFS-enabled, then I can use software which states that it is for the m50x, Clie or Handera because the major difference is that they have VFS and Visors do not. Correct? (I was getting quite confused as to why so many applications were being mentioned, yet when I would look for them they would state they were specifically for m50x, Clie and Handera).

    3. As I understand from the release notes in VFSHelper, I need to use either LauncherIIIbeta or PowerRun because the native Palm launcher cannot recognize anything on a memory card. Correct? According to the notes, PowerRun is supposed to work with any launcher. Correct? Does the launcher need to be in RAM? I'm thinking yes...

    4. Somewhat off topic...many people have had concerns about ISilo files since it's nice to be able to preserve the links from HTML pages. However, most of us don't want to drag all 5, 10 or 20 MB of data along for the ride. Is there anyway around this? Or is there some other converter that can preserve the links but converts to something recognized by CSpotRun? Iambic Reader, HandStory and another program I can't think of right now can maintain links but I'm not sure if they are propriatary formats or not. I have a number of medical texts which I would like to move individually rather than en masse if possible.

    Addendum: Okay...I just looked into HandStory Suite. This is from the support page (http://www.handstory.com/support/browser2.html):

    Q6. Where should I store Doc/Image files in SD?
    A. For SD/MMC/CF/Memory Stick, place your files to /Palm/Launcher folder using expansion card file managing utility (ex. MsGate, McFile).



    TIA,
    PurpleMD
    Last edited by purplemd; 08/22/2001 at 02:42 AM.
  20. #20  
    Whoo hoo!! So, does this mean that I can use this with the VFS helperbeta?

    I'm not going to work tomorrow! I'm loadin' this baby onto my Prism!!!!
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