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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by gadgetluva View Post
    I LOVE WM5. Its a great OS that is powerful, aesthetically pleasing, and has kept me organized for the past year or so. I DEFINITELY prefer it over the PalmOS - actually, I probably won't be using POS ever again.

    With that said, I completely agree with the commentary. WM5 is definitely not for everyone. There is a steep (steeper?) learning curve associated with WM5. PalmOS really isn't a complicated OS. Most people can pick it up and start using it. The biggest thing that I've noticed that confused people about my Treo 650 when I had it was how to undo the key-lock (END key then Center button). People can't even figure out how to turn the screen on with my 8125 (to be fair to WM5, the Treo 700w|wx and 750 turn on/off the same as the Treo 650).
    .
    please.....wm5 is for everyone, it's just somewhat new.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by bcaslis View Post
    I agree with the commentary. Ease of use for useful things (like contacts and calendar) along with good looks and colors is going to make it more successful than current Palm products. The people on this board are enormously skewed from most people. The only people I know with Treos personally (beside myself I believe) don't even know how to change the default ringtone and volume. This is going to be more than enough for them.
    .

    BINGO!
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tastypeppers View Post
    Surer,

    OTOH the functionality of the Treo (calendar/email/contacts in your hand) is highly prized by the soccer mom crowd -- I've seen this in action. Size is not relevant -- the phone goes into a cavernous purse anyway.

    I've seen soccer moms get the PalmOS Treos and I've seen one get the W. The one with the W didn't have nearly the positive reaction that the other ones did.
    ."
    hey, you're stealing my lines!
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    #24  
    I don't know which category I am belong to but definetly not soccer mom.. But I do use my T650 extensively. My most frequent use program are Agendus Pro, Dataviz Pro, Chatteremail, FileZ, SMS, Phone (ofcourse), Memo, Nomad, Bejewell, and Texas Hold'm. I used to do DUN a lot but after Chatteremail, DUN has never been activated. T650 replace my laptop on a 2-3 days short trip.

    On a smartphone device, I went through T650, Dopod 838, SE M600i, and back to T650 and for the reason that everyone else is saying. POS is easy and intuitive. Do I need wifi ??? Nah... eventhough pretty soon like next year, the whole country where I live is going to be cover by wifi. I don't want to carry so many spare batteries. Do I need 3G service, may be... but chatter is quiet fast.

    Well T650 has done pretty much what I need with a communication device and T680 is a much needed improvement on the form factor. Yes there is a slight up grade in the OS and other stuff and Yes I would get this device as soon as it is on the street so that my migration is not going to be a headache. I won't have stability issue with this T680 as my T650 is quiet stable now with ROM modification.

    I am heading a multiple business in various countries and many of my peers who travel a lot like me do want to spend a lot of time on works rather than tweaking and fumbling to tune their communication device.

    Yes... Pink is welcome and so does black....
    Need WIFI, 3.5G, slim and light form factor for Treo to win me back from Samsung i600 !!!!!
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    #25  
    I'll probably take a lot of grief for this but I have to say this. The commentary stacks up a bunch of phones but what caught my eye is how everyone always has to include the Moto Q in any comparison.

    The Moto Q is not a POS or PPC it is a SMARTPHONE. It has no touchscreen and no pocket office. If you want to compare the Moto Q to the Nextel i930 I'll agree with you. To put the Q in the same sentence as any POS or WM5PPC device is doing all devices considered a disservice.

    Why all devices? Well the Q can't stack up to the touchscreen and pocket office suites as well as a few other features. On the flip-side to expect a phone that has it all with touchscreen etc... to be as thin as the Q is absurd. We are getting smaller people but we aren't there yet. And also, thinner isn't always more comfortable...I owned the RAZR and I hated it...yes personal preference but I like the feel of a phone in my hand and ear when I am talking on the phone...not something that just fits in my pocket well. There is a balance to be had there and I think they are doing their best with what is available today.

    Let's keep the Q and the real high-end devices in the proper comparisons guys. Again, Q against any other SMARTPHONE...wins hands-down. Moto did great. Q against anything else...it's only slimmer and thats it. It's aimed at a different crowd people. Even Moto admits that.
    Beware the lollipop of mediocrity...lick it once and you suck forever!
  6. #26  
    It depends on the features needed. For our purported soccer mum, who just wants to keep a diary, get e-mails and sms and surf the web, a snartphone may be exactly what they want. The simple fact is, if you expand into the low end your high-end features (especially busines-centric ones) starts mattering less.

    Surur
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
    Lady Diva, i'm surprised you said what you said....in truth, a "business user" might want it in a variety of colors as well....they're not all stodgy "wall street" types wanting everything flannel grey.....
    Honestly, does the bright red and orange look professional in a business situation? Those 2 look like toy phones IMO. I could use the white one however, but even that's pushing it a bit. I, however, am self-employed.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  8. #28  
    The 680 is going to be wildly successful. I'm a TREO guy... I'm also an investor. I spend hours looking at company fundamentals and growth estimates... I won't buy a 680.. but I will be plopping some cash down on some short and long term options this week (after the stock dips on Monday from the post-announcement high) because I think it's a good bet that PALM will be reporting some absurdly positive earnings data at the next go 'round post Holiday season based purely on 680 sales. There are many more feature phone users ready to upgrade to a proven and SIMPLE POS then there are TREO brethren standing in line to berate the 680. The former are coming with cash this holiday season.
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    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by septimus View Post
    Whoa, I was expecting a beat down! I agree with you, obviously. Why on EARTH didn't they make a pink one? Ah well.
    I agree. I see more and more pink RAZRs. The ladies love them. I want to see the orange version in person. If it's not TOO bright, I might go with it (assuming I decide to get a 680). They should make the next Treo's such that the face plate is easy to change. Like Nokia does (did?).
    GSM Treo 600 > Unlocked GSM Treo 650 on T-Mobile - Attempting to use a BB Curve

    Technology is neither good nor evil, good people will find good uses for it and evil people will find evil uses for it. Phil P.
  10. cgk
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    #30  
    There are many more feature phone users ready to upgrade to a proven and SIMPLE POS then there are TREO brethren standing in line to berate the 680.
    I really don't understand this statement - all the evidence suggests that the general consumer really doesn't give a toss about OS - they will not care if the POS is proven or not - it's irrelevant. Does the phone look cool and will it go in my backpocket are far bigger considerations.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    I really don't understand this statement - all the evidence suggests that the general consumer really doesn't give a toss about OS - they will not care if the POS is proven or not - it's irrelevant. Does the phone look cool and will it go in my backpocket are far bigger considerations.
    Honestly, I think you are incorrect about the POS's reputation with the average consumers. They all heard of PALM, from yers ago, when everyone was running around with $300 Pilots.

    The truth is likely somewhere in the middle between your take and mine, and is likely that the success of the 680 will depend totally on it's "Mass market" appeal.

    In that stead, PALM did pretty well. I think the only mistake they made, so far, was not offering it in more colors (specifically, pink, red, dark grey and glossy black).

    As fickle as this may make the average consumer sound, it's quite true that looks will probably be the deciding factor, if the device is affordable, comfortable to hold, and has all the features the 680 has.

    Remember, the RazR isnt that great of a phone.. it's just sleek loking, and aresthetic appeal is what gave it the success it has. The advertising photographs really did it justice - its quite photogenic and appears "futuristic" without intimidating the consumer by looks alone.

    The 680, with proper colors, can win big time in that same regard, because of its antenna-less look and slimmer feel, and that hi resolution touch screen.

    Oh, and as for slipping it in someone's back pocket.. I don't think so. The flip phones are fine for that, but, once people start to realize that their nefangled 680 is not only a great phone, but a true mini-computer, they will think its the best value ever and we will see a slew of case designs and accessories that help glorify and celerate it, rather than delegate it to "derierre duty".

    I think!

    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  12. cgk
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    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    Oh, and as for slipping it in someone's back pocket.. I don't think so. The flip phones are fine for that, but, once people start to realize that their nefangled 680 is not only a great phone, but a true mini-computer, they will think its the best value ever and we will see a slew of case designs and accessories that help glorify and celerate it, rather than delegate it to "derierre duty".

    I think!

    Stop stop stop - this is geek think (and I'm one too). It goes like this "once the public finds out that....", it doesn't happen, only geeks care. I saw some of the people at symbian speaking at an event - the question of the very "weak" and simple PIM came up* and why wasn't it as good as the ones included in POS or WM5. The answer was very simple - what people *think* they will use and what they *actually* use is very difficult, all their research shows that general consumers only use a very basic set of PIM functions and so the PIM offered by Nokia is deliberately very limited. That's why nokia is the world's biggest phone manufactor - they have a very very good understanding of the consumer marketplace.

    All of us geeks are convinced that once people discover functions X,Y,Z they will be amazed and converted - but the truth is - nobody cares! They want music and video and they want it in a small package. If it's not a small package, it better be nice looking (like the n-series).
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    I really don't understand this statement - all the evidence suggests that the general consumer really doesn't give a toss about OS - they will not care if the POS is proven or not - it's irrelevant. Does the phone look cool and will it go in my backpocket are far bigger considerations.
    It's not the NAME of the OS... it's the simplicity factor that will be a hit with people that just don't care one way or another (the vast majority of people on the planet as it turns out). We agree the name doesn't matter - but I'm going to go out on a limb and say that POS is more intuitive and user friendly and that this fact will sell the 680 to feature phoners (even if they don't know what OS they're using and don't care).
  14. #34  
    Nice article... one of the best I've seen on a forum like this in a long time....

    I would add that palm has to get this right the first time! Hopefully reliability will come standard and the device will work "out of the box." I can't see mom dealing with a device that locks up, resets, or simply turns itself off two or three times a week.

    Anyone ready to purchase palm stock?
    01000010 01100001 01101110 00100000 01010100 01101000 01110010 01100101 01100001 01100100 00100000 01000011 01110010 01100001 01110000 01110000 01100101 01110010 01110011 00100001
  15. #35  
    Personally, I'm sticking with my 650 'til it dies. If it dies before ALP is available, then I'd opt for the 680 rather than any of the 7xx devices. I've used WM (even way back to WinCE) and it just makes doing things too complicated compared to POS. Now, I agree POS isn't going to cut it going forward... Palm really needs ALP to be successful in the high end (at least).

    But when I consider those things for which people seem to be flocking to WM for... EVDO, WiFi in particular... I find I'm really not needing those. Sure, I'll take whatever extra bandwidth I can get. But I'm not gonna bleed myself dry to get it, much as the carriers seem to want. And the whole point of having WiFi would be to offset the use of cell data... so why would I need EVDO *and* WiFi? Give me GSM/EDGE, perhaps with WiFi, and I'd be happy.

    At the end of the day though, it's all about the user experience and the ability to do the things I want. I saw several people getting 700's and now other WM devices at work... and then I hear them constantly complain about how hard it is to do things with them. And then they get really irritated when they see me using ChatterEmail, Causerie, VNC, Remote Desktop, ssh, and VPN (Mergic) -- amongst many others -- on my 650. To me, Microsoft have missed the point; reproducing the Windows experience on a mobile device doesn't make a mobile device easier to use... it just brings the complexity of using Windows to a mobile device without a mouse. So, I don't feel I'm missing anything particular feature-wise by staying with POS. That said, I'm eagerly awaiting updates on ALP's progress -- but that discussion is for other threads.
  16. #36  
    This whole idea that only "power users" are interested in phones like the Treo, or even the Q, is just silly. I'm running into Treo users virtually every day. In the grocery store, on the subway, at soccer games, and more. They're business people, geeks, housewives, cops, you name it.

    I was at an NFL game yesterday, and the guy sitting a couple seats away from me was panicked because he had losts his cell phone. He said, "My life is in that phone," referring to his directory of contacts. (Amazingly, he actually got it back at the game.) I think that as people have come to rely more and more on their phones for this purpose, they see more and more the value of having information readily at hand.

    I recently showed a co-worker all the contact information I have in my Treo: not just names and phone numbers, but addresses, fax numbers, email addresses, and more. He was impressed not only with the Treo's ability to keep all that centralized, but also how *easy* it was to use. Between the large screen and keyboard, it's far easier to enter and maintain that info on a Treo than on any normal cell phone, including Nokia.

    (I do agree that for the typical user, the Moto Q is competition for the 680. Editing Word and Excel documents doesn't matter to them, although the lack of touchscreen might, if they bother to compare.)

    I don't think the calendaring capabilities will sway many people to either device. But once people have a smartphone, they may find themselves using the calendar. After all, if I've already got it with me, why not stick the info in there. It quickly becomes easier than taking the little appointment card the doctor or dentist gives you, not losing it on the way home, and remembering to write it on a paper calendar. And just like the contacts app, the calendar on a Treo is far, far easier to use than the one on any regular cell phone.

    Does size matter? Yeah, but how much is anyone's guess. People talk about how thick the Treo is, but the truth is that it's no thicker than a lot of flip phones are when they're closed. Will the keyboard and large screen overcome, in people's minds, the extra size? I don't know, but if not then the Q, and all the other keyboard equipped phones, are dead, too.

    The success of the 680 will depend greatly on price. If someone's looking at a blackberry or Q, and the 680 is priced the same, it's going to get a look. If it's $150 or $200 more, forget it.
    Bob Meyer
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  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by septimus View Post
    Read Commentary

    Honestly, I'm not just stirring the pot here. I've come around. I think the 680 is going to do just fine.
    Excellent article. I guess we will see what happens when the numbers start rolling in.
    ELR
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  18. #38  
    Alot of people have made excellent points. Alot of the talk about the OS is definitely subjective, being dependent on the user. In any case, if the 680 does well (as in, crowds of people are getting them) then that really means good news for us. Palm gets more cash to spend on R&D, and maybe they'll be able to come up with that killer device that everyone will want.
  19. cgk
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    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by gadgetluva View Post
    Alot of people have made excellent points. Alot of the talk about the OS is definitely subjective, being dependent on the user. In any case, if the 680 does well (as in, crowds of people are getting them) then that really means good news for us. Palm gets more cash to spend on R&D, and maybe they'll be able to come up with that killer device that everyone will want.
    Hum.. somehow I expect the treo 900 and 1000 not to look that dissimilar to what we see now... just a feeling..
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by CGK View Post
    Hum.. somehow I expect the treo 900 and 1000 not to look that dissimilar to what we see now... just a feeling..
    It might look similar, sure. Read up on all of these threads on here about why people love their treo - in most cases, people PRAISE the form factor. I had a 650, loved the hardware, just couldn't stand the OS. So I switched to the 8125. Great device, but it doesn't have the right form factor. Its just irritating. I'm now migrating BACK to the Treo, but luckily I get to keep the WM5 OS that I really enjoy. The point of all this is that if Palm has gotten anything right with its treo line, its the form factor. And if we see a Treo 2000 that LOOKS very similar to the Treo 750 with some minor improvements, then I'll probably get it. The form factor is just THAT good.
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