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  1. #61  
    The last 2 days I've seen a drop in battery life since applying the patch. Yesterday I had the low battery warning less than 12 hous later. So now I'm not getting the 38 hours between charges that I was seeing at first. And there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason. I always charge overnight anyway, but just had wanted to see how long it would last in between charges. But even with a recent charge, I wonder why by the evening less than 12 hours later with very little use, I am ending up at 10% one evening, 18 the other. 24 hours later, okay, but 12 seems too soon to be that low. It's reminding me of pre-patch times. Yesterday I had about 3 short phone calls, no data use. I shouldn't be getting low battery warnings at 8 pm when it just came off the charger at like 10 am.
    I'm debating about doing the battery reset thing (again-have done it before), with SIM card removal. It just gets ridiculous to have to be constantly wondering about this. I have the slimmer Seidio battery on the way, but I may end up biting at the 2400 one even if it adds some bulk. I'd rather know I can use my device all day without having to be concerned about plugging it in somewhere. I would just go back to the 650, but I do like having the added internal memory and faster web browsing, so I'd like to see the 680 work out!!

    Christinac130: I used the 3G Sim in my 650 for a week and no change in my 650's excellent battery life. And well, of course my 650 has an older battery but it's performing just fine still. You seem to be describing an ABRUPT change in your 650, so I can see why you're wondering.
  2. #62  
    DHL will drop off my replacement 680 on Monday. I'll install the patch and re-run the experiments and see if there is any difference.
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms. Who's bringing the chips?
  3. #63  
    I believe none of the changes any of you have seen are real. If the battery circuit is truly flaky and profoundly unreliable, the numbers you see of massive battery life or no battery life left, are simply artifacts. The only way of being CONFIDENT of what battery performance you are receiving is to run the phone down to zero power. Otherwise all you know is what an unreliable battery circuit is telling you. Even then of course you dont know 100% because although you know when the battery is exhausted, you still don't know for sure whether you started with 100% power. But with that you can play around with it, and at least get as close as possible to the true battery life.
  4. #64  
    I am confident that my phone performs the way I have stated, since I have run several experiments and they are consistent. I have also tested my unit to "exhaustion" with the settings I normally use and I do indeed get 100 hours out of a single charge.

    This weekend, I pulled the phone off the charger around 5pm yesterday. I have 79% at 10AM today. This is running bluetooth, but not checking e-mail, and with the IR turned off.

    What I hope for with my replacement phone is lower power usage with the IR turned on. I have no other expectations.
    Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms. Who's bringing the chips?
  5. #65  
    Quote Originally Posted by red-beard View Post
    I am confident that my phone performs the way I have stated, since I have run several experiments and they are consistent. I have also tested my unit to "exhaustion" with the settings I normally use and I do indeed get 100 hours out of a single charge.

    This weekend, I pulled the phone off the charger around 5pm yesterday. I have 79% at 10AM today. This is running bluetooth, but not checking e-mail, and with the IR turned off.

    What I hope for with my replacement phone is lower power usage with the IR turned on. I have no other expectations.
    I agree with you, I pulled mine out from the charger around 12.30pm saturday and today 11.40am sunday, I have 79.4% so that is with making 3 calls less than a min each, 1 missed call and butler nagging for 4 mins at 15sec intervals.

    Good luck with the replacement. Is it new or refurbish palm is sending you? Palm wanted to send me a refurb and I am not too excited about that.
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by red-beard View Post
    ... I do indeed get 100 hours out of a single charge.

    ....
    I don't doubt that you can get 100 hours out of a single charge. I think anybody can get that. I had trouble exhausting my battery when I first got it--several days went by and my wife couldn't stop asking, "when is that thing going to die?" So that's not the issue, and I don't mean to provoke any defensive replies by this, but my point is that any projections or measurements based on the voltage or amperage unless measured directly (pretty difficult to do by any sane person with his priorities straight) are going to be as unreliable as this very unreliable battery circuitry and algorithm we are dealing with here with the 680.

    An additional issue, but not my central issue here, is that any measurements in "lab" conditions are almost impossible to translate to "real world" conditions. The most important variable I have found is signal strength, and that is almost impossible to stabilize. The basic laboratory measurement of battery longevity, as I say, is pretty non controversial. If you just turn on the unit it will last forever....or at least 100+ hours, which is apparently the question here.
  7. #67  
    its workin for me....wish i hadnt invested in that spare battery now
  8. #68  
    I received a replacement unit last week. Constant brain freezes were driving me crazy. I was hoping a newer build of the firmware might also be on it. The version number is the same so I do not know about that. HOWEVER, I have loaded and run the camera update and am pleased to report MUCH improved battery life. I'm at 82% after 6 hours with GOODLINK data on. This is much much better than before. Can't tell whether it's the new battery, a new firmware build or camera update.
  9. #69  
    After the initial Camera patch I did not see an improvement. Only did see a slight improvement after doing the battery reset with the removal of the SIM card. I.e. I was getting about a 25% per day drop.
    Guess what, yesterday for the first time after applying the camera patch I used the camera. Charged the phone in the evening and pulled it off the charger around midnite. Right now after 15 hours the phone still shows 99% which has never happened before. The best I did before was 1% per hour.

    So, it looks like you have to use the camera to get full mileage out of the camera patch.
  10. #70  
    i dont know what i did differently but it lasted three days one time

    i charged it and when i took it off it went to 82 or 92% on the battery so i put it back on the charger and bam it lasted three days

    i didnt use it much maybe 20 calls and texts a day
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by MoveOver View Post
    After the initial Camera patch I did not see an improvement. Only did see a slight improvement after doing the battery reset with the removal of the SIM card. I.e. I was getting about a 25% per day drop.
    Guess what, yesterday for the first time after applying the camera patch I used the camera. Charged the phone in the evening and pulled it off the charger around midnite. Right now after 15 hours the phone still shows 99% which has never happened before. The best I did before was 1% per hour.

    So, it looks like you have to use the camera to get full mileage out of the camera patch.
    Did you remember to launch the Camera app immediately after installing the patch? That step was included in the official Palm instructions, but it was easy to overlook.
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    I believe none of the changes any of you have seen are real. If the battery circuit is truly flaky and profoundly unreliable, the numbers you see of massive battery life or no battery life left, are simply artifacts.
    I'm really not sure what you are trying to say here. Yes, people measuring 76% versus 82% ... who cares?

    Most of us that use the phone care about whether or not it lasts the day before we get home to put it on battery. And if it *never* lasted the day before the battery fix, and now it *almost always* lasts the day, and now sometimes lasts nearly 24 hours... how exactly can you say that the changes aren't real?

    Look, I'm done with this conversation. Masturbating over 3 or 4 days of battery life is irrelevant to those of us that use our phone for both voice and data all day long. And having people tell us that we're imagining things that we have direct experience with ... go back to your armchair.

    It works for me. It works better for everyone that I know who is using the phone constantly. We're all focused on the bluetooth problems now. Ciao.
  13. #73  
    well

    mine would be giving me messages before i got home that i need to charge it

    14 hours is all i would get now i can make it through the day
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    I don't doubt that you can get 100 hours out of a single charge. I think anybody can get that.... .
    I really think you are dismissing too much evidence in putting all reported improvements down to a faulty battery meter. Firstly, the battery meter works very consistently once it is calibrated. The absolute test is that for many people, it was not possible to get anything like 100 hours out of a single charge. ie. the phone would die. It happened to me on the weekend, my battery drained at approximately 2% per hour and it ran right down in 1.5 days (I didnt have my charger as I didnt think I would need it for a 2 day vacation). I was perplexed because I normally get 0.5% per hour on standby and it will last 3-4 days with low use. After recharging, I noticed that my wife had switched on Bluetooth a couple of days earlier. I switched it off, and the drain rate went back to 0.5% per hour. This (and many other observations like this) tells us that the battery meter IS giving sufficiently accurate readings to be a good guide to how different variables affect the 680 performance. It is good to be skeptical, but not to take a position (ie. faulty battery meter means all tests are meaningless) and then dismiss any evidence to the contrary. Can I also ask, what are you using to reach the decision that signal strength is the most important variable, if not the battery meter?
  15. #75  
    My bat. drains in a few hours. My phone is always warm. Something is wrong. I did the patch. I can get any phone on the market. I like the Palm OS. Is it too much to ask for a phone to last the day? I am very dissappointed.
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by DIG View Post
    I really think you are dismissing too much evidence in putting all reported improvements down to a faulty battery meter. ... what are you using to reach the decision that signal strength is the most important variable, if not the battery meter?
    I didn't even suggest that any improvements are due to the meter. What I suggested and actually said is that because the data supplied by the meter is unreliable, conclusions based on it are equally unreliable. I don't think I said signal strength is the most important variable, I said it was the one I had found to be most important.

    Finally, I haven't taken issue with the camera patch working. It seems to be quite significant. It's just that you can't tell by reference to the battery meter, but by seeing how long it takes to exhaust what we presume to be a fully charged batter. I don't know what that has to do with masturbation but if somebody thinks it does, I don't think the 680 is going to be much help.
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    Yes but you probably have an old battery in your 650. I'd say its the old battery not the new SIM card.
    I do have the original battery that came with my 650, but it's kinda odd that it would exhibit such a drastic change in behavior the one time I switch my SIM. And, now that the 3G SIM is out and the original is back in, my battery life is great again...

    Quote Originally Posted by baje View Post
    Christinac130: I used the 3G Sim in my 650 for a week and no change in my 650's excellent battery life. And well, of course my 650 has an older battery but it's performing just fine still. You seem to be describing an ABRUPT change in your 650, so I can see why you're wondering.
    It was ABRUPT and temporary, so it's really bothering me. My 680 has improved since the patch, but it's still not great.
  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by mdavis View Post
    I believe none of the changes any of you have seen are real. If the battery circuit is truly flaky and profoundly unreliable, the numbers you see of massive battery life or no battery life left, are simply artifacts. The only way of being CONFIDENT of what battery performance you are receiving is to run the phone down to zero power. Otherwise all you know is what an unreliable battery circuit is telling you. Even then of course you dont know 100% because although you know when the battery is exhausted, you still don't know for sure whether you started with 100% power. But with that you can play around with it, and at least get as close as possible to the true battery life.
    My interpretation of your earlier posts (such as this one above), is that you dont believe any experiments/reports of power usage and the variables that influence it, if they are based on battery meter readings. (is this an incorrect interpretation?). My point is that the meter does appear to accurately indicate when power is draining faster or slower, and that the percentage power remaining seems to be a good indicator of how much power is actually left (once the battery meter is calibrated). eg. Switch BT on, power drains faster (according to Battery Meter) and the 680 dies sooner (the real measure of battery power). Switch BT off, power drains slower (according to Battery Meter) and the 680 lasts an extra day or more. It is possible to switch BT on then off for a few hours at different times, and the battery meter shows the expected response. This is why I dont see how you can write the battery meter off as a useful tool. I think your doubt about it is based on its initial inability to judge the range of battery power before it is calibrated, but is there any evidence that you can point to that shows it continues to be unreliable after it is calibrated?

    All of that said, I must admit, over the last three days I have twice experienced the unexplained phenomenon of increased battery drain (>2% per hour on standby) that is not associated with camera usage, BT, IR, GPRS or time sync, but it immediately returns to 0.5% per hour after a soft reset. I trust my battery meter, so I think this indicates that something is still wrong that the camera patch has not fixed.
  19. #79  
    I really don't believe the battery measurement circuit is reliable enough to be confident about results based on it. The fact that what we are talking about--overall battery life--is almost hopelessly multi-factored just makes things worse.
  20. #80  
    Hi all,

    I have had my 680 since Saturday, and I installed the patch on Sunday.
    I am charging right now for the second time since Sunday. At which time I reset the battery after applying the patch.
    After charging it the first time, I went to bed and it was at 97%. 8 hrs later it was at 92%, and the alarm had gone off.
    I ended up plugging in the unit at 5%.
    Today I charged it at 2%.
    I am not on the phone that much and I haven't been online at all over the last 2 days. So most of it is adding software and just playing around, learning the Palm OS as this is my first Palm.
    For a phone of this size and feature list I would say 2 days is not bad, but of coarse a little longer would be nice.
    If they come out with a larger battery that still fits in the factory case / cover I'll get it.

    Anyway, just putting in my numbers for a brand new unit.
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