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  1. ink883's Avatar
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       #1  
    Do we still need to be as concerned about a lack of a multi-tasking OS and a Browser that isnít up to the level of IE or Netscape when we have EVDO and programs like Palm VNC and MobileTS?

    I am of the feeling that the simplicity of the Palm OS will not longer be as much of a burden since I should be able to use my desktop if I really need to multi-task or view a page that Blazer canít handle.

    What do you think?
    Visor --> Visor Platinum --> Treo 300 --> Treo 600 --> Treo 650 --> Treo 700p --> Treo 755p --> Treo 800w --> Palm Pre
  2. #2  
    Two things I don't attempt ... multitasking on a phone or in the bedroom. I don't put calls on hold to take another as that is offensive to the 1st party. I keep trying to imagine what I could do at the same time while talking, e-mailing, web browsing or whatevr but keep coming up short. I mean it would be nice to be typing an e-mail saying "the meeting is at "... whoops let em check calendar....."10 am on Tuesday" but I much more likely to think "hey maybe I should look that up before I write the email.

    There are times where I have said "aw shucks, wish I didn't have to close this to open that", but I don't have to take any clothes off to count since I have enough fingers on one hand to count the times it's really been an annoyance. And to give up speed, and stops to close all stuff, one handed functionality and reboots to clear mem .... nah .... that's every day kinda issues.

    At some point...maybe when there's a vid card and external screens that we can use when in a car or soemthing tehre might be enough screen real estate to make multitasking worthwhile but right now I like concentrating on 1 thing at a time.
  3. ink883's Avatar
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       #3  
    Given the limitations of Blazer, wouldnít you want to connect to your PC just to surf from a more robust internet browser?

    Do you think it would be faster to let your home computer do the webpage rendering, caching, dealing with cookies, flash, java, and leave your treo cpu to just worry about displaying the image?
    Visor --> Visor Platinum --> Treo 300 --> Treo 600 --> Treo 650 --> Treo 700p --> Treo 755p --> Treo 800w --> Palm Pre
  4. #4  
    A new OS is loooong overdue...4 years ago Palm OS 6 came out, but it was never implemented. Palm OS 5.x is just a duct-tape version of 3.x, which is nearly TEN YEARS old!

    Windows will probably rule the day, like it or not, as people demand multitasking from their phones/pdas. A Linux version is at least 2 years away, which is a long time to wait.

    It really is too bad Cobalt didn't get the support it needed.

    I really wonder how many people will get a 700p from Sprint if they know the 700w is a couple months away.
  5. #5  
    The P is gonna be my first treo. I often hear people say that Windows is much better at multi-tasking than POS. What exactly can't POS do that you would really need on your phone? Can you text and talk at the same time? Play music and surf the web? Thanks in advance.
  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by ink883
    Given the limitations of Blazer, wouldnít you want to connect to your PC just to surf from a more robust internet browser?

    Do you think it would be faster to let your home computer do the webpage rendering, caching, dealing with cookies, flash, java, and leave your treo cpu to just worry about displaying the image?
    Blazer 1.0 in 650 or Blazer 3.0 in 700p ?

    I do 99% of my surfing at 28.9 Mbps....EVDO's 0.5 Mbps just isn't that attractive for all but the shortest of sessions.
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikec
    I really wonder how many people will get a 700p from Sprint if they know the 700w is a couple months away.
    Considering the comparative perfomance we have been hearing about, I can ony see a few groups going for the 700w. Right now the P stands for "Plus" ! I just have read 30-40 700w reviews all drawing the same conclusion .... "the 700w is the best WM5 convergence device ever ... tho it doesn't quite compare with the 650".

    I sat behind a woman at a hockey game who was like 12 days into her 700w free trial...we were both snapping pictures and e-mailing them to our kids at home....beer in one hand, Treo in the other. As she was struggling with not enough hands, after I let her try the 650....she was heading in to trade it in the next day. In her words, she went for the700w "cause it looked so pretty ... but with yours , you can get things done a lot faster and without juggling"
  8. ink883's Avatar
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       #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    Blazer 1.0 in 650 or Blazer 3.0 in 700p ?

    I do 99% of my surfing at 28.9 Mbps....EVDO's 0.5 Mbps just isn't that attractive for all but the shortest of sessions.
    I am not sure you are understanding what I am getting at. I am not talking about EVDO replacing your wired cable modem. I am talking about using EVDO to link to your home computer and surfing the net via WindowsXP Internet Explorer.

    Somehow, I do not think any version of blazer can or will support java web apps. I have a feeling the OS is too limited to support complex pages. For example Lexis-Nexis or Westlaw are not accessible from Blazer, and would be surprised if the version of Blazer on the 700p will be able to load those pages. When I need to access pages like those and I am on the road or in a hotel room, I will use MobileTS log into my home computer and surf to those pages with IE. My only complaint was the 1xRTT was to slow to do this on a casual basis.

    I have a feeling using the Treo as a window to my home computer will be a more satisfying experience.

    BTW Blazer on the Sprint 650 is Ver. 4. Blazer is an old program that has been around since the days of the Visor.
    Visor --> Visor Platinum --> Treo 300 --> Treo 600 --> Treo 650 --> Treo 700p --> Treo 755p --> Treo 800w --> Palm Pre
  9. #9  
    Jack, did you just say that you keep coming up short in the bedroom?

    I'm torn about the whole multitasking issue. I'd like true multitasking, but not if it means that the device slows to a crawl and everything suffers. Palm's single-tasking with one background thread (for MP3 or email fetching) may be fine. Expanding that with another couple of threads for apps that really need it (so, maybe, MP3s *and* email fetching *and* one other thing) could be the way to go. I think Cobalt was going down that path, but Palm (then palmOne) didn't seem interested.

    I think that if developers (including Palm) did a better job of saving state, I could be happy enough with Garnet. For example, I can load a big page in Xiino, start up Snappermail, and return to Xiino and that last page I was on will load up instantaneously. I wish Blazer worked that way. While I've been happy with Xiino's speed, the rendering leaves a lot to be desired. I'd love to see AJAX support (which other browsers for S60, for example, are getting) and multi-window support.
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  10. ink883's Avatar
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       #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by oddlou
    What exactly can't POS do that you would really need on your phone? Can you text and talk at the same time? Play music and surf the web? Thanks in advance.
    As I noted before, having multiple web pages open. Say you want to go out for dinner and a movie. You need to find a good restaurant, get directions, find a movie, buy tickets, and check traffic and weather conditions, finally call everyone and let them know where to go and how to get there. Do you really want to have to juggle all that while having access to only 1 page at a time or do you want to leave important pages open till you know you are done with them?
    Visor --> Visor Platinum --> Treo 300 --> Treo 600 --> Treo 650 --> Treo 700p --> Treo 755p --> Treo 800w --> Palm Pre
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by Scott R
    Jack, did you just say that you keep coming up short in the bedroom?
    No....I said when in the bedroom I don't multitask.....I concentrate on just one thing ...don't answer the phone, change channels on the TV, have a sandwich, yell at the kids to be quiet ... of course my wife does all those things

    I did get her to stop answering the phone tho ..... when my mother-in-law called I yelled out "Hi mom, guess what I am doin to ya daughter ! "

    Now my wife doesn't answer the phone in the BR and my MIL doesn't call after 6 pm
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by ink883
    I am not sure you are understanding what I am getting at. I am not talking about EVDO replacing your wired cable modem. I am talking about using EVDO to link to your home computer and surfing the net via WindowsXP Internet Explorer. ...I have a feeling using the Treo as a window to my home computer will be a more satisfying experience.
    I must be missing something....

    This would make sense to me

    "I am not talking about EVDO replacing your wired cable modem. I am talking about using WiFi to link to your home computer and surfing the net via WindowsXP Internet Explorer."

    Tho why would I surf from a 2" screen w/ my thumbs when I can sit at a 21" hi end monitor witha full size KB ?
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by ink883
    As I noted before, having multiple web pages open. Say you want to go out for dinner and a movie. You need to find a good restaurant, get directions, find a movie, buy tickets, and check traffic and weather conditions, finally call everyone and let them know where to go and how to get there. Do you really want to have to juggle all that while having access to only 1 page at a time or do you want to leave important pages open till you know you are done with them?
    I do that on my home computer and the 20 minutes I'd save would get me seated before the movie starts while you still out in the lobby waiting for acne faced kid to put butter on ya popcorn

    All kididng aside lets look at this situation.

    1. I am home

    I know the reaturants, know the movies, I can look out the window and see weather, and what if it's rainin I ain't goin ? .... the movie is indoors. I know the traffic and I wouldn't be looking at movies at all unless I called everybody first anyway. I ain't even gonna use the Treo for calls as in house reception ain't that great and why burn minutes while home plan is unlimited. Plus I can talk and surf at the same time on the puter (21" screen shows lots more stuff) ....hard to even see screen on Treo and have handset at ear at the same time

    2. I am "outta town"

    If visiting, I gonna depend on the host or local peeps whether business or pleasure. If at a convention.....I gonna meet peeps in bar ... I gonna ask concierge where to eat w/ a movie nearby ..... I'll pop on and get the schedule while having beer and peanuts at bar .. ask the people who's goin, give them the times ... get an agreement ... still on movie site grab the tickets, take Treo in car and fire up TomTom for directions.

    I mean it's a "conceivable" scenario you have outlined but after 50+ years of life I have never done that, wanted to do that, or conceived of doing that. It's just not the easiest / quickest way. I could type a 3 page report sitting in the lobby of my hotel....but I can go up to my room, fire up the laptop, write the report on 1920 x 1280 instead of 320 x 320, get the formatting right the 1st time and e-mail it off before my other self get half way thru the 1st page with his thumbs in the lobby.

    It's the age of the multiplex .... the last 30 movies I have seen have been in the same theater....the only thing we ever discuss and everybody needs to know is what movie, what time and where we meetin' to eat this time ? The multi's have driven all the small guys outta business and I'll bet I can locate every movie theater within 40 miles of my house w/o thinkin about it.

    Now granted I have been frustarted cause I had to close e-mail to open calculator and then come back but I encounter those situations so rarely that they pale to insignificance.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE
    I must be missing something....

    This would make sense to me

    "I am not talking about EVDO replacing your wired cable modem. I am talking about using WiFi to link to your home computer and surfing the net via WindowsXP Internet Explorer."

    Tho why would I surf from a 2" screen w/ my thumbs when I can sit at a 21" hi end monitor witha full size KB ?
    And everybody thinks Jack is a humorless techno geek - little did they know a raging Bill Murray hides behind those bug eyes....
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
  15. #15  
    Actually, it sounds to me like he's talking about using the Treo's EVDO modem as his PC's internet connection - DUN.

    It worked fine, although a little slow with the 650. DUN with the 700p will be pretty sweet, but I only really use it if I have to make a bank transaction, or some other web transaction that blazer cannot support (so long as I have my laptop with me in the car). At home I pay for my cable internet. I think its a bit silly to try to use a cell phone as your 'permanent' internet connection at home. If you want to use the cell service's internet capability, buy a PC connection card.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by dmrfresh
    Actually, it sounds to me like he's talking about using the Treo's EVDO modem as his PC's internet connection - DUN.
    I thought of that but this changed my mind

    "I am not talking about EVDO replacing your wired cable modem."
    If you have a wired cable modem at hand, why would you DUN ?
  17. #17  
    Good point. I guess I dont know what he's getting at.
  18. tc600's Avatar
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    #18  
    What the OP is proposing is utilizing PalmVNC or MobileTS to open up a window onto a home (or office) computer and then using that remote computer to open up the browser of your choice (Firefox, IE, Opera, etc). PalmVNC and MobileTS are remote desktop clients like pcAnywhere or GoToMyPC, which work from a Palm environment. This uses the host computer to do the html rendering and lets the Palm only handle rendering a 320x320 view onto that host computer. It allows you access to all the features of your desktop, including running your favorite browser, office suite, email client, etc.

    However, you'll pay a price in two ways (possibly): one, you'll either have to put up with 320x320 window with scrolling or the client can shrink the view down to 320x320 (at the expense of possibly being illegible), and two, depending upon the speed of your connection, you either have to deal with dithered output for more frames per second or get full color with fewer frames per second (which feels like the system is responding slowly to you).

    You wouldn't do this if you were at home or on the road with a laptop, but short of the people who carry around an OQO, there are plenty of places when I'm just out and about and yet would rather be able to browse with a "real" browser and given the speed of EVDO, this might be a more viable option now.
  19. ink883's Avatar
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       #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by tc600
    What the OP is proposing is utilizing PalmVNC or MobileTS to open up a window onto a home (or office) computer and then using that remote computer to open up the browser of your choice (Firefox, IE, Opera, etc). PalmVNC and MobileTS are remote desktop clients like pcAnywhere or GoToMyPC, which work from a Palm environment. This uses the host computer to do the html rendering and lets the Palm only handle rendering a 320x320 view onto that host computer. It allows you access to all the features of your desktop, including running your favorite browser, office suite, email client, etc.

    However, you'll pay a price in two ways (possibly): one, you'll either have to put up with 320x320 window with scrolling or the client can shrink the view down to 320x320 (at the expense of possibly being illegible), and two, depending upon the speed of your connection, you either have to deal with dithered output for more frames per second or get full color with fewer frames per second (which feels like the system is responding slowly to you).

    You wouldn't do this if you were at home or on the road with a laptop, but short of the people who carry around an OQO, there are plenty of places when I'm just out and about and yet would rather be able to browse with a "real" browser and given the speed of EVDO, this might be a more viable option now.

    YES!!!! You got it.

    Will the speed increase of EVDO and the functionality of MobileTS and PalmVNC give me the best of both worlds? The speed and simplicity of Palm OS and the robust nature and power of a desktop pc with WinXP.

    Does anyone have experience using these programs with on a palm with Wifi to give their impression on usibilty with a fast connection?
    Visor --> Visor Platinum --> Treo 300 --> Treo 600 --> Treo 650 --> Treo 700p --> Treo 755p --> Treo 800w --> Palm Pre
  20. #20  
    I've used palm vnc over bluetooth at home to access my pc to change the internet radio station volume that's playing on winamp. I also used it to launch a browser on the PC and surf from the palm. it's fast, but too hard to make the browser window the right size for the treo 320x320 screen and the browser doesn't do a good job of wrapping text and you end up scrolling.

    doing this over the 1xrtt is obviously painfully slow, but gets the job done in a pinch if I need to do something on my home computer.

    so I think the evdo thing with palmvnc is better than 1xrtt, but to me it wasn't a pleasurable browsing experience.
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