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  1. #121  
    adding (successfully) multitasking capability to an o/s is a monumental undertaking - and increases the size and overdead - the cpu instruction set can help or hinder the task as well as the hardware architecture - while i would not consider windows a stable product, it has improved significantly since its birth - my guess is that palm would need to support the customer's invesrment by allowing existing applications to execute on the new o/s - that could limit your options when developing the o/s - if the birthing pain is too severe, some customers may opt for a more mature (and hopefully stable) o/s - from a business perspective, it may be less expensive to adopt an existing product - entail less risk - and leave them legal recourse

    just a few reasons that come to mind
  2. #122  
    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Treo
    But I also heard the next version of Palm is supposed to be Linux-based. That would better IMO. Which rumor is closer to the truth? I really WOULDN'T want to see Windows on a Treo, competition is a GOOD thing
    I heard the same and would prefer they go in that direction. I think the Palm OS is played out but embracing Windoze is accepting mediocrity - IMO.

    I'm very pleased with my VX6600 but I'm not even close to being as satisfied as I was with my '82 Filofax, '86 Casio Boss, '93 HP 200 LX, '97 Palmpilot, and even my '02 Kyocera 7135 Smartphone. This device is exciting as the many unmentioned handhelds I had in-between the above.

    My next handheld will be another Windoze device if there is nothing better.
  3. #123  
    Quote Originally Posted by sloop
    adding (successfully) multitasking capability to an o/s is a monumental undertaking - and increases the size and overdead - the cpu instruction set can help or hinder the task as well as the hardware architecture - while i would not consider windows a stable product, it has improved significantly since its birth - my guess is that palm would need to support the customer's invesrment by allowing existing applications to execute on the new o/s - that could limit your options when developing the o/s - if the birthing pain is too severe, some customers may opt for a more mature (and hopefully stable) o/s - from a business perspective, it may be less expensive to adopt an existing product - entail less risk - and leave them legal recourse

    just a few reasons that come to mind
    And then MS will continue to monopolize. Not good, IMO. I don't hate Windows(can't say I love it either though), but the average consumer's been tricked into thinking it's the way to go for EVERYTHING. And as a result, they are actually not as great as they want us to believe, because they're lax. ME was actually a re-release of 98b, so I've heard from those that know software. That XP SP2 release should have been in the first version, if they were really that innovative. Pop-up blocker, firewall, virus monitoring, long AFTER it became known these are necessities?? Front Page is not always a good website building standard due to it's proprietary extensions, I went to Dreamweaver. I guess Office is good, although it drained all my computer resources after SP2 was installed, so I had no choice but to uninstall it until I can get more memory. A lot of Windows programs are bloated, IMO. Not to mention the constant updates even AFTER the HUGE SP2 was downloaded!

    I don't truly know if the mobile versions had problems, but I sure hope they're better than the desktop versions!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  4. #124  
    Quote Originally Posted by TonyH
    No one will benefit from your experience, other than Treo fanatics, like you. The truth of the matter is that Treo lovers will find any excuse to justify their strange love for a Treo 600 or 650 no matter how foolish their Treo makes them look before their clients.

    Well, I for one. am tired of looking like a fool before my clients. I will not embarrase myselef anymore by having my device reset itself before tota strangers.
    What an unbelievably naive comment. I can tell you absolutely that my appreciation for this thread is enormous. I am a Treo 600 owner and have spent the last several months desparately trying to get it to provide what I feel is the acceptable minimum functionality from one of these convergent devices. I am not a happy chappy when it comes to my Treo and have been looking around for a reasonable alternative for some time now. I know one or two people who have the XDA II Mini but suspect that personal pride or something similar colours their comments. I for one am extremely grateful for those (especially the initiator) who have contributed sensibly to this post. (that excludes you!)
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  5. #125  
    Quote Originally Posted by PhilzGr8
    I for one am extremely grateful for those (especially the initiator) who have contributed sensibly to this post.
    Meaning of course that I'll be making do with the T600 for now!
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  6. #126  
    Hey! I already aplogized about that post. Give it a rest, huh

    Hope you and your t600 are happy forever.
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    #127  
    Quote Originally Posted by sloop
    adding (successfully) multitasking capability to an o/s is a monumental undertaking - and increases the size and overdead - the cpu instruction set can help or hinder the task as well as the hardware architecture - while i would not consider windows a stable product, it has improved significantly since its birth - my guess is that palm would need to support the customer's invesrment by allowing existing applications to execute on the new o/s - that could limit your options when developing the o/s - if the birthing pain is too severe, some customers may opt for a more mature (and hopefully stable) o/s - from a business perspective, it may be less expensive to adopt an existing product - entail less risk - and leave them legal recourse

    just a few reasons that come to mind
    If the CPU is fast enough, and you have enough memory, I can imagine a Palm OS (Garnet) emulator running on Linux. This would allow you to move to a Palm/Linux phone without starting over with your software. However, emulators are a workaround. What you want is, applications rewritten to use multitasking capabilities, Linux file structures, Linux security, etc. etc. The major software houses will want to rewrite their applications to run "native" on Linux. I have to think they are already working on this. The Java developers won't have to do much if anything.
  8. #128  
    I wouldn't be opposed to a phone with multiple operating systems on it (Palm OS, Linux, WM). That way the customer base could choose for themselves. Of course, that would probably drive phone prices through the roof (common CPU required - currently non-existent, 2 x license agreements plus Linux porting fee). Still, I would consider buying it at a higher price.
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    #129  
    Everyone uses pretty much the same components, except that GSM and CDMA radios come from different sources. Also I think license fees are per handset. It's development and testing time that doubles, not hardware and software.
  10. #130  
    Pretty sure WM and Palm OS can run on the PXA chip. Haven't seen a Linux example yet. Symbian doesn't run on one yet either, I believe.

    License fees in the example I gave would be per handset per OS. Microsoft, PalmSource and perhaps someone like Red Hat are all going to want the user to pay for their OS. Even Symbian might want to get in on the "universal phone" which, by definition, should be GSM and CDMA capable!
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    #131  
    Intel's website shows developer kits for all four OS's, for the older chips. There's nothing showing up on the website yet for the bulverde chip (JAM, i730), but I'm sure the beta versions are available if you know who to talk to. I agree that you won't be able to swap OS's without paying for the new one, but I wasn't planning to do that. I just want to be able to buy the phone with my choice of OS.
  12. #132  
    Quote Originally Posted by TonyH
    Hey! I already aplogized about that post. Give it a rest, huh
    Doh! My apologies, I missed that one! Probably better not to post while exceeding your local driver alcohol limit hey?
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  13. #133  
    Sometimes posting while drunk comes out great, but controlling your semantics can be rather difficult Anyway, I never really knocked anyone because they prefer one OS over the other. I used Palm for years, but finally chose the PPC devices because they work better for me, and have more of the functions I need.
  14.    #134  
    Quote Originally Posted by PhilzGr8
    What an unbelievably naive comment. I can tell you absolutely that my appreciation for this thread is enormous.
    Thanks PhilzGr8.
  15.    #135  
    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman6
    If the CPU is fast enough, and you have enough memory, I can imagine a Palm OS (Garnet) emulator running on Linux. This would allow you to move to a Palm/Linux phone without starting over with your software. However, emulators are a workaround. What you want is, applications rewritten to use multitasking capabilities, Linux file structures, Linux security, etc. etc. The major software houses will want to rewrite their applications to run "native" on Linux. I have to think they are already working on this. The Java developers won't have to do much if anything.
    Iceman6, you have absolutely hit the nail on the head with that one. I agree with Lady Treo and yourself that Linux may be a better option but Linux on convergent devices have not been widely trialled, based on what I know. As a result, Palm will need to do a lot of work to get it in shape for the masses.

    With Linux' multitasking capabilities and community support, the device could see a lot of new software concepts contributed by the community. I think that's a good thing for the PDA/Phone industry as a whole.
  16.    #136  
    Just out of interest...Does anyone know what Sony's plans are with regards to PDA/Phones? I mean they had some great Palm based PDAs in the form of their Clie range...their phone OS leaves a lot to be desired though.
  17. #137  
    Quote Originally Posted by laugher
    Thanks PhilzGr8.
    No probs. Actually I think you might have saved me from a severe case of frustration. I've decided to wait a bit longer before I upgrade to anything now. It seems this convergent technology just isn't quite mature enough yet for my liking.
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  18. #138  
    Quote Originally Posted by laugher
    Just out of interest...Does anyone know what Sony's plans are with regards to PDA/Phones? I mean they had some great Palm based PDAs in the form of their Clie range...their phone OS leaves a lot to be desired though.
    Seems to me any Sony/Ericsson smartphones are Symbian-based.
  19.    #139  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe
    Seems to me any Sony/Ericsson smartphones are Symbian-based.
    They are but remember, Sony has the Clie range of Palm based PDAs which were (and probably still are) selling better than their PalmOne counterparts. I was wondering if anyone heard of any directions or strategies they may have put in place to put out a Palm based PDA/Phone.
  20.    #140  
    Quote Originally Posted by PhilzGr8
    No probs. Actually I think you might have saved me from a severe case of frustration. I've decided to wait a bit longer before I upgrade to anything now. It seems this convergent technology just isn't quite mature enough yet for my liking.
    Well, that's all relative. The Treo 600 had its own wrath of BIOS issues when it first came out (and I bought it when it literally got announced). When I updated the BIOS from PalmOne's website, those problems went away and the phone was smooth sailing ever since. If you are happy with the Treo and you find the keyboard indispensable, keep the Treo 600 for now until the Treo 650's issues have "calmed" down.

    If I were you, with what I know now, and I wanted to jump to the Windows platform, I wouldn't choose the XDA II Mini because of its 64Mb footprint. But there aren't that many Windows phones that are in the size/form factor as the XDA II Mini so I guess your choice is limited if you like your phone to be "compact". Otherwise, look at the O2 XDA II and IIs (and its imate equivalents).

    The other phones suggested here are predominantly available in the US and/or are derivatives of the ones I mentioned here anyway.
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