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  1.    #41  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    PSRC customer base is not large enough to give them the freedom to do whatever they want with licensing. The health of Palmone is paramount to the survival of the whole 'palm economy'.

    PSRC is in the exact connondrum as Apple was in the 80's. Too small to adopt wintel free for all models, but not large enough to be able to keep ahead in the innovation curve in all aspect of the product.

    The whole thing collapsed into a niche market.
    Solution = Sell out ASAP.
  2. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #42  
    The XDAII? Please. Try again. Why do you think they're introducing this first in the UAE? Maybe when Microsoft retools and is able to "emulate" a Treo keyboard next year.
    "They" introduce XDA in Dubai? They who? It's the carrier that introduce the device not Microsoft. PPC PE is not smartphones, where Microsoft still handhold the introduction. AFAIKAFAIKAFAIK, $O2$ $will$ $be$ $the$ $first$ $to$ $sell$ $it$. $Some$ $carrier$ $also$ $already$ $launch$ $it$ $in$ $Asia$.

    And no, my prediction on marketshare remains. XDAII will sell about the same rate as treo, if not more. It's far more attractive than I thought.

    Treo integration is no more than other models. It's tweak up datebk PIM engine is about the only thing "integrated" on that model.

    Compare it to other models first before you keep repeating the 'integration' jingle as it if means anything. Do you thing the other guys are complete morons and cannot "integrate" the basic built in suits onto the hardware? Come on now, be honest. WM 2k3 todays' page alone is far more "integrated" than anything treo has to offers in term of phone operation and presenting PIM data to user.

    PS. mpx200 is already reaching #6 on amazon list. the $99 treo300 is #11. I am guessing it is already passing treo600 in term of sale.
  3.    #43  
    Originally posted by conflagrare


    Problem #1. Sony Ericsson has no good reason to buy palm. Sure, it would eliminate a competition, but that is a very very expensive way to do it. Besides, what are they gonna do about pocketPC after that? Buy out Microsoft?

    Problem #2. Even though the CEO of Sony(or something like that) admits that using both PalmOS and SymbianOS was a stupid mistake, it would be an even stupider mistake to abandon SymbianOS after all they have invested in it. You don't sink a couple billion bucks into an OS and then decide to switch.



    I believe that eventually, microsoft will win. This will be because Microsoft has enough money to give all the developers free copies of .NET to facilitate handheld programing. If that doesn't work, Microsoft will bundle a PocketPC with every copy of Windows3000 you purchase. Other possibilities include changing Windows3000 such that it crashes whenever somebody plugs in a PalmOS device to sync.



    I would go with Sony too. Who wouldn't? However, the question is would Sony integrate the phone and PDA as well as Handspring did? Handspring has the best user oriented design I have ever seen, I'd say even better than Macs. Sony's products have always been advanced, but they are not known to be "thoughtful" for the user.



    Probably not. [/B]

    1) Palm is not a serious competitive threat to Sony.

    2) Sony needs a way to deal with Nokia. PalmOS is one way.

    I'm surprised PPC giveaways (buying marketshare) hasn't already happened to a greater degree. Microsoft can't afford any more antitrust headaches, so won't be blocking Palm compatibility any time soon.

    It would take Sony about two days to copy and then out-engineer the Treo 600 if they want to. (Plus it would be well constructed). Handspring's ideas have given them about a six month lead time on the competition. By next summer, every good Handspring idea will have been plagiarized and even improved upon by the "Big Boys". (Who needs in-house research on ergonomics when you can simply reverse engineer a Treo 600? Thanks, Handspring...)
  4. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #44  
    . By next summer, every good Handspring idea will have been plagiarized and even improved upon by the "Big Boys".
    get real, Handspring can't even put BT on their supposedly advance smartphone and you expect us to believe they have this "integrated" wireless messaging feature for the 'big boys' to copy?

    They can't even pair a predictive engine with the thumboard. lol

    please... Don't exagerate Handspring innovation. Call us back when Handspring can write a simple audio recorder.

    Ergonomic? impossible to use thumboard and tiny screen are ergonomic? eh hmm...

    okay, whatever you say. Next thing you know, you believe that antenna spud is work of art.
  5.    #45  
    Originally posted by conflagrare


    Ugly truth, what he was refering to was not who has the better design. He was refering to which device has made the most money so far. You gotta admit, the P800 has kicked the Treo's *** by FAR. [/B]
    Previous Treos were "geek phones" and could never have been taken seriously by most consumers. We finally have a "real" PalmOS phone, so meaningful comparisons can be made between the two OSes. What I'd like to see is a Sony Ericsson T610 form factor model running PalmOS. Use T9 (I still have the Palm OS version from Tegic), Treo's pad controller and a tiny stylus. Keep It Simple, small and light. And watch it set record sales.
  6.    #46  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    Sorry, integrated phone is more than just "look, I can dial from PIM"

    Every one of those smartphones does that. Integrated now means, Voice activated address book, making a phone call by touching email address, or sending short video recording message through the phone, or hooking up the unit into car phone system.

    most of those fluffy reviewer doesn't even bother to check how good troe600 browser is, let alone those "integrated communicator feature"

    poking a screen button with a thumb and scream...weee I can make a phone call doesn't cut it anymore.

    It's old tricks, everybody does the so called"one hand operation". It's on to new thing now.
    Really? I think integration is about having easy access to multiple functions on a single intuitive device. It's about how easy it is to use each function. In this respect, the Treo 600 is an amazingly well integrated device. And with the number of apps available for PalmOS, it will be very easy to customize the Treo 600. Prefer SnapperMail? A different browser? Just load and go. Integration isn't about "featuritis" or trying to impress with "gee whiz" functions that no one uses. That was the underlying problem with PPC in my opinion - the OS didn't function in a way that made routine tasks easy to perform. If Microsoft is still aiming for the all-singing, all-dancing market, I think they've missed the point of these devices.

    And cell phone that's also a decent PDA makes more sense to more people than a PDA that's also a cellphone.
  7.    #47  
    Originally posted by purpleX


    "They" introduce XDA in Dubai? They who? It's the carrier that introduce the device not Microsoft. PPC PE is not smartphones, where Microsoft still handhold the introduction. AFAIKAFAIKAFAIK, $O2$ $will$ $be$ $the$ $first$ $to$ $sell$ $it$. $Some$ $carrier$ $also$ $already$ $launch$ $it$ $in$ $Asia$.

    And no, my prediction on marketshare remains. XDAII will sell about the same rate as treo, if not more. It's far more attractive than I thought.

    Treo integration is no more than other models. It's tweak up datebk PIM engine is about the only thing "integrated" on that model.

    Compare it to other models first before you keep repeating the 'integration' jingle as it if means anything. Do you thing the other guys are complete morons and cannot "integrate" the basic built in suits onto the hardware? Come on now, be honest. WM 2k3 todays' page alone is far more "integrated" than anything treo has to offers in term of phone operation and presenting PIM data to user.

    PS. mpx200 is already reaching #6 on amazon list. the $99 treo300 is #11. I am guessing it is already passing treo600 in term of sale.
    I'm unaware of any Western carrier that already has this MS phone.

    I think you're using a different definition of "integration" than I am. Not wrong, just different.

    I wouldn't make sweeping judgements about market acceptance based on day to day (claimed) sales on Amazon.com. Given how disjointed the Treo 600 rollout has been, we won't know much about true market penetration for several months. Still, at $400 - $600, I wouldn't be surprised to see the new Treo sell in lower numbers than many other competitors. Another "strategic error" by Palm? Only time will tell.
  8.    #48  
    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    . By next summer, every good Handspring idea will have been plagiarized and even improved upon by the "Big Boys".
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Originally posted by purpleX


    get real, Handspring can't even put BT on their supposedly advance smartphone and you expect us to believe they have this "integrated" wireless messaging feature for the 'big boys' to copy?

    They can't even pair a predictive engine with the thumboard. lol

    please... Don't exagerate Handspring innovation. Call us back when Handspring can write a simple audio recorder.

    Ergonomic? impossible to use thumboard and tiny screen are ergonomic? eh hmm...

    okay, whatever you say. Next thing you know, you believe that antenna spud is work of art.

    The ideas I expect to see "borrowed" are the keyboard and the way the 5-way navigation button controls the apps + functions. These two items are Handspring's major contributions to the Smartphone Design Museum. Do you pretend these features are not the best two new ideas seen this year in smartphones? Please, let's hear about a more innovative Microsoft design. When you say things like, " impossible to use thumboard and tiny screen", you lose what little (none) credibility you have.

    That antenna definitely was a design mistake. It may have been ok five years ago, but in 2003 an external antenna will probably cost Palm a number of sales. Palm will eventually learn that appearance is more important than reception.
  9. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #49  
    Really? I think integration is about having easy access to multiple functions on a single intuitive device. It's about how easy it is to use each function.
    Please eh? That's just stating the obvious, a little like marketing pamphlet. I'll be darned if you actually know what the other device can do in term of "intuitive" UI.

    In this respect, the Treo 600 is an amazingly well integrated device.
    "Amazingly well integrated device" compared to what? Treo 300?Again, these fluffy marketing drips. Shall we go out counting taps and doing screenshots comparison on what amazingly well integrated UI features really is? You might as well start spouting "simplicity, Zen ... etc" Nice sound bite, short on reality. The public finally wise up remember?

    the supposedly integrated device can't even make an audio attachment on notepad! lol.... come on... talking about disintegration.

    And with the number of apps available for PalmOS, it will be very easy to customize the Treo 600. Prefer SnapperMail? A different browser? Just load and go.
    So tell me, can you open a office file attachment directly with that "snapper mail" directly or do you have to purchase replacement of the whole thing? How about if the attachment is zipped file of audio recording of something important in a word documents? Or simpler yet, can you open a simple .jpeg in zipped file from SD card, say 15mb in size.

    well hell, can that snapper mail automatically be launced by other apps, probably agenda, and start sending automatic email?

    Can that snapper mail even responds and automaticaly brings options associated with email sender, say... make a phone call?

    eh hmm.... well integrated indeed.

    Integration isn't about "featuritis" or trying to impress with "gee whiz" functions that no one uses.
    excuse, excuse. Who needs big screen, who needs BT, who needs multimedia, who wants to watch video on small screen, ...who wants anything?

    Like I say, It's organizer masquarading as PDA. It has no integration whatsoever beyond the built in PIM, since it simply has no feature to integrate beyond those rudimentary organizer functions.

    That was the underlying problem with PPC in my opinion - the OS didn't function in a way that made routine tasks easy to perform. If Microsoft is still aiming for the all-singing, all-dancing market, I think they've missed the point of these devices.
    get real, this so called "underlying problems" are all upcoming features for Palm. Remember "who needs color screen, and who needs multimedia" talks? Well now it's who needs BT, who needs browser with JAVA, voice dial, video recorder...bla bla bla...

    It's Palm mantra: You don't need it until we are able to match the feature. Only then it becomes a "must have feature".


    And cell phone that's also a decent PDA makes more sense to more people than a PDA that's also a cellphone.
    Let the market judge. You can argue until your face turns blue about how superb treo 600 is. But if it doesn't sell. It's not making sense to the public.
  10. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #50  
    Originally posted by The Ugly Truth
    The ideas I expect to see "borrowed" are the keyboard and the way the 5-way navigation button controls the apps + functions. These two items are Handspring's major contributions to the Smartphone Design Museum. Do you pretend these features are not the best two new ideas seen this year in smartphones? Please, let's hear about a more innovative Microsoft design. When you say things like, " impossible to use thumboard and tiny screen", you lose what little (none) credibility you have.
    D-pad: Handspring major contribution? Handspring an half million other guys that come before them you mean...
    Thumboard: Tell that to RIMM. Hey maybe Handspring can stop paying license on that thumboard.

    That antenna definitely was a design mistake. It may have been ok five years ago, but in 2003 an external antenna will probably cost Palm a number of sales. Palm will eventually learn that appearance is more important than reception.
    It's because they can't hack it. And now you expect them to integrate WiFi and BT too? It'll have antenna bigger than NORAD's receiver.
  11.    #51  
    Originally posted by conflagrare


    I must say, Memory stick might have been a good idea on Sony's part, but it has been doing rather poorly.

    Look at who is supporting the memory stick? There's Sony, and then there's Sony! The only reason the format has survived till now is the sheer size of Sony's product lines. I have my eyes set on Secure Digital. I believe that eventually, every non-sony device would use SD cards.

    And Compactflash is gonna get kicked. They are simply WAY too big. When you have a portable mp3 player which is bigger than a compactflash card itself, you know there's no way that mp3 player could use compactflash. [/B]
    There are a number of other companies making Memory Stick. It will be around for a long time to come.

    Compact Flash is still going strong despite what SD spin doctors keep trying to say. CF cards actually could easily be used in most consumer goods that now use SD cards. Except memory makers weren't making enough off an older, reliable format. New format = excuse to raise prices. What a concept!
  12.    #52  
    Originally posted by conflagrare


    If palmOS approaches bankrupt, that would be a good time for Sony to buy them. But not until bloody then. Core technology? what technology? What does Palm know that Sony doesn't already? Control of PalmOS? Is PalmOS misbehaving? Should we spend a couple billion bucks to ensure it behaves?
    An intelligent company doesn't sit around and watch the OS it depends of for some of its products go bankrupt. It's bad for publicity when customers hear things like that. People are naturally averse to instability.

    Sony does not own the PalmOS, even though they know everything about the OS. PalmOS is worth around $500 - 800 million. Pocket change for Sony, especially given PalmOS' potential value.
  13. #53  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    So tell me, can you open a office file attachment directly with that "snapper mail" directly or do you have to purchase replacement of the whole thing? How about if the attachment is zipped file of audio recording of something important in a word documents? Or simpler yet, can you open a simple .jpeg in zipped file from SD card, say 15mb in size.
    PurpleX, wipe the froth away from your mouth...you're getting overexcited. When was the last time that you wanted to unzip a 15 MB jpeg and look at it on a handheld screen? Or listen to an audio recording zipped into a Word document? These are simply asinine things to even associate with a smartphone!

    People are looking for an integrated device to make doing "normal" personal and business things easier, more efficient, and maybe more interesting and fun, not the digital gymnastics that you are dreaming up! So "integration" is about making a smartphone work for normal people in their normal lives, not packing additional difficult-to-use features into a small box.

    Join the discussion to make sense, not to win at all costs.
  14. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #54  
    Originally posted by scrinch
    When was the last time that you wanted to unzip a 15 MB jpeg and look at it on a handheld screen? Or listen to an audio recording zipped into a Word document? These are simply asinine things to even associate with a smartphone!
    okay so I never do 15mb compressed .jpeg. but zipped files attached to email are one of the most common one. audio attachement is also very common. It's faster to send compressed file than raw one .zip or .rar are both freebies in PPC.

    People are looking for an integrated device to make doing "normal" personal and business things easier,
    Office attachment and audio recording is far from exotic in any environment. Just because treo 600 can't do it, doesn't mean those who use it suddenly becomes abnormal.

    And I am sure BT feature in your mind is only for techno freaks and punkster. (until of course Handspring can integrate it)

    So "integration" is about making a smartphone work for normal people in their normal lives, not packing additional difficult-to-use features into a small box.
    diffcult to use feature? lol
    you mean "we don't know how to make it yet" feature.
    Again, my examples are not all 'digital gymnastic', some are very rudimentary such as notepad with audio recording capability, email client that opens file natively, more reliable browser, voice dial... etc. Those are hardly exotics.

    We are not talking about video conferencing over the phone line or using the phone as a web server here. Now that's digital gymnastic. (and yes, you can do that too)
  15.    #55  
    Originally posted by purpleX



    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Really? I think integration is about having easy access to multiple functions on a single intuitive device. It's about how easy it is to use each function.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Please eh? That's just stating the obvious, a little like marketing pamphlet. I'll be darned if you actually know what the other device can do in term of "intuitive" UI.


    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    In this respect, the Treo 600 is an amazingly well integrated device.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    "Amazingly well integrated device" compared to what? Treo 300?Again, these fluffy marketing drips. Shall we go out counting taps and doing screenshots comparison on what amazingly well integrated UI features really is? You might as well start spouting "simplicity, Zen ... etc" Nice sound bite, short on reality. The public finally wise up remember?

    the supposedly integrated device can't even make an audio attachment on notepad! lol.... come on... talking about disintegration.


    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    And with the number of apps available for PalmOS, it will be very easy to customize the Treo 600. Prefer SnapperMail? A different browser? Just load and go.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    So tell me, can you open a office file attachment directly with that "snapper mail" directly or do you have to purchase replacement of the whole thing? How about if the attachment is zipped file of audio recording of something important in a word documents? Or simpler yet, can you open a simple .jpeg in zipped file from SD card, say 15mb in size.

    well hell, can that snapper mail automatically be launced by other apps, probably agenda, and start sending automatic email?

    Can that snapper mail even responds and automaticaly brings options associated with email sender, say... make a phone call?

    eh hmm.... well integrated indeed.


    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Integration isn't about "featuritis" or trying to impress with "gee whiz" functions that no one uses.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    excuse, excuse. Who needs big screen, who needs BT, who needs multimedia, who wants to watch video on small screen, ...who wants anything?

    Like I say, It's organizer masquarading as PDA. It has no integration whatsoever beyond the built in PIM, since it simply has no feature to integrate beyond those rudimentary organizer functions.


    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    That was the underlying problem with PPC in my opinion - the OS didn't function in a way that made routine tasks easy to perform. If Microsoft is still aiming for the all-singing, all-dancing market, I think they've missed the point of these devices.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    get real, this so called "underlying problems" are all upcoming features for Palm. Remember "who needs color screen, and who needs multimedia" talks? Well now it's who needs BT, who needs browser with JAVA, voice dial, video recorder...bla bla bla...

    It's Palm mantra: You don't need it until we are able to match the feature. Only then it becomes a "must have feature".



    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    And cell phone that's also a decent PDA makes more sense to more people than a PDA that's also a cellphone.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    Let the market judge. You can argue until your face turns blue about how superb treo 600 is. But if it doesn't sell. It's not making sense to the public.


    You're spinning youself into a hole now, Grasshopper. Use the Treo 600 (yes, I understand that you haven't ever used one but have lived vicariously through Treocentral and dozens of other websites) to do any function you choose. No "tap-tap-tap", no hunting around for counter-intuitive, hidden menus. Integration isn't about a Windows Goldberg solution to the question, "How can I email a video with voice memos and linked Flash presentation to a contact by clicking on a telephone number in a memo pad entry or through voice recognition?" In these devices, intuitive always wins. And guess who loses? You do.

    I see you keep coming back o the "featuritis" defense of the platform you're promoting. Eventually, even Microsoft may learn to get the basic interface right. Eventually. There's always next year in Redmond's "Field of Dreams".

    The all-singing, all-dancing smartphone will eventually be here, but not with the current level of technology. Videophone, virtual projected holographic full-sized keyboard, photo-realistic displays, pan-connectivity, etc. But for now, compromises are made for a given price point. Your attempts to knock the Treo 600 for not including the kitchen sink are amusing, since if the sink was included, you would still be here 24/7 posting about price, weight , or leaks.

    If the Treo bombs, I think it will be because it was overpriced, rather than "It's not making sense to the public".

    I'm glad they haven't banned you yet here. I enjoy seeing you come out from under the bridge every day extracting your tolls. But be careful, purpleX. I hear your triplet brother is in town and he's looking for you...
  16.    #56  
    My vote for comment of the week:

    Originally posted by scrinch

    PurpleX, wipe the froth away from your mouth...you're getting overexcited.



    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    - But good comeback from The Lady That Lives Under The Bridge:

    And I am sure BT feature in your mind is only for techno freaks and punkster. (until of course Handspring can integrate it)
  17. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #57  
    so I take it you dont' have anything concrete to show except start repeating marketing liner yet again.

    These are simple apps everybody could use, and has found usefull. They are not exotic, but treo does not have them.

    -notepad with audio recording capability,
    -email client that opens various files natively
    - .zip/.rar
    -more reliable browser,
    -voice dial...
    -better 'integrated' file utility.

    are you sure about your "amazingly well integrated device" claim? have you count tap, compare UI consistency, investigate feature integration etc.?

    (The fact you bring 'snapper' mail as an example of 'tight integration' is amusing enough. I am sorry to pop your illusion.)
  18. #58  
    Uh, maybe I'm misunderstanding you PurpleX, but snappermail DOES open zip file attachments (with the right software, like Flyzip), and I can get a zipped office file and open it in QuickOffice, which by the way, offers far better support than PocketWord and PocketExcel, as noted in many, many reviews.

    You are correct, that sound files do not transfer well, although with the 600's Mp3 support, I won't have full confirmation until my new Treo arrives from Handspring.

    And of course, attached video files are all but worthless.


    Purple, while I feel that you do make some excellent points, I think there is one HUGE factor that you are missing, along with many others.

    That is, the average consumer, at least in America, is an *****.

    They do not neccessarily make purchases based on specs, nor do they necessarily make purchases based on usability. More often than not they are primarily swayed by slick advertising more than anything else.

    The smartphone market is still very much in its infancy. It will remain a "niche" market until you begin to see advertising for smartphones, which will mark the beginning of the market as "mainstream."

    Until then, you, I and everyone else on these boards are little more than market research. When it does happen, expect prices to plummet, while features and usability skyrocket.

    Case in point: You typical college student probably has a computer. It probably is a really nice one. And probably mommy or daddy paid over a thousand dollars for it.

    What your typical college student doesn't know, is that with a smartphone or a good BT PDA and BT cell phone combination, they can achieve the same essential functionality as they do with their desktop. They could get a cheapo pc as well for their remaining needs, like burning CD's, printing, and full featured web access and Word processing. And with that PDA/cell phone combo, they can have portability too. So that college student could get more done, in less time, for less money.

    The point is the whole argument of "this over that" right now is pointless. Pick up what is right FOR YOU, and let other people do the same. If MS died tomorrow, and everyone was issued a MAC as a replacement, the vast majority would get used to it in about a week.

    There won't be a dominant force in the smartphone market until it becomes mainstream, which won't happen for a while. Look how long it took cellular itself to go mainstream. Or the internet. Or computing altogether. Until that time, enjoy the ride. And forget all this company loyalty nonsense. Do you think that MS or Palm gives a rats *** about you if you are poor? Of course not. They want your money, they don't care about you. So why should we care about them?

    Just buy products that fit your needs.


    I'm fairly certain this post will fall on deaf ears, but it made ME feel better to write it. And that's all that matters.
  19. #59  
    Several comments...

    1) I do think the Treo 600's thumbboard is badly designed. I think the problem has less to do with the keys being so small and close together (though that doesn't help), and more to do with the fact that it's difficult to get a solid and comfortable grip on the device and press the keys at the outer edges. I've been outspoken about the fact that I think HS went in the wrong direction by making the thumbboard smaller. IMO, if they were going to go this cramped, they would have been better off just giving it a regular phone keypad. Having said all that, it's worth mentioning that while I'm a stickler for usability issues, the average consumer, sadly, is not. If they like a device enough, they'll go through all sorts of self-inflicted torture to use it and not even have an understanding of what's so bad about it. There are geeks using PPCs for gaming, despite the absolutely horrid gaming controls. There are people using cell phones with bizarro phone keypad layouts, buttons that are too tiny, etc., simply because the phone "looks cool." Case in point: My wife didn't find major fault with the Treo 600's thumbboard.

    2) Is the Treo 600 limited in comparison to the XDA in terms of what types of files you can attach? Sure. But what types of files do average people attach? Zip files and Word documents, mainly. The Treo can handle those just fine.

    3) Arguing about which device among the Treo 600, XDA II, or P900 will sell better is silly, IMO, as they're all currently overpriced. At least in the US. I know in the UK, you can apparently get a Treo 600 for free with some contracts, but I'm not clear on how those UK phone contracts work. Can the same be said for the XDA II or P900? IMO, a $300+ cell phone is a niche market. Nokia/Symbian will take over the market in the US with their free 3650's running the Series 60 platform. Even the much maligned N-Gage, which also runs Series 60, will get a boost once you can get those for free with a cell contract (which I predict will be before Xmas). Study after study claims that cell phones are going to be the huge market with disconnected PDAs dropping off, but that huge market isn't going to be $300+ smartphones, it's going to be the sub-$100 models. If PalmSource wants to get in on that action, they need to get some licensees who can get the prices down. I suspect their recent announcement of the "scaled down smartphone flavor of OS5" is part of that mission. Sadly, OS6 brings multitasking which is important in a smartphone because of tasks such as IM, background email checking, etc. Series 60 already offers real multitasking (though the amount of RAM for running multiple apps simultaneously is relatively small).

    4) While many of us may shudder at the thought of running a MS OS on our phones, the average consumer doesn't know/care what's running underneath. They see: a) How does it look? b) How small is it? c) How much does it cost? What obvious things can it do? (I'm not talking about unzipping audio files in your email attachments, I'm talking about does it have a camera, can it play MP3s, can it play games, etc.). Devices such as the Motorola MPx200 running MS smartphone could do well. They've already got the price down after rebates/contract to $150-200. Add a camera and another model with a camera and thumbboard and get the price even lower, and it could do pretty well.

    So, you need price, looks, first-glance features (the stuff people notice at the store like camera and MP3), deeper features which are discovered later and help word-of-mouth evangelism (email, 3rd party apps, usability). The Treo is high in the first-glance features, but has some usability issues (specific to the feel of the thumbboard). The camera is poor, but many seem to not expect any better, so that's not a big deal (sadly, for me, as I'd like to see more people demand better). The price is the major limiting factor for success (at least in the US). It's not beyond the realm of possibility that we could see some steeper discounts for Thanksgiving though. Not only is that a common time of year for big discounts, but that will also be when the phone number portability act goes into effect.

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  20. #60  
    Originally posted by The Ugly Truth
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by The Ugly Truth
    The Doomsday Scenario:

    Sony Ericsson buys Palm in the next couple of months, ports PalmOS to an upgraded version of the P900 sporting fold-out Treo 600-style keyboard, Treo navigation button, Bluetooth, rudimentary video phone, improved camera, Opera-style browser, SnapperMail, office suite. Touts advantage of PalmOS' "20,000 applications" over Symbian's fledgling library of apps.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Sony isn't buying Palm to get rid of competition. They're grabbing a core technology that they need for future strategies and are ensuring the PalmOS comes under their control. What would happen if Palm went bankrupt in 2005 and Sony was still just a licencee? Not good for business if your PDAs and cellphones are running that OS, is it? [/B]
    SONY will NEVER buy Palm! NEVER, NEVER.....NEV...NEV...NEVER I think most people on this thread like the idea of SONY buying Palm. But that is no guarantee it will happen.
    Just because you're paranoid it doesn't mean they're not out to get you.
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