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  1.    #1  
    I have 2 questions regarding ChatterMail in IMAP 'Idle' mode:
    1. Is there more drain on the battery than just being in radio mode
    2. Is this mode consuming data usage

    TIA.
    Regards,

    Allan C.
  2. #2  
    There is a definite drain which was extensively discussed in the past in the developers forum. You can go to the Preferences ----> Performance menu and check those options for lower power consumption. Something else which may help is to set the idle time in the command menu. The maximal amount of time you can set this to is 1800 (seconds). Go to preferences----> console and in the command line, type in "idletime 1800". That being said, I have found that the biggest issue in battery consumption is a lousy signal, which causes persistent attempts to connect to the server. So this can be an issue if you are in a weak signal area and in these circumstances, I just shut Chatter down.
  3.    #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by phillydog View Post
    There is a definite drain which was extensively discussed in the past in the developers forum. You can go to the Preferences ----> Performance menu and check those options for lower power consumption. Something else which may help is to set the idle time in the command menu. The maximal amount of time you can set this to is 1800 (seconds). Go to preferences----> console and in the command line, type in "idletime 1800". That being said, I have found that the biggest issue in battery consumption is a lousy signal, which causes persistent attempts to connect to the server. So this can be an issue if you are in a weak signal area and in these circumstances, I just shut Chatter down.
    Assuming that there is no Email in/out, is my data usage increasing anyway?
    TIA.
    Regards,

    Allan C.
  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by allanc View Post
    Assuming that there is no Email in/out, is my data usage increasing anyway?
    TIA.
    Don't use automatically synced email if you have limited data, period. Data is not cheap unless it's unlimited.

    But yes, of course it's using some data. Every N seconds it'll ask the server if there's something new. The server likely sends out stuff to the phone too.

    Idle traffic would be pretty minimal I suspect. I bet a whole days Idle traffic would be less than a reasonably sized email. Kind of like leaving a florescent light on all day saves more energy then turning it on and off twice.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by khaytsus View Post
    Kind of like leaving a florescent light on all day saves more energy then turning it on and off twice.
    I realize this is OT, but that's actually a myth. According to the US Department of Energy:

    For most areas of the United States, a general rule-of-thumb for when to turn off a fluorescent light is if you leave a room for more than 15 minutes, it is probably more cost effective to turn the light off. Or in other words, if you leave the room for only up to 15 minutes, it will generally be more cost effective to leave the light(s) on. In areas where electric rates are high and/or during peak demand periods, this period may be as low as 5 minutes.

    It is a popularly held belief that fluorescent lights use a "lot" of energy to get started, and thus it is better not to turn them off for "short" periods. There is an increase in power demand when a light is switched on, and the exact amount of this increase depends on the type of ballast and lamp... the relatively higher "inrush" current required lasts for half a cycle, or 1/120th of a second. The amount of electricity consumed to supply the inrush current is equal to a few seconds or less of normal light operation. Turning off fluorescent lights for more than 5 seconds will save more energy than will be consumed in turning them back on again. Therefore, the real issue is the value of the electricity saved by turning the light off relative to the cost of relamping a fixture. This in turn determines the shortest cost-effective period for turning off a fluorescent light.
    Reading on, it becomes apparent that the 15-minute figure takes into account both power comsumption and reduced lifespan of the bulb. Lots more info here: http://www.eere.energy.gov/consumer/.../mytopic=12280

    Plus, I think this was confirmed on MythBusters a little while ago.
  6.    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by khaytsus View Post
    Don't use automatically synced email if you have limited data, period. Data is not cheap unless it's unlimited.

    But yes, of course it's using some data. Every N seconds it'll ask the server if there's something new. The server likely sends out stuff to the phone too.

    Idle traffic would be pretty minimal I suspect. I bet a whole days Idle traffic would be less than a reasonably sized email. Kind of like leaving a florescent light on all day saves more energy then turning it on and off twice.
    My ISP supports IMAP and, with our business domain, we have several additional Email addresses available.
    I am not very technical yet in terms of the Treo and software like Chattermail, etc.
    So, in layman's terms, in my scenario is there any advantage to using Chattermail and Fastmail vs rolling my own with what I have?
    TIA.
    Regards,

    Allan C.
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by allanc View Post
    My ISP supports IMAP and, with our business domain, we have several additional Email addresses available.
    I am not very technical yet in terms of the Treo and software like Chattermail, etc.
    So, in layman's terms, in my scenario is there any advantage to using Chattermail and Fastmail vs rolling my own with what I have?
    TIA.
    Not sure what you mean by rolling your own, but if you receive all of your business email through your ISP, it should work with Chatter assuming your ISP supports IDLE. If you google around you can find tricks to find that out (involves connecting to the imap server, authenticating, and typing a command to see if it takes it or errors...)

    I kind of doubt your business domain will go to your ISP, so it depends on what THAT system uses.

    Even if idle isn't available, you can poll every 5, 10, whatever minutes. Regardless, IMAP is much better than POP. No fuss about what computer an email got downloaded to, or multiple emails to keep track of, etc...
  8.    #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by khaytsus View Post
    Not sure what you mean by rolling your own, but if you receive all of your business email through your ISP, it should work with Chatter assuming your ISP supports IDLE. If you google around you can find tricks to find that out (involves connecting to the imap server, authenticating, and typing a command to see if it takes it or errors...)

    I kind of doubt your business domain will go to your ISP, so it depends on what THAT system uses.

    Even if idle isn't available, you can poll every 5, 10, whatever minutes. Regardless, IMAP is much better than POP. No fuss about what computer an email got downloaded to, or multiple emails to keep track of, etc...
    That is what I have done so far and it 'works'. I have not installed any s/w to monitor data usage yet. This is what I meant by 'roll my own'.
    We have our own domain (mydomain.com) which is hosted by Bell here in Canada.
    They support POP3, IMAP and Web Mail.
    I have created a new Email account (mobile@mydomain.com) which is not used except for the purpose explained here.
    In Outlook 2007 I set-up a rule that is normally disabled. It is something like if the sender is one of my most important clients then forward the Email to mobile@mydomain.com. When I leave the office, I enable this rule and do a send/receive every 2 minutes.
    I normally do not retrieve this new Email account on the desktop except when I return to the office.
    On my Treo I set-up an Email account for mobile@mydomain.com which is IMAP. I enable the auto-sync for every 30 minutes.
    I was asking if there was any advantage to Chattermail and possibly FastMail compared to the above process.
    TIA.
    Regards,

    Allan C.
  9. #9  
    If your current IMAP server does IDLE, then there's no point in FastMail. However, Chatter will get you 'instant' email.. Usually within 30-45s I've found with my battery-saving settings.

    Depends on if you need it 'now' or up to 30 minute lag time is fine with you. What email client are you currently using?
  10.    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by khaytsus View Post
    If your current IMAP server does IDLE, then there's no point in FastMail. However, Chatter will get you 'instant' email.. Usually within 30-45s I've found with my battery-saving settings.

    Depends on if you need it 'now' or up to 30 minute lag time is fine with you. What email client are you currently using?
    Outlook 2007.
    Without getting too technical, how does Chattermail get you the Email in less than a minute without using very much battery or almost continual data?
    Does it send a SMS or something like that to the phone which is waiting and then responds by getting the Email via IMAP?
    This is all very confusing.
    Last edited by allanc; 07/18/2007 at 09:04 PM. Reason: grammar
    Regards,

    Allan C.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by allanc View Post
    Without getting too technical, how does Chattermail get you the Email in less than a minute without using very much battery or almost continual data?
    Does it send a SMS or something like that to the phone which is waiting and then responds by getting the Email via IMAP?
    This is all very confusing.
    Chatter does have that "connect-on-SMS" capability... if you have unlimited SMS and relatively low email load - and if your mail server doesn't support the IMAP IDLE command - that might be a good way for you to set things up. You just need your email server to send you an SMS (with certain keywords) every time it gets a new email, and Chatter can synchronize with the server when it intercepts that SMS.

    But the real power of Chatter lies in its use of the IMAP IDLE command. Basically, Chatter maintains a data connection with the email server (if the server supports IDLE), but the connection is "asleep" ... however, the server has instructions to wake up the connection if there's anything interesting to report, like incoming mail. Also, Chatter "checks in" with the server every so often, by default every 480 seconds I think, to make sure the server hasn't forgotten about it. But only during these active connections (i.e. the data conneciton arrows are green) is the connection using up any significant bandwidth or battery. Most of the time the arrows are grey, meaning the connection is dormant, and using only a little of your battery.
  12.    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by jberman View Post
    Chatter does have that "connect-on-SMS" capability... if you have unlimited SMS and relatively low email load - and if your mail server doesn't support the IMAP IDLE command - that might be a good way for you to set things up. You just need your email server to send you an SMS (with certain keywords) every time it gets a new email, and Chatter can synchronize with the server when it intercepts that SMS.

    But the real power of Chatter lies in its use of the IMAP IDLE command. Basically, Chatter maintains a data connection with the email server (if the server supports IDLE), but the connection is "asleep" ... however, the server has instructions to wake up the connection if there's anything interesting to report, like incoming mail. Also, Chatter "checks in" with the server every so often, by default every 480 seconds I think, to make sure the server hasn't forgotten about it. But only during these active connections (i.e. the data conneciton arrows are green) is the connection using up any significant bandwidth or battery. Most of the time the arrows are grey, meaning the connection is dormant, and using only a little of your battery.
    I think I understand now.
    It is time for me to Google the IMAP Idle test.
    Thanks to all.
    Regards,

    Allan C.

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