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  1. slinky's Avatar
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    #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by 2000 Man
    Actually, the CDMA Treo 650 has a talk time of 5 hours with the standard battery. www.phonescoop.com
    Phonescoop can say whatever it wants. Verizon reports in their stores and online that the talk time is 150 minutes. That's it. I trust the vendor selling the phone and needing to make a solid representation more than I do any news reporter.

    http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/s...edPhoneId=1741
  2. #22  
    I have had four and can vouch that the talk time is much more than 150 minutes. If you don't believe it start a poll
  3. #23  
    ...or a petition
    MaxiMunK.com The Forum That Asks, "Are You Not Entertained?"

    Remember: "Anyone that thinks the Treo should just work right out of the box, shouldn't own a Treo..."
  4. slinky's Avatar
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    #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by grndslm
    SLINKY...I know that I've told you this on more than one occasion: 5 hour battery life (unmatched by most other phones out there, and certainly all ppc phones). I use my non-WiFi device all the time and don't carry a laptop...what're you talking about!?!?
    I guess you should tell Verizon that they are wrong and agree to pay out whatever lawsuit may result because you KNOW that the Treo 650 puts out 5 hours of battery life on Verizon's network. Here you go:

    http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/s...edPhoneId=1741

    I also can use it everywhere you can find a WiFi spot and everywhere you can't find a WiFi spot (at least in this country), for $10/mo...quit the biatchin'!! You can speed it up by trying Xiino, perhaps. How about using Wassdat. I think I'll be payin' $10/mo for data even after I get an EV-DO phone 'cause I won't want to surf on a pda for my everyday bookmarks.
    What are you yammering about? Data plans on Verizon's networks cost $45 for any practical usage and the cheapest plan is $25. Any other plan will result in a cost far greater with moderate email checking daily. Not only is WiFi faster, it's cheaper (costs nothing in many instances), you can get hold of a connection virtually everywhere (including at home and corporate networks), you can travel and use your phone as an IP Phone (if you are unfamiliar with it, they are also popular outside of MI), and traveling in areas of the country where phone connectivity is poor (go anywhere in upstate NY, etc.) and if you are at a hotel/motel there is almost always at least wireless WiFi connectivity even though there may be no phone service. Your efforts are better investing in complaining to Verizon/Sprint/Palm about releasing the WiFi driver already. WiFi is great. Accept it. EVDO is not an alternative and is damned expensive.

    It's for solitude and emergency uses only pretty much. Again, not for reading your everyday bookmarks. It's got nothing to do with the speed. You could have Wifi in your home, but there's going to be a memory, screen, and keyboard limitation when it comes to REAL browsing!!!
    Without being obnoxious you need to get out of Mississippi to see how popular WiFi is. In New York I can hop into WiFi almost anywhere in the city. WiFi is used every day and often, not for emergencies.

    IF you want to talk about limitations when it comes to browsing, all of us are plagued by the crappy browsers there are for the Palm and the memory limitations, not only in the app but also with the 32 MB (23 usable) of RAM provided with it. From my perspective the browsing is equivalent and most of what I do and many others do is frequent email checking and occasional web browsing.

    FIRST OF ALL...have you used the i730, slinky? How about the 650? Have you used it for longer than 2 weeks? If so, it hasn't been MUCH longer. Just PUH-LEEZE would you stop saying stuff about phones you haven't held in your hand for longer than a couple hours, if even held at all!!! Do you not remember me saying that after you made your very first post? I said you needed to spend a little more time in analysis of the phone and that your initial reactions were the same as everybody elses...and that you'd adjust. And now you're telling everybody here how the i730 is a real threat. I wish that for one day, I didn't have to come to TC and to tell you to ZIP IT!!
    I'm not happy because WiFi is available for the other Palms but is crippled on the 650. When I see misinformed people rationalizing why WiFi isn't that great, it makes me think that the same people were speaking to the folks at Palm who claimed that the people they surveyed thought the Treo was totally amazing and like 32 MB of RAM was still more than enough. It's in the print. I've had Palms since the 90s and have had 3 Treos, including this one. The companies I've worked with use them longer than you have yours and for purposes that obviously far exceed your usage experience, politely put.

    EVERY phone is a threat to the 650...just like every mp3 player is a threat to the iPod. But they need to build MOMENTUM before they start turning heads. The i730 will not gain momentum. Not even the i800...it's gonna take a couple more tries for all PPC phone manufacturers to get the hardware right before they have any momentum at all. But by that time, you've got the first version of Palm Linux on your perfect hardware (at least in terms of a candybar form factor; I'm waitin' on the clamshell). And when that new version of Palm comes out, you're going to see a LOT of Palm users upgrade because THAT's what most are waiting for.
    I'm hoping we can have a conversation and you can use your efforts to influence manufacturers rather than informing others here they are wrong because you are concerned about what a local person in MI might want. Who gives a damn whether the Treo is using a Linux based system? In fact, I don't think I recall anyone pining away that they want this either. VFS causes enough problems and now we're talking about Linux? Jeeez...

    Not every phone is a threat to the Treo 650. Regarding WiFi, if you just take a little trip to NY, Chicago, LA, Boston -- places where there is a much larger demand for PDA-phones than Mississippi by sheer numbers -- you will have an understanding just how ubiquitous WiFi really is. WiFi is huge and given a choice of also spending $45 per month on data makes the Treo 650 not palatable at all. The speed and accessibility also trump the Treo by great margins. Do you have any idea how long it takes me to download email using my phone versus WiFi? I'd say that it probably takes 5-8 times longer using the phone, at a MINIMUM.

    Slinky, if you want to blame somebody...blame PalmSource. Palm really hasn't done much wrong. I'd say the RAM thing was kinda messed up (for a small fraction of users, like people with large contacts/calendars and a couple other cases)...but other than that, you can't really fault Palm for much else, except not pushing PalmSource harder to release Palm Linux. Palm just friggin' got the phone, dude!! This was their very first time at releasing a phone!!!!!! FIRST FRIGGIN' PHONE! AHH, SLINKY!! AHH!!!
    Whoops. I didn't realize you were one of those people who told Palm that 32 MB of RAM was far more than enough. The RAM thing was messup up for a small fraction of users? Hmmm... comments like that will make you lose credibility amongst users very quickly (although gain points with Palm's clueless marketing team.) I don't think I've ever heard of any piece of technology where the processor got more powerful, the footrpint of the OS was larger and the RAM stayed the same.

    I'm prolly gonna be blocking your comments as they are too repetitive. I have a feeling that you're not a very quick learner. How 'bout this recommendation: STOP POSTING AND START READING 'TIL YOU CAN SPIT OUT EVERY BIT OF INFORMATION ON EVERY SMARTPHONE EVER MADE...OK!?!? Then maybe you can post again if you prove yourself.
    Sorry slinky...I was only kiddin'!
    Politely put, I can understand your enthusiasm. Don't get me wrong, I like having the coolest gadget on the block too. We can't do much about the RAM issue (I remember those cool RAM upgrades for the Vx) but we can do something about WiFi drivers. I sincerely hope you get a chance to travel, perhaps to NY, LA or Chicago, and see what is out there in the very large metro areas. You'll probably be amazed at how popular it is and how many people use it every day... no worries.
    Last edited by slinky; 07/15/2005 at 09:37 AM.
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    I guess you should tell Verizon that they are wrong and agree to pay out whatever lawsuit may result because you KNOW that the Treo 650 puts out 5 hours of battery life on Verizon's network. Here you go:

    http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/s...edPhoneId=1741


    What are you yammering about? Data plans on Verizon's networks cost $45 for any practical usage. Any other plan will result in a cost far greater with moderate email checking daily. Not only is WiFi faster, it's cheaper (costs nothing in many instances), you can get hold of a connection virtually everywhere (including at home and corporate networks), you can travel and use your phone as an IP Phone (if you are unfamiliar with it, they are also popular outside of MI), and traveling in areas of the country where phone connectivity is poor (go anywhere in upstate NY, etc.) and if you are at a hotel/motel there is almost always at least wireless WiFi connectivity even though there may be no phone service. Your efforts are better investing in complaining to Verizon/Sprint/Palm about releasing the WiFi driver already. WiFi is great. Accept it. EVDO is not an alternative and is damned expensive.


    Without being obnoxious you need to get out of Mississippi to see how popular WiFi is. In New York I can hop into WiFi almost anywhere in the city. WiFi is used every day and often, not for emergencies.

    IF you want to talk about limitations when it comes to browsing, all of us are plagued by the crappy browsers there are for the Palm and the memory limitations, not only in the app but also with the 32 MB (23 usable) of RAM provided with it. From my perspective the browsing is equivalent and most of what I do and many others do is frequent email checking and occasional web browsing.


    I'm ticked off because WiFi is available for the other Palms but is crippled on the 650. When I see misinformed people rationalizing why WiFi isn't that great, it makes me think that the same people were speaking to the folks at Palm who claimed that the people they surveyed thought the Treo was totally amazing and like 32 MB of RAM was still more than enough. It's in the print. I've had Palms since the 90s and have had 3 Treos, including this one. The companies I've worked with use them longer than you have yours and for purposes that obviously far exceed your usage experience, politely put.


    I'm hoping we can have a conversation and you can use your efforts to influence manufacturers rather than informing others here they are wrong because you are concerned about what a local person in MI might want. Who gives a damn whether the Treo is using a Linux based system? In fact, I don't think I recall anyone pining away that they want this either. VFS causes enough problems and now we're talking about Linux? Jeeez...

    Not every phone is a threat to the Treo 650. Regarding WiFi, if you just take a little trip to NY, Chicago, LA, Boston -- places where there is a much larger demand for PDA-phones than Mississippi by sheer numbers -- you will have an understanding just how ubiquitous WiFi really is. WiFi is huge and given a choice of also spending $45 per month on data makes the Treo 650 not palatable at all. The speed and accessibility also trump the Treo by great margins. Do you have any idea how long it takes me to download email using my phone versus WiFi? I'd say that it probably takes 5-8 times longer using the phone, at a MINIMUM.


    The RAM thing was messup up for a small fraction of users? I don't think I've ever heard of any piece of technology where the processor got more powerful, the footrpint of the OS was larger and the RAM stayed the same.


    Politely put, I can understand your enthusiasm. Don't get me wrong, I like having the coolest gadget on the block too. We can't do much about the RAM issue (I remember those cool RAM upgrades for the Vx) but we can do something about WiFi drivers. I sincerely hope you get a chance to travel, perhaps to NY, LA or Chicago, and see what is out there in the very large metro areas. You'll probably be amazed at how popular it is and how many people use it every day... no worries.

    wow...ever consider volunteering for a charity?
  6. slinky's Avatar
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    #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by dutchtrumpet
    wow...ever consider volunteering for a charity?
    Actually, I do.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Actually, I do.
    I mean besides the palm trashing one
  8. #28  
    I have no issue with someone trashing palm if its fair (the last thing I want is for palm to think its ok to have the same processor, ram, camera, no wifi, etc...in the next treo ) I also don't think its an overstatement to say that *most treo owners would like to see *some of these improvements in the next version.
    Palm III-->Palm IIIxe-->Palm 505-->Samsung i300-->Treo 600-->PPC 6600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700wx-->BB Pearl--> BB Curve

  9. jstpa's Avatar
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    #29  
    I had a Treo 600 and I now have an i730. A few comments:

    1. The i730 keyboard is very nice. It is not at all like the keyboard on the xv6600. It slides out like silk with one hand and the keys are bigger than the treo. I find it to be very easy to use one handed. It's actually one of the nicest parts of the phone.

    2. The palm phone and contact software is far superior. Period. While one handed operation can be done with the i730, it is not as easy.

    3. Battery life is short on the i730. You will have to learn to live with this.

    4. I've found that my i730 requires frequent soft resets. On the other hand, I've also heard this from other people about the 600, but I never had this problem with my 600.

    5. EVDO is nice. It makes the web far more usable. Now, Windows mobile browsers have to get better, because they do seem to cause a bottleneck speedwise, and they do not fully utilize web site functionality.

    So what's the answer? Depends on you. I don't think that the i730 will kill the treo, because the treo is a very well designed phone. On the other hand, if Palm does not upgrade the treo to EVDO in timely fashion, then Palm will kill the Treo without any assistance.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    Phonescoop can say whatever it wants. Verizon reports in their stores and online that the talk time is 150 minutes. That's it. I trust the vendor selling the phone and needing to make a solid representation more than I do any news reporter.

    http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/s...edPhoneId=1741
    Drongo
  11. slinky's Avatar
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    #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    I have no issue with someone trashing palm if its fair (the last thing I want is for palm to think its ok to have the same processor, ram, camera, no wifi, etc...in the next treo ) I also don't think its an overstatement to say that *most treo owners would like to see *some of these improvements in the next version.
    Nobody is trashing the Treo 650 or Palm. I agree 100% with t2gungho and am hoping that my comments will further people here to realize that we can be happy and proud to have a Treo 650. But when you try to rationalize how amazing it is for your own sense of security and not speak up about significant and deliberate shortcomings, you're doing yourself and all other Treo 650 owners a disservice.

    Heck, I hope Palm and Verizon/Sprint get out of their ivory towers. WiFi capability is a serious threat. Only 32 MB of RAM (The Samsung has over 100MB?) is ludicrous and to even imply that it "only affects the minority" is flat out rationalizing and inaccurate. They NEED to stay current or else netting greater profits isn't going to mean a thing if the next version will have even less appeal.

    What we need are people to say that the Treo has excellent capability but only has the POTENTIAL to stack up to the current phones coming out. The Treo 650 is the newest addition to the Verizon line. There won't be another for a while. Let's see what we can do to ensure that it stacks up to the i730, at least with regard to WiFi, a HUGE seller and service in major markets.

    PS - Another HUGE advantage of WiFi -- it doesn't use up existing minutes of usage. You can surf for an hour during lunch and it won't eat up 60 minutes of "talk time." On the Treo 650, I feel those minutes ticking away during peak hours...
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    PS - Another HUGE advantage of WiFi -- it doesn't use up existing minutes of usage. You can surf for an hour during lunch and it won't eat up 60 minutes of "talk time." On the Treo 650, I feel those minutes ticking away during peak hours...
    WiFi is a wonderful technology. On this we agree. But your comparison of WiFi to the Treo's typical data usage scenario is inaccurate. One does not have to use airtime (minutes) to browse the web or to use data services on a Treo.

    I have unlimited data service. It has nothing to do with my airtime minutes. I don't dial-up to an ISP treating my Treo as a MODEM. The data is always-on, just like a broadband connection. If you are going to make comparisons between technologies, get your facts straight.

    The only people that would use airtime minutes for data on a Treo are those that don't want to pay for a data plan. Since data plans vary around the world, I will speak to my own service (Sprint), in which I pay $15 a month for unlimited data usage...and I don't have to find a WiFi hotspot in order to get on-line.

    In the US, unlimited data plans are the norm. In Europe and other places, they charge by the KB/MB. In those markets, the demand for WiFi is understandable.
    Last edited by Insp_Gadget; 07/15/2005 at 01:55 PM.
    --Inspector Gadget

    "Go Go Gadget Pre!!"
    Palm Pre on Sprint

    Palm V--> Palm IIIc--> Visor Prism--> Visor Phone--> Treo 270--> Treo 600--> Treo 650-->
    Treo 700wx--> HTC Touch Diamond--> Palm Pre & HTC EVO 4G.
  13. #33  
    treo
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by slinky
    PS - Another HUGE advantage of WiFi -- it doesn't use up existing minutes of usage. You can surf for an hour during lunch and it won't eat up 60 minutes of "talk time." On the Treo 650, I feel those minutes ticking away during peak hours...
    Are you sure about that, troll? Please tell us exactly which plan you have where your data usage comes out of your talk time minutes.
  15.    #35  
    Folks, got the Treo 650 on 7/1 and returned it yesterday to do the 15 day trial with the i730.

    I really want to wait to give full review/impression as I am a bit lost on Pocket PC after 7 years with PalmOS.

    Only thing I can give immediately is battery life is weak on the i730. Left the house for two meetings at 10AM and by 2:30 I was below 50%. 650 battery was much better.

    We will see at the end of the month which way it pushes me. I may take this back and go back to the Treo 600 I have tucked away.
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    #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by 2000 Man
    Are you sure about that, troll? Please tell us exactly which plan you have where your data usage comes out of your talk time minutes.
    Yet another Sprint user I assume... Buying new VZW service at this moment you can get flat fee data plans. There is a reason why Snappermail and Batter Doctor were so popular amongst VZW Internet users and marketed directly to VZW users with MOU contracts.

    VZW data plans cost 300%+ more than Sprint. You can get a WiFi plan with over 1,000 hotspots all over NYC and way more bandwidth for less than half of VZW's relatively slow 1x data access.

    Broadband under Verizon costs you $80 per month. WiFi can be free or a fraction of that amount. The speed differential between 1X and WiFi are, putting it simply, worlds apart. As a result I usually download headers only to my phone and then individually decide what to download. With my WiFi connection it's just "send-receive" and it's all done in a minute.

    The cost savings with WiFi for 6-8 months is more than the cost of the Treo 650. Accept the facts. WiFi is pretty important, especially now that the cat is out of the bag.
    Last edited by slinky; 07/15/2005 at 03:49 PM.
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    #37  
    We understand wi-fi, thank you.

    Try to get a grip on the facts. Verizon broadband costs $44.99/month/unlimited --> no minutes usage.

    I don't get free wi-fi unless I'm at home or in my office -- and then I have a PC available - so I don't need it on my phone. Otherwise I have to pay for it or steal it.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by jstpa
    Otherwise I have to pay for it or steal it.
    What about places that offer it for free? (I am assuming there are no free hotspots where you are?)
    Palm III-->Palm IIIxe-->Palm 505-->Samsung i300-->Treo 600-->PPC 6600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700wx-->BB Pearl--> BB Curve

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    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by t2gungho
    What about places that offer it for free? (I am assuming there are no free hotspots where you are?)
    very few

    certainly not enough to rely on
  20. #40  
    I had a chance to play with the i730 today. A patient of mine has been using it for awhile and let me play with it. I didn't even know it existed until now.

    First impression: Neat form factor. Beautiful. I love the big screen and the slide out keyboard. If Palm developed a similar form factor for the Treo line, most would rave and jump on it. I am a die-hard Palm user, but let's face it, "style" is not in their vocabulary.

    Downside: The same form factor I just praised. The advantage of seeing this guy's phone is that it has been used. While it initially felt sturdy and well-built, the keyboard slides up and down freely now. It will not stay in place when "hidden." Also, the casing on either side of the keyboard has completely worn down and now looks almost abused, and this was a reasonably new phone!

    Great idea, but could use some improvements.
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