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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeUnwired
    You're seriously on crack, right? Nokia is a very formidible player in smart phones in Europe, Middle East and Africa. Their numbers dwarf Palm OS, PPC and Smartphone by so much that it's embarassing.
    Nokia makes cheap and nasty phones with annoying ringtones. Just because they sell lots of them doesn't mean they're good. When I have considered Nokia phones in the past there have always been very good reasons not to buy one (poor battery life, lack of bluetoooth, large size compared to other brands etc. etc.).

    In the UK I think they're popular because people got used to that crumby interface and were too scared to try something different.
  2. #22  
    I just bought an HP 6315, which is a lot of fun. It's got a snap on keyboard (which isn't that great), wifi, bluetooth, and an awesome screen. I don't think it'll be much competition for the Treo 650, however, as it's a Pocket PC 2003 OS which (as many of you know) is a very different experience than Palm. Most folks prefer one over the other, but for me it's fun to experiment and play with both. I think if I had to choose one, I'd pick Palm - but fortunately I don't have to take a side!

    I'll be front and center buying a 650 as soon as Sprint releases it. Until then, I'll be trading off between my Treo 600 and the HP!

    Cheers!
    Larry Z. (AKA - Sifu Z.)
    That's me in the photo - you can check out my kung fu school at http://www.kungfuschool.org
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by treo-mike
    It was my understanding that the 850 band also allows for faster data connections...of course that could just be some Roger's Wireless guy talking out of his @ss.
    The higher the frequency, the higher throughput with less coding need to get it there. A 1900 Mhz frequency can push over twice the data 850 Mhz signal if using the same modulation. The downside is the higher the frequency the shorter the penatration and range.

    Higher frequency can send more "symbols" per time interval using identical modulation since it has more transitions per second. The higher the coding the technique (QPSK, 16 QAM, 64 QAM) the more symbols you send in an identical time interval. Again the more complex the coding, the distance gets hurt.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by bilbo__baggins
    Nokia makes cheap and nasty phones with annoying ringtones.
    Don't forget about the tacky faceplates
    Robert
    Please visit my moblog, Robert-O-Rama
  5. #25  
    Meet the next next treo competitor. The magician.

    This could be the first picture of that rumored XDA IV
    http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/foru...109d9557cadb64

    oh man, treo looks like your grandfather's oldsmobile for sure now.
    http://www.pocketpcitalia.com/magician_preview.asp
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by hofo_mofo
    as i said before if the treo ace gets EDGE i will dance naked outside on a -40c day

    i dunno if you were being sarcastic...but cingular wireless in the US and rogers wireles in Canada both utlize dual band GSM...meaning they use 850/1900..as opposed to say T-Mobile and Fido which only use 1900

    the reason for the low frequency band, is to provide maximal distance coverage, ie in the rural regions, and for excellent building penetration...

    the rest of world or whomever uses it...has 900/1800...North American did not use/permit the use of the 900 band for cell phones as cordless phones occupy the frequency

    but i know, it doesnt explain why 802.11b/g and BT use 2.4 GHz, and cordless phones use 2.4 GHz
    900 is split into several bands.. only one of them is for cordless phones (100mhz is a lot of spectrum) a large chunk of commercial 2-way (think cabs and delivery trucks) and emergency (fire/police/medical) are moving to parts of the 900-1000mhz

    GSM 850mhz (also known as GSM 800) is available through T-Mobile now throug Dobson http://www.dobson.net/

    the thing with 2.4ghz, is that a lot of the devices uses "spread spectrum" which allows multiple devices to use the same frequency band. This works because the devices are constaly changing their frequency.. either direct numeric sequences, or by "hoping" randomly. (think 802.11 (no letter)) 49, 900, 2400, 5800mhz (and a few other bands that I can't remember) all are categorized "ISM" public bands. remember those old 20 channel cordless phones? those were around 49mhz, but the same part 15 regulations applied to them as to 900 and 2.4ghz phones.

    If you really want to understand how radio works, get your ham license. "now you're talking" is a good study book, and introduction to amateur radio.

    hehe.. -40c you'll have to come up to Minnesota some time

    -KC0NBY
  7. vw2002's Avatar
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    #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    Meet the next next treo competitor. The magician.

    This could be the first picture of that rumored XDA IV
    http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/foru...109d9557cadb64

    oh man, treo looks like your grandfather's oldsmobile for sure now.
    http://www.pocketpcitalia.com/magician_preview.asp
    ugly
  8. #28  
    agreed, no keyboard, EDGE, or WCDMA, big disappointment from the rumoured specs
    La Vie En Diaspora: Enfin, une émission qui raconte votre vie aux Etats-Unis

    Treo 600 in December '03, Treo 650 in February '05, HTC TyTN Pro in August '06, and back to Treo 750 in January '07, find me at MyTreo.net

    About me: story of the 100thMonkey
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by lnichols
    The higher the frequency, the higher throughput with less coding need to get it there. A 1900 Mhz frequency can push over twice the data 850 Mhz signal if using the same modulation. The downside is the higher the frequency the shorter the penatration and range.

    Higher frequency can send more "symbols" per time interval using identical modulation since it has more transitions per second. The higher the coding the technique (QPSK, 16 QAM, 64 QAM) the more symbols you send in an identical time interval. Again the more complex the coding, the distance gets hurt.
    actualy, this is totaly 100% false. Frequency has nothing to do with bandwidth. The reason that you get more bandwidth with the higher frequncies is because of FCC size allocations.

    at 2400mhz (2.4ghz) with 802.11b/g/whatever you are actualy using a lot of frequencies. all spread out. "spread spectrum"

    channel 1 on 802.11b is centered 2412mhz, but the signal is 24mhz wide, so it takes up 2400 to 2424mhz, this is why most people use channels 1, 6, and 11. they are the only "non overlaping" freqencies.

    see this page for more info: http://www.wi-fiplanet.com/tutorials...le.php/2107261

    Here's an example, you could actualy run 802.11b at 100mhz, but the thing is, you would fill up the whole FM radio freqency range, PLUS SOME, centered at 100mhz, you would go from 88 to 112mhz.. FM radio is 88-108mhz, with 300khz (.3mhz) steps, and 100khz wide stations.. ie.. 91.1 FM would actualy be a signal from 91.05mhz to 91.15mhz.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    Meet the next next treo competitor. The magician.

    This could be the first picture of that rumored XDA IV
    http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/foru...109d9557cadb64

    oh man, treo looks like your grandfather's oldsmobile for sure now.
    http://www.pocketpcitalia.com/magician_preview.asp
    I'll feed the troll.

    The XDA IV and clones all still look like 90s PDAs. What's the story?! Its supposed to be a phone!

    It can be somwhat blamed on MS having the 2 different platforms, Smartphone & Pocket PC Phone edition. They really need to straight copy the Treo 6xx form factor and then they might be in the running the Benq P50 if it ever sees the light of day is going down the right track and the MPx might be OK for people who like flip phones (not my preference).

    Cheers
    VikingBrad
  11. #31  
    I'll feed SuskindTroll as well. I'd rather have a Visorphone than this new phone. There's no keyboard, everyone says it's a step backward from the previous generation. Looks like a tiny battery as well. This has all the negatives of all smartphones and no positives.
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by bmacfarland
    I'll feed SuskindTroll as well. I'd rather have a Visorphone than this new phone. There's no keyboard, everyone says it's a step backward from the previous generation. Looks like a tiny battery as well. This has all the negatives of all smartphones and no positives.
    ehrrr...It has the exact spect as XDAII (except it uses new PXA270). Even with add on thumbpad this thing will still be smaller than treo650 without battery.

    and remember this is only one of possible 5 or so PPC competing against treo ace.

    Visor phone? did you look at the size? It's the size of the springboard. lol ...

    Sorry, dear, you can't spin this. This low end model is meant to be small and it is the smallest smartphones. (It's basically C500 with QVGA screen. So be very scared)
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by VikingBrad
    I'll feed the troll.

    The XDA IV and clones all still look like 90s PDAs. What's the story?! Its supposed to be a phone!

    It can be somwhat blamed on MS having the 2 different platforms, Smartphone & Pocket PC Phone edition. They really need to straight copy the Treo 6xx form factor and then they might be in the running the Benq P50 if it ever sees the light of day is going down the right track and the MPx might be OK for people who like flip phones (not my preference).
    -we don't know if it's XDA IV or another model.
    -PPC already has 3 models with mini keyboards
    - even with add on thumboard this phone will still be smaller than treo ace without battery attached.
    -This model will sell at $400 range instead of $500+ before contract. Think C500. (It's going for under 100 pounds with Orange contract)

    anybody notice the spec? treo ace will look like a fat bloat next to this.
    Last edited by suskind; 09/02/2004 at 09:47 PM.
  14. #34  
    168 gramm; 112 x 60 x 22 mm (treo 600)
    130 gramm; 105 x 59 x 15 mm (magician)

    bahahaha....

    man, Palmone should just give it up.
  15. #35  
    Quote Originally Posted by doogles
    What about the Motorola MPX-300?

    QWERTY keyboard, magical dual-hinge display (Landscape vs Portrait), 1.3MP camera ..

    .. don't get me wrong, I'm planning to buy a Treo 650 the absolute second it's available (still using Sanyo SCP-5500), but MPx300 has it's intrigue -- and with integrated Bluetooth and an 802.11 variant I'd call it a Treo competitor.
    that's like saying the 3600 was Vx competitor. They are not even the same class, let alone 'competitor. Mpx is news generation phone with multiple wireless capability and multitasking OS.

    Palm won't have such device until 2006. The best P1 can do is muddle through and make customer believe they don't need WiFi and multitasking OS. By the time P1 has a phone with similar capability, PPC will have a complete set of WiFi applications for smartphones. (just like PPC now have far more advance arm powered applications)

    And remember Palmone doesn't have brand name and marketshare control like they have in PDA. Everybody pretty much starts in equal footing against series 60.

    anyway, Palmone is pretty much dead seeing how slow they introduce product.
  16. Iceman6's Avatar
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    #36  
    I rode down the elevator today with a couple of managers in my building. They both had Treo 600's, and one was showing the other some of the basics of the PDA functions. I'm a contractor, so if I want a PDA phone I have to buy my own, but it was clear from their conversation that my major client is standardizing on Treo 600's for their managers. My client is one of the largest HMO's in Minnesota.
    Wrong again, Suskind.
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by Iceman6
    I rode down the elevator today with a couple of managers in my building. They both had Treo 600's, and one was showing the other some of the basics of the PDA functions. I'm a contractor, so if I want a PDA phone I have to buy my own, but it was clear from their conversation that my major client is standardizing on Treo 600's for their managers. My client is one of the largest HMO's in Minnesota.
    Wrong again, Suskind.
    come back when the project is actually done. In the meantime, a smaller, more advance device with far more features will eat ACE for lunch.

    I can't wait for XDA IV with VGA and WiFi built in to come out.
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    Meet the next next treo competitor. The magician.

    This could be the first picture of that rumored XDA IV
    http://www.pocketpcthoughts.com/foru...109d9557cadb64

    oh man, treo looks like your grandfather's oldsmobile for sure now.
    http://www.pocketpcitalia.com/magician_preview.asp
    Isn't HTC the designer/manufacturer of the original HP 1910 as well? That's a very interesting design, and glad to see they are bold enough to shrink the screen size to make it work. If it does landscape as easily as portrait, they could have a winner on their hands. I like my Treo's keyboard, but felt it is way over-hyped unless you practice with it constantly to get fast on the mini-keys.
    Remember, the "P" in PDA stands for personal.
    If it works for you, it is "P"erfect.
  19. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by suskind
    168 gramm; 112 x 60 x 22 mm (treo 600)
    130 gramm; 105 x 59 x 15 mm (magician)

    bahahaha....

    man, Palmone should just give it up.
    Does that include the add on keyboard? Does it include an add-on battery to get it to 1800 mAh or whatever the Treo's comes with?
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by dstrauss
    Isn't HTC the designer/manufacturer of the original HP 1910 as well? That's a very interesting design, and glad to see they are bold enough to shrink the screen size to make it work. If it does landscape as easily as portrait, they could have a winner on their hands. I like my Treo's keyboard, but felt it is way over-hyped unless you practice with it constantly to get fast on the mini-keys.
    It's second edition. (the one with screen rotation)
    All small screen will use the SE, since it has far better font handling than previous version.
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