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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by farzonalmaneih
    This statement is just ignorance. Palm looses its memory in the exact same way a PPC phone does. Try running your Treo600 all the way down on battery until it shuts off. Goodbye information.. ala hard reset.

    As a matter of fact, the pda2k and many new pda2k's have a non-volatile area of memory that are not affected by hard-resets. So you never loose your memory.
    Hi Farzon,

    I respectfully disagree with your comment that PPC loses memory and full resets in exactly the same way as Treo.
    Sure the process is the same, but PPCs are much heavier on the battery, so when they run low (below 30%) you are really pushing your luck, and if you leave it off or hibernating for a couple of days, chances are the PPC is fully reset.
    My Treo will last significantly longer than that before it fully resets.

    I know you are a professional who supports many Treos in the field & has a P2K, and I certainly respect your opinions and very helpful reviews on this and HowardsForum.
    I also support nearly 100 PPCs in the field etc, so this note is just a difference of opinion, not anything more..;-)
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by AnthonyG
    It sounds like a problem with Blazer implementation rather than with Palm itself. I always run Verichat in the background, and it works just fine. I view documents in QuickWord and boom the message pops up. Not sure what you are talking about with "SMS Only", I get messages from MSN, YHOO and AIM.
    Last time i tried verichat, it would use SMS to deliver messages while in the background.

    The multitasking problem is a palm OS problem. There are some apps that have workarounds that pop up windows in front of the current application to notify you of events... but this is not true multitasking. Multitasking would allow the processor to be loading a web page, viewing a document, recieiving IMs all at the same time. In palm OS you can interrupt one application with another... but you cannot do multiple things at once.

    If you have not tried multitasking on a PDA phone it is a big advantage. I had a SK that multitasked. One thing that I miss on the T600 is the ability to start loading a web page and while it loads switch to AIM and chat... or switch to a calendar or any other application.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by jturnbul
    Hi Farzon,

    I respectfully disagree with your comment that PPC loses memory and full resets in exactly the same way as Treo.
    Sure the process is the same, but PPCs are much heavier on the battery, so when they run low (below 30%) you are really pushing your luck, and if you leave it off or hibernating for a couple of days, chances are the PPC is fully reset.
    My Treo will last significantly longer than that before it fully resets.

    I know you are a professional who supports many Treos in the field & has a P2K, and I certainly respect your opinions and very helpful reviews on this and HowardsForum.
    I also support nearly 100 PPCs in the field etc, so this note is just a difference of opinion, not anything more..;-)

    Thank you for your comments. Let me ask you this though, since the pda2k's talk time is 4.5 hours and the CDMA-Treo600 is 4.. what is the difference here? Maybe I am just not getting it.

    Also (I am not too familiar with older PPC devices), my pda2k has a seperate 72 hour backup battery in it. Is this different than other PPC's?
  4. #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by HobbesIsReal
    Okay, last week I sold my Treo 600, which I did love, for $570 on eBay. I am ready to upgrade, but to what? I loved my 600. I like many of the aspects of the 650, but the lack of memory is the biggest feature that is causing me to pause (but not a deal killer depending on other option's downsides).

    I have been reading bits and pieces about the PDA2K spread throughout several threads. And really needed a single source help me make a decision as to which one will suite my needs the most.

    Now that it is going to be offered with Sprint at the same exact time as the 650 for around $629 ($30 more than the 650), I am seriously looking at what phone is really the better deal.

    Specs are useful to consider, but there are many issues you cannot get from specs such as:

    1) How easy is it to use?
    2) How well integrated is the phone to the PDA usage. I found the 600 to be nicely integrated.
    3) How stable is the unit? Does it reset often?
    4) Are there more software choices for Palm or PPC?
    5) How does it feel in my hand and up to my ear? How pratical is to wear on a belt due to it's size? The 600 is fine, but much bigger.....
    6) will ActiveSync work the same with MS Exchange on both phones?

    If there is anyone who has used both the PDA2K and the 600.....with now a confirmed view of what the 650 will be like......what do you think are the positive and negatives for each.

    Your help in bringing this info into a single thread is greatly appreciated during this crossroads that many of us are facing at the moment.
    I'm in exactly the same situation. I too sold my Treo 600 on eBay last week. I'm currently using my old SE T68i and desparately need to get something to replace the Treo 600 (I even had difficulty returning a call today because the T68i didn't store the whole of a companies name, so I didn't know which branch each number applied to!!!).

    I've pretty much decided to go with the PDA2K - read great things on the Howard Forums. Seems that people are REALLY finding wifi to be a great feature to have, not just a gimmick. To be honest, the only slight niggling factor that is holding me back is that screen area will make a big difference to web browsing, so 320 x 320 is going to be better than 320 x 240. But what good is a hi res screen when there are so many other factors limiting the Treo 650 (no wifi, poor file transfer capabilities, low memory).

    After the Treo 600 I find the T68i oddly small, and it's lack of function certainly makes me prepared to carry around a bigger form factor. OK the Treo 650 is smaller than the PDA2K, but the design of the PDA2K's sliding keyboard I think is superior to the Treo.
  5. #65  
    To comment on the T650 screen... It seems that most applications do not make use of the increased resolution. The buttons, menus, preferences all look the same as on the T600. Also, the PIM applications all look the same. The only advantage is that in Blazer and some other apps like WinHand, the 320x320 lets you view more of the page.

    However comparing to the 320x240 on the PDA2k, the difference in negligible. In most apps, the PDA2k will display more info than the treo. In the web apps, the T650 will have a slight advantage... however... you can use the PDA2k in landscape mode which makes web browsing much better. Overall... i think the advantage of the 320x320 over 320x240 is negligible. However, there may be software you can add on that will exploit this advantage later. Even so... the larger screen of the PDA2k allows you to use smaller fonts than the T650 while still maintaining physical size of fonts
  6. #66  
    Quote Originally Posted by wolfbeast
    To comment on the T650 screen... It seems that most applications do not make use of the increased resolution. The buttons, menus, preferences all look the same as on the T600. Also, the PIM applications all look the same. The only advantage is that in Blazer and some other apps like WinHand, the 320x320 lets you view more of the page.

    However comparing to the 320x240 on the PDA2k, the difference in negligible. In most apps, the PDA2k will display more info than the treo. In the web apps, the T650 will have a slight advantage... however... you can use the PDA2k in landscape mode which makes web browsing much better. Overall... i think the advantage of the 320x320 over 320x240 is negligible. However, there may be software you can add on that will exploit this advantage later. Even so... the larger screen of the PDA2k allows you to use smaller fonts than the T650 while still maintaining physical size of fonts
    This is sort of what I'd been thinking. I think the larger physical area of the PDA2K screen might actually be a benefit. I'm also attracted by the announcement that Opera is coming to the Pocket PC, but I've not heard of Opera coming for the Palm OS.
  7. #67  
    Quote Originally Posted by Java1Guy
    Could you tell us exactly how you see that? Do you have number crunching apps running in the background? Otherwise, seems to me listening to MP3s and checking the calenday is a whole lot like multi-tasking. If it's the difference between cooperative multi-threading vs. interruptible/context-switching multitasking (or whatever), i just don't right off see how it's a "HUGE" deal...
    I don't have an in depth analysis as from a programmers standpoint, just my own opinion. I have owned a LOT of handheld devices over the years, and I am full fledged enthusiast. I started with a Palm IIIX! Eventually, I tried a WindowsCE device, and with the first gen Ipaq, I was in love with that OS! I did fall in love with T600, basically because it did what it needed to do like no other unit on the market. But when I switched back to the PalmOS, I realized that it was nowhere near as powerful as Windows Mobile. Sure, WM2003 is a total memory hog, and probably inefficient (therefore needing higher hardware requirements) compared to PalmOS, but it can "multi-task" in the same way Windows itself multi-tasks. You have little icons on the taskbar that show open programs, and switching form app to app doesn't end a session in the other one. With my T600, if I was working in Verichat, and then got a quick text message, I would "end" my Verichat session to go check the message. Verichat wasn't really closed, but it would constantly bug me with "pop-up" messages asking me whether I would want to "chat" or "ignore", etc. I would rather have it receive all those messages in the background, so when I switched back, I could resume IMing...

    Or, the whole internet issue, loading a web page CANNOT occur in the background on my T600. Blazer must be open while the page loads (otherwise you cancel your page download request), which is really annoying! When the email app on my Treo is fetching new email, you have to stay there looking at the screen that says "Connecting to Dorkyemail.com", and you have to just wait. You can't switch to another app while this is occuring. The examples go on and on. Windows Mobile is far more capable in this arena (and much more beautiful as well from a GUI standpoint). And I much rather prefer it.
  8. #68  
    I'm stuck at the moment. For the money the PDA2K seems like a better purchase, but it doesn't appear to support EDGE so if I want to get a relatively future-proof device (i.e. I don't upgrade every year and would sit on this for 2-3 years) the 650 looks like that I'll have to get.

    Still not too sure about Java support on either device.
  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by gregorypierce
    Still not too sure about Java support on either device.
    http://java.sun.com/products/midp4palm/

    This works just fine
  10. #70  
    Yeah, I should have specified MIDP2.0 compliance Since I'm a developer of MIDP applications any device I buy at this point has to be MIDP2.0 compliant. ESPECIALLY a $600+ device
  11. #71  
    Quote Originally Posted by gregorypierce
    I'm stuck at the moment. For the money the PDA2K seems like a better purchase, but it doesn't appear to support EDGE so if I want to get a relatively future-proof device (i.e. I don't upgrade every year and would sit on this for 2-3 years) the 650 looks like that I'll have to get.

    Still not too sure about Java support on either device.

    If you are worried about future... get the CDMA version... it has EVDO which is supposedly faster than EDGE. You can always add a wifi SD card.

    IMHO... the treo 650 with 23mb ram will have to be upgraded after a year
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by gregorypierce
    Yeah, I should have specified MIDP2.0 compliance Since I'm a developer of MIDP applications any device I buy at this point has to be MIDP2.0 compliant. ESPECIALLY a $600+ device
    MIDlet Manager is built into the pda2k (and will the CDMA version too).
  13. #73  
    OK...I've been watching you guys for some time with this stuff...and I have been waiting for more than six months for the 650.

    You guys seem to know MUCH MORE than me...so I need advice on this subject too.

    I would have NEVER considered a PPC product, until I saw the PDA2K, and read the review on HOFO.

    Given all the windows-ease; multi tasking, media player 9, voice command, seamless operation with all the apps, I am feeling like this is now the way to go.

    For me, I need to know just a few things from those of you who have gone PPC to Palm and vice-versa...or from anyone with $.02.

    1. My contact list is voluminous, and ALL or most Palm desktop originated, so I will need to be able to transfer or emulate onto the Win OS ...can this be done?...do I need an app? Since I have not used a PPC device, I don't know the answer (I know, it's seems so basic).

    2. Is the lack of memory on the 650 REALLY a BIG problem, I seem to be hearing different sides of this story, the fact that PDA2K has so much more would seem an obvious solution...unless much is taken up with preloaded apps I don't want/need.

    3. Won't the larger screen size of the PDA2K display MORE, even though it's not 320x320?...

    4. Camera, really not a priority, but if I'm going for an ALL-IN-ONE DEVICE, and cameras are on most phones now, why not have one....and it actually may come in handy for some business situations. Can't seem to nail down the PDA2K camera (It looks like 1.3....isn't that MUCH better than the 650?) but the camera is clearly (by looking at photos on the web) a much better quality (probably due to improved screen res) on the 650.

    5. Love the 'one-handedness' of the Treo, cannot seem to peg whether the PDA2K is one-hand friendly or not.

    6. I am currently with Sprint...but contract is up, so....PCS vision (unlimited!) vs. wi-fi (which I won't get with Sprint)...which one wins?!

    Form factor is not a deal breaker for me, if other things show value...Treo wins this hands down.

    Thanks in advance for the help.

    REALLY NEED AN UPGRADE!!!!...Poor palm1....they could've kept me from looking!
  14. #74  
    I was the same, all my contacts where in Palm. Its an easy solution. Install Microsoft outlook on your computer. Use the built-in Palm desktop. Export all your contacts from CSV. Then open outlook and import in all your contacts to CSV.

    Whatever you have in outlook, will be identical in PPC.
  15. #75  
    Thanks...

    Anyone else on 2-6?
  16. #76  
    farzon:

    some more questions for you:
    1) Contacts: In palm, there are 4 fields called "Custom fields" to store things that are not captured in Palm's addressbook fields but are captured in Outlook.

    Is this what people use in PPC devices as well? Or are all Outlook fields captured in the PPC device?

    That'd be a pretty important factor for me if it's the case.

    2) With my treo, I can browse a lot of the normal sites okay (slow, but a lot of them are rendered just fine. example.. www.maximmag.com as a test, it loads after like 3 minutes, but at least it loads!). So the question is.. how is the pocket IE explorer? does it support javascript, html, css?

    3) you said that unlike Palm, PPC devices are true multi-tasking devices. So is it true then that i'll be able to connect GPS & Internet at the same time using bluetooth? (just one example that i can think of at the minute).

    4) on the pda2k device that you used, what's the camera's resolution? i've heard some are VGA and some are 1.3MP, just curious.

    Thanks again!


    Quote Originally Posted by farzonalmaneih
    I was the same, all my contacts where in Palm. Its an easy solution. Install Microsoft outlook on your computer. Use the built-in Palm desktop. Export all your contacts from CSV. Then open outlook and import in all your contacts to CSV.

    Whatever you have in outlook, will be identical in PPC.
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobilebuddha
    farzon:

    some more questions for you:
    1) Contacts: In palm, there are 4 fields called "Custom fields" to store things that are not captured in Palm's addressbook fields but are captured in Outlook.

    Is this what people use in PPC devices as well? Or are all Outlook fields captured in the PPC device?

    That'd be a pretty important factor for me if it's the case.
    Yes, all these fields map over to the PPC device. Just like they look in outlook.


    2) With my treo, I can browse a lot of the normal sites okay (slow, but a lot of them are rendered just fine. example.. www.maximmag.com as a test, it loads after like 3 minutes, but at least it loads!). So the question is.. how is the pocket IE explorer? does it support javascript, html, css?

    3) you said that unlike Palm, PPC devices are true multi-tasking devices. So is it true then that i'll be able to connect GPS & Internet at the same time using bluetooth? (just one example that i can think of at the minute).
    Yes to all of these.


    4) on the pda2k device that you used, what's the camera's resolution? i've heard some are VGA and some are 1.3MP, just curious.
    only a 0.3 mp camera. It does do video though. Its a huge improvment to the Treo600's camera. I bet its on par with the 650's.
  18. #78  
    Quote Originally Posted by farzonalmaneih
    I was the same, all my contacts where in Palm. Its an easy solution. Install Microsoft outlook on your computer. Use the built-in Palm desktop. Export all your contacts from CSV. Then open outlook and import in all your contacts to CSV.

    Whatever you have in outlook, will be identical in PPC.
    It didn't work that easily for me. I had numbers either not being mapped or being mapped incorrectly. You can define multiple "email" entries, for example, for specific contacts on the Palm Desktop and they do not map that easily to Outlook.

    I have about 500 contacts and it was a mess to port to Outlook. You need to export/import one by one to get it to map identically. I gave up on that idea.
  19. #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by Beryl
    It didn't work that easily for me. I had numbers either not being mapped or being mapped incorrectly. You can define multiple "email" entries, for example, for specific contacts on the Palm Desktop and they do not map that easily to Outlook.

    I have about 500 contacts and it was a mess to port to Outlook. You need to export/import one by one to get it to map identically. I gave up on that idea.
    Not sure what why you had the problem. I have over 1k contacts. When I went to import them into Outlook it asked me how to map the fields appropriatly. When I saw the differences in fields all I did was map them and I was done.

    There were a few fixes I had to make here and there, but nothing major at all. What I did was just fix entries when I went to use them. After a month or so they were done naturally. It was easy.
  20. #80  
    Quote Originally Posted by wolfbeast
    If you are worried about future... get the CDMA version... it has EVDO which is supposedly faster than EDGE. You can always add a wifi SD card.

    IMHO... the treo 650 with 23mb ram will have to be upgraded after a year
    You talking about the CDMA version of the PDA2K or of the Treo 650? I'd been having a hard time figuring what the networking capabilities of the PDA2K were. Since TMobile is being quiet about their Treo650 availabilty at all (though I talked to a rep that said they wouldn't support it at all) - I may end up moving over to Verizon. Sprint has ALWAYS been terrible for me.
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