Page 1 of 9 123456 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 177
  1.    #1  
    Taken (and edited) from various posts around the Internet:

    TVoR's Paradigm Shift: Web-Accessible, Smartphone-Centric Applications [The "WASCA Manifesto"]


    Okay, so we've now all had time to digest Palm's recent announcement of the Foleo. We've heard everyone fumble around trying to explain its raison d'ętre.


    Jeff Hawkins claims that the Foleo is being positioned as a Treo companion, a veritable physical expander of the Treo's tiny screen and keyboard. The Treo remains the "brains" of the operation, while the Foleo acts as a portable equivalent of a laptop's docking station, complete with keyboard and bigger screen. The argument for such a setup is that everyone always carries around a cell phone, and as cell phones get smarter and acquire larger on-device storage, eventually these phones have the potential to become our primary computing devices. The only limitation in that case becomes the physical size of the cellphone, which both limits ease the entering data (via keyboard) and also makes it difficult to view the data due to small screen size. As long as the goal for the ideal cellphone remains for it to be as small as possible, cellphone design will always be at cross purposes with ideal methods of entering and viewing data. In the future, voice transcription software, holographic projection displays, screens projected onto eyeglasses etc. may be able to obviate the need for physically larger keyboards and screens, but this type of technology is still several years away. So what do users do now?

    [Cue triumphant music] ENTER THE Foleo...

    But wait a minute! Why would anyone in their right mind want to carry around another 2 1/2 pound device that can't even run regular Windows applications? Especially when dozens of lighter devices that do run Real Windows® are available? Isn't the whole point of convergence devices to avoid carrying extra hardware? If the Treo and other smartphones are supposed to become the personal computers of the future, surely there must be a better solution to the problems of entering data into and viewing data from tiny smartphone devices. Of course there's a better solution, but unfortunately, it's a rather revolutionary paradigm shift. And one other thing: Since the "better solution" doesn't really require any new hardware, it won't exactly be a big moneymaker for Palm unless it becomes popular and manages to boost Treo sales. Let's just call it "Palm's Dirty Little Secret". The answer is...





    Web-Accessible, Smartphone-Centric Applications [The "WASCA Manifesto"] featuring wireless (+/- wired) syncing to smartphones!

    This is the first REAL paradigm shift we've seen since the dawn of the "PC Era", but it appears that Palm is too afraid/incompetent/slow to embrace it fully. How far to take this new way of thinking depends on whether a given company makes a lot of money selling desktops/laptops and/or software for desktops/laptops. If the company (e.g. Palm) has no vested interest in desktop/laptops and the software that runs on them, then the smart phone can be completely freed to become the new PC. Purely Web-based applications (available through any Internet-connected dumb terminal/desktop/laptop) would then allow users to have access to personal files with the added bonus of larger screens and keyboards whenever necessary. Taken to the extreme, users would be able to have real-time syncing (through broadband connections) to their smartphone of data being entered into these Web-based applications. A simpler solution would involve entering data into Web-based applications which would then be backed up (either over the air, via WiFi, via Bluetooth or via wired connection) to the smartphone with a user-initiated sync. With online storage available (at a price) for the data generated with Web-based applications, this syncing between Treo/Foleo and online databases could occur at the users whim.

    If you want to get fancy, ensure the web-based apps can also be run OFFLINE on any platform (Windows, Mac, Linux, PalmLinux) and that syncing can be triggered the next time users go online. Options to save predetermined numbers of timed backups of files online can be set in an app's (or better yet, file's) preferences. Suddenly, desktop/laptop OS doesn't matter. Paid Internet connection doesn't matter (if Wi-Fi is available). Hardware doesn't matter (ANY computer with a keyboard, screen and Internet connection can become the Treo's "bigger keyboard + screen"). All that matters is the smartphone.

    In addition to online and Treo/Foleo-based apps, Palm should offer a full-featured suite of apps stored on a USB Flash drive that would allow the apps to be run temporarily (+ without any traces being left behind) on a host computer + then would automatically upload file changes to a user's personal space on Palm's server, save the data to the USB Flash drive + wirelessly update the smartphone/other devices in the user's profile.

    The USB flash drive isn't mandatory - it would just be a convenient way of temporarily loading an environment of custom applications onto a host computer. The apps could also reside on the (PalmLinux) Treo and then be accessed when connected to the host computer with a USB cable. If the Treo app is able to use PdaReach-like linking to the host computer and is (ideally) able to scale the Treo app up to fit the host computer's screen then all you would ever need is literally just your Treo and a USB cable. (Or even leave the cable at home if the process works over Wi-Fi.)

    MotionApps has an application theat does basically this (scales to the host computer's screen size when the Treo is connected via USB or Wi-Fi) and hints at the Treo's future:

    http://www.motionapps.com/mexpenses/_treo700p.jsp

    This is an absolutely BRILLIANT concept, and plays perfectly into Hawkins' vision of the Treo as the PC of the future: apps and data residing on the Treo, but ALWAYS accessible from ANY computer.

    I believe Palm intends to release a PalmLinux Treo with similar functionality . But first they need to ensure something like POSE works reliably under PalmLinux, so that legacy PalmOS apps are still supported. Then we'll see a series of PalmLinux apps that work both on the Treo and on a desktop/laptop screen when the Treo is connected. The biggest problem in all this is the SPEED at which Palm's software development has moved. If only these concepts had been ready for release 1 or 2 years ago...

    So where does this leave the Foleo? Nowhere. Palm's problem is that it likely currently lacks all the STABLE software needed to have PIM, word processing, accounting, database, presentation, music, video and other data syncing with their Treos. A project of this scope would require flawless integration of a complete suite of Web-based applications with counterparts on the Treo. It also seems highly unlikely that PalmOS 5 would-be robust enough to handle this type of mobile application. Can you say PalmLinux? I knew you could.

    The Foleo is simply a beta test mule (donkey?) for the whole concept of a smartphone syncing with a larger device wirelessly. Its (simplistic) email syncing merely amounts to an early proof of concept. Baby steps. For Palm to REALLY succeed, they need to cut out the need for proprietary HARDWARE like the Foleo by figuring out how to get the Web-based syncing running smoothly as well as figuring out how to get Treo-based applications to smoothly scale up to any connected desktop or laptop withour requiring the loading of software onto the host computer.

    Two problems:
    1) Palm's code monkey talent may be too limited to get this all up and running with the bugs worked out anytime soon.
    2) Microsoft (and soon Apple) already have suites of functional desktop applications as well as smartphone applications that could be used to create a competing system fairly quickly. I doubt that Palm will be able to execute quickly enough to have a chance in this impending David versus Goliath death match.

    Treo = The new PC. Brilliant. Simply, Palm.
  2. #2  
    First of all, I am very curious about your chance of text color.

    Secondly, in regard to the thread title, LOL.
  3.    #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by whatever7 View Post
    First of all, I am very curious about your chance of text color.

    Secondly, in regard to the thread title, LOL.

    Red is BOLD, like the thinking behind Jeff Hawkins' Foleo concept.
    Red is the color of losses in accounting that the Foleo may have caused Palm.
    Red is the color of blood that may be spilt over the Foleo.

    Hopefully in 12 months Jeff Hawkins will be the one who can laugh out loud.
  4. #4  
    The blood that may be spilled over the Foleo?

    I say you've spent too much time thinking about this.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by NJ Dog Doc View Post
    say you've spent too much time thinking about this.
    I'm pretty sure there wasn't much thinking at all...
  6. TxDot's Avatar
    Posts
    892 Posts
    Global Posts
    916 Global Posts
    #6  
    I'm curious about the 5 star rating this thread has. Who gave it that?
    GSM Treo 600 > Unlocked GSM Treo 650 on T-Mobile - Attempting to use a BB Curve

    Technology is neither good nor evil, good people will find good uses for it and evil people will find evil uses for it. Phil P.
  7.    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by NJ Dog Doc View Post
    The blood that may be spilled over the Foleo?

    I say you've spent too much time thinking about this.

    Yes, I've probably spent more time trying to explain the Foleo than Palm has trying to make a decent tabbed browser or standalone email program for it.

  8.    #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    I'm pretty sure there wasn't much thinking at all...

    So what are YOUR brilliant ruminations on the Foleo? The main people I've seen expressing themselves well here are Gameboy and dstrauss (sp?). I guess we'll all know soon enough what the market thinks about the Foleo.

    I find it interesting to read elsewhere that Palm just dumped its entire team that was developing Wi-Fi for the Treos. Wow. And I thought Palm was supposed to be a company full of software experts. If Palm actually doesn't have many good coders in-house, maybe that's why they're depending on third party developers to supply almost all of the Foleo's software. This isn't reassuring.
  9. TxDot's Avatar
    Posts
    892 Posts
    Global Posts
    916 Global Posts
    #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Chupacabra View Post
    I find it interesting to read elsewhere that Palm just dumped its entire team that was developing Wi-Fi for the Treos...
    How about a link to where you read that?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Chupacabra View Post
    ... Wow. And I thought Palm was supposed to be a company full of software experts. If Palm actually doesn't have many good coders in-house, maybe that's why they're depending on third party developers to supply almost all of the Foleo's software. This isn't reassuring.
    That's a huge leap; from a team being let go (if true) to them being bad coders. Companies let people go all the time for all sorts of reasons. I work for a software company and we have let a lot of really good coders go mostly for economic reasons. For some of them they were on the wrong team at the wrong time and there was no place to transfer to internally. It's a real bummer but it happens.
    GSM Treo 600 > Unlocked GSM Treo 650 on T-Mobile - Attempting to use a BB Curve

    Technology is neither good nor evil, good people will find good uses for it and evil people will find evil uses for it. Phil P.
  10. #10  
    If Google bought Palm, many of the loose ends would be tied up...from day one I felt the Foleo was meant to be paired with Google Apps but an announcement fell apart at the last moment.
  11.    #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by TxDot View Post
    How about a link to where you read that?


    That's a huge leap; from a team being let go (if true) to them being bad coders. Companies let people go all the time for all sorts of reasons. I work for a software company and we have let a lot of really good coders go mostly for economic reasons. For some of them they were on the wrong team at the wrong time and there was no place to transfer to internally. It's a real bummer but it happens.

    http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp?doc_id=127895

    That "leap" was taken after seeing several years worth of buggy code, slow updates and inability to produce basic applications on the part of Palm. Yes, there are dozens of possible explanations as to why these coders were let go, but most reasons appear to revolve around Palm either giving up on PalmOS or else deciding to outsource Wi-Fi development/support. It will be interesting to find out what the real story is behind all of this.
  12.    #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by mas90guru View Post
    If Google bought Palm, many of the loose ends would be tied up...from day one I felt the Foleo was meant to be paired with Google Apps but an announcement fell apart at the last moment.
    Good thought, but I would think that Google could easily just go to a company like HTC (or ASUS) and have them build a platform for Google's apps for half the price that the Foleo is initially supposed to sell for.

    Even nicer would be if Google would partner with Palm to create a Wi-Fi PalmOS smartphone loaded with Google apps and offering free (ad-sponsored?) VoIP service.


    Put the lotion in the basket, Palm.
  13.    #13  
    Well a colleague of mine will be going to the Foleo demo in San Francisco this Thursday. I've given them a list of questions to ask there. Anyone have anything they want to find out about the Foleo?

    I've also asked them to send me some photos and a hands-on evaluation on Friday, so I can post it here.

    After hearing more about the Asus Eee PC I believe Palm is going to have a LOT of difficulty marketing the Foleo. The fact that it needs a Treo simply to download regular email is disappointing. And the $600 price takes it out of the "impulse buy" category. I doubt Palm will be able to sell more than 10,000 Foleos this year. Not exactly a great market for developers looking to make a quick buck.
  14. JayC3's Avatar
    Posts
    149 Posts
    Global Posts
    154 Global Posts
    #14  
    I have some questions that I would like your colleague to ask in the sneak peek:

    1. Is it comfortable/safe to put the foleo in your lap for a prolonged period of time (let say 1 to 3 hours)? Or is it advised to put it in a desk instead?
    2. Does Palm have any solid plans in adding new functions to the foleo? If so, any timeframe?
    3. What type (if any) of music/movie playback can it support during launch?
    4. Since most treo's use bluetooth 1.2, does it take some time to sync large emails (3 to 5 MB) from the treo to the Foleo? Or can the foleo set a limit on the
    size of the email to be synced in the treo?
    5. This only works with Versamail right? (this may have been asked before but I didn't see it)

    Thanks ! That's all I have for now
  15.    #15  
    Great questions!

    I want to find out what happens if I'm storing files on the CompactFlash card and the Foleo gets stolen - are the files easily accessible to the thief? If the CompactFlash card can't be password protected or encrypted this will make the device a lot less useful for businesses.

    I'm also interested in seeing real-world tests of how long it takes to sync emails (say a 1 or 2 MB email with attachments) from the Treo using the default connection (Bluetooth) to the Foleo.

    I'm also wondering if Palm will be dropping the price a couple hundred dollars ($399 seems reasonable) for the introduction. If they ship with better software - including an email app that works independent of the Treo - then I might be more inclined to pick a Foleo over something like the Asus Eee PC.


    Quote Originally Posted by janric View Post
    I have some questions that I would like your colleague to ask in the sneak peek:

    1. Is it comfortable/safe to put the foleo in your lap for a prolonged period of time (let say 1 to 3 hours)? Or is it advised to put it in a desk instead?
    2. Does Palm have any solid plans in adding new functions to the foleo? If so, any timeframe?
    3. What type (if any) of music/movie playback can it support during launch?
    4. Since most treo's use bluetooth 1.2, does it take some time to sync large emails (3 to 5 MB) from the treo to the Foleo? Or can the foleo set a limit on the
    size of the email to be synced in the treo?
    5. This only works with Versamail right? (this may have been asked before but I didn't see it)

    Thanks ! That's all I have for now
  16.    #16  
    My colleague "Chupa" has given me control of his account here at Treocentral and asked me to pass on my thoughts re: the Foleo now that I've had a chance to see it in person. I'll write up my evaluation here today (Friday) over a few posts and if anyone has any questions, I'll try to answer them as well.

    My background: PalmOS user since Day 1, about as hardcore as possible. I have a collection of around 30 PalmOS devices and have > 100 apps on my Treo 700p (which ironically crashed the first time I tried to use it at the Foleo demo Thursday night in The City). Thanks to a late surgery, traffic on the Bay Bridge and Palm's decision to hold the event downtown where parking is impossible to find, I wasn't able to get down to the Palm Store until around 8 p.m. Fortunately, by that time people seemed more interested in the wine and cheese than the Foleos, so I had the opportunity to spend a little "quality time" with the Foleo.

    First impression: Build quality appears to be MUCH greater than anything I've ever seen with a Palm logo on it. But it was a little bigger and definitely significantly heavier than what I had hoped/expected. The device surface has a more satiny rubberized (oxymoron?) coating than Palm's excellent Treo hard case or the new Treos. The ribbed ("for her pleasure"?) surface on the top surface of the Foleo is reminiscent of the ribbing on my ThinkPad's extended battery and contributed to making the Foleo very easy to handle. I'd be interested in finding out if Taiwan's HTC is the contract manufacturer of the Foleo. In any event, the impression of much-better-than-average build quality imparted by the Foleo was its main positive attribute. If only the rest of this $600 package was as impressive.
  17.    #17  



    Last edited by The_Chupacabra; 07/20/2007 at 06:17 AM. Reason: Finally figured out how to resize photos in Flickr
  18.    #18  
    Unfortunately, once I started probing a little deeper into the Foleo things got somewhat uglier under the surface.

    Problem #1 appears to be its very limited specs:



    CPU speed = 415.33

    128 MB available RAM

    Wow.
    Not. Good. Palm.
    Last edited by The_Chupacabra; 07/20/2007 at 06:14 AM.
  19.    #19  



    The CompactFlash slot is under the battery, so obviously CF is intended to act as a hard drive equivalent rather than being a convenient way to move files around.

    At least the hidden location provides a (thin) layer of protection for files stored on the CompactFlash card. Palm reps admitted there is no encryption or even password protection available for the CF card. In other words, if you leave your Foleo in a taxi, all of your files on the CF card are vulnerable to anyone that simply takes the card out of the Foleo and pops it into a card reader. For a device that will (presumably) be marketed as a business tool, the lack of basic security features on the Foleo is very surprising.
  20.    #20  
    Nice... screen






    Side expansion slots/inputs






    Disappointing photo viewer

Page 1 of 9 123456 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions