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  1.    #21  
    i was *just* about to reply, but then i realised suskind was a tool and chose to spend my time navigating through my treo without leaving ugly "suskind-approved" marks all over the screen...
  2. #22  
    QUOTE=MarkC

    Which of these can be done one handed:
    1) leave one app and launch another?

    -yes and all below are based on using ONE HAND, ONE THUMB

    2) open the browser, navigate to a link on a page, go to that page?

    -if its bookmarked no problem. but if you have to enter address manually then it depends what 3rd party input you uses. It might be tricky to use built in input, unless you want to scribble grafitti gesture using your thumb. (not my idea of fun input. I use Tengo)

    3) refresh a web page?

    yupe

    4) return to a previous web page?

    yupe

    5) open Pocket Outlook and open the inbox?

    same as number 1

    6) open an email message, read it and then close it again?

    yupe

    7) adjust settings - simple things like screen brightness, ringer and alarm volume?

    yupe (dude, that is just combination of #1 plus an icon )

    8) make a phone call?

    yupe. I have average thumb mind you.

    It seems from the tenor of your post (and others that you've made) that you'd rather have an argument than a debate and rather score points than bring clarity, but it also seems that you also have a degree of knowledge of PPC and I for one would be grateful if could address the the questions above and say how each of the actions the questions refer to can be accomplished with one hand. It may be like trying to describe porsche semi-automatic transmission to your grandmother, but go on, have a go. Bear in mind that this thread already has spacehog's replies to these questions so what we (the Treo users who 'don't know jack about PDA input') are looking for is some sort of deeper insight. You've mentioned add-on dialler software, so part of question eight is covered and you might confine yourself to just addressing making a call from the contacts database for that one. Are there add-on apps or features of WM2003 SE that spacehog has overlooked that make 1-7 easier? This is a chance to redeem yourself. *Please* try to be constructive.
    basically anything beyond the start button. (does he know how to alter font size to give bigger thumbfootprint for touching text? Does he install today'plugins'? Does he install dialer if he wish to have something fancy thumbing? Does he know what soft input works the best to maximize iJam? does he know a lot of launcher come with big icon for today plug in...etc etc.)

    I don't know about 2.8 inch in iJam, but 3.5 works absolutely fine.

    Now if he has phobia to touch a touchscreen, I can't do a thing about it. What can I say? The entire iJam interface is designed around touch screen.

    -----

    here is something to ponder if you believe what spacehog is saying.
    1. what size do you think is the 'start button'? He says he has no problem using the touch screen.
    2. how big do you think the rest of UI he is talking about. (pIE buttons, poutlook email text, pull down menus, etc etc...)
    3. do you kow you can just highlight a text and drag your thumb across the screen and it will automatically scroll down? (of course not, because Palm doesn't have this feature so no Palm user bother trying this trick. How about the fact that pIE can scroll down using the d-pad?)

    You want the best punch line?
    -You use the browser with two hands, like a gameboy, landscape mode. (wow, revolutionary isn't it?)
    Last edited by suskind; 11/18/2004 at 01:55 PM.
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by spacehog
    i was *just* about to reply, but then i realised suskind was a tool and chose to spend my time navigating through my treo without leaving ugly "suskind-approved" marks all over the screen...
    so what sort of sticky stuff sits on top of your thumboard? wonder of all wonder.

    you do know touch screenis easier to clean than thumboard right? just instal new screen protector.....voila...
  4. #24  
    suskind, Thanks for your post and for being constructive in it!

    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    QUOTE=MarkC
    Which of these can be done one handed:
    1) leave one app and launch another?

    -yes and all below are based on using ONE HAND, ONE THUMB

    [snip]
    If I might summarise, basically your answers to my questions are the same as spacehog's with addition that you suggest a Today screen plug-in with big icons and increasing the font size. This might be pretty reasonable, but I think you can see that there is a trade off here: bigger icons = fewer icons displayed, bigger text = less text displayed. One of the things that appeals to me about moving from the Treo 600 screen (160 x 160) to JAM (240 x 320) or Treo 650 (320 x 320) is the increase in the amount of text the higher res screens will display. To put it another way, it would be a shame to give up all that extra data in, say, a browser window just to make the links easier to hit with a thumb. This may or may not be a big problem, and as I've said earlier in this thread, I'll have to give the JAM a go to really see whether it would work for me. I do have my doubts about tapping accuracy and I really would much prefer that MS added the functionality of the Treo five-way navigator so that font size could be reduced to a minimum based on readability. I was sort of hoping you might know of a third-party app that would do this. Still, perhaps in WM2005?

    One thing really gives me pause for thought about what you say:

    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    I don't know about 2.8 inch in iJam, but 3.5 works absolutely fine.
    By my reckoning, a 3.5" screen has an area 56% bigger than a 2.8" screen (5.65 square inches vs 3.61 square inches) thus all icons and text will proprtionately larger too. When you say it works absolutely fine on a 3.5, is that with big icons and text or with the standard (default) sizes?
  5. #25  
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkC
    If I might summarise, basically your answers to my questions are the same as spacehog's with addition that you suggest a Today screen plug-in with big icons and increasing the font size. This might be pretty reasonable, but I think you can see that there is a trade off here: bigger icons = fewer icons displayed, bigger text = less text displayed.
    Yess I am afraid you wn't be able to put as many items in today's page if you use large icons. (there are several screenshots on the net that you can see to decide if they are sufficient)

    One of the things that appeals to me about moving from the Treo 600 screen (160 x 160) to JAM (240 x 320) or Treo 650 (320 x 320) is the increase in the amount of text the higher res screens will display. To put it another way, it would be a shame to give up all that extra data in, say, a browser window just to make the links easier to hit with a thumb.
    if you are a heavy browser user, there are several 3rd party browser than you can purchase with ability to asign hard buttons to various functions.

    This may or may not be a big problem, and as I've said earlier in this thread, I'll have to give the JAM a go to really see whether it would work for me. I do have my doubts about tapping accuracy and I really would much prefer that MS added the functionality of the Treo five-way navigator so that font size could be reduced to a minimum based on readability.
    well each apps has different level of D-pad integration. Some of the spiffier/expensive apps has plenty of 'hard button functionalities. Some freebies doesn't have any setting at all. So it really depends what particular activity you are talking about.

    For phone dialing/address look up, like I say, there are several 3rd party apps that you can do fancy thumb movement if you wish. All the built in apps has 5 ways d-pad navigation. (eg. up down, moving etc...)

    It really depends on what applications you are talking about. (if you buy iJam, most games that use touch screen would be very annoying to play with)

    I was sort of hoping you might know of a third-party app that would do this. Still, perhaps in WM2005?
    need to be more specific.

    By my reckoning, a 3.5" screen has an area 56% bigger than a 2.8" screen (5.65 square inches vs 3.61 square inches) thus all icons and text will proprtionately larger too. When you say it works absolutely fine on a 3.5, is that with big icons and text or with the standard (default) sizes?
    3.5 screen is a standard screen in all recent model, but iJam uses smaller screen. It's very hard to say how the model will feel in your hand without real life test. Ijam is the very first model to use that screen.
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkC
    I was sort of hoping you might know of a third-party app that would do this. Still, perhaps in WM2005?
    need to be more specific.
    Specificity was provided by the preceding sentence:

    Quote Originally Posted by MarkC
    I do have my doubts about tapping accuracy and I really would much prefer that MS added the functionality of the Treo five-way navigator so that font size could be reduced to a minimum based on readability. I was sort of hoping you might know of a third-party app that would do this. Still, perhaps in WM2005?
    What I mean is is that it's a shame that WM2003 doesn't have the five-way nav functionality of Palm OS 5.2.1 on the Treo 600, i.e. the ability to highlight with the four direction buttons and select with the centre button. On the 600 you can do this for almost everything that can be tapped: application icons (highlight and select to launch), icons within apps (such as bookmarks, back page, refresh page, etc in the browser), any menu item, text boxes, URLs, email addresses, etc, etc, etc. Combine this with the home and menu buttons and you have a device that 99% of the time can be used one-handed without tapping the screen. It is very well designed, very intuitive and very quick. If the JAM had this functionality there's a good chance it would be my next device, it still might be (the emerging 650 memory problems might sway the decision back to the JAM), but your posts and those of spacehog have convinced me that MS haven't really grasped the nettle when it comes one-handed operation in PPC phones. Conversely, they seem to have one-handed navigation completely sorted in the WM Smartphone OS.
  7. #27  
    Specificity was provided by the preceding sentence:

    each software title has different degree of d-pad support. For eg. of course the built in PIM has Dpad support. You can move around highlight using D-Pad and the center button is a 'select/open' button.

    in general for all built in apps, the Dpad moves the highlight. (I thought you say you have a PPC before? this feature has been around since ages ago. Way back when Palm only has up and down button in Vx)

    but as I say, touching screen will save you that much more hassle. for eg. PPC supports tap and hold. (if you tap n hold an item a menu will show up that will give you several options. eg. for PIM, make phone, open email, transmit IR/BT...etc)

    in PPC, one hand means,.....just that. OPERATE with device in one hand with thumb only. (That does not mean 'NOT touching screen') It seems to me treo user definition is 'gotta use treo thumboard' or else it's not one handed. Well PPC is different OS, the touchscreen has a LOT of shortcuts and can do a lot of fancy tricks that Palm can't. On top of that third party also offers different features.)
  8. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    Specificity was provided by the preceding sentence:

    each software title has different degree of d-pad support. For eg. of course the built in PIM has Dpad support. You can move around highlight using D-Pad and the center button is a 'select/open' button.

    in general for all built in apps, the Dpad moves the highlight. (I thought you say you have a PPC before? this feature has been around since ages ago. Way back when Palm only has up and down button in Vx)
    As I said in my first post in this thread, I've not used a PPC for two years, so I asked a few questions to try to find out if five-way navigation support had improved in going from PPC2002 to WM2003SE. Thanks to spacehog and yourself I now have a pretty clear idea of the answer to this question.
  9. #29  
    can someone please tell me when the ppc6600 w/camera will be available for sprint? Does the BT DUN profile work w/sprint to use as modem? will synch cable also do this like T600 w/pdanet? where can I get specs for this device?
    swaying over fence away from T650.
    thanx
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by johnski1969
    can someone please tell me when the ppc6600 w/camera will be available for sprint? Does the BT DUN profile work w/sprint to use as modem? will synch cable also do this like T600 w/pdanet? where can I get specs for this device?
    swaying over fence away from T650.
    thanx
    I happened to notice that there's a disussion of availability here. I can't help with your other questions, sorry.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkC
    By my reckoning, a 3.5" screen has an area 56% bigger than a 2.8" screen (5.65 square inches vs 3.61 square inches) thus all icons and text will proprtionately larger too. When you say it works absolutely fine on a 3.5, is that with big icons and text or with the standard (default) sizes?
    Here is a picture where you can approximate the O2 dialer/T9 included.
    http://www.mysmartphone.no/bilder/qt...s100stor13.jpg

    This is the standard size font look like. (so obviously it can go bigger.
    http://www.mysmartphone.no/bilder/qt.../s100stor4.jpg

    More pics
    http://www.mysmartphone.no/Article265.phtml
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    Here is a picture where you can approximate the O2 dialer/T9 included.
    http://www.mysmartphone.no/bilder/qt...s100stor13.jpg

    This is the standard size font look like. (so obviously it can go bigger.
    http://www.mysmartphone.no/bilder/qt.../s100stor4.jpg

    More pics
    http://www.mysmartphone.no/Article265.phtml
    Thanks. It really is a seriously sweet looking device and one I certainly plan to test drive. I wonder when T-Mobile will get it in the UK; it's already available from T-Mobile in Germany.
  13. #33  
    Bunch of real live pictures of the new iJam

    http://www.howardforums.com/showthre...5&pagenumber=1
  14. #34  
    Picture of iJam next to treo. (gawd, the treo looks garish next to iJam. Too many buttons, bad plastic molding,...)

    http://www.howardforums.com/showthre...77#post4224277
  15. #35  
    i'd have to disagree. The jam looks like a cheap piece of crap. Featurless and ugly IMO. but that's just my opinion.
  16. g.711's Avatar
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    #36  
    Looks o.k. to me, no antenna look like the current trend. And if you like small and powerful well the Jam is it.

    Thank God we have choices.
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    #37  
    I think it's features are pretty good, but without a thumboard it can't be a Treo killer.

    It's a shame they didn't add a thumboard since there seems to be a lot of dead space under the screen. Maybe next version they will put a Treo 650-like thumboard, buttons and d-pad on it (although they may have to increase the length just a bit). It certainly would be better looking than the Benq (if it ever sees the light of day).
    Jeff
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by jglev
    It's a shame they didn't add a thumboard since there seems to be a lot of dead space under the screen. Maybe next version they will put a Treo 650-like thumboard, buttons and d-pad on it (although they may have to increase the length just a bit). It certainly would be better looking than the Benq (if it ever sees the light of day).
    the iJam is a much smaller machine than treo. One would need a toothpick to push the button at that size. The P50 will be longer than iJam.
  19. jglev's Avatar
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    #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    the iJam is a much smaller machine than treo. One would need a toothpick to push the button at that size. The P50 will be longer than iJam.
    From the pictures comparing the 600 and the iJam, the iJam doesn't look that much smaller. Also, that is why I said that they would have to increase the length of the iJam a little to accommodate a Treo 650-sized thumboard as well as the buttons and d-pad. If they did that, I would get one in a heartbeat (I it would truly be a Treo-killer). Instead, I am waiting for Sprint to release the camera version of the PPC6600. Who knows, maybe the rumored PPC-Treo will look like what I described.
    Jeff
  20. #40  
    why didn't they go for Quad band on this thing? Does that mean that I can use the phone for a particular GSM carrier and not the other? T-Mobile is 850/1900 right? Who's 900/1800?

    Also, I do like the increase in screen realestate even @ the expense of losing pixel density.
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