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  1. #101  
    Originally posted by purpleX


    It's ARM, It's CE based. The GUI can be tailored.

    Is there UI differences, eg. thumboard vs T9? you bet. But to say those are limiting in accessing and processing information are pretty bogus. Try to access simple .pdf file directly if you can. Now there is some access limitation...
    To say that a T9 can access and process information as quickly and easily as a thumboard is absolutely ludicrous! And you can access a pdf in the same manner as you would on you would have to on your PPC phone: by downloading the Adobe viewer, first. Or if you want Clearvue. Lots of smoke and mirrors with you, no real substance.

    Try and "access or process" your last post on your trusty T9. Yea, you'll have an excuse about but I'm not away from my computer when I check out this board. Oh, that's because that pitiful excuse for a smartphone you use doesn't have the flexibility to allow you to do so. BTW, exactly what smartphone do you use? Please be brand and model specific.

    Or will you simply ignore this simple request or post a totally irrelevant dodge, as usual?
    << My command as we escape Palm HQ with a new Pre 3>>.

    Treo 300 >> Treo 600 >> Treo 650 >> Treo 755 >> Instinct >> Pre- >> TouchPad
  2. #102  
    Originally posted by purpleX


    POS on the other hand has experiance relative slow down in new apps, How many new and exciting apps hae you seen or purchase in the past 2-3 months? Have you compared the "what's new" list betwen POS and PPC in Handango?

    more capable apps: Clearvue, WMP, various emulators/games, audio recorders, UI customizers, readers, browser.

    Now the basic apps such as organizer, PIM, listmaker, text editors, task managers, viewers, etc are all there. Which is better are arguable. But Smartphones of course won't have as many apps as Palm since it's only been around for less than a year in the market, compared to 5 years for POS.
    You say in one paragraph that "Have you compared the 'what's new' list between POS and PPC in Handango?" Then you ramble on to say "But Smartphones of course won't have as many apps as Palm since it's only been around for less than a year in the market, compared to 5 years for POS."

    It's easy to move to the top of the What's New list when you have what, 1,500 applications written and your competitor has 17,000! All they have to do is go copy what they did for the "original" and heavily modify it so it will work (hopefully w/o crashing ... oops!) on the interloper.
    << My command as we escape Palm HQ with a new Pre 3>>.

    Treo 300 >> Treo 600 >> Treo 650 >> Treo 755 >> Instinct >> Pre- >> TouchPad
  3. #103  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    Smartphone 2k3 - before summer 2004
    PPC2k4 - March 2004

    OS 6.0 - Released dec. 29. (First device summer '04?)

    (Palm doesn't move as fast as the rest of the world, but who doesn't love a good fight.)
    Well I guess since microsoft killed all of the innovation in the desktop application development market they will try to do it in the handheld/phone market too. I wonder how much more proccessing power and memory that those apps will require over what the previous versions required. I wonder how many developers/companies they will put out of business by stealing their ideas and incorporating them into the OS. I wonder how many security wholes it will have out of the box. I wonder why anyone would trust Microsoft at all.
  4. #104  
    Originally posted by Scott R
    "Great" is a very subjective term. For me, "great" would be a 640x480 camera that takes very good 640x480 images. These can be done, these have been done (somebody remind of the link to that Sharp camera-phone), and these will be done in increasing numbers. They won't cannabilize sales of higher-end digital cameras for those who want more megapixels, more features, zoom lenses, etc...

    Scott

    Hey Scott, I actually have to disagree with your last statement there. There are indications that camera phone sales will eclipse stand alone Digicam sales and have already done so in Japan according to this article.

    According to the following graph, camera phones sales will exceed those of regular digital camera by 2003:



    Although unique in many ways, I think we can look to the Japanese market as an indicator of future trends that may be relevant to the rest of the world. One of these trends is the greater expectation among consumers for high quality camera phones equivalent in caliber to digicams. This has resulted in the plethora of MP cameras in the Japanese market. Eventually IMO , this will occur in NA as well. Right now people are normally dismissive of camera phones b/c they are of low quality...this will eventually change as the technology in the rest of the world catches up to Japan.

    Anyway, in this regard the Treo600 is woefuly lacking. There other options out there like the forthcoming SE P810 etc that will have much nicer 1 MP cameras and etc that will blow away the Treo600. But in order to make use of a nice camera, you also need to have a nice screen. Thus, I don't its worthwhile to criticise the weak camera on the treo600 if there isn't an adequate screen to view them on. Contrast this with emerging rumors that the SGH-i500 may now come with a 1 MP camera + flash! This coupled with a 320x320 high rez screen and 300 Mhz proc will be a very formidable multimedia camera phone. However, having said all this the Treo600 does do some things very well and IMO has the best pda phone and thumbboard integration of any device out there. Eventually, IMO PalmOne is going to have to integrate a nice MP camera into the Treo...in fact I believe it will become an important necessity as the market develops ever more sophisticate devices. We'll just have to wait until that happens though. In the meantime, there are not many smatphones handsets (other than the forthcoming P810, SGH) which will have these cameras...and that includes M$ smartphones...
    _________________
    aka Gfunkmagic

    Current device: Palm Pre
    Device graveyard: Palm Vx, Cassiopeia E100, LG Phenom HPC, Palm M515, Treo 300, Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 700p, Axim X50v, Treo 800w



    Please don't PM me about my avatar. For more info go here.

    Restore your Pre to factory settings using webos doctor and follow these instructions
  5. #105  
    Originally posted by purpleX


    It's all nice and dandy were it not for the fact, PPC has truetype fonts and cleartype which play role in better fonts scaling.
    Palm OS 6 will integrate cleartype fonts...

    Originally posted by purpleX

    POS on the other hand has experiance relative slow down in new apps, How many new and exciting apps hae you seen or purchase in the past 2-3 months? Have you compared the "what's new" list betwen POS and PPC in Handango?
    The're a few palmOs for which there are no M$ smartphone equivalents: namely a unified IM messaging app like Verichat. Secondly there is no Snappermail for M$ smartphone which IMO is probably one of the best email clients period.

    As far as DOC editors, there are apps like Doc2go and forthcoming Textmaker for PalmOS...so the gap there is superficial...
    _________________
    aka Gfunkmagic

    Current device: Palm Pre
    Device graveyard: Palm Vx, Cassiopeia E100, LG Phenom HPC, Palm M515, Treo 300, Treo 600, Treo 650, Treo 700p, Axim X50v, Treo 800w



    Please don't PM me about my avatar. For more info go here.

    Restore your Pre to factory settings using webos doctor and follow these instructions
  6. #106  
    A couple of comments...

    gfunk, yeah I probably misspoke about camera-phones not cannabalizing digital camera sales. That will happen when the cameras built into PDAs and smartphones become of better quality and the mindset of consumers changes from valuing hardcopy prints to viewing images on the web. I think we're a ways away from that still. Nevertheless, we're in agreement that manufacturers will improve the quality of the cameras built into phones. They may drag their heels for fear of losing sales of their higher priced cameras, but they'll have to do it to stay competitive. Also, it should be noted that standalone digital cameras are coming down in price, so if there was once a huge profit margin built into those prices, they can't rely on that either.

    Regarding the Treo 600's poor camera quality not being too important because the display is so small...Well, I don't agree there. That may help cover up the out-of-focus look, but it won't cover up poor contrast, too-dark images, etc. Also, remember that people are going to take these pictures and then email them to someone who, more than likely, will be viewing them on a desktop PC.

    One comment about the lack of SnapperMail on the smartphone....Doesn't the PPC and MS Smartphone come with a mail app which is already capable of attachments, etc.? The one thing the PPC version is not capable of, apparently (not sure about the Smartphone version), is polling for email periodically.

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  7. #107  
    Originally posted by Scott R
    A couple of comments...

    One comment about the lack of SnapperMail on the smartphone....Doesn't the PPC and MS Smartphone come with a mail app which is already capable of attachments, etc.? The one thing the PPC version is not capable of, apparently (not sure about the Smartphone version), is polling for email periodically.

    Scott
    FWIW, snappermail.com's front page says that the Palm OS version is capable of handing attachments.

    Cool to see it does POP3 over SSL, however it is extra $$$. Additionally, it doesn't do IMAP.
  8. #108  
    Originally posted by JBoogie


    FWIW, snappermail.com's front page says that the Palm OS version is capable of handing attachments.

    Cool to see it does POP3 over SSL, however it is extra $$$. Additionally, it doesn't do IMAP.
    You misunderstood me. I own Snappermail. Yes, it does attachments. gfunk was saying that the MS Smartphone was at a disadvantage because it lacked an app of Snappermail's caliber. My point was that the built-in mail app for the MS Smartphone should be able to handle attachments.

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  9. #109  
    Originally posted by Scott R
    Call me insane, but I would even consider the G1000, as big as it is, if it was running the newest version fo the OS and had a decent built-in camera (which it doesn't).
    Scott
    It depends on what your idea of decent is. I got the pics in the following album under some really trying conditions: fast moving subjects in low-light conditions, areas of deep shadow contrasted with glare.

    The colors were all very true. I was especially pleased at the photos of the bio-luminescent jelly fish--wasn't sure that one would come out at all, much less come out pretty much the way it looked to my eyes. The G1000 camera is not better than my usual digital camera (which died on me, hence the use of the G1000 camera) but it was easier to use.

    http://www.fototime.com/inv/408EE4E8FF9FB30 (This album may be available only for a short time due to the small bandwidth allowance of my account).

    I forgot to add that none of the photos were retouched in any way. I think FotoTime will let you have the option of viewing the photo in its original size, and that may be helpful in eliminating any distortion caused by the service's compression scheme.

    On the G1000's screen the photos look really crisp.

    In answer to another person's comment, yes, the G1000 is very large to lug around. If the next Treo has a screen like that of the Zire 71 or better, and a camera as nice or better than my G1000's, I might be tempted to switch. I don't know that the current Treo 600 will tempt me. Maybe, but I doubt it. I love the G1000--it's been very stable. Its major drawback is the large size and I think the phone aspect is not as well done as the Treo promises to be.
    Last edited by monkeywithacold; 10/03/2003 at 03:14 AM.
  10. #110  
    Oh yeah, and one more thing, on the G1000, you are still married to that @#$% stylus or one good pointy fingernail. The Treo designers did right in making navigation as much of a one-handed operation as possible. I can't wait to see the implementation for myself.
  11. #111  
    monkeywithacold, thanks for those pictures. They were better than others I had seen. Either that or I'm just seeing so many of these lousy pictures day in and day out that I'm unconsciously lowering my expectations for what good photos look like. I'd love to see some samples taken in better lighting conditions (e.g. - outdoors). If you have any albums like that, please PM me (as others here may not want us getting sidetracked into a G1000 discussion). The other big problem with the G1000 is that it doesn't have the new PPC 2003 OS. This is an especially big deal because MS actually built-in support for keyboards in PPC 2003. Have you heard any word about Sprint possibly offering an OS upgrade?

    Regarding the need to use the stylus, yeah that's a big one. I shouldn't have to use the stylus to do simple phone functionality. Also, Hitachi didn't think to lay out the numeric keys on the thumbboard in a phone-pad layout. Interestingly, the leaked photos of the upcoming iPaq h4350 does (despite it not having a phone built-in).

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  12. #112  
    Oh, BTW, I love how you snuck that photo of the fish and chips in there!

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  13. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #113  
    Yikes, Sierra wireless is going to announce Smartphone with keyboard tomorrow. (never make a phone, but a good player in wireless embedded market. They have a bunch of wireless PCcards)

    No leak picture so far, press conference tomorrow.

    http://msmobiles.com/news.php/721.html
  14. #114  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    Yikes, Sierra wireless is going to announce Smartphone with keyboard tomorrow. (never make a phone, but a good player in wireless embedded market. They have a bunch of wireless PCcards)
    Ah yes, I had a feeling that might be the one. I've known about this for a couple of months now. I say the more the merrier. Hopefully, prices will be adjusted all around to be more competitive. Unfortunately, it's my understanding that Sierra is looking to target the enterprise customers with theirs as well, which I interpret to mean that it will be priced high like the Treo 600.

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  15. #115  
    I have yet to see one of these "Treo 600 killers" that I actually want as much as I want a Treo 600.

    I think most of the posts on the subject are by people who the Treo 600 doesn't appeal to, and therefore, it's very easy for them to get excited about some feature that most people waiting for the Treo 600 don't value all that highly (such as 240x320 vs. 160x160) while ignoring features that most here DO value very highly (qwerty, form factor, integrated device instead of two devices, etc etc).

    This Sierra model may or may not squarely compete with the Treo 600. I guess we'll find out in a few months, eh? If it's got a good (small) form factor, qwerty and works on Sprint, I will surely take a look. But why think much about it when I have a GREAT PDA/phone in a box on a brown truck looking for my house right now? The Sierra may or may not be as great and it's not out yet, so ... shrug.

    I keep getting the feeling that Handspring hurt some of you guys' feelings somehow, because a lot of energy seems to go into brainstorming to find something that somehow has an edge on the Treo, and generally, the features you're coming up with are not priorities for people who want a single versatile device with qwerty and a good form factor.
  16. #116  
    Mgauss
    Mgauss

    I like your idea of using two devices . I have had a treo 300 for a year . I am tired of looking at the crapy screen. The 600 does not add anything great . No blue tooth, Poor screen res. I use a G4 powerbook and personally think Tungsten T3 and bluetooth phone is the way to go.

    The features on T3 are great . the exapnsion card, 1 GB is not very expensive. To browse web page in a high res screen in a landscape mode would be awesome . I thought about Sony UX50 , which has both blue tooth and wifi . The screen area is not as big , also sony memory card 1 gb is around 600 bucks.

    Have you personally tried logging on to internet using bluetooh phone with a T3 . How is it diffrent from TREO's.
    Does the browser on T3 support Java and HTML and how good is the speed .
    And lastly which provider .
    If you do not think there is a major diffrence. I am going to get these two devices
  17. #117  
    Originally posted by purpleX
    Yikes, Sierra wireless is going to announce Smartphone with keyboard tomorrow. (never make a phone, but a good player in wireless embedded market. They have a bunch of wireless PCcards)

    No leak picture so far, press conference tomorrow.

    http://msmobiles.com/news.php/721.html
    http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/4168.html

    Picture of phone with thumboard folded out on second page.
  18. #118  
    Big news here. pocketop just released beta drivers for their foldable full-size QWERTY keyboard for the Series 60 platform. So, you should now be able to pair this with a Nokia 3650 and have a complete mobile solution for $80 (as the Nokia 3650 can be had for free after rebates). Beta drivers here:
    http://www.ultimatekeyboard.com/drivers.htm

    Scott
    Now THIS is the future of smartphones.
  19. #119  
    Originally posted by ar-cain


    http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/4168.html

    Picture of phone with thumboard folded out on second page.
    First, you wanted BT, this phone does not have it.

    Do you actually think that this thumboard will be a long-term success? If you have problems typing on a Treo 300 t/b or you have had problems with the flip lid ... just how relaible is a thumboard on flip be?

    How will you support (physically) the flipped open side of the keyboard?

    How will it hold up with someone that is a heavy data input user?

    And with that offset between the screen and the t/b, it could get awkward trying to use the thumboard.

    Will the T9 keypad inadvertently depress the keys on the reverse side of the keyboard?

    How much "feel" will there be to the thumboard?

    Is a 200 mhz processer enough for MS Mobile OS? No one really knows for sure.

    How soon before you break off that half of the t/b and now have no key pad to dial for assistance? Wait ... voice dialer ... no, not on the specs listed. Pull out the stylus ...

    Take a look at the photo again and tell me this is a usable device for you, whether or not you want a Treo 600.
    << My command as we escape Palm HQ with a new Pre 3>>.

    Treo 300 >> Treo 600 >> Treo 650 >> Treo 755 >> Instinct >> Pre- >> TouchPad
  20. purpleX
    purpleX's Avatar
    #120  
    Originally posted by ar-cain


    http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/4168.html

    Picture of phone with thumboard folded out on second page.
    I have to say, that is one hideous thing, plus it has too many moving parts.

    It'll flop gloriously.

    Hopefully sharp will bring their latest Japanese phone it's very nice form factor. ((slide fan, like V60)
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