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  1. #181  
    You will always have dbcache. You'll just have more if you leave your custom ROM short of the limit.
  2. #182  
    I blew my phone up bigger than hell, this tool saved my phone. It was easy/simple.

    http://discussion.treocentral.com/sh...d.php?t=107906
  3. #183  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle
    Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle
    I'm sorry for the PM
    I have asked this in many relevant threads:

    "Okay, a question based on reading your (mmastrac's) linked thread.

    If I use james' Stripped Rom (Cust #1) which is at about 5.8, and the smallest RomUpdaterApp.prc for Gsm is 7.1, what do I do w/ the surplus?
    Fill it back up to a little under 7.1, or just leave that 1mb wasted in Rom?
    Or is it Wasted? Is it DBCache?
    Thanks again and again."

    I have held off putting anything in Rom
    until I understand this better.

    Thanks,
    And sorry for the PM
    mmastrac's Reply:

    "Leave it empty - you get more DBCache"

    From the Horses Mouth
    Just call me Berd.
  4. #184  
    mmastrac, correct me if I'm wrong:

    Memory is 32MB
    There are two partitions:
    ROM & NVFS
    ROM is where the bootloader and ROM image are stored.
    NVFS is the rest. So if ROM is 7MB then NVFS is 25MB, 8MB then 24MB etc.
    RAM is where there are 3 different things:
    1- Running version of ROM (variable)
    2- Dynamic memory (fixed ~5MB)
    3- DBCache (difference of the above two)

    The "wasted" space is the left over of the ROM partition. The way this has any effect on dbcache is that the samller the ROM size that will be running in NVFS the more dbcache you will have.
    Last edited by jamesgangut; 03/06/2006 at 10:45 AM.
    PalmIII > PalmIIIx > PalmIIIxe > TRGPro > Handera 330 > Zire71 > Treo600 > Treo650 > Treo680 > Treo750 > Centro > TreoPro > iPhone 32GB 3GS

  5. #185  
    So he says:
    "Leave it empty - you get more DBCache"
    So the question still remains:
    Let's say I have a 7.0999999 mb Rom,
    (.09's added for exasperation)
    Do I use the 7.1mb RomUpAp or the 8.4?
    Just call me Berd.
  6. #186  
    Quote Originally Posted by 2000 Man
    You will always have dbcache. You'll just have more if you leave your custom ROM short of the limit.
    I can leave my Rom as short of the Limit as I want,
    So how short do I leave it; 1mb short, or .09mb short?
    What is too little? what is too much?
    What if someone can't use the 7.1, he has to use the 8.4
    8.4-5.8 (completely stripped) = 2.6
    Do I really need that much "wasted space" (DB Cache)
    What is the Optimum Balance?
    Just call me Berd.
  7.    #187  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle
    I can leave my Rom as short of the Limit as I want,
    So how short do I leave it; 1mb short, or .09mb short?
    What is too little? what is too much?
    What if someone can't use the 7.1, he has to use the 8.4
    8.4-5.8 (completely stripped) = 2.6
    Do I really need that much "wasted space" (DB Cache)
    What is the Optimum Balance?
    berdinkerdickle: Always use the smallest ROM updater that just fits your ROM size.

    Your DB cache is calculated approximately as:

    32MB - size of uncompressed ROM - 5440kB (dynamic RAM size). Use this to figure out what your DBCache size will be.

    Your available NVFS storage is calculated as:

    32MB - size of ROM partition (fixed by the ROM uploader).

    Use this as a guide to calculate approximately how much space your ROM will take. I'll add this stuff to a future version of the ROM tool to help people out.

    The "wasted space" is just non-volatile space that isn't used for anything. You want to minimize wasted space by using the smallest ROM partition size, not by adding things to your ROM.

    Does this help clear things up?
  8. #188  
    I stuffed (almost) everything I could into my ROM (8.4 MB). Since the ROM is compressed, it freed up LOTS of RAM on my phone. I now have 15.3 MB free. I guess as long as my phone is stable (which it is), I don't need to worry about db cache. I might even try to stuff a little more into that ROM.

    I'm a happy camper.
    NiceGPSuperior1 is a free GPS program, now with the ability to save your map! Get more info here. It's free! If you like this app and want to encourage development, you can donate from the web page link.

    NiceDrudgeReader is a fast, simple reader for The Drudge Report. It is only $0.99, so check it out, too! More info here.

    Search for "Nice" in the app catalog to see all my apps.
  9. #189  
    Quote Originally Posted by mmastrac
    berdinkerdickle: Always use the smallest ROM updater that just fits your ROM size.

    Your DB cache is calculated approximately as:

    32MB - size of uncompressed ROM - 5440kB (dynamic RAM size). Use this to figure out what your DBCache size will be.

    Your available NVFS storage is calculated as:

    32MB - size of ROM partition (fixed by the ROM uploader).

    Use this as a guide to calculate approximately how much space your ROM will take. I'll add this stuff to a future version of the ROM tool to help people out.

    The "wasted space" is just non-volatile space that isn't used for anything. You want to minimize wasted space by using the smallest ROM partition size, not by adding things to your ROM.

    Does this help clear things up?
    So the Final answer is:
    "Leave it empty - you get more DBCache"
    So we can answer to Everyone:
    'DONT PUT ANYTHING BACK IN ROM'
    Absolutly nothing!
    'Strip it of everything you can, and put nothing back in.'
    That's the Final answer to EVERYONE?
    Just call me Berd.
  10.    #190  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle
    So the Final answer is:
    "Leave it empty - you get more DBCache"
    So we can answer to Everyone:
    'DONT PUT ANYTHING BACK IN ROM'
    Absolutly nothing!
    'Strip it of everything you can, and put nothing back in.'
    That's the Final answer to EVERYONE?
    This is the ideal answer for everyone. You don't have to do it, but it's better to leave something out of ROM and put it in NVFS instead. No matter what, you'll end up with more usable memory overall. It's better even to strip Blazer out of ROM and drop it into NVFS. That way it would only be loaded when it was needed!
  11. #191  
    Quote Originally Posted by mmastrac
    This is the ideal answer for everyone. You don't have to do it, but it's better to leave something out of ROM and put it in NVFS instead. No matter what, you'll end up with more usable memory overall. It's better even to strip Blazer out of ROM and drop it into NVFS. That way it would only be loaded when it was needed!
    THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!
    Just call me Berd.
  12. #192  
    mmastrac,
    I am so sorry,
    Still one more thing.
    And I will go away.
    (atleast w/ this 'wasted space' thing)

    What if someone can't use the 7.1, he has to use the 8.4
    8.4-5.8 (completely stripped) = 2.6
    Do I really need that much "wasted space" (DB Cache)
    What is the Optimum Balance?
    Just call me Berd.
  13.    #193  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle
    mmastrac,
    I am so sorry,
    Still one more thing.
    And I will go away.
    (atleast w/ this 'wasted space' thing)

    What if someone can't use the 7.1, he has to use the 8.4
    8.4-5.8 (completely stripped) = 2.6
    Do I really need that much "wasted space" (DB Cache)
    What is the Optimum Balance?
    There shouldn't be any reason why you can't use the 7.1 updater. The update apps aren't tied to GSM/CDMA/ENA/ROW/APR/etc - they are 100% generic.

    If your ROM is smaller than 7.1MB, always use the 7.1 updater. If it's bigger than 7.1 but smaller than 8.4, use the 8.4, etc...
  14.    #194  
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonylmiller
    I stuffed (almost) everything I could into my ROM (8.4 MB). Since the ROM is compressed, it freed up LOTS of RAM on my phone. I now have 15.3 MB free. I guess as long as my phone is stable (which it is), I don't need to worry about db cache. I might even try to stuff a little more into that ROM.

    I'm a happy camper.
    Actually, what you freed up was NVFS. The Treo really means free "non-volatile storage" when it talks about free RAM. You are technically using more RAM (ie: the SDRAM type), as the uncompressed ROM files are transferred into an unfreeable RAM area.

    It's better to keep your applications on your SD card to keep your free NVFS as large as possible.

    In all truth, there's nothing wrong with sliding slightly under the ideal and adding back a couple of applications after removing a bunch. It certainly won't leave you any worse off (assuming your ROM isn't bigger than the one it replaces). It's just better in general to keep the amount of DBCache as high as possible to keep your phone as stable as possible when using certain DBCache intensive apps - Blazer comes to mind immediately.
  15. #195  
    I want to start off by
    We have really been given one of the Coolist Rom customizing Tools Ever

    I have been asking this question for days.
    I by no means ment to cause confusion.
    I think the confusion came from:
    Here is a new Tool, Lets call it a Gun.
    It will make things easier for killing game.
    Everyone says great.
    People ask questions like where do I put the bullets?
    And they get answers.
    But someone asks: 'do I need to be careful where I point this. And they get very little response.
    Someone says I'm stuck I got the bullets in, now what?
    And they get answers!
    So a similiar repeated question gets asked: 'do I really need make sure I am aiming this correctly?'

    Someone replies (w/ irritation)
    'stupid just use the gun,
    Your answers will come'

    I know this is a severe illustration,
    but come on, do we really need to be helping people figure out how to get this Tool up and running, when they don't know what, and what not, to do with it?

    Sorry again,
    if I caused any confusion.

    I know matt has gave clear info from the beggining.
    Maybe some did'nt read it.
    Don't know.


    Thanks Again for this Fantastic Tool.
    Espcially now that I know how to use it.

    I look forward to the advancements that matt continues to make to this Tool.
    Just call me Berd.
  16. #196  
    Quote Originally Posted by mmastrac
    It's better to keep your applications on your SD card to keep your free NVFS as large as possible.
    Actually I run from my SD card, generally, if I can. However, I like to use the buttons on the phone to launch a few apps, so I keep those in RAM (NVFS, I suppose).

    Regardless, my phone is running great with the 8.4 MB ROM, so I don't think I have a problem with my db cache.

    Thanks for all the help, and the excellent tool!
    NiceGPSuperior1 is a free GPS program, now with the ability to save your map! Get more info here. It's free! If you like this app and want to encourage development, you can donate from the web page link.

    NiceDrudgeReader is a fast, simple reader for The Drudge Report. It is only $0.99, so check it out, too! More info here.

    Search for "Nice" in the app catalog to see all my apps.
  17. #197  
    Quote Originally Posted by mmastrac
    This is the ideal answer for everyone. You don't have to do it, but it's better to leave something out of ROM and put it in NVFS instead. No matter what, you'll end up with more usable memory overall. It's better even to strip Blazer out of ROM and drop it into NVFS. That way it would only be loaded when it was needed!
    I thought Blazer had to stay in ROM???I am so confused...
  18. #198  
    I am running one of James' stripped roms quite successfully and my phone seems so much more stable. Almost no reboots at all.

    Anyway, I have been following these threads quite faithfully, and I, as well, am completely totally confused. I was going to make me a rom and stuff it full of my programs so I could save some ram, but now I see that seems to be a naive complete lack of understanding on my part. I thought our whole goal here was to get things out of rom we don't need, use, or like and to replace them with things we do use, need, and like????? And in the process, have more open RAM available for use.

    ?
    Nanotechnology Nerd
    i300-->i330-->i500-->6700(1 wk!)-->Sprintt650-->gsm650-->HTC Universal (1 mo.)-->gsm650-->Cing8525(3wks!)-->gsm650
  19. #199  
    Quote Originally Posted by shadowboxer
    I am running one of James' stripped roms quite successfully and my phone seems so much more stable. Almost no reboots at all.

    Anyway, I have been following these threads quite faithfully, and I, as well, am completely totally confused. I was going to make me a rom and stuff it full of my programs so I could save some ram, but now I see that seems to be a naive complete lack of understanding on my part. I thought our whole goal here was to get things out of rom we don't need, use, or like and to replace them with things we do use, need, and like????? And in the process, have more open RAM available for use.

    ?
    This is the answer to go by.

    This is the ideal answer for everyone. You don't have to do it, but it's better to leave something out of ROM and put it in NVFS instead. No matter what, you'll end up with more usable memory overall. It's better even to strip Blazer out of ROM and drop it into NVFS. That way it would only be loaded when it was needed!
    PalmIII > PalmIIIx > PalmIIIxe > TRGPro > Handera 330 > Zire71 > Treo600 > Treo650 > Treo680 > Treo750 > Centro > TreoPro > iPhone 32GB 3GS

  20. #200  
    Yes they are still needed. I was just using that as an example.
    PalmIII > PalmIIIx > PalmIIIxe > TRGPro > Handera 330 > Zire71 > Treo600 > Treo650 > Treo680 > Treo750 > Centro > TreoPro > iPhone 32GB 3GS

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