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So I jumped ship... so far.... AKA webOS vs Icecream Sandwich
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Old 07/15/2012, 09:01 AM   #41 (permalink)
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Thanks for your post. That may well be true (and I expect in practice it is, see my earlier post on the privacy issue), but it sounds scary and big-brother-in-your-face worded the way it is. No doubt there are legal reasons why not but I feel they could have achieved the same thing by saying this app uses the camera but will only access it when you initiate a command to instruct it to (e.g. taking a video).
I was going to say much the same in my post, but on reflection I think it's right that it makes the point that malicious apps could hijack this. Note that the message is automated from the Android market, not supplied as part of the YouTube app itself. It's the standard message for all apps that use the camera (see Skype for example).

The market doesn't know whether YouTube or any other app is using the camera access for nefarious or benign purposes, so I think it does need to be worded in this way. It comes down, as always, to whether you trust the supplier.

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Old 07/15/2012, 09:14 AM   #42 (permalink)
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Fair enough, thanks for clarifying. I guess if it's a generic message it does have to consider the worst possible scenario. It would be better if the message was from the app creator and indicated how the app in question actually uses the camera, not just that it DOES use the camera and therefore portray the worst possible way in which it could be misused. But perhaps that's not practical. Anyway thanks again.
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Old 07/15/2012, 01:04 PM   #43 (permalink)
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* I still can't work out any way of changing the colours of the different calendars so it's all black on white. Horrible. Just horrible, and so un-useful compared to webOS.
I'll have to pick one up and play with it next time I'm in the office and can run over to the Sprint store. Google don't know how to create a decent UI, so it wouldn't surprise me if you can't have colors. The UI is one reason I switched back, aside from the general un-intuitive way to do most things. The EVO 3D at least color-codes the calendars, but as far as I know you can't change the assigned colors.
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Old 07/20/2012, 12:04 PM   #44 (permalink)
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you guys kidding me? You can change the colors from within google calender and it shows on the phone.
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Old 07/30/2012, 05:51 AM   #45 (permalink)
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you guys kidding me? You can change the colors from within google calender and it shows on the phone.
If you refer to my post a little way back where I first raised this...

"unless I'm stupid (which is always on the cards ) the calendar app is WOEFUL! As far as I can tell all appointments for all calendars come up in black, and there's no way to make different colours for different calendars. ... Either that or all my hunting around failed to find the rest of the options, in which case they're so deeply hidden the problem simply morphs into a major issue with the UI. Compare that to the calendar app on webOS and well... enough said."

Whichever way I look at it I think that says it all, but if you know some way to change this I'd be pleased to hear it.


So where am I at the moment? I've been back on the Pre 3 for a couple of weeks now and don't really see myself going back to ICS. So while I jumped ship, I think I'm back in the fold

I've considered the discussion on the privacy side of things... it may well be that the "you authorize us to capture what the camera is seeing at any time" message is a generic message, and it may be that Google takes your privacy seriously and would never dream of sharing your private information with anyone. But if heaven forbid they happened to have a brain snap one day and wanted to take a picture of you sitting on the toilet without you knowing, you'd have no comeback. You've agreed to those terms and have explicitly allowed them to do it. Mix that blatant invasion of privacy with a company that is trying to access as much personal information as it can and it's a perfect recipe (in fact an invitation) for identity theft.

So I'm thus far running with a Pre 3 that has a calendar that is simple to use, easy to sync to Exchange without risking someone wiping my device; apps that are just apps, not hooks into my private life. Yes I have to put up with 2G mode unless when I take a risk and switch to 3G for data or something. But on 2G I can still send and receive emails and make calls and do all the necessary business of day to day life so long as I don't want to get too fancy with maps and other data/cpu-hungry apps. For me I think it's the best solution, which is what I set out to find in the first place. I may hang onto the Nexus for travelling, we'll see; but the Pre 3's likely to be my daily driver for the foreseeable future.

Greg

Last edited by gregp; 07/30/2012 at 06:05 AM.
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Old 08/10/2012, 11:14 AM   #46 (permalink)
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Ice Cream Sandwich is absolutely horrid. For all you people who complained about bugs on the PRE, I just updated to ICS on my Sprint Galaxy Epic Touch and there is something wrong with everything. bluetooth doesn't pick up any devices. email doesn't work. the only good think ics has is the swipe to delete notifications, although the notifications still suck.
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Old 08/10/2012, 09:54 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Ice Cream Sandwich is absolutely horrid. For all you people who complained about bugs on the PRE, I just updated to ICS on my Sprint Galaxy Epic Touch and there is something wrong with everything. bluetooth doesn't pick up any devices. email doesn't work. the only good think ics has is the swipe to delete notifications, although the notifications still suck.
I think the Epic Touch ICS upgrade is a special case of awfulness. They have put it on hold at least once, maybe twice, to fix issues, and apparently, there are still issues. My EVO 3D upgrade was smooth. It's still ugly, just different ugly. It will never be webOS. Please webOS ports, put webOS on the 3D. I had to switch back to the EVO for a while because my Pre started spontaneously rebooting on me and I didn't have time to investigate it. I removed a few apps and patches and it seems back to normal now, so I will probably be switching back to the Pre again.
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Old 08/10/2012, 10:21 PM   #48 (permalink)
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I think the Epic Touch ICS upgrade is a special case of awfulness. They have put it on hold at least once, maybe twice, to fix issues, and apparently, there are still issues. My EVO 3D upgrade was smooth. It's still ugly, just different ugly. It will never be webOS. Please webOS ports, put webOS on the 3D. I had to switch back to the EVO for a while because my Pre started spontaneously rebooting on me and I didn't have time to investigate it. I removed a few apps and patches and it seems back to normal now, so I will probably be switching back to the Pre again.
What's ugly, the phone or the operating system?
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Old 08/10/2012, 11:04 PM   #49 (permalink)
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What's ugly, the phone or the operating system?
Android. It's just so plain and unrefined looking.
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Old 08/11/2012, 12:47 AM   #50 (permalink)
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Android. It's just so plain and unrefined looking.
Don't over-exaggerate that's wrong, its not plain at all. I think that Google has improved in many areas of their Android operating system than previous versions of OSes(aka Gingerbread). The phone version, I'm not fond of that due to the small screen which makes everything seen overly crowded, specially navigating on the settings menu...However, on the tablet factor the Android experience is way superior than on the phones version of Google's Android. And their latest Android "Jelly Bean" also improves in a few things as well, such as, in notifications and speed improvements when navigating menus. For me the widgets and voice capability of Android plus the services that Google has been offering....its way refine looking to me.
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Old 08/11/2012, 04:28 AM   #51 (permalink)
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I wouldn't say its plain looking. Android is more of an ungodly mess to me, just never like the looks of it.

I spent half a day with my friend's galaxy S2 and don't get all this about ice cream sandwich. It's same old android to me. They added their cards rip off and managed to make it look crowded with the card and the icon and lines and crap.
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Old 08/13/2012, 01:29 AM   #52 (permalink)
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I wouldn't say its plain looking. Android is more of an ungodly mess to me, just never like the looks of it.

I spent half a day with my friend's galaxy S2 and don't get all this about ice cream sandwich. It's same old android to me. They added their cards rip off and managed to make it look crowded with the card and the icon and lines and crap.
Well, I understand your feelings towards Google's Android platform.....Yet, its offering more things and services than Palm's WebOS at the moment. While my phone's WebOS 2.0 is nice and speedy compared to my old Palm Pixi, but the OS as days goes by it's starting to look a bit of old and plain....compared to Android with its widgets and voice-search capability.

For me, there would never be an OS like WebOS when it comes to ease of use like its gesture area and the ability to multitask with one-hand. But I wouldn't underestimate the search-engine giant company Google "Android"" with its Voice-digital search assistant which is named "Google Search" among other offering like Google's cloud music service, Google's Maps, Voice-dictation, Book-Store among other good services on their Android's platform.
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Old 11/24/2012, 07:13 PM   #53 (permalink)
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I've been on my pre for like 3 yrs finally switching to a galaxy nexus. I'm psyched but wish webos had kept going better. Still have touchpad. The 2 pres I have are finally both almost unusable
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Old 11/25/2012, 11:36 AM   #54 (permalink)
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I opened Tapatalk on my Touchpad in CM9 to head over to XDA Developers and accidently selected WebOS Nation. This thread was on top so I thought it only fitting to comment. I agree that Android is a hot mess. You have to spend hours downloading programs and tweaking it just to get an ounce of the default WebOS or iOS functionality out of it. I'm a desktop Linux nut and I like tweaking things but this is ridiculous. To top it off it is unstable as hell. Apps crash on the first run every time and stuff stops working at weird times causing me to reboot. It is no where near as stable as WebOS, especially the browsers. I keep coming back to Android and using it because of the apps and services. Definitely not the usability. If WebOS had half the apps or the ability to access the services correctly via the browser, I wouldn't touch Android with a 10 foot pole. I hate to say it but if HP/Gr.am don't get their stuff right and soon, my next tablet will be an iPad. I don't think Google will ever get their stuff right.

What amazes me is that the services on Android are top notch. Maps, navigation, search, and voice are excellent. However, usability and stability (even on my OEM Android phone) just plain suck.

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Old 11/28/2012, 04:56 PM   #55 (permalink)
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I opened Tapatalk on my Touchpad in CM9 to head over to XDA Developers and accidently selected WebOS Nation. This thread was on top so I thought it only fitting to comment. I agree that Android is a hot mess. You have to spend hours downloading programs and tweaking it just to get an ounce of the default WebOS or iOS functionality out of it. I'm a desktop Linux nut and I like tweaking things but this is ridiculous. To top it off it is unstable as hell. Apps crash on the first run every time and stuff stops working at weird times causing me to reboot. It is no where near as stable as WebOS, especially the browsers. I keep coming back to Android and using it because of the apps and services. Definitely not the usability. If WebOS had half the apps or the ability to access the services correctly via the browser, I wouldn't touch Android with a 10 foot pole. I hate to say it but if HP/Gr.am don't get their stuff right and soon, my next tablet will be an iPad. I don't think Google will ever get their stuff right.

What amazes me is that the services on Android are top notch. Maps, navigation, search, and voice are excellent. However, usability and stability (even on my OEM Android phone) just plain suck.

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Sounds like you had a bad expereience simlar to what i had on web os

ICS Android has been super awesome for me. Never got the cluttered complaint. You can literally have your homescreen be as cluttered, or as clean as you want.



I will get a rare app crash but i've gotten those on WebOS, iOS , Android and Windows Phone. The fact you are saying with a serious face that android is less stable and has more bugs than WebOS is a joke in itself that I don't even want to touch.
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Old 12/07/2012, 07:11 PM   #56 (permalink)
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Sounds like you had a bad expereience simlar to what i had on web os

ICS Android has been super awesome for me. Never got the cluttered complaint. You can literally have your homescreen be as cluttered, or as clean as you want.
.jpg]Click to view quoted image



I will get a rare app crash but i've gotten those on WebOS, iOS , Android and Windows Phone. The fact you are saying with a serious face that android is less stable and has more bugs than WebOS is a joke in itself that I don't even want to touch.

Having a bad experience.. It hasn't ended yet. I still have CM9 on my tablet. I've thought about removing it again to save space, but on webOS I'm really not using the space for anything (not like we are getting any major apps any time soon). I update to the latest nightlies as soon as they come out. Apps still crash on the first run. I'm starting to get used to the crash warning. None of the browser are stable. Not a one of them. Especially when using Flash. This is the same on my Motorola Photon phone which is stock Android (also updated when new updates arrive). I set the apps to update themselves and I get about 20 updates a week on both devices. I get a bunch of new features but rarely do I get a stability fix.

On the webOS side, I have not had a crash in so long I can't remember. My wife has not had one in a long time either. I have 19 patches installed. The browsers do not have all the bells and whistles of the Android browsers but at least they don't crash. I'm running both the stock browser and the Advanced Browsers, btw.

Before you say anything about having to install patches on webOS, I had to actually go through all the trouble of installing CM9 on the TouchPad. Then after that I had to install GApps. Then I had to find a virtual keyboard that was actually worth a darn. I ended up PAYING for Swiftkey Tablet version. Then I had to find a browser that actually allowed me to load the desktop version of a website by default (not after the fact), which webOS does with no issues, btw. I finally installed FireFox mobile and the Phony plugin. I have gotten so used to using Zite (I can't stand Pulse anymore and I think Flipboard is so-so) that I wanted it for Android. I installed it easily on my phone, but it was incompatible with CM9. I had to side load it to get it to work. I like Spotify and like the Android version of the app for my phone. For some reason when I installed Spotify on CM9 it kept opening up in portrait mode. I ended up PAYING for a rotation control app to fix that. I deleted all of the extra home screens and only have one with four widgets on it (that I actually use). I have spent countless hours, Google searches, and some of my hard earned money on solutions to fix things in Android (both CM9 and on my phone) that I am rightfully jaded (especially when another CM9 user complains about taking the time to install a free patch on webOS that makes it stable). Even after all of that webOS is still easier to use (especially with LunaCE) and I find myself coming back to it for the sake of my sanity. If webOS had half of the apps that Android has and a decent phone on Sprint I wouldn't touch Android with a ten foot pole. Unfortunately that is not the case.

Speaking about phones, I love the Motorola Photon. Not as much as I loved the Pre, but it will do. It has the best reception of any phone I have ever owned on Sprint. I can get and hold a good signal at work while my co-workers Sprint iPhones and other Android phones tap out. The problem I have with the phone is with Android. Specifically with Bluetooth and music apps. I don't know why Google decided that you need to specify a default music app for Bluetooth audio control instead of just allowing the Bluetooth device to control whatever music app you have open at the time. To clarify, I used to listen to the music on my phone while driving through Bluetooth. When I go to change the song while in an app like Spotify, the phone starts Google Play Music and begins playing a song from it. I found out that the Bluetooth audio controls are tied to the default music app, not the app that is currently playing. I can change the app in my settings but I think that is ridiculous. What if I decide to listen to iHeart Radio or Slacker Radio that morning? I would have to change it every time. Also, it is too dangerous for me to drive and change the song from the phone. Especially with the lock screen on. The Pre never had an issue. The Bluetooth audio controls were slaved to whatever music app was opened at the time on the Pre. The Android phone also has a bad pausing problem with all of the audio apps through Bluetooth while I am driving. It is so annoying, along with the audio control problem, that I have almost completely stopped listening to music on my phone while driving.

I want to like Android so much. I've been using it since pre-1.x. However, Google seems to keep adding more bells and whistle to it and useability seems to be an after thought every time. I am deeply impressed with Google Navigation/Maps and the integration these apps have with my desktop. I am impressed with Gmail. I am not impressed by Android. After owning an Android tablet (the first tablet I bought, BTW), owning several Android phones, and installing it on several devices, I know why people prefer to pay $500+ for an iPad yet would not pay more than $250 for Android's best offerings. I keep coming back to a nearly dead OS just to get away from the Android mess. If you don't demand more from them, Google will never fix the issues and Android will forever be relegated to cheap devices.

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Old 12/07/2012, 08:33 PM   #57 (permalink)
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I have been running jelly bean on the nexus 4 since Nov.16 The phone rebooted once over night. I haven't had an app crash yet. I can control my networked Yamaha receiver DirecTV and it navigates good. My pre 3 never seem to find the 3g or h+ networks on T-Mobile. The browser is a biggie.. drop down menus on webos are pretty much no longer working..To compare a hacked version of android on the touchpad is just not a good litmus test. Headami is beta testing the music player for android that will be a good comparison to see. IMHO that is the coolest app in webos. Everyone has their pet peeves. I kinda like 350 dollar phone and the 30 dollars a month on T-Mobile
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Old 12/07/2012, 09:00 PM   #58 (permalink)
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I have been running jelly bean on the nexus 4 since Nov.16 The phone rebooted once over night. I haven't had an app crash yet. I can control my networked Yamaha receiver DirecTV and it navigates good. My pre 3 never seem to find the 3g or h+ networks on T-Mobile. The browser is a biggie.. drop down menus on webos are pretty much no longer working..To compare a hacked version of android on the touchpad is just not a good litmus test. Headami is beta testing the music player for android that will be a good comparison to see. IMHO that is the coolest app in webos. Everyone has their pet peeves. I kinda like 350 dollar phone and the 30 dollars a month on T-Mobile

My phone doesn't have a hacked version of Android. It came with it and with the exception of a few upgrades it is pretty stock. The phone has never rebooted. The browsers keep crashing and the Bluetooth audio controls suck. Every now and then a random app will crash on the phone but not as frequently as on CM9.

I forgot to mention something else that bugs the heck out of me about Android. My phone and tablet have become billboards for advertisements. Every hour a new add pops up in the notification area. It is highly annoying and I actually PAY for a lot of apps on Android.


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Old 12/08/2012, 09:41 AM   #59 (permalink)
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My phone doesn't have a hacked version of Android. It came with it and with the exception of a few upgrades it is pretty stock. The phone has never rebooted. The browsers keep crashing and the Bluetooth audio controls suck. Every now and then a random app will crash on the phone but not as frequently as on CM9.

I forgot to mention something else that bugs the heck out of me about Android. My phone and tablet have become billboards for advertisements. Every hour a new add pops up in the notification area. It is highly annoying and I actually PAY for a lot of apps on Android.


---Sent from my HP TouchPad using Communities (a great webOS app!)
k4ever Adblock Plus = what ads?

Paying for Swift Key 3 for my phone was probably one of my best bangs for my buck. No regrets there.

The new revamped version of Music Remix Player is pretty slick as well. I still enjoy using the webOS version...probably my favorite app of all time for webOS, however there are some neat enhancements on the Android side. If you haven't already, you might want to check out the Beta that is found http://forums.androidcentral.com/and...-now-open.html here. Dan is optimizing it for all screens, all resolutions, going back as far as Gingerbread.
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