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  1.    #161  
    Thanks for posting that - it is very good to know, it reiterates my belief that in many cases where people report high drain rates like 10% per hour without intense use, that there is something unusual (not inherently linked to the 680)that is causing it, and that a bit of effort can isolate and remove the problem. Welcome to the community and congrats on your first post!
  2. tck
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    #162  
    My battery drain for the past few weeks has been about 0.8 to 1.0% (based on 24hrs, with Phone off from midnite to 0530)

    This is because for every in coming call, I will do an out going call to negate TGP. Now my battery can last for up to 3 days during weekdays.
    Last edited by tck; 05/03/2007 at 03:51 AM.
  3.    #163  
    Hi TCK
    That is good performance if you are using your 680 regularly as well (presumably you are). I have found that TGP seems to be avoidable simply by pressing the red disconnect button at the end of a call, even if the caller beats you to hanging up. I dont know how much time you get - possibly until your phone goes back to sleep - havent really tested it, but this is all I have been doing and havent had TGP for weeks, and I know I havent always been first to hang up.
  4. #164  
    *UPDATE*

    OMG, *shakes head*

    WANT TO KNOW HOW SIGNIFICANT the IR receive is in regards to battery life?
    I've known that it's been set to on... and have ignored that...

    WHEN I suddenly turned it off... MY battery life stabilized.

    INSTEAD of 10% loss... TODAY I experienced 9 hrs... and it was at 87%... unbelievable... I WAS HAPPy!!

    I'll continue to monitor my battery levels... but this is GREAT news finally...
    Now it's the WAITING GAME: a GSM Palm Pre
    T680 (COPPER) + Cingular = FUN!!
    My T650 & 6230b and NX70 are retired... =(
    http://mrg9605.com
    http://ipgeek21.com
    noncents.net
    http://seresqueridos.com

    justdai.com
    reddingk.com
    georgeozuna.com
    goaskoscar.com
  5. tck
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    #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by DIG View Post
    I have found that TGP seems to be avoidable simply by pressing the red disconnect button at the end of a call, even if the caller beats you to hanging up.
    Tried this method. Now 6pm & 24mins of calls, battery level is 83% (4.03V). Looks like TGP is held back.

    Congrats on Aussies winning the World Cricket!! Ripper mate!
  6.    #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by jmg_P1OS21 View Post
    *UPDATE*

    OMG, *shakes head*

    WANT TO KNOW HOW SIGNIFICANT the IR receive is in regards to battery life?
    I've known that it's been set to on... and have ignored that...

    WHEN I suddenly turned it off... MY battery life stabilized.

    INSTEAD of 10% loss... TODAY I experienced 9 hrs... and it was at 87%... unbelievable... I WAS HAPPy!!

    I'll continue to monitor my battery levels... but this is GREAT news finally...
    Good news. IR is a big drain for some folks but not others. Another poster (redbeard) also reported about 10% per hour drain due to IR. I see nothing like that, it makes a small difference, but I turn it off anyway. you should also disable BT if you havent already.
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by DIG View Post
    ... in many cases where people report high drain rates like 10% per hour without intense use, that there is something ...not inherently linked to the 680 ... that is causing it, ...
    That is misleading. What is "intense use" is a relative term and is in fact iniherently part of the 680. What is "intense use" on the 680 is normal use on the 650. It is the inherent design flaw of the 680--designing greater power or at least memory into an underpowered platform -- that creates these problems in the first place. I have yet to see a problem that is not, in fact, related to an inherent design flaw in the 680. Most of the problems are those inherited from the 650 that were not corrected, added to the incredible failure to power it with a battery of equivalent capacity.
  8.    #168  
    Ahh, just like the good old days...

    I do understand your point of view, you have made it very clear many times. When you use the 680 alot/all day/push email kind of use, it does not have the power to survive as long as you would like, whereas the 650 did. I actually reckon that you are in the minority with your intense dissatisfaction and you should focus on the other 80% of people for a while....

    I am not trying to say your problem can be corrected...(and I mean that in a caring, sharing way), I am talking about unexplicably high drain rate problems that other folks have that are not related to 'intense use' (ie. moderate to light use, ie. less than 5-10 minutes of activity per hour, trying to be as specific as I can so you dont talk about my relatives again), such as the problems reported above, from jmg, and before that, from chemxs. By finding out the cause, some folks, like me, jmg and lots of others, can get quite dramatic improvements, because many of the problems are not inherently associated with using the 680, ie. they can be separated.

    'INHERENT'...Existing as an essential constituent or characteristic; intrinsic.
    Last edited by DIG; 05/04/2007 at 08:25 AM.
  9. #169  
    I'm not going to get into a spitting match over speculation. Just think about whether "minority" is a meaningful term when we're talking about an inherently defective design, using your definition of inherent. For instance, did it matter to the handful of Ford drivers killed by a badly designed gas tank that they were an almost infinitely small minority? Does it render the design any less defective if the defect affects less than all of the users? And why is it so important to you to minimize the problem?
  10. #170  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    ........... And why is it so important to you to minimize the problem?
    One can surely wonder.

    ("Only" ten percent an hour. Yesterday I was on a call for an hour and a half on my 650 and only went down ten percent. I admit that Palm was being beat on by a constituency that wanted "thin." One should be careful what one asks for; one might get it. One must be particular careful when asking those with round heels.)
  11.    #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    I'm not going to get into a spitting match over speculation. Just think about whether "minority" is a meaningful term when we're talking about an inherently defective design, using your definition of inherent. For instance, did it matter to the handful of Ford drivers killed by a badly designed gas tank that they were an almost infinitely small minority? Does it render the design any less defective if the defect affects less than all of the users? And why is it so important to you to minimize the problem?
    Clearly, we are not talking about something that is life threatening with battery drain on a 680, so that is a pretty weak analogy. I am not arguing that the design is not defective - you know that. I am arguing that some of the common flaws can be minimised or even completely avoided, without any inconvenience. It isnt important for me to minimise the problem - I already have, with dramatic results. With regard to battery drain issues, I am interested in talking with other users here who may have similar problems that I may be able to help, and also to get other ideas about what may be causing problems. Despite your view of this, I think this has been worthwhile (eg. sorting out the TGP problem, calibrating the battery meter, turning IR off if it is not needed). I can ask you a similar question. Why is it so important to you to take every opportunity you get to simply complain about the performance of the 680. You obviously have the view that nothing can be done to improve it, and nothing is worth trying or even discussing - it is just an inherently underperforming device, which is fine as that is your view, but you dont have to look hard to find posts from other people who are much happier with their 680 as a result of working out ways to improve the performance.
  12. #172  
    It's important that no manufacturer get a free pass on shoddy products. Consumers have few avenues--in fact, generally no avenues--of redress, and this site is one way that users can state unambiguously that the product sucks. If manufacturers can count on others minimizing their failures to design to minimal quality standards, they will have no incentive to improve. The market system, if it works at all, has no place for apologists. Many of your posts don't simply offer ways to repair what Palm failed to perfect, but instead insist that "most users are happy" or some such apology. It would be better to say that far too many people are dissatisfied, and until Palm repairs it, you're there to do the best you can with a bad deal. There would be no need, in that case, for me to say a thing.
  13. #173  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    It's important that no manufacturer get a free pass on shoddy products. Consumers have few avenues--in fact, generally no avenues--of redress, and this site is one way that users can state unambiguously that the product sucks. If manufacturers can count on others minimizing their failures to design to minimal quality standards, they will have no incentive to improve. The market system, if it works at all, has no place for apologists. Many of your posts don't simply offer ways to repair what Palm failed to perfect, but instead insist that "most users are happy" or some such apology. It would be better to say that far too many people are dissatisfied, and until Palm repairs it, you're there to do the best you can with a bad deal. There would be no need, in that case, for me to say a thing.
    I can understand your frustration a lot more easily than I can appreciate Dig insisting that the world is flat. Why can't he face it? The product is a dog.
  14. #174  
    DIG certainly knows the world isn't flat; you would too, if you were in his position, upside down except when standing on his hands. That's why I always pull my punches with him.
  15. #175  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    DIG certainly knows the world isn't flat; you would too, if you were in his position, upside down except when standing on his hands. That's why I always pull my punches with him.
    I had missed the fact that he was down under. Hope he holds on tight.
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by chemxs View Post
    After reading this forum for months (and having bought my unlocked graphite Treo on the first possible day), I felt like I had to comment.

    I followed the instructions on upgrading from "old" Palm TX to the Treo680. One app I beamed directly from the TX to the Palm -- the Palm keyboard app. However, I didn't use the dang thing between Dec. and mid-March.

    >>>When I used the keyboard for the first time on the treo, I discovered the app had been in the "ON" position for roughly four months. My poor TREO had been desperately seeking keyboard. I had thoughtlessly assumed that having beam-receive off would also disable the keyboard.

    ***In summary, when I turned the keyboard app "OFF," my power usage went from 10%/hour to 20% or less for the whole day.

    Well, duh, of course it would. But I figured 10%/hour was not crazy since I had been reading all these posts. I haven't seen anyone else as dumb as I was, so I thought I'd post and let everyone know this is another (possibly overlooked) power drain.
    Thanks for this info, i checked my keyboard programme and it was on too, with no power saving option selected. This becuase the salesman had neamed it to my phone. Let you all know in 8 hours or so if my battery life is better.
  17.    #177  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    It's important that no manufacturer get a free pass on shoddy products. Consumers have few avenues--in fact, generally no avenues--of redress, and this site is one way that users can state unambiguously that the product sucks. If manufacturers can count on others minimizing their failures to design to minimal quality standards, they will have no incentive to improve. The market system, if it works at all, has no place for apologists. Many of your posts don't simply offer ways to repair what Palm failed to perfect, but instead insist that "most users are happy" or some such apology. It would be better to say that far too many people are dissatisfied, and until Palm repairs it, you're there to do the best you can with a bad deal. There would be no need, in that case, for me to say a thing.
    mdavis, I think that one small purpose of this site might be to provide indirect feedback to Palm, but it would be a pretty monotonous site if everyone made that their focus. It would also be pretty dull if everyone just talked about how happy they were with the product, so a good mix of opinion and a little banter isnt a bad thing. Even the skillfully argued approach of WHMurray has its place....

    I know your view and I dont challenge you every time I see it posted (unless provoked), even though I personally dont think it is very constructive or beneficial, apart from letting off a bit of steam for yourself and generating a few laughs, and I have my doubts about whether it will have any impact on Palm. I am not trying to make an apology or taking an apologist approach - the 680 has obviously got several design flaws and I have said that before. I am only trying to illustrate the fact that there are ways to improve it, and the evidence is that there are many (but obviously not all) people who have gone from being very dissatisfied, to reasonably or even very happy with their 680, simply by employing a few tricks to avoid unnecessary battery drains. I was extremely disappointed when I first got mine, I even made a few negative posts. I really liked the features, but the battery life really sucked - couldnt get through the day with minimal use. But after learning about some tips and working some out myself, the improvements were remarkable and the battery life problem (for me) was reduced to near insignificance. I think that you understand my approach, you just dont like my wording. Your version of what I should say is fine with me, I dont disagree with that really, although I simply dont think it is necessary to lead with the negative.

    BTW, please dont pull your punches - Australians have thick skin. Where I come from, f...wit is a term of endearment. The more disagreeable you are, the more I enjoy your posts. It was a dull week at TC when your glass was half full.
    Last edited by DIG; 05/05/2007 at 11:18 AM.
  18. #178  
    Quote Originally Posted by DIG View Post
    ... Where I come from, f...wit is a term of endearment. ....
    Sorry, that says nothing to me. I've looked at it from every angle and have been unable to make anything out of it. The closest I've gotten was standing on my head and taking a look. I did that twice, but each time the screen on my laptop closed before I could really read it. Plus now I have a headache.
  19.    #179  
    Hmmm, maybe you arent familiar with the term, assuming you could fill in the gaps without too much uncertainty? I cant remember from my time working in the US whether it is used there, but I know you spend time skiing with Australians, so I thought you may have heard the term from time to time. Maybe they didnt like you enough to give you that label. What about dag? If you find yourself being labelled a dag, then you should be quite flattered. And from my time working upside down over there, I quickly discovered that if you like an American, you dont express it by referring to them as a f...wit, or a d...head, or a dag.
    Last edited by DIG; 05/06/2007 at 12:47 AM.
  20. #180  
    Quote Originally Posted by jahmusic View Post
    Thanks for this info, i checked my keyboard programme and it was on too, with no power saving option selected. This becuase the salesman had neamed it to my phone. Let you all know in 8 hours or so if my battery life is better.
    So far after 12 hours I have gone from 97% to 76%, much better than before, should last two days at this rate.
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