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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by k4ever View Post
    I mentioned the same thing in a thread I started and some of you guys thought I was nuts:

    http://forums.precentral.net/hp-touc...touchpads.html

    Nice to see some tech journalists agreeing with me.
    It just means there are more nuts. Nuts are plentiful.
  2. #22  
    Whatever they paid Russell Brand (plus the production costs) should have been split into $150 subsidies per X many tablets.

    Then follow suit with Lea Michelle. Use the Selena Gomez money to shoot a commercial letting you know these things sell for $225 or whatever.

    I'm a 20/20 hindsight genius!
    untitled likes this.
  3. DRFP's Avatar
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    #23  
    Looks like the Apple FanB are out in force on that article ( they always jump in to discredit anything thats not apple very annoying)

    What an insulting comparison. That's like saying my beautiful mahogany dining room set "met its match" by putting it next to a foldaway card table at a yard sale. The only reason these pieces of garbage were so cheap was because it was a dead product. 99 is more than 0. That doesn't mean that consumers should realistically expect that price point.

    Read more: Comments on: iPad met its match in the TouchPad
    This is totally baseless and not well thought out because its wrong almost 100%
    They got WebOS right, but the hardware was woefully inadequate for competing with the iPad 2, and other tablets, at the same price. Why would anyone pay full price for last year's hardware specs?

    Meh, electronics companies are more concerned with patents, lawsuits and acquisitions than they are with actually making good hardware.

    Not sure what caused HP to put the TouchPad together as they did, and sell it at the price they did. They wanted large profit margins? Other components were already spoken for? If you're going to introduce a new product to the market, you cannot just plop into the water like a fat cow, you need something sleek and graceful.

    The sad thing is that I think its harder to put together a good OS than it is to manufacture a tablet. Why you would do well with the OS, and then fall flat on your face with the hardware is very puzzling.

    Read more: Comments on: iPad met its match in the TouchPad
    This rant is priceless, if APple cut the price I doubt they would post this
    Pricing an item below its cost of manufacture in order to gain market is a borderline illegal practice known as DUMPING. It generally happens as a function of export/import (see Sony, Fuji mid 70's-early 90's), but within the United States might have a different name.

    Based on precedent, if HP or any other manufacturer were to offer a product below manufacture price that wasn't a clearance item or linked to a host of supporting products that would shore up the cost to the consumer (which here would have to be apps or accouterments sold directly by HP), competitors would have lawyers filing unfair competition cases so fast HP's head would spin.

    Read more: Comments on: iPad met its match in the TouchPad
    This is what Scares the Apple Fans and APPLE to be honest
    I am waiting for ipad 3, BUT if I could get an android tablet for 150-225, I will forget about the ipad. I like ipad ecosystem, so I am willing to pay a premium for a proven platform. Android tablets for 400, NO WAY!!!

    Read more: Comments on: iPad met its match in the TouchPad
    When you spend over a year on an Apple forum with the numerous FanB you would find its a Cult these people attack anyone who thinks there is a flaw even when there is a big flaw ( Antenna anyone?) Apple products have no flaws because when they do Steve Jobs in the past comes out with a spin that "Every one has this flaw" and the devotees post this over and over till the lie becomes truth, like

    "Apple laptops do not crash and do not have viruses" this is the biggest and hardest myth ever. Viruses for Macs have increased 1000 fold over the past year, why? There are more macs in the past year and now they are targets.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by k4ever View Post
    They spend millions on advertisement. Cut that budget and use it to pay to subsidize sells. HP should also use their leverage in the market to drive the cost of the hardware down. Apple does this all the time. Their initial cost are usually 3x higher than what the demand drives the price down to. Sony does this also. It takes them close to a year to drive the cost down on their PlayStation hardware.
    There is not enough demand for a non-iPad tablet to give HP any room to negotiate. And tablets are different from game consoles (or anything that needs regular "refills"), so selling at a loss wouldn't really help HP much.

    HP just jumped into the tablet game too late -- Android and iOS will be the only two players from this point on, with Android always lagging far behind iOS in sales, but selling just enough to keep manufacturers making the tablets.
    DRFP likes this.
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    #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jophiel View Post
    Whatever they paid Russell Brand (plus the production costs) should have been split into $150 subsidies per X many tablets.

    Then follow suit with Lea Michelle. Use the Selena Gomez money to shoot a commercial letting you know these things sell for $225 or whatever.

    I'm a 20/20 hindsight genius!
    Honestly if the HP touchpad 16GB came out back in June/July for $249 and the 32GB for $299 they would of sold 250,000 in a month, instead they did what they did Stupid, they had no Fan base for them like APple does, APple had millions of Iphone users and even though APple did not like, saying the Ipad was a BIG IPHONE drove people to buy it because now you had a BIG screen and it was like the Iphone they loved.

    HP has terrible market people and terrible CEO no vision or thought behind all this.

    I wish I was interested and they would hire someone like me or one of us here.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by Jophiel View Post
    Whatever they paid Russell Brand (plus the production costs) should have been split into $150 subsidies per X many tablets.

    Then follow suit with Lea Michelle. Use the Selena Gomez money to shoot a commercial letting you know these things sell for $225 or whatever.

    I'm a 20/20 hindsight genius!
    The should have used no celebrities, just a pair of hands showing what the device can do. Any decent looking hands will do, and for cheap.

    TP had to many obstacles to overcome (not listed in any particular order):
    1: Leo
    2: Price
    3: Timing
    4: Construction quality
    5: Specs (not up to modern tablet specs)
    6: OS (not in prime condition, patches don't count)
    7: Environment (limited apps and no doc editing among many others)
    8: Perception
  7. DRFP's Avatar
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    #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinsin07 View Post
    The should have used no celebrities, just a pair of hands showing what the device can do. Any decent looking hands will do, and for cheap.

    TP had to many obstacles to overcome (not listed in any particular order):
    1: Leo
    2: Price
    3: Timing
    4: Construction quality
    5: Specs (not up to modern tablet specs)
    6: OS (not in prime condition, patches don't count)
    7: Environment (limited apps and no doc editing among many others)
    8: Perception
    Yes with stupid music in the background and a slogan like

    "If you don't have a HP Touchpad, you Don't have a HP TouchPad" LOL

    OMG I hate that stupid slogan
  8. #28  
    So selling at a loss is illegal? Then what about Sony's PS3 and Microsoft X360? Weren't these sold at a loss?

    Pricing an item below its cost of manufacture in order to gain market is a borderline illegal practice known as DUMPING. It generally happens as a function of export/import (see Sony, Fuji mid 70's-early 90's), but within the United States might have a different name.
    Long Time Palm and Sprint User!

    IIIxe, Tungsten T3, Samsung SPH-i500, Treo 700p, 755p, Centro, Palm Pre, Palm Pre+, 2.2.4 Franken Pre2 and a Touchpad!
  9. DRFP's Avatar
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    #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by neit_jnf View Post
    So selling at a loss is illegal? Then what about Sony's PS3 and Microsoft X360? Weren't these sold at a loss?
    Yes anything that Upsets Apple's grip on the market is unfair and illegal

    How about APple patenting anything they they think of and what others think of they see it and its not patented yet, Even Steve J. made fun of this. This behavior leaves little room for other companies to innovate and develop tech, APple controls too much IMHO.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by jrstinkfish View Post
    There is not enough demand for a non-iPad tablet to give HP any room to negotiate. And tablets are different from game consoles (or anything that needs regular "refills"), so selling at a loss wouldn't really help HP much.

    HP just jumped into the tablet game too late -- Android and iOS will be the only two players from this point on, with Android always lagging far behind iOS in sales, but selling just enough to keep manufacturers making the tablets.
    From what we have seen over the past week, if you jump into the game late you need to do something drastic to catch up. The fire sale is allowing them to catch up. Why spend tons of money on advertisement and training brick and mortar employees on how to sell the product when that is not working? Used that money on subsidies and give yourself a competitive advantage.

    This is not a foreign concept in the computing world. Microsoft does it all the time to eliminate competitors. They give products away for free or way below cost to corner the market. Heck, Standard Oil did this over 100 years ago to create and sustain a monopoly in the oil industry.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by viper151 View Post
    No tto mention that whoever is buying a touchpad more probably he will also buy a pre 3 or a veer at full price in order to test the functionalities at maximum. And when webOS pc's were about to come out everyone with a touchpad would want to buy one.

    Apple doesn't have this. No everyone with an iphone wants ot buy a Mac because Apple's ecosystem is not based on the synergy between the devices but on the brand. Neither google has this.
    I have a pre- but I want a new webOS phone. This tablet is going to be a huge help to me, as I've recently had family move in unexpectedly and the children sleep on the sofa-bed in the family room where my desktop is located. Now I am not resentful over not having access to my stuff, I don't have to worry about disturbing anyone and I get some peace and privacy away from those loud kids. I had to pay a little more at Aaron's but the aggravation this thing is going to save me is priceless.

    I already have purchased a wireless router I normally wouldn't have purchased back when I got the pre just to help someone TEST a syncing app for webOS, but I would have bought one to use this tab. This is also putting me in the market for a wireless printer which I'll probably get between black Friday and Christmas. If the phones were available that would be a no brainer. I need the keyboard if I can find one and I want the touchstone. This one purchase generates several more. If the case hadn't come with it I'd have bought one of those too and still may, as I don't think this one will allow TS charging.

    Everyone who sees this tablet wants one, even my tech adverse brother who is a truck driver once I introduced him to YouTube old school music videos, explained he can watch anywhere in the house or on the road where he can find a hotspot as well as being able to load his own music and videos to watch any time. I have to see if I can find him one now.
    The value of knowledge is not in its possession, but in its use.
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    #32  
    Tablet are not gaming consoles. Microsoft and Sony get royalties for every game sold. Now, it's true that HP could get a cut of every app, but apps cost nowhere near the $60 games cost, plus HP has to cover the overhead of their app store. I do not believe there is enough money in apps to subsidize. In fact, according to Jobs the App Store is built to break even, similar to the other iTunes stores.

    Google makes no money on Android because they just want you on the internet using their services. HP has no services to offer.

    Perhaps Amazon could pull it off, but they haven't. I believe the Kindle is now subsidized, but there is a direct profit source in books that I am not sure is there for tablets.

    Point is I do not believe there is a profit source for hp that cover the cost of a subsidy. Remember, cell companies subsidize anywhere from $200-$400 and need two years of you paying $70/month to make it worth it to them. HP, or any other tablet maker, can't make that kind of profit on extras.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by drfp View Post
    Yes with stupid music in the background and a slogan like

    "If you don't have a HP Touchpad, you Don't have a HP TouchPad" LOL

    OMG I hate that stupid slogan
    I'm not fond of that Apple line either. HP's line: "Works like nothing else" was better. Of course when you say that, you got to mean it, otherwise it makes a good tag line for tech blogs to twist around.
  14. #34  
    sinsin07, why did you even answer drfp's post? There is no need to get into a yet another argument about how dilusional some techies are.

    Edit: drfp, I did not mean you were dilusional. The comments by the Apple fans you listed were. sinsin07, the comments you listed from some P|C fans were also. You can find dilusional people by opening up your front door and throwing a few rocks in the air. You are bound to hit one.
  15.    #35  
    How about, "Everybody on"

    Now that's a real humdinger!
    sinsin07 likes this.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by Sukiyaki View Post
    snip...Everyone who sees this tablet wants one, even my tech adverse brother who is a truck driver once I introduced him to YouTube old school music videos, explained he can watch anywhere in the house or on the road where he can find a hotspot as well as being able to load his own music and videos to watch any time. I have to see if I can find him one now.
    Shouldn't be hard: Touchpad on Ebay
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by k4ever View Post
    sinsin07, why did you even answer drfp's post? There is no need to get into a yet another argument about how dilusional some techies are.

    Edit: drfp, I did not mean you were dilusional. The comments by the Apple fans you listed were. sinsin07, the comments you listed from some P|C fans were also. You can find dilusional people by opening up your front door and throwing a few rocks in the air. You are bound to hit one.
    Post deleted. Freedom of speech still in effect.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by drfp View Post
    "Apple laptops do not crash and do not have viruses" this is the biggest and hardest myth ever. Viruses for Macs have increased 1000 fold over the past year, why? There are more macs in the past year and now they are targets.
    I don't think you know the difference between Malware and a virus. Leap-A was the last known virus on Mac's back in 2006. Malware and Trojan horses have increased (not 1000 fold though) in the past few years on iDevices, this is true. If hackers can make money on a popular system, they will find exploits. However, Apple's app store is over 75,000 times less likely to give you malware on your iDevice than the marketplace on an Android based device.

    Why is this?

    Apple itself*builds a wide range of security measures into the Mac OS, including—in OS X’s most recent incarnation—a limited malware-detection system. Security requires a proactive approach, but Apple helps users out by enabling most of those measures by default. Now this is the part where Apple haters call Apple users iSheep that have Steve Jobs holding their hand and what to think, yada yada...
  19.    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by sinsin07 View Post
    Shouldn't be hard: Touchpad on Ebay
    Beast deal you can get is $230 for a 16GB.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by cashmonee View Post
    Tablet are not gaming consoles. Microsoft and Sony get royalties for every game sold. Now, it's true that HP could get a cut of every app, but apps cost nowhere near the $60 cost, plus HP has to cover the overhead of their app store. I do not believe there is enough money in apps to subsidize. In fact, according to Jobs the App Store is built to break even, similar to the other iTunes stores.

    Google makes no money on Android because they just want you on the internet using their services. HP has no services to offer.

    Perhaps Amazon could pull it off, but they haven't. I believe the is now subsidized, but there is a direct profit source in books that I am not sure is there for tablets.

    Point is I do not believe there is a profit source for hp that cover the cost of a subsidy. Remember, cell companies subsidize anywhere from $200-$400 and need two years of you paying $70/month to make it worth it to them. HP, or any other tablet maker, can't make that kind of profit on extras.
    Microsoft has used their monopoly on Windows to push into other markets for years. Their first target was Netscape Navigator. People used to pay $25 to use that web browser. Microsoft tried to match that price with IE and it didn't work. People realized IE was crappy software (still is). Microsoft eventually gave it away for free (and tied it to Windows) and drove Netscape out of the market. Microsoft then began to make money off of the market share for IE. They funded their whole IE invasion with money made from Windows sales. They then used their market share on Windows to create a new cash cow, Office. Afterwards they pushed into hardware (mice, keyboards, Gaming Consoles). They got into a price war with Sony and Nintendo by selling their consoles at a loss. They used the interest off of the cash they made on their software to initially fund their hardware. The price war drove the cost of the games up. I remember when games where $30 a piece. When console prices went down, the cost of games went up (this had nothing to do with inflation before anyone mentions that).

    HP's PC division is still highly profitable. Their profit margin is low, but their volume makes up for it. HP's printer business is also highly profitable. They make the majority of their money on ink sales. Every notice how the ink cost more than the printer? HP can use the interest off the cash they have on hand to fund tablet fire sales. They can drive everyone but Apple and the new Google/Motorola out of the market. They can also cut deeply into Apple's profits.

    Yes, HP can make up their money in app sales. If you have noticed most webOS apps cost slighty more than iOS apps. HP only has to charge $1 more on app sales. They would get it without little complaint because the hardware cost was low. I would rather spend buy 10-20 webOS apps at a dollar over the cost of an iOS app if I only paid $150 to $200 for the webOS hardware vs $600 for the iOS hardware. Heck I could buy over 100 webOS apps and still come out on top.

    HP can also make money on licensing the OS. By dumping so much cheap hardware on the market they have driven up the user base, which in turn should drive up the developer base (if HP doesn't screw that up), which in turn will make the platform more palatable for licensing once the initial hardware nears it's end of life. HP could charge a $10 licensing fee for the hardware and get away with it because Android hardware makers are paying $15 patent fees to Microsoft alone. HP doesn't have the same issues with patents that Google has.

    I'm just an amateur on this like most of you so this is just my opinion. Take it with a grain of salt.
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