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  1.    #1  
    I've had my Arctic 680 since it came out - how many months has that been now? Already the silver paint is wearing off the center button. This is nothing new - the paint wore off my 300, my 600, and my 650 too. Why does that happen? Why don't my wife's 3 year old RAZR, or my son's 2 year old SLVR (which gets a hell of a lot more texting / button workout then my 680) have any paint worn away? My 300 had the flip crack off. My 600 had the tabs break off the battery door. My 650 had stress cracks on the back of the case next to each screw. Why is it that Palm builds such cheap quality devices?

    Dunc
  2. #2  
    Well, my 700p is just under a year and no cosmetic defects yet. Maybe it is the way we use it. My 300 never had a flip problem, though I would not have been surprised. Ben
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by Dunc View Post
    I've had my Arctic 680 since it came out - how many months has that been now? Already the silver paint is wearing off the center button. This is nothing new - the paint wore off my 300, my 600, and my 650 too. Why does that happen? Why don't my wife's 3 year old RAZR, or my son's 2 year old SLVR (which gets a hell of a lot more texting / button workout then my 680) have any paint worn away? My 300 had the flip crack off. My 600 had the tabs break off the battery door. My 650 had stress cracks on the back of the case next to each screw. Why is it that Palm builds such cheap quality devices?

    Dunc
    Either there is a problem with Palm products, or there is a problem with the way you treat them??? Mine is 4 months old, used frequently, and when not in use, spends much of the day in my pocket with keys and coins, and is as good as new.
  4. #4  
    In this case, it's likely your body chemistry or the environment you expose it to. OTOH, it could be a run of the mill manufacturing defect. The keypad on my wife's RAZR is in horrible shape compared to mine and mine is slightly older. Her battery cover is no longer the same color as the rest of the phone.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by Toby View Post
    In this case, it's likely your body chemistry or the environment you expose it to. OTOH, it could be a run of the mill manufacturing defect. The keypad on my wife's RAZR is in horrible shape compared to mine and mine is slightly older. Her battery cover is no longer the same color as the rest of the phone.
    Does your wife use a lot of lotion on her hands and not have a case? Lotions, perfumes, makeup etc...will discolor metals, except platinum (which I doubt any phone manufacturers use ).
  6. #6  
    and if you have been measuring its volume by putting it in a condom and immersing in water, some of those lubricants and anti-viral agents that they put in them can wreak havoc with the shiny chrome plating...
  7. #7  
    I vote for lack of. I think the most notorious evidence is the audio jack problem, that is inherited from the misdesign of the 650. I will be on my third soon when I receive the replacement they've mailed out (and if I'm lucky I'll regain the crimson color I originally bought that Palm quality saw fit to replace with a copper unit by "mistake." I'm not sure that the word "mistake" is the kind of word that makes any sense in this context).

    On the other hand, although all my Palms since the 680 lost color and other cosmetic features, I'd gladly trade cosmetic defects for the manifold misdesign problems.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Christinac130
    Does your wife use a lot of lotion on her hands and not have a case? Lotions, perfumes, makeup etc...will discolor metals, except platinum (which I doubt any phone manufacturers use ).
    The discoloration is uniform across the entire battery cover, so that's not likely. The keypad is destroyed due to fingernails and makeup most likely.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  9.    #9  
    Look at the number of threads in this forum (going all the way back to the 300 & 180) about people having their phones replaced. Does Motorola do that, how about Nokia? While someone will undoubtedly say they don't because they don't offer the same level of customer support I'll insist they don't because they don't have to - their phones just don't wear out like Palms do.

    Dun
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Dunc
    Look at the number of threads in this forum (going all the way back to the 300 & 180) about people having their phones replaced.
    It's become cliche to point this out, but this is a forum dedicated to Treos, and human nature is to complain more than compliment on this type of forum, so I'd expect to see a lot of that.
    Does Motorola do that, how about Nokia?
    Undoubtedly they do. I know this because I used to work for a company that owned a cellular carrier (until they sold that part of the business to Alltel).
    While someone will undoubtedly say they don't because they don't offer the same level of customer support I'll insist they don't because they don't have to - their phones just don't wear out like Palms do.
    Nokia, IME, has a pretty good track record for hardware reliability (although they've had some ****-poor designs where reception is concerned in a few cases). Motorola, not so much. The antennas on the Motorola v60s used to break all the time. The flips would eventually wear out. The RAZR had a fairly significant power related recall. Bluetooth on the RAZRs will occasionally flake out requiring you to power cycle the phone. Maybe you should check out some other forums before you jump to conclusions. Howardforums is a good spot:
    http://www.howardforums.com/forumdisplay.php?f=316
    http://www.howardforums.com/showthread.php?t=610413
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  11. #11  
    There is no doubt that quality control and design itself are abyssmal with Palm. There are posters here who suffer from some sort of misplaced Palm patriotism who will counter that you should buy something else. They refuse to understand that poor quality and abyssmal design can coexist with technical superiority--there really is no other smartphone that will do what the Treo does when it does it. The problems of quality and design lapses simply mean that it doesn't do it very consistently. Some of us need or value it so much, however, that we are forced by desire or circumstances to have something that is nevertheless designed by apparent incompetents.

    I would pay literally twice the amount if I were offered a 680 that worked at the level of the state of the art. I guess Palm figures most people won't so they put junk on the market.

    Right now I'm awaiting the arrival of my third because of audio jack failures.
  12. #12  
    I don't see anyone here defending Palm in that manner.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by Toby View Post
    The discoloration is uniform across the entire battery cover, so that's not likely. The keypad is destroyed due to fingernails and makeup most likely.
    But is the battery cover on the back of the Razr? Her entire palm would rub against the back while using the phone. If so, lotion on her hands would cause discoloration all over the battery cover.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by Toby View Post
    I don't see anyone here defending Palm in that manner.
    I think the very notion of "defending", in any manner, a commercial enterprise is strange--and suspect--behavior for consumers.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    There is no doubt that quality control and design itself are abyssmal with Palm. There are posters here who suffer from some sort of misplaced Palm patriotism who will counter that you should buy something else. They refuse to understand that poor quality and abyssmal design can coexist with technical superiority--there really is no other smartphone that will do what the Treo does when it does it. The problems of quality and design lapses simply mean that it doesn't do it very consistently. Some of us need or value it so much, however, that we are forced by desire or circumstances to have something that is nevertheless designed by apparent incompetents.
    I have my own personal "Law of 80/20".

    The law is that nothing and nobody on this earth will ever be 100% of what you want and need that item or person to be to you. Even when that item or that person is performing at the very best it can do...it still will not perform at 100% of what you had in mind. The problem of human nature is that we will focus on the 20% that is less than satisfactory, and minimize the 80% that is doing a great job.

    In fact, lots of people will leave the great 80% they have...and run to an item or person that is the 20% they don't have. And then, when it is evident that that item or person doesn't or can't supply the 80% that they had before in the other item or person...they're stuck with the 20% they chose over the 80%. Or, they end up leaving the 20% in an endless search for the 100% that they will never find...

    The struggle is to be happy and satisfied with the 80% you have, and not to be focused on the 20% you don't.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by Christinac130
    But is the battery cover on the back of the Razr? Her entire palm would rub against the back while using the phone. If so, lotion on her hands would cause discoloration all over the battery cover.
    Yes, the battery cover is on the back. No, her entire palm is never going to be touching the entire back. To hold a RAZR in that manner is impractical and would be quite uncomfortable. Simple manufacturing variables are much more likely.
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis
    I think the very notion of "defending", in any manner, a commercial enterprise is strange--and suspect--behavior for consumers.
    I tend to agree, but as I said, I don't see anyone doing that here. Pointing out that no manufacturer is perfect is not defending in any reasonable definition.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by davistld01 View Post
    I
    ...



    The struggle is to be happy and satisfied with the 80% you have, ....
    I don't think I've ever met a Palm designer before.

    That's the most frightening "philosophy" (actually a form of self-effacing debasement) I've ever encountered.
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    I don't think I've ever met a Palm designer before.

    That's the most frightening "philosophy" (actually a form of self-effacing debasement) I've ever encountered.
    Just fact. I try to keep a "the glass is half-full" attitude about everything. But, if you keep your personal expectations at as high a level as you do...you are setting yourself up for disappointment.

    Then again...I have never, ever read a post by you that wasn't negative. Or wasn't at least a rant about how disappointed you are with your device...or about how the Palm designers and engineers are "apparent incompetents".
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis
    That's the most frightening "philosophy" (actually a form of self-effacing debasement) I've ever encountered.
    The 80/20 rule (also known as the Pareto Principle) is a basic business philosophy. I'm not sure why it frightens you.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  20. #20  
    I have a co-worker with a Blackberry Pearl - dislikes it. The RazR she had was replaced multiple times. The Nokia my oldest son has is his 2nd in two weeks. None are perfect. My 650 and 700p are still the original units. Due to the use of cases, none have any scratches. The 700p is covered with a skin because of my hands getting filthy during the day. Taken care of, they do last. My high end Nextel Bluetooth enabled smart phone is number 3 and was in the repair shop yesterday for speaker replacement. It also is in a case.

    Take it from there.

    Be
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