View Poll Results: Foleo - good or bad?

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  • Foleo is a good thing

    194 37.38%
  • Foleo is a bad thing

    325 62.62%
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  1. #201  
    Quote Originally Posted by taroliw View Post
    Umm... but doesn't NO RADIOs mean NO RADIOS? That would mean bluetooth too... so sorry. But to the extent that the Foleo can work on it's own without it's PDA leach, then I would agree you should be able to queue up work to deliver when connections are legal (and safe!) again.
    You can disable both WiFi and Bluetooth radios on the Foleo, just like you can disable the GSM/CDMA and Bluetooth radio on your Treo. When they are off, it doesn't emit or scan for wireless signals and it's as safe to use on an airplane as a laptop computer or Nintendo DS.

    It is smart about changes made while it's disconnected from the smartphone and will resync when you reconnect and turn the radios back on.
  2. #202  
    Quote Originally Posted by bcombee View Post
    It is smart about changes made while it's disconnected from the smartphone and will resync when you reconnect and turn the radios back on.
    I understand. The posting wasn't especially clear about whether one expected the Treo connection to be working at the time.
  3. #203  
    You can't power down a foleo completely. How long does the battery last when in it's standby state? Long enough to bring on a plane?
  4. #204  
    Quote Originally Posted by taylorh View Post
    You can't power down a foleo completely. How long does the battery last when in it's standby state? Long enough to bring on a plane?
    It's supposed to have 5 hours of continual use.
  5. #205  
    Quote Originally Posted by taroliw View Post
    Umm... but doesn't NO RADIOs mean NO RADIOS? That would mean bluetooth too... so sorry. But to the extent that the Foleo can work on it's own without it's PDA leach, then I would agree you should be able to queue up work to deliver when connections are legal (and safe!) again.
    Does it? It clearly means no cell phones or PDAs. Does it mean no Wi-Fi or Bluetooth? Anyone ever asked whether the Wi-fi or the Bluetooth on their laptop is off? Ever watch the kids on a plane engaging in multi-player games using their "PSP"s? Ever see an attendant ask them to turn their games off? No?

    I have used my laptop on planes all over the world. If I turn the Wi-Fi on my laptop on, I will see a dozen other PCs on the plane with their "Wi-Fi"s on, mostly by default. Apple has an ad showing Mac users networking and collaborating on planes. I do not forget to turn my Bluetooth off because it will respond to all the others on the plane.

    This is not about the radios. It is about fear, uncertainty, and doubt. To the extent that it is about cell phones, it is about lighting up multiple cells on the ground, not the hardened electronics on the plane. (Private pilots carry relatively noisy analog phones on their planes to talk to centers or airports when radio is too busy. They are concerned about the shut down of analog cellular because relatively quiet digital phones will not work from altitiude. I have never met a private pilot who reported that he saw any change in his aviation electronics when he turned his cell phone on or off.)

    The airlines will treat a Foleo like a notebook, not like a cell phone or PDA.
  6. #206  
    I'm very excited about the Foleo. I feel as if the folks who are comparing it with full laptops just don't have the same needs I do. For what I want, a laptop won't do.

    Currently I use an alphasmart, a very small, light, near unbreakable word processor to write on the go. The later model alphas actually use a port of Palm OS, but mine is older than that. It's kind of a hassle, the screen is just a few lines and in grayscale, it does nothing but word process and then you have to dump the text into your desktop machine through USB. But... it's instant on, it NEVER fails, has any problem or needs any update. A set of three AA batteries lasts about (if I remember right) 70 hours.

    Now, hook me up with something that does that, but is nicer to look at, has PIM, Email and Web and I'm set. All Foleo really lacks is a control that won't let me surf the web or check email until I've written a certain number of words.

    Michael
    http://kokyu.livejournal.com
  7. #207  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    That's to boot - not from standby. My dell comes out of standby and links to a wireless connection pretty much as quickly as I can raise the screen and get my hands on the keyboard to type my password.
    As was said before, you close ya machine to "standby" getting in and out of a cab, in the airport, getting on the plane, etc ? or do ya turn it off ?
  8. #208  
    Quote Originally Posted by taylorh View Post
    You can't use a Foleo on a plane. It depends on a wireless connection to a Treo. Can you use it without connecting to a treo?
    Wireless bluetooth is not allowed on a plane.
    Ya us a Treo on a plane w/o BT don't ya ? So why would the Foleo be any different ? Perhaps it's just cause my on line life began with OLR's that I don't fell the need to be connected every second. I can fully function with that connection shut down. Back in the day when e paid for our internet access almost "per character" we invented lotsa abbreviations and used Off Line Readers (OLR's). The OLR accessed your account, downloaded ya messages and forum posts on threads you were following and then disconnected. I do the same thing with my Treo.

    I "can" log onto my e-mail account, download all my e-mails, disconnect (now I am perfectly flight legal) and then answer all of my e-mails and store responses in my outbox. Plane lands, seatbelt sign goes off, I can fire up a connection and send them off while waiting to "deplane". Ya can do the same thing with the Foleo.
  9. #209  
    Does anyone else think it is to expensive? Especially when you consider $499 is an introductory offer.
  10. Q
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    #210  
    It's still up in the air if it'll be $499 out of pocket or $599 -$100 mail-in rebate.

    I'd like to see it for less, though I don't know if we'll see it for less before Christmastime. By then we'll see $50 off the going price for sure. Maybe even $100 from online vendors.
  11. #211  
    Quote Originally Posted by integra144 View Post
    Does anyone else think it is to expensive? Especially when you consider $499 is an introductory offer.
    Same price as an iPhone.
  12. wlmoore's Avatar
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    #212  
    Quote Originally Posted by integra144 View Post
    Does anyone else think it is to expensive? Especially when you consider $499 is an introductory offer.
    It's a nice chunk of change, but it seems to be a fair price for the hardware. A quick search shows that 10" raw LCD modules retail for over $400. Add silicon, plastics, etc. and you're in the right ballpark.

    Now whether or not peple will find enough value to purchase at this price is the big question for Palm.
  13. tirk's Avatar
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       #213  
    Quote Originally Posted by wlmoore View Post
    It's a nice chunk of change, but it seems to be a fair price for the hardware. A quick search shows that 10" raw LCD modules retail for over $400. Add silicon, plastics, etc. and you're in the right ballpark.
    Really? Considering you can get 15 inch monitors for about USD100 I would have thought Palm could source 10 inch ones for the same or less.

    Now whether or not peple will find enough value to purchase at this price is the big question for Palm.
    Palm are saying Foleo 1.0 won't be a high volume seller. Whether this is damage limitation or not is a matter of debate, but I guess they will say Foleo sales are "as expected" whatever happens.
    PalmPilot Professional...Palm Vx...Treo 600...Treo 680...HTC Touch HD...iPhone 4S...
  14. mmereos's Avatar
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    #214  
    Quote Originally Posted by whmurray View Post
    Same price as an iPhone.
    The iPhone is useful, this isn't. The iPhone weighs less then a Treo, this weighs more then a bowling ball (just kidding). This thing is useless, the iPhone is a phone, a music player, a high definition photo device, and movie player. I suspect this device will only be on the market a short time and the person at Palm that made the decision to release it will be working at Palm half as long....LOL
  15. #215  
    That's a bit strong, I think. Nor would I be coparing an iPhone to a Foleo. I do tend to agree Palm might have spent it's R&D money more wisely on a convergence device rather than a smartphone accessory, but I do believe there is some kind of market for what they have put on the table (even if it doesn't include me).

    That said, the iPhone serves a very different market and, despite it's price, will probably wind up serving a much larger audience than the Foleo -- it may have even sold more in it's first few days than the Foleo will in a year. But the iPhone is not without it's own challenges. I don't plan on considering one until those are addressed. YMMV.
  16. Q
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    #216  
    Quote Originally Posted by mmereos View Post
    The iPhone is useful, this isn't.
    Useful is very much in the eye of the beholder.

    For me, both of my phones can do things the iPhone can't that matter to me (both play music and are expandable, I don't watch movies... the Treo can run all my Palm OS apps, cut and paste... the SE k790 has a better camera than the iPhone, FM tuner, and works with my watch). I'll be glad when either the Treo or the iPhone will work with the watch, too. That may mean waiting for the watch's second generation, which is coming soon, and will almost certainly require 3rd party development.

    So for me, the iPhone is not useful. Sleek and exciting to look at, yes. Useful... no. Down the road, who knows?

    The Foleo, on the other hand, is useful for me.
    Last edited by Q; 07/07/2007 at 08:49 AM.
  17. #217  
    I do think given the current technologies, the Foleo is still overpriced. I really hope they give us a package deal for a Foleo and a Treo when it comes out. i'd have less hesitations about that
  18. #218  
    If you think the Foleo is an excellent device, get an Asus Eee, its $300 cheaper and has exponentially more potential:

    I bumped into this forum through a Google search and decided I would try to be as level as possible and explain what both sides are argueing and decide "fo sho" which device is better. I am going to compare directly the capability of each device straight out of the box, regardless of what it may be capable of with a bit of modding or programming because the bottom line is both devices are very capable. Since the second generation of the Asus Eee wont be released for a few months now, I am going to be asuming its not there, taking specifications from only the Asus Eee 701. Also, since the Foleo is advertised as a companion to the Treo, any disadvantages that the Foleo has that the Treo makes up for will be noted. Also, as with the Foleo and Eee, any capabilites I cite will be ones that the Treo has out of the box with little or no additional hardware/software. The Wikipedia articles that I sourced from can be located here:

    Asus Eee:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASUS_Eee_PC

    PalmOne Foleo:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foleo

    Size and Weight:
    You can view a very clear size comparison between the 2 devices at this link:
    http://www.sizeasy.com/page/size_com...ePC-vs-CD-Case
    Both devices are very compact and very simular in size. The Foleo is wider than the Eee but the Eee is thicker. Size wise, they are basically the same, a centimeter here or there doesnt matter too much. The Foleo is rather hefty at 1.113 kilograms where the Asus Eee weighs only 0.89 Kilograms. Eee takes this one.
    Score:
    Eee: 1 Foleo: 0

    Screen:
    The Eee has a rather small 7 inch screen with an effective resolution of 800480 pixels. The Foleo has a much larger screen at 10.2 inches with an effective resolution of 1024x600. Both Devices are high color and both devices natively support VGA out at 1024x768. Foleo gets this one.
    Score:
    Eee: 1 Foleo: 1

    Processing Power:
    Alright I know you Foleo fans are going to argue its only a suppliment to the Treo, but the Foleo is fully capable of running by itself, especially considering it has its own Wifi and bluetooth, and with its built in linux and the high probablity that third party developers are going to try to write programs for it, its important to know how powerful the device is so you know what it can and cant do. The Eee will ship with a 900 mhz Dothan class Pentium-M processor. All we know about the Foleo is it will sport a PXA class CPU, if Palm follows their current trend and powers it at 400 mhz thats still a far cry from the Pentium 900 mhz. Even if the PXA is clocked up to 614 mhz, the ARM architecture means that even at 614 mhz it could only stand toe to toe with nothing higher than a 150 mhz pentium class CPU. With only a handheld class CPU inside, the Foleo is vastly underpowerd for its size. Eee gets this easy. (BTW, the Treo runs PXA CPU as well, so even if you came up with a way to combine the power of both CPU's effectively, it wouldnt even come close to that 900 mhz Pentium)
    Score:
    Eee: 2 Foleo: 1

    Memory:
    The Foleo has 256 MB of flash memory, 128 MB is accessible by the user. Even with adding the Treo's memory to this you only get a total of 256 MB between the 2 devices. Now I know your going to argue about expansion with SD cards but both the Eee and the Foleo are capable of expansion, besides, we are comparing out of box capabilities because we could go back and forth all day long about what is capable of what with a little bit of money and/or work. The Asus Eee wins this one beyond the shadow of a doubt with an impressive 512 MB of RAM and 4 GB of onboard solid state program memory. (I read arguments against a regular laptop due to its conventional internal rotating disc, the Eee does not have this. Like the Foleo the Eee has solid state memory only.)
    Score:
    Eee: 3 Foleo: 1

    Connectivity:
    Both devices sport Wifi, however, the Eee has a much faster wireless connection with 802.11g, where the Foleo only has 802.11b. Now the Foleo does have bluetooh but the Eee has dial up and ethernet built in right out of the box. Even the Treo doesnt have anything better than 802.11b out of the box and completely lacks any kind of wired connectivity, which admitidely would have been a useless function for the Treo, but not for the Foleo. Now to alot of people the bluetooth connection capability is very important. I could tell you that you could solve that with a bluetooth dongle on the Eee, but we are comparing out of box capability. So while the Foleo does lack the wired connectivity it makes up for that with bluetooth. Considering these devices where aimed at the mobile professional, the lack of Bluetooth makes the Eee loose this one.
    Score:
    Eee: 3 Foleo: 2

    Multimedia:
    Well the Palm Treo is capable of videos and music as well as the Asus Eee. However, the Asus Eee has a 7 inch screen and a much more capable CPU. Not to mention the Asus Eee having much more storage memory which gives it much more opportunity for DivX movies right out of the package. Sorry PalmOne fans - once again the Asus Eee wins this catagory.
    Score:
    Eee: 4 Foleo: 2

    Battery:
    Since both devices have not hit the shelves yet we can only speculate as to wether they have removable or expandable battery packs so we can only go off of the advertised battery life. The Asus Eee has an advertised battery life of 3 hours in normal mode. Now im not sure but I read in another article where there is a secondary, low power mode that only allows like web surfing which can extend the battery for up to 5 hours, but for now im going to assume that doesnt exist since I dont have an article to cite, so the Foleo wins with its stock 5 hour battery life.
    Score:
    Eee: 4 Foleo: 3

    Boot Time:
    Not a big deal usually - but it is here. The Asus Eee has a cold boot time of roughly 15 seconds. This is where its at a disadvantage with its desktop class Operating system and components. The Foleo has an advertised instant on feature. We all know that this "Instant on" is the feature that handhelds have almost always had from the desktop equivelant of a stand by state. I could get into how with a little bit of tweaking you could get linux to do the same, but as far as I know this feature is not supported out of the box, Foleo gets this one.
    Score:
    Eee: 4 Foleo: 4

    Capability/Usability:
    Both devices have linux running and both devices have a strong group of developers standing behind them already, however, while the Foleo is only capable of email, web, and some simple office applications, the Asus Eee has a rather impressive suite of programs straight out of the box like OpenOffice and Firefox, programs that already have a strong following and many people are already accostumed to with a massive support library standing behind these applications, all of them would be very usefull to just about anybody. The basic suite, as far as we know, does include simple office applications, a paint program, and some simple games. Any further doubt of the Asus Eee being more capable is removed when we start talking about the vastly more powerful CPU and the fact that it can run any already made x86 applications designed for linux. But once again, out the of the box only features - Eee still takes it. And anybody who wants to argue about the solid state memory that the Foleo has, I hate to bust your bubble but the Eee has got it too. Now where the Eee is very much more powerful than the Foleo, the Foleo does have a larger screen which makes it much easier to use for many people. I could always argue about the 10 inch Eee model comming out in 2008 but this is Eee 701 vs Foleo. Still, you cant argue with native built the built in microphone, webcam, and dial up and ethernet networking, plus the multimedia features all in that one device, rather than having to fiddle between your Foleo and Treo.
    Score:
    Eee: 5 Foleo: 4

    Price:
    Considering that the Foleo isnt capable of any multimedia features by itself and has very little onboard memory, the price of $500 is simply outragouse. Then we can start talking about the way underpowerd CPU and lack of 802.11g. Considering that 802.11g is now being replaced by Wireless-N the cost of puttting 802.11g on a device has fallen significantly and to not include it on a $500 device that already lacks many features of devices simular to its size seems like Palm is just trying to jew us out of our money. At $200 for its capabilities the Eee is the winner here, no doubt about that.
    Score:
    Eee: 6 Foleo: 4

    Conclusion:
    I have tried to be as neatral as possible but I cant help but side with the Eee here because of its capabilites. Even if you want to argue to me that all you need is a device that can sync with your Palm Treo and allow you to type on it...this is a desktop class OS installed on th Eee and with a bluetooth USB dongle you could do exactly the same thing with the Eee as you would have wanted to do with the Foleo - for atleast $200 less. The fact that the Eee has a Pentium CPU in it meaning that any currently existing Linux applicatoins in the massive library already available will run on it straight out of the box doesnt even come close to maching up to the software available for the Treo or Foleo.

    Both devices should be very stable and responsive. As being a past PalmOS device owner, I would be very dissapointed if Palm made the Foleo a slow device. Admitidly, since the Foleo has less software to break it down it has a lower chance of crashing but Linux is already a very stable system.

    There is only a few things that the Foleo has going for it compared to the Eee - bigger screen, instant on feature, and bluetooth out of the box. Is this a selling point that makes it worth $300 more? I don't think so - but if that 15 seconds is that big of a deal, If that bigger screen matters THAT much, if you REALLY dont want to buy a bluetooth dongle, I know to some people these things do matter alot - then the Foleo, as underpowered and overpriced as it is, is a good choice. But overall, the Eee is more bang for the buck, no matter how you look at it.

    There are applications where it would save some trouble getting the Foleo if all you wanted to do was browse the web and email but those same features of stability and simplicity could be added to the Asus Eee with very little work. And if you ever had to sell the device it has a much higher resell value because of its capabilities. If the Foleo becomes outdated with that underpowered CPU and lack of a decent software library - even if it had one there arent any speakers or anything that can be used for multimedia so for you folks who like to give away your old, unused electronics to 15 year old cousins and such as christmass gifts or birthday present, the Foleo has very little capability outside browsing the web and typing up papers. To some, that doesnt matter, but to me - I want a device that will stay useful now matter how long I have it. Even if the Eee becomes outdated in 3 years you could still use it in a carputer or as a webserver - the Foleo on the other hand gets thrown away - all $500. To me, its an easy choice. I mean, who doesnt want more for less? To me, picking the Foleo over the Eee would be like picking a 2007 BMW over a 97 ford pinto when they both cost $1,000.

    The Foleo's capability and usefullness is there, but it covers a very, very small niche. Bottom line - the Eee is more bang for your buck, no matter how you look at it, no matter what you say the Eee is more capable for the price - period. Final score:
    Asus Eee: 6
    PalmOne Foleo: 4
    Last edited by NuttyPro67; 07/12/2007 at 10:39 AM. Reason: broken URL
  19. Q
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    #219  
    On the Foleo vs the eee, which device can I try out before buying? So far, the only way I've seen to get an eee is to order one online, which is fine for getting a lower price, but not good to test it out beforehand.

    However, I've seen the Foleo live and like it, and know that I could go to a Palm store to test on out come launch day.

    My point is simply this: there isn't one logical analysis that will hold true for everyone. Just because one is the better choice on paper doesn't mean it's the one I really want.
  20. #220  
    Quote Originally Posted by NuttyPro67 View Post
    I bumped into this forum through a Google search and decided I would try to be as level as possible and explain what both sides are argueing and decide "fo sho" which device is better.
    Seems to me that a conclusion was drawn before the review was done and facts gathered to support a predetermined conclusion. I can't see myself using either device so don't have an ax to grind. But the review is flawed for several reasons:

    1. Equal weighting is given to each category, How can each item be equally important to the user ?

    2. Other critical items are not addressed such as keyboard size.

    3. Why is a 7" screen listed as an apparent advantage on MM ?

    4. The CPU and memory provided on the eeepc are only twice the MINIMUM system requirements for its OS. Now consider the fact that Windows XP's minimum requirements are published as 233 Mhz and 128 MB RAM. Can anyone possibly envision running XP on 256 MB of RAM ....or even 512 ? Simply put, processing power and memory can not be discussed outside of the OS it's running on. Linux isn't Linux no more than Windows (NT) is Windows (Vista)

    5. The usability / capability category is a rehash of the other categories.

    you cant argue with native built the built in microphone, webcam, and dial up and ethernet networking, plus the multimedia features all in that one device, rather than having to fiddle between your Foleo and Treo.
    You also can't argue the distinction that the Foleo is an add on. Most times a Treo / Folio user is going to be just fine using their Treo w/o the foleo whereas the eeepc user must drag out that brick every time they want to do anything. The webcam I guess is something cool for teenagers...nah tweens to fiddle with but what usage does it have for your designated "target audience" the mobile professional ? Wired connectivity for the mobile professional ? Not sure how movies fits in that designation either. I can imagine a peep going to his boss and making a recommendation that the company buy 500 of these over that cause it has a webcam and allegedly has more movie playing capability.

    The price is something I am not sure Palm will be able to maintain. I'm sure they are banking on Treo compatibility to maintain this margin. However IBM was able to maintain a significant price margin, and lenovo still does because of its great keyboard....and its pointie stick. On a laptop, I would pay a $500 premium for a great keyboard / pointie stick. The only reason I moved away from the Stinkpads is that they refuse to make anything bigger than a 15" screen.....I can get the keyboard from other sources but not the pointie stick unfortunately....touch pads simply stink if your work demands any level of accuracy.

    So for the mobile professional I think your review leaves out the five (in bold) of the seven most important considerations:

    1. Option to leave it in briefcase and work from handheld
    2. Useability of Keyboard / Inputs
    3. Battery Life
    4. User Interface navigability, minimization of taps and clicks
    5. Responsiveness (is hardware matched to OS and software requirements)
    6. Screen size
    7. Compatibility how well do both translate business documents back and forth with desktop systems.

    Now in the end, I think it's going to fall into a mold where these devices will best serve two different markets:

    1. The business professional whose mind is on business will best be served the Treo / Foleo option. He / she is quite happy with the Treo but doesn't like the idea that on trips lasting a day or two, he also has to lug a laptop to get any serious work done. While sitting on the plane this peep is editing the agenda for next week's meeting.

    2. The worker who is somewhat mobile and company has decided that there is no significant ROI to providing him / her with a < 3 pound "real" laptop or a Handheld will choose the eeepc option. When sitting on a flight, this peep is watching a movie or listening to mp3's.

    I use a hand held "in a pinch" when a real laptop is not convenient. There are rare times where I wished I could have had a full size keyboard to bang something out as I'm more likely to let it wait or dictate something over the phone rather than type > 25 words with my thumbs. But I'm a bit too tight to spend $500 for those rare occasions.

    But what purpose does the eeepc serve ? Will it replace my 17" 1920 x 1200 Core Duo, 2Gig RAM laptop ? No, it might serve as a laptop for someone with meager needs tho. Will it replace my Treo ? No. It is intended as a companion device for a Treo (and other smartphones).

    To me, picking the Foleo over the Eee would be like picking a 2007 BMW over a 97 ford pinto when they both cost $1,000.
    The argument of Foleo versus eeepc is akin to comparing a Yugo to a Harley storage trailer. The Yugo gonna get you places about as cheap as ya can go on 4 wheels. For the Harley owner, it gives the motorcyclist an option when he / she chooses to bring more "stuff" when he / she travels with "da bike". But how many peeps are gonna turn in their Harley's and go out and buy a Yugo ? I think most are gonna keep there Harley's as well as their SUV and for the times they want a quick getaway, just the two of them, for a trip to the mountains, they gonna buy that cute little storage trailer.
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