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  1.    #1  
    I'm a skeptic -- but I'm curious as what people would want if Palm were to ever produce your perfect Foleo -- what specs would you want the prospective hypothetical Foleo to have ??

    I.E.: ram, speed, storage, weight, features, software, price ??
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  2. #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    I'm a skeptic -- but I'm curious as what people would want if Palm were to ever produce your perfect Foleo -- what specs would you want the prospective hypothetical Foleo to have ??

    I.E.: ram, speed, storage, weight, features, software, price ??
    Either it should be the same, and $150-200, or it should be a little more powerful and include WIMAX or HSDPA or swappable WAN card/module at $500-600.

    A tablet mode with touch screen seem to be a no-brainier, especially for the more expensive model.

    Lastly, imagine the ability to multi-task PalmOS applications on the screen (ie running 6 different apps all at the same time on tiled windows on the screen - that would be cool and useful, and turn PalmOS apps into useful widgets).

    Surur
  3. vrf
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    #3  
    Personally, all the improvements I have in mind would be slight software tweaks and more applications. (One minor thing: I want to hit ctrl+delete to backdelete a word.)

    Hardware and form-factor are perfect as is. Loved the design.

    Maybe longer battery life. A low power device at this size should go 8-10 hours, although that probably would have been possible if the wifi/bt radios were off.
  4. #4  
    • Email app that could function independently with IMAP servers over WiFi.
    • Compatibility with Treo 650 and up.
    • Ability to manage Treo files via BT and USB.
    • Ability to purchase, download and install Treo apps.
    • Ability to do scheduled backups of Treo.
    • Ability to run Linux Treo apps in a window with single license.
    • Encryption of stored files and remote wipe.
    • Bundled with PIM that can sync online with Treo and PC.
    • Bundled with 8GB CF card.
    • Bundled with robust media player which can manage media files for Treo.
    • Tabbed browsing and Flash video - which require more memory and faster processor. Not sure what the magic numbers are.
    • Properly oriented logo when the cover is open.
    • Same weight.
    • 4.5 hrs battery life.
    • $599 retail. No rebate.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim View Post
    • $599 retail. No rebate.
    Nice ideas, but still too expensive as a "companion" unit?

    Surur
  6. #6  
    Well, with these features (memory, processor, storage, Flash video, tabbed browsing, IMAP email, PIM, and media player), it would be a real laptop replacement for a good number of people. A 2.5lb, 10" laptop with 4.5 hrs battery-life that does everything I need a laptop to do - plus the companion stuff? $599 seems reasonable to me.
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim View Post
    Well, with these features (memory, processor, storage, Flash video, tabbed browsing, IMAP email, PIM, and media player), it would be a real laptop replacement for a good number of people. A 2.5lb, 10" laptop with 4.5 hrs battery-life that does everything I need a laptop to do - plus the companion stuff? $599 seems reasonable to me.
    By the time a Foleo 2 comes out full-sized laptops will be $400. The value proposition will still not fly.

    Surur
  8. #8  
    once is enough, 2 is too much. don't be 2x a laughinstock, palm. let the fooleo r.i.p.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    By the time a Foleo 2 comes out full-sized laptops will be $400. The value proposition will still not fly.

    Surur
    You're talking about 5lb laptops without Office and with 2.5hrs battery-life, right? Getting the right weight, battery-life, and functionality is key.

    Remember that the goal isn't to appeal to everyone. If you need a full Windows laptop with a 2GHz processor, you're not the target market. If you just want the cheapest Linux system possible, you're not the target market. I think we've had this conversation before.
  10.    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    By the time a Foleo 2 comes out full-sized laptops will be $400. The value proposition will still not fly.

    Surur
    I think you're right Surur --

    cost seems to be the obvious insurmountable hurdle beyond which this idea cannot flop.

    It would be a device produced outside of Palm's core competencies, manufactured in quanities likely far smaller than comparable mini-laptops, and sold without the subsidization that carriers normally provide for cell phones.

    I fear that to get it to the price that you correctly guess it would need to fall to ($200-400) it would look more and more like the sinclair z81

    Last edited by BARYE; 09/09/2007 at 11:00 AM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim View Post
    You're talking about 5lb laptops without Office and with 2.5hrs battery-life, right? Getting the right weight, battery-life, and functionality is key.

    Remember that the goal isn't to appeal to everyone. If you need a full Windows laptop with a 2GHz processor, you're not the target market. If you just want the cheapest Linux system possible, you're not the target market. I think we've had this conversation before.
    The problem is that most people share my POV in this, which is why the Foleo died.

    Surur
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    The problem is that most people share my POV in this, which is why the Foleo died.

    Surur
    The Foleo was killed because it didn't fulfill the promise of a smartphone companion, because it didn't meet the potential of a laptop replacement, and because someone finally realized that it was stupid to try to launch and support two incompatible Linux platforms.

    If your POV is that the demand for an inexpensive, ultra light-weight laptop with a long battery life is insignificant, then I don't think the market will be on your side.
  13. tirk's Avatar
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by vrf View Post
    Hardware and form-factor are perfect as is. Loved the design.
    Form factor was the obvious problem with Foleo. If you need a free hand to carry it, or a notebook bag, why not carry a notebook? The weight of the notebook bag and other contents (if you're anything like me!) will exceed the notebook anyway!

    It either needs to be small enough to go into a pocket (the original folding screen design), or it needs to be a sub-notebook (if so, there are better/cheaper/more powerful products available).

    Security (or lack of it) would have been the real business killer though. It probably would have been impossible for many business sectors in the UK to buy under security compliance rules given that the memory card was unencrypted. It would have sold in thousands to geeks like us, but not a lot beyond that.
    PalmPilot Professional...Palm Vx...Treo 600...Treo 680...HTC Touch HD...iPhone 4S...
  14. #14  
    You don't need a companian for a smartphone. That's what a smartphone is for.

    Anymore stop gap device in the future will be fullfilled by the 5-8 inch multimedia PMP/GPS/backup gedgats.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by samkim View Post
    • Email app that could function independently with IMAP servers over WiFi.
    • Compatibility with Treo 650 and up.
    • Ability to manage Treo files via BT and USB.
    • Ability to purchase, download and install Treo apps.
    • Ability to do scheduled backups of Treo.
    • Ability to run Linux Treo apps in a window with single license.
    • Encryption of stored files and remote wipe.
    • Bundled with PIM that can sync online with Treo and PC.
    • Bundled with 8GB CF card.
    • Bundled with robust media player which can manage media files for Treo.
    • Tabbed browsing and Flash video - which require more memory and faster processor. Not sure what the magic numbers are.
    • Properly oriented logo when the cover is open.
    • Same weight.
    • 4.5 hrs battery life.
    • $599 retail. No rebate.
    By and large, I agree with most of these. As a "smartphone companion", many of the initial features planned for Foleo made it mostly a "smartphone E-MAIL companion". I hope that if Palm is indeed planning a Foleo II, it will allow for easy file sharing with the Treo.

    A few things that I don't agree with (and nothing personal, samkim: just a difference of opinion):

    I actually thought that Palm had it right allowing users to select their own memory. While I wouldn't complain about an included 8gb CF card, leaving it out could help control costs and allow the user to determine how much memory and what format is right for them. Personally, I can't imagine ever having a need for anything more than 1gb, and would prefer to use a simple SD card.

    While flash video (i.e. YouTube) support would be nice, I got the impression from Hawkins' interviews on Foleo that this was a matter of drag on the system's rather basic resources. So if we want to watch YouTube on a Foleo II, it will take a more robust processor (read: higher unit price). Personally, I always saw Foleo as a business tool and can do without flash video if it keeps the cost reasonable.

    As did many others, I felt that the design of the unit was about as perfect as it could get. 2.5 pounds, 5+ hour battery life, less than an inch thick, full size keyboard - the design was great!
    Last edited by David.Swinehart; 09/09/2007 at 03:38 PM. Reason: Edited for typo's
    _______________________________________
    David Swinehart
    Palm Treo 700wx, Dell Latitude X1, Wish I had a Foleo
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by David.Swinehart View Post
    By and large, I agree with most of these. As a "smartphone companion", many of the initial features planned for Foleo made it mostly a "smartphone E-MAIL companion". I hope that if Palm is indeed planning a Foleo II, it will allow for easy file sharing with the Treo.

    A few things that I don't agree with (and nothing personal, samkim: just a difference of opinion):

    I actually thought that Palm had it right allowing users to select their own memory. While I wouldn't complain about an included 8gb CF card, leaving it out could help control costs and allow the user to determine how much memory and what format is right for them. Personally, I can't imagine ever having a need for anything more than 1gb, and would prefer to use a simple SD card.

    While flash video (i.e. YouTube) support would be nice, I got the impression from Hawkins' interviews on Foleo that this was a matter of drag on the system's rather basic resources. So if we want to watch YouTube on a Foleo II, it will take a more robust processor (read: higher unit price). Personally, I always saw Foleo as a business tool and can do without flash video if it keeps the cost reasonable.

    As did many others, I felt that the design of the unit was about as perfect as it could get. 2.5 pounds, 5+ hour battery life, less than an inch thick, full size keyboard - the design was great!
    If you are so concerned about the cost, why do you agree with the high price? The Foleo has many of the same components as a TX - it should cost about the same.

    Surur
  17. #17  
    I suppose that when I really think about it, I'm not so concerned that the pricing will be a problem. I don't know how Palm's production pricing was weighted, but I get the impression from the hands-on reports that the unit was fairly robust - which was important for those of us that planned to use the device on the road a good deal of the time - and I saw the cost of the device in line with what I would be willing to pay for a high-quality piece of hardware.

    In the theme of the thread's question, I would rather see more options to truly syncronize data (PIM, Files, etc.) than asking Palm to create a more robust standalone device. That's what my laptop is for.
    _______________________________________
    David Swinehart
    Palm Treo 700wx, Dell Latitude X1, Wish I had a Foleo
  18. #18  
    I think Palm would be mad to waste a lot of resources on a niche product. They need successful mass market products, and this means either very compelling functionality at a reasonable price (compelling to the masses) or limited functionality at a very low price.

    Limited functionality at a high price screams niche.

    Surur
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    I think Palm would be mad to waste a lot of resources on a niche product.
    I can't disagree with that at all. I suppose how worthwhile the resource expenditure is depends on the size of the niche market. I think it's large enough to justify the development of Foleo II, but I'm sure there are plenty out there who are better plugged into this project that could answer that better than my guesses.
    _______________________________________
    David Swinehart
    Palm Treo 700wx, Dell Latitude X1, Wish I had a Foleo
  20. vrf
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    #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by tirk View Post
    Form factor was the obvious problem with Foleo. If you need a free hand to carry it, or a notebook bag, why not carry a notebook?
    Yeah, I think a few people have made that argument before. It's getting a little old.

    If it fits in a pocket, I won't buy it. Without the full keyboard, it is useless to me. And a folding screen? WTF?

    If you don't see the advantages in a laptop that's instant-on, solid-state, cool-running and NOT running a bloated desktop OS... well, then the Foleo wasn't for you.

    The Foleo's form-factor was perfect for me. Not for you. Whatever. You win. It's dead anyway.
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