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  1.    #1  
    I have been watching and waiting for both devices.

    Check out the HTC Shift here.
    http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/13/h...gets-hands-on/

    I know that we are talking apples and oranges here including two very different price points.

    But the reality is I am one of the people watching and waiting for both, and now am considering waiting for the shift in stead of the foleo.

    Anyway I thought that every one should see this.

    Regards
    graylion
  2. JayC3's Avatar
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    #2  
    After watching the video, the only main advantage of the Foleo is the instant on and cheaper price. However, the shift is a fully functional PC with both windows vista and pocket PC (for instant on also) in a very, very nice package. I am now seriously thinking on getting the shift instead of the Foleo, mainly because I won't be able to use google docs, google calendar, IM and open office on the Foleo.

    Honestly speaking, instant on is cool, but lets face it, do you need it everytime? What's 3 mins of your time if you can have all the function that you need in 1 machine The Foleo should have been a laptop replacement IMO. Anyway, that's my 2 cents
  3. #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by janric View Post
    After watching the video, the only main advantage of the Foleo is the instant on and cheaper price. However, the shift is a fully functional PC with both windows vista and pocket PC (for instant on also) in a very, very nice package. I am now seriously thinking on getting the shift instead of the Foleo, mainly because I won't be able to use google docs, google calendar, IM and open office on the Foleo.

    Honestly speaking, instant on is cool, but lets face it, do you need it everytime? What's 3 mins of your time if you can have all the function that you need in 1 machine The Foleo should have been a laptop replacement IMO. Anyway, that's my 2 cents
    The reason i want the foleo is because i dont want to wait. It is a specific use appliance, not a general all purpose machine. I expect specific or one use appliances to turn on instantly like a cell phone.

    i see your point though.
  4. #4  
    The HTC Shift is the type of device I want!! I may wait until gen 2 of the Shift, hoping that it will have the Menlow processor and a larger HD. My long shot hope is that it will have WiMax or an ExpressCard slot.
    Last edited by slbailey1; 08/13/2007 at 11:05 AM.
  5.    #5  
    Great Avatar slbailey!

    You know I watched the shift video again and I have several more comments.

    The strength of the review could have been better or deeper. He did cover a lot of ground but I maybe better approach?

    Having said that he was very excited about this and I agree this is one of the coolest devices coming out.

    I am actually hoping that the price tag on this is not as stagering as the other umpc's. We will see.

    It is an odd comparison but when I think about it I am looking at these too devices for the same primary purposes:

    - Ease Travel
    - Email / PIM
    - Web Browsing

    everything after this is gravy, I may do away with my notebook and just use a port replicator to hook in a home or work.



    Regards
    graylion
  6. Gerorne's Avatar
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    #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by janric View Post
    After watching the video, the only main advantage of the Foleo is the instant on and cheaper price. However, the shift is a fully functional PC with both windows vista and pocket PC (for instant on also) in a very, very nice package. I am now seriously thinking on getting the shift instead of the Foleo, mainly because I won't be able to use google docs, google calendar, IM and open office on the Foleo.

    Honestly speaking, instant on is cool, but lets face it, do you need it everytime? What's 3 mins of your time if you can have all the function that you need in 1 machine The Foleo should have been a laptop replacement IMO. Anyway, that's my 2 cents
    Three minutes is a huge deal in situation such as creative writing, where a scene pops into your head, and you need to get as much written down before the scene leaves you.

    But that pocket pc portion of it may solve that issue. (Does it have a document editor in the pocket pc side? Can it copy/paste between the two OSs?)

    But that doesn't mean the Shift isn't a very cool device. What's the price on this thing? And does it have a full sized keyboard?
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  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerorne View Post
    Three minutes is a huge deal

    Why does everyone always forget that windows has a standby and/or hibernate feature? I haven't rebooted my laptop in weeks! And it powers on in seconds every time. I would call that instant on. And that's all Palm is offering with it's linux OS, standby, nothing more.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by mclark2112 View Post
    Why does everyone always forget that windows has a standby and/or hibernate feature? I haven't rebooted my laptop in weeks! And it powers on in seconds every time. I would call that instant on. And that's all Palm is offering with it's linux OS, standby, nothing more.
    no one here has "forgotten" that "feature" as it's been discussed endlessly in this forum.

    Point is: Standby kills the battery quickly if you're leaving for more than 15 minutes and you're totally screwed if you forgot you put it standby but don't need it (now you have to wake the device and tell it to turn off: brilliant).

    Also, it's hardly "instant". I don't consider watching a progress bar both on startup and standby to be instant at all. especially if you just remembered to do something and have to repeat the process again. Instant? More like a PITA.

    There's also that issue that for writers/academics/business people: lugging around 3+lb laptop that gets 2.5 hours of battery life (if you're lucky), along with your ac/dc brick charger and the bloated, slow Windows OS with all their silly A/V, spyware and "updater" components is just overkill for these tasks: email, office, PIM, web.

    Some of us are looking for simplicity and elegance in a device, not a mobile desktop which is too much for our needs and too little for practical use. I can't wait to whip out my Foleo on the LIRR, write an email, work on a paper and not worry about booting, standby, a heavy charger, silly Windows and yet can get all my work done and not worry about the battery.

    The Shift, while pretty and neat is still overkill for what I need it for (not to mention way to expensive).
    Last edited by Malatesta; 08/13/2007 at 05:06 PM.

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  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by mclark2112 View Post
    Why does everyone always forget that windows has a standby and/or hibernate feature? I haven't rebooted my laptop in weeks! And it powers on in seconds every time. I would call that instant on. And that's all Palm is offering with it's linux OS, standby, nothing more.
    Did you watch that video? It took just short of forever to wake up from hibernate (not even from a cold boot up). Instant on is a huge plus.

    That being said, the Shift is the most intriguing UMPC I've seen so far. While it has great wow factor, I think the foleo meets my needs (and wallet). Less can be more.
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    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerorne View Post
    Three minutes is a huge deal in situation such as creative writing, where a scene pops into your head, and you need to get as much written down before the scene leaves you.

    But that pocket pc portion of it may solve that issue. (Does it have a document editor in the pocket pc side? Can it copy/paste between the two OSs?)

    But that doesn't mean the Shift isn't a very cool device. What's the price on this thing? And does it have a full sized keyboard?
    If instant on is really a big deal, that's why there's pen and paper. Its always on, doesn't crash and you only need to replace your pen if it doesn't work

    I guess it can run the document editoer in pocket PC. However, I am not sure if it can copy and paste between the two OS. We can find out soon enough.

    I believe the price is almost double that of the foleo. But may be cheaper than an ultraportable.
  11. #11  
    Almost double? I havn't seen a firm price on the shift, but saw $1200 some place. The Foleo is "only" $499 (after rebate)..
  12. Gerorne's Avatar
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    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by janric View Post
    If instant on is really a big deal, that's why there's pen and paper. Its always on, doesn't crash and you only need to replace your pen if it doesn't work

    I guess it can run the document editoer in pocket PC. However, I am not sure if it can copy and paste between the two OS. We can find out soon enough.

    I believe the price is almost double that of the foleo. But may be cheaper than an ultraportable.
    Oh I use pen and paper too, but when I do, I tend to write in much more fragmented sentences, since it's also much slower than a keyboard.

    Plus all the other benefits of a word processor, such as cut/paste to easily rearrange those notes. The ability to cram whole paragraphs inbetween two words if I want, without having to re write everything below it or draw arrows to remind me what goes where, has no real substitute in pen and paper form.

    (Pen and paper does have it's advantages such as using idea webs, but if there was a good wiki style program made for the foleo, drawings would be the only real benefit to pen and paper)



    Has the HTC Shift been given a release date yet? The few articles I browsed didn't say.
    Vx --> M515 --> T|T3 --> T|T5
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerorne View Post
    Oh I use pen and paper too, but when I do, I tend to write in much more fragmented sentences, since it's also much slower than a keyboard.

    Plus all the other benefits of a word processor, such as cut/paste to easily rearrange those notes. The ability to cram whole paragraphs inbetween two words if I want, without having to re write everything below it or draw arrows to remind me what goes where, has no real substitute in pen and paper form.

    (Pen and paper does have it's advantages such as using idea webs, but if there was a good wiki style program made for the foleo, drawings would be the only real benefit to pen and paper)


    Has the HTC Shift been given a release date yet? The few articles I browsed didn't say.
    I tried my TX to replace my pen and paper, guess what happened?

    No PDA is as fast and accurate as pen and paper. I still rely on this method even today. I agree with your statement that pen and paper still has its advantages.

    My main gripe with the Foleo is that the concept has so much potential, I believe in JH idea. But the product that was released only allows me to perform certain things in a limited way (eg. no google docs, google calendar, IM, skpe, print, you tube, etc). And the funny thing is that most of these tasks that I do (except google docs) can be done in my Treo 680. I do hope that Palm will release the Foleo 2.0 within the next year with the concept of "laptop replacement", instead of "mobile companion".

    I guess the release date for the HTC shift may be september or october. For sure this is before the holidays. Expansys (mobile planet in the US) already have this for pre-order and it cost around $1500 (costs 2.5 times the foleo).
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by NJ Dog Doc View Post
    Almost double? I havn't seen a firm price on the shift, but saw $1200 some place. The Foleo is "only" $499 (after rebate)..
    Sorry about that, it should be 2.5 time the Foleo's price (I don't count the rebate as it may take forever to get your money back from Palm ). Expansys list it around $1500.
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    #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by janric View Post
    I tried my TX to replace my pen and paper, guess what happened?

    No PDA is as fast and accurate as pen and paper. I still rely on this method even today. I agree with your statement that pen and paper still has its advantages.

    My main gripe with the Foleo is that the concept has so much potential, I believe in JH idea. But the product that was released only allows me to perform certain things in a limited way (eg. no google docs, google calendar, IM, skpe, print, you tube, etc). And the funny thing is that most of these tasks that I do (except google docs) can be done in my Treo 680. I do hope that Palm will release the Foleo 2.0 within the next year with the concept of "laptop replacement", instead of "mobile companion".

    I guess the release date for the HTC shift may be september or october. For sure this is before the holidays. Expansys (mobile planet in the US) already have this for pre-order and it cost around $1500 (costs 2.5 times the foleo).
    Yeah, I've tried using my T5 as a replacement for pen and paper, but it didn't really work. I found other uses for it, but not that. The Treo was an improvement in speed due to the keyboard built in, but I still need a real keybaord. The Foleo provides that. The Shift may too... depending on how large/small that keyboard is. And since it's windows/pocket pc, I know for certain that eReader works with that, and it could be nice for ebooks.

    The price may be an issue. I guess that's still up in the air. mobilebee.com lists it as $999.99, and estimates that it'll be available in 49 days.

    Edit: Well... it would be ok as an ebook reader with only the 3 hour battery life. If the eReader can be installed on the pocketPC side that would make it excellent. I know eReader makes a version for that as well, but I'm unfamiliar with pocketpcs, and am not unsure if the pocketpc side the guy was showing was the full system and can use all the programs currently available for it.
    Last edited by Gerorne; 08/13/2007 at 08:14 PM.
    Vx --> M515 --> T|T3 --> T|T5
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  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerorne View Post
    Oh I use pen and paper too, but when I do, I tend to write in much more fragmented sentences, since it's also much slower than a keyboard.

    You, like myself, would ideally be suited by this puppy..
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    #17  
    Hahah, that'd be cool. But what would it retail for? =P


    And wow, I just read the comments on engadget about that reivew, and they're pretty harsh. I really dont' know what most of those people are expecting.
    Vx --> M515 --> T|T3 --> T|T5
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  18. JayC3's Avatar
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    #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerorne View Post
    Hahah, that'd be cool. But what would it retail for? =P


    And wow, I just read the comments on engadget about that reivew, and they're pretty harsh. I really dont' know what most of those people are expecting.
    You should read the comments on the Foleo on Engadget.. they're comments are much more harsh than the shift.

    I guess most people do not yet envision themselves with a UMPC or a "mobile companion". Anyway, we'll see by the end of the year if they are right.
  19. #19  
    why can't palm ever try to make something cool? the shift can cost 2x the price of foleo and its would still be of better value.
  20. #20  
    The estimates I've seen for the Shift range between $1500 and $2000.

    If that video is any example, the Shift is going to look much better on paper than it does in real life.

    Did you see how painfully slow it was? I'm not just talking about coming out of hibernation. It's 850 MHz processor simply isn't up to the job of handling Windows Vista and the applications written for it.

    And let's not forget the less than full size keyboard, and a battery life that's maybe half the Foleo's.

    Don't get me wrong, the Shift looks like a cool device, but the Foleo has many advantages.
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