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  1. #161  
    ptunes isn't a 3rd party app. It's loaded into ROM and still runs like crap after a hard reset on the 700p. A 650, loaded with software, still runs ptunes better than a stripped 700p.

    My 650 scores almost 1400% in data access and can run ptunes in the background perfectly with no skipping. It can also switch to the phone app instantaneously, unlike the 700p.
  2. Chazzan's Avatar
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    #162  
    Quote Originally Posted by 2000 Man
    hepe? What's your pbench score on your 700p?
    pbench score is still crap, around 550, but this score doesn't tell the whole story. Don't get me wrong, I'm am VERY disapointed, but what we need to do is COMPLAIN TO PALM. I CALL ON ALL UNHAPPY TREO 700P OWNERS TO HARRASS PALM ABOUT THE RIDICULOUS SLUGGISHNESS OF THIS PHONE. WHO's WITH ME????????
  3. #163  
    Count me in! Palm needs to fix this ASAP. We should be able to load applications on w/o slowing down our 700P's so much. The "white screen of doom" must go!
    D
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    #164  
    Just to make sure the full picture of this problem is portrayed......
    my app switches are instantaneous........my browsing is the same..........blows away my 650..
    AND......
    because of syncing problems I ended up taking my card from the 650 and just restoring all data from Backupman to the 700p.
    Strange.
  5. Chazzan's Avatar
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    #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by rockky
    Just to make sure the full picture of this problem is portrayed......
    my app switches are instantaneous........my browsing is the same..........blows away my 650..
    AND......
    because of syncing problems I ended up taking my card from the 650 and just restoring all data from Backupman to the 700p.
    Strange.
    What/how many programs do you have installed? What is your pBench data access score? Do you work for palm??? (Just kidding)
  6. #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by rockky
    Just to make sure the full picture of this problem is portrayed......
    my app switches are instantaneous........my browsing is the same..........blows away my 650..
    AND......
    because of syncing problems I ended up taking my card from the 650 and just restoring all data from Backupman to the 700p.
    Strange.
    Any pbench scores yet?
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by Chazzan
    What/how many programs do you have installed? What is your pBench data access score? Do you work for palm??? (Just kidding)
    You bring up a good point. Doesn't it seem just a bit odd that the quality control engineers at Palm didnt run their own 700p performance benchmarks? Im sure they even loaded a fair share of 3rd party apps. Those guys didnt see the performance hit? Or, was this a case of Marketing telling Engineering, "forget about the performance, this thing has to ship by Memorial Day weeked!"

    Of course, the 650 went out to the shipping docks with a major memory flaw also, so, either there is No Quality Control at Palm, or its a small room of techno-geeks (and I mean that in a flattering and respectful way) who are largley ignored by the Marketing VP's?
  8. #168  
    They might have thought that the increase in RAM was worth the performance hit that it was going to cause.
  9. mal5z's Avatar
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    #169  
    Not to be an apologist for Palm, but -- having reverted to my 650 while they send me a non-broken 700 -- I am reminded that I lose a lot of time on the 650 running DB Cache clears. For example, if I want Blazer not to tell me that it's out of memory, I have to run a DB Cache clear for 15 to 30 seconds before opening. Also, boot time after reset takes longer because it has to run a 30-60 second DB Cache clear. Also, there's a brief white screen during most application switches even on the 650. Not as long as on the 700, but it reminds me that switches weren't instantaneous on the 650 either.

    This isn't to say that I didn't wish the 700 was zippier. I hope it will be someday. But, for me, it has largely just redistributed lag times that existed on the 650. Given the things you can do on the 700 that you simply can't do on the 650 (most notably, true web surfing), I'll live with the imperfect 700 until they speed it up. But hopefully they can and will.
  10. #170  
    What's the typical Palm lag time between release and first updates?
  11. #171  
    Has anyone compared the performance of FAT16 vs FAT32 on the 700p? On the 650 w/FAT32 hack, I got better results with FAT16.
    Treo 600 > Treo 650 > Treo 700p > Treo 700wx -> Mogul -> Touch Pro
    You may like to flash, but your phone shouldn't. LED Killer
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by adjmcloon
    What's the typical Palm lag time between release and first updates?
    About 4 months.
  13. #173  
    As I read this thread I am reminded of many past early adopter experiences I have had with many things including PC OSs and smartphones. I almost returned my Samsung I330 because the over cancelling of the microphone when weeks later it was discovered that the earphone was so loud when in normal (not speakerphone) mode that it was being detected by the noise cancelling routines. Fix = turn down the ear speaker volume. Everyone was relieved it was so easily fixed yet we felt a bit embarrassed to have been duped by a phone that was actually performing better than the previous model.

    There will likely be numerous root causes for the reported performance problems for some and only one or a few for others. Just a few thoughts to reduce the blood pressure during this early adopter period:

    1) Watch out for apples vs oranges comparisons (make sure all variables are the same: most of us run long UNIQUE lists of 3rd party apps and hacks and some while they are really cool some are not very high quality in their design and operation)
    2) Watch out for applications not systematically verified by the author/provider as being certified for the 700p (old Treo applications, even benchmark apps, can act much differently on new hardware like the 700p despite what the specs say)
    3) Finally, Without a consistent test plan being strictly followed among all those providing input there will be a great deal of well intended yet erroneous comments made that will be simply misleading for themselves and the rest of us.

    So for the 700p early adopters this round, please stay cool and know it will take awhile to isolate the real from the perceived and the general problems from the individual ones. Over the years, I typically have caused myself a least half of my own technology related problems by not keeping close track of my practices, applications and my assumptions.

    The assumptions are the biggest downfall for me! So question everything and keep a journal of your observations and your actions. Our memories easily get fuzzy and inaccurate when dealing with so many details. I will join you soon for a Verizon 700p knowing full well that some of the applications and the routines on my Verizonized Sprint Treo 600 I have grown so used to will have to be cast aside because they are no longer supported or worth the trouble on the new hardware.

    Good Luck and thanks for all the posts!
  14. #174  
    A 700p fresh off a hard reset is slower than a 650 loaded with software. I'd hope that all of the software that comes pre-loaded in to the 700p ROM has been certified by the developer. lol
  15. #175  
    D@mn, I haven't checked this board for a few days, and today I'm reading that others already have the 700p in their hot hands! After reading some of these posts, I'm wondering if I should get one now, or wait til the bugs are ironed out. What to do, what to do??

    Casey
  16. #176  
    okay, I did a hard reset (frankly it was easy to decide, since I was getting freezes more and more often....)
    post reset numbers:

    hard reset:
    only synced calender, memo, tasks, address, pbench and palminternals

    pbench data access: 829

    palminternals speed test: time in tics 97
    time in secs 1

    prior to the hard reset, my data access numbers stayed in the low 500s.
  17. #177  
    I had a horribly slow 700p after I restored from a Resco backup.

    I did a clean re-install to give the pig a fair chance. It CAN BE fast. Maybe pBench doesn't provide high numbers, but switching apps even with 46MB free, it is no slower than the 650.

    Once the 700p is fast, Blazer truly does sing. It struggles with large sites like espn.com and cnn.com, but most sites are ok, and load up as fast as Xiino. The cache handling is pretty good. If I keep the p, I might bid Xiino farewell.

    pTunes-choppy, no doubt, but not noticeably more choppy than my 650 was.

    Streaming video has been a disappointment so far. I tried to stream a 300k feed off nhl.com's home page, and it told me 'insufficient bandwidth' and 'audio codec not supported'. Boo.

    Still on the fence over whether I will keep this device.
    A new Avatar to commemorate Silly Season.
  18. #178  
    Quote Originally Posted by ido
    okay, I did a hard reset (frankly it was easy to decide, since I was getting freezes more and more often....)
    post reset numbers:

    hard reset:
    only synced calender, memo, tasks, address, pbench and palminternals

    pbench data access: 829

    palminternals speed test: time in tics 97
    time in secs 1

    prior to the hard reset, my data access numbers stayed in the low 500s.
    Those numbers are still pretty poor considering the 650 can get 1400-1500 on the pbench data access. It really shows in how well the phone performs, especially with ptunes choppiness when playing in the background.
  19. #179  
    With the latest version of pTunes in RAM, the playback is unusable.

    Using pTunes in ROM, it doesn't appear to be much worse than the 650.
    A new Avatar to commemorate Silly Season.
  20. #180  
    Quote Originally Posted by skfny
    With the latest version of pTunes in RAM, the playback is unusable.

    Using pTunes in ROM, it doesn't appear to be much worse than the 650.
    Just wait until you start adding contacts and programs then the ROM version becomes unusable.
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