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  1. #21  
    Quote Originally Posted by gmlongo View Post
    Except the iPhone will be a more capable business sedan, as well as, a flashier sports car. The Pre 3 will have almost no advantages over the next iPhone.
    Will the iPhone 5 have a keyboard you can actually type on? I mean one where you can type a word and be confident that the word you wanted to type actually appears on the screen, and not one where an algorithm has to sift through all the possible combinations of letters that your fingertaps indiscriminately touched on a perfectly smooth surface in order to find a list of words that you MAY have meant and ends up selecting one of them, resulting in "buggery" being displayed when you meant to type "bitters".

    Will the iPhone 5 be able to let me open a number of websites in a row and copy and paste stuff into a notes app or something easily? How easily?

    Will the iPhone 5 have real multitasking or will it merely allow you to quickly access a list of recently-paused apps from a task manager just like you could on Windows Mobile 5?

    Will the iPhone 5 be able to let me take a phonecall on my iPad when the iPhone is in the other room, charging inductively? Will it allow me to take a phonecall, open a website, copy something out of the website, open an email, copy it into the email, send the email, all the while still talking on my phone? How easily?

    Will the iPhone 5 be able to be charged with any old standard USB cable when I'm on a business trip or will I have to use something else? What if I lose that something else?

    Will I be able to access my company's flash-based website to show it to a potential customer while I'm on a business trip?

    Will I be able to touch my iPhone 5 to my iPad and easily transfer that flash-based website to the tablet to more comfortably show it to the customer WITHOUT first forcing me to open an app on my iPhone and open an app on my iPad? Will the apps that would allow me to do this on iOS, albeit less comfortably and straight-forwardly than on webOS, be free or would I have to purchase them twice, once for the iPhone and once for the iPad?

    Will I be able to install my company's custom-written application on my iPhone 5? We're a small shop with less than 5000 employees and can't afford to pay Apple 50,000.

    Will I be able to change the color scheme on my iPhone 5 to something in line with our corporate identity without having to hook it up to a computer and follow a lengthy, dangerous procedure that has bricked phones in the past, that WILL void its warranty as soon as I do it, and is something that Apple has literally sought to sue its own customers over?

    Will I be able to hold my iPhone 5 any way I want when I want to make a phonecall or will I be required to either hold it between two fingers or purchase with my hard-earned money a plastic cover for it that will make the whole adage about iPhones feeling "expensive" and "not plasticky" a bit useless? I'd really like to know. I sometimes use my phone as a phone. I know that's old-fashioned but what can you do.

    Will I be able to still feel like I'm "thinking different" when I'm using a phone that in all likelihood is going to sell a million units on day 1, or would that make me like those dumb Windows sheep that use Windows because everyone else is using it? I understand Apple users do not like these dumb Windows sheep. I also understand that even though Mac doesn't have nearly as many programs as Windows, the number of available programs isn't really important because the OS is supposed to be so much better.

    Will I be able to........ oh, what's the use. Yeah, the iPhone 5 will be waay better even though you have no idea what it'll actually look like, what it'll come with, when or even IF it will come It's not like Apple has even mentioned an iPhone 5 so far. If Apple was HP, I suppose their quiet would be an infallible sign that nothing is coming and that the OS is being scrapped as we speak.
    falconrap and gmlongo like this.
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by gbp View Post
    I hope you are not on Sprint.
    Aboutface: Sprint pushes iPhone 5 release date over Android EVO : Beatweek Magazine
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by that article
    Sprint customer support is pulling an aboutface and is now definitively telling customers that the iPhone is indeed coming to the carrier, but that it does not have information regarding the “exact launch date” for it.
    So... in the coming months, then?

    Not even a vague seasonal launch date, then?

    Why is the Pre3 such a huge let-down again?

    Wasn't Apple supposed to be this shining paragon of excellence whose release dates you could set your calendar by?
    Thead likes this.
  4. #24  
    Quote Originally Posted by spudland View Post
    I have always preferred a physical keyboard but I've been toying with a Samsung Fascinate ... a virtual keyboard...but I don't hate it like I thought I would...in fact, it makes it NOT a deal breaker for me anymore.
    that's sort of where i am. i bought my pre specifically because i wanted a physical keyboard. But over time i've changed. i've had several problems with it from keys that have broken and won't respond and deep down i really originally wanted a horizontal keyboard cause it's bigger. Plus i used a relative's EVO for a month and realized it could totally live without that keyboard. So I actually flip flopped and i now want a virtual keyboard.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Why is the Pre3 such a huge let-down again?
    my guess is because there are a lot of webos users that want a new phone now . That coupled with the fact that HP, one, held a rather large press conference in February and, two, it displayed the phone and it's August now and the phone hasn't been released. By contrast Apple not held a press conference nor displayed a phone coupled with quite high customer satisfaction.
    Last edited by SnotBoogie; 08/08/2011 at 06:17 PM.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  5. #25  
    Take deep breaths, GodShapedHole, take deep breaths.
  6. #26  
    Do you read that for real. Do you take it as a credible source?

    Industry News : Beatweek Magazine

    This guy does nothing but suck on apples you know what and bash everyone else for even trying.
  7. #27  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    By contrast Apple not held a press conference nor displayed a phone coupled with quite high customer satisfaction.
    Back in January, this forum was teeming with people who said that HP's lack of an announcement regarding new phones could only possibly mean that no new webOS phones would ever be made. EVER. They said HP was about to completely scrap webOS and join the Android camp. Others said that webOS may come to printers but definitely not to phones because if it was coming to phones, HP would've announced new phones already.

    That was what people believed in January. People were saying they're about to jump ship, not because they didn't like their Pres, not because they were broken, but simply because they believed that HP would decide not to pursue webOS anymore. They wanted to leave because anonymous people on the internet had told them that their platform had already died and HP simply didn't care enough to give them the news.

    Astroturfed FUD worked well enough to force HP into making an early announcement simply to tell people that they're NOT ABANDONING WEBOS BY A LONGSHOT.

    Do you seriously think it would have been in HP's best interest to stay quiet for months and months and more months and NOT address these concerns?
    Do you seriously think it was a mistake for HP to go and tell people that they have no intention of dropping webOS or killing it on phones?
    That it was a bad idea of HP to dispel the baseless and, truthfully, quite silly notion astroturfed into all the webOS forums that they only went and paid more than a billion dollars in order to get the rights for a product they intended to scrap and completely abandon?

    They needed to make an announcement, and they needed to show more at that announcement than the TouchPad or people would've said "see, no phones were announced. PROOF that no more phones are coming, ever."
    And they needed to show more than the Veer or people would've said "see, no other phones were announced. PROOF that no other phones are coming, ever. webOS is a one-phone shop, and that one phone took the unpopular Pre design and made it smaller."

    HP means to bring webOS to many different form factors, but they're just humans and couldn't create dozens of products with a completely new company-internal OS within the same year they needed to introduce their teams to that new OS and get them familiarized with the stuff. They could only create a few products within that year, but they needed to announce these few products in order to show people that yeah, we're still around and yeah, webOS isn't going away anytime soon.

    Meanwhile, Apple doesn't need to do anything because people apparently don't have any expectations of them. Whenever Apple decides to release is perfect. Late? Doesn't matter, Apple is popular so we shouldn't hold them to any particular standards.
    Last edited by GodShapedHole; 08/08/2011 at 07:08 PM.
  8. #28  
    I actually think most of Apple's customers have very high expectations of their products.
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by millworkman View Post
    Do you read that for real. Do you take it as a credible source?

    Industry News : Beatweek Magazine

    This guy does nothing but suck on apples you know what and bash everyone else for even trying.
    Normally, I wouldn't, but given the information we have regarding Apple employing carrier-specific people in the "Kansas City area" back in March makes this rather credible.

    See my other thread for that.
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Apple is popular so we shouldn't hold them to any particular standards.
    Apple generally exceeds most people's standards, and that's why they succeed.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Back in January, this forum was teeming with people who said that HP's lack of an announcement regarding new phones could only possibly mean that no new webOS phones would ever be made. EVER. They said HP was about to completely scrap webOS and join the Android camp. Others said that webOS may come to printers but definitely not to phones because if it was coming to phones, HP would've announced new phones already.

    That was what people believed in January. People were saying they're about to jump ship, not because they didn't like their Pres, not because they were broken, but simply because they believed that HP would decide not to pursue webOS anymore. They wanted to leave because anonymous people on the internet had told them that their platform had already died and HP simply didn't care enough to give them the news.

    Astroturfed FUD worked well enough to force HP into making an early announcement simply to tell people that they're NOT ABANDONING WEBOS BY A LONGSHOT.
    Not sure what any of that was about but uh...


    or have a beer. But relax.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Do you seriously think it would have been in HP's best interest to stay quiet for months and months and more months and NOT address these concerns?
    Do you seriously think it was a mistake for HP to go and tell people that they have no intention of dropping webOS or killing it on phones?
    That it was a bad idea of HP to dispel the baseless and, truthfully, quite silly notion astroturfed into all the webOS forums that they only went and paid more than a billion dollars in order to get the rights for a product they intended to scrap and completely abandon?
    i'm not these phantom people you're talking about from January, but it doesn't relate to my post and i don't know what any of this has to do with astroturf.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    They needed to make an announcement,
    No. I think they needed an actual phone launch.

    Honestly it was your question. You asked "why the Pre 3 was a let down" Simple, cause it hasn't launched yet and they announced it 6 months ago and people want a new phone. Doesn't seem too complicated or illogical to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    and they needed to show more at that announcement than the TouchPad or people would've said "see, no phones were announced. PROOF that no more phones are coming, ever."
    And they needed to show more than the Veer or people would've said "see, no other phones were announced. PROOF that no other phones are coming, ever. webOS is a one-phone shop, and that one phone took the unpopular Pre design and made it smaller."

    HP means to bring webOS to many different form factors, but they're just humans and couldn't create dozens of products with a completely new company-internal OS within the same year they needed to introduce their teams to that new OS and get them familiarized with the stuff. They could only create a few products within that year, but they needed to announce these few products in order to show people that yeah, we're still around and yeah, webOS isn't going away anytime soon.
    This is more about you're whole, "people in January said we'd never have a webos phone ever ever again" thing which wasn't me and i didn't say in any post so i really have no response to this either.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Meanwhile, Apple doesn't need to do anything because people apparently don't have any expectations of them. Whenever Apple decides to release is perfect. Late? Doesn't matter, Apple is popular so we shouldn't hold them to any particular standards.
    No I think people have very high expectations of Apple one of which is after the actual press conference and announcement the phone will launch in days not months. I think the idea that nobody that wanted an Iphone in June is upset and thinks it's "perfect" because it's late is nothing more then massive exaggeration. Of course there are disappointed people. the current expectation for iphone launch is end of Sept. - Oct. I'm sure if it doesn't come people will be annoyed. Your blanket statements statements strike me as is just hyperbole.

    Regardless if you announce a phone and 6 months later still don't have a release date you can expect the people that have been waiting for 6 months to be a bit annoyed at the lack of concrete information.
    Last edited by SnotBoogie; 08/09/2011 at 12:35 AM.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
    koolkid09 likes this.
  12. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    i'm not these phantom people you're talking about from January, but it doesn't relate to my post and i don't know what any of this has to do with astroturf.
    Go back a few dozen pages until november, december january and read a few threads from then, and browse the frontpage article comments sections from roughly the same time. I dunno if you weren't there, were in fact one of those people and don't want to let on, or have forgotten, but it was terrible.



    No. I think they needed an actual phone launch.
    Absolutely. And because they also needed to launch a fully bake product, they told us to wait until summer. It IS summer now, and lo, it seems like the wait is all but over.

    Honestly it was your question. You asked "why the Pre 3 was a let down" Simple, cause it hasn't launched yet and they announced it 6 months ago and people want a new phone. Doesn't seem too complicated or illogical to me.
    No, I get it. The thing is, they announced six months ago that it'd be ready around this time. THAT is why being so let down is illogical.

    This is more about you're whole, "people in January said we'd never have a webos phone ever ever again" thing which wasn't me and i didn't say in any post so i really have no response to this either.
    ok, ignore it. seems like you know EXACTLY how important it was for HP to do this, otherwise you'd address this. People were switching because they thought HP wasn't going to make new phones and they didn't want to spend even more time with something they believed had no future. People were WILLING HP to make an announcement. HP did. Now that was a mistake. HP is damned if they do and damned if they don't.

    I think people have very high expectations of Apple one of which is after the actual press conference and announcement the phone will launch in days not months. I think the idea that nobody that wanted an Iphone in June is upset and thinks it's "perfect" because it's late is nothing more then massive exaggeration.
    White iPhone 4 lol. Note that it didn't even fit into existing black iPhone 4 cases when it finally did arrive 9 months later.
    Also, it's a massive exaggeration to say the iPhone is late when people expect it to launch in june but it hasn't launched by august. Meanwhile, it's a massive let-down if people expect the Pre3 to launch in summer and it launches in summer?

    of course there are disappointed people. the current expectation for iphone launch is end of Sept. - Oct. I'm sure if it doesn't come people will be annoyed. Your blanket statements statements strike me as is just hyperbole.
    Regardless if you announce a phone and 6 months later still don't have a release date you can expect the people that have been waiting for 6 months to be a bit annoyed at the lack of concrete information.
    There is a release date, but it's vague: summer. it hasn't been broken yet. It is, in fact, looking as though the Pre3 is coming within the month. And your big problem is that HP hasn't made a concrete day announcement half a year in advance.
    Looks like HP means to keep an Apple-like secrecy. But again: they HAD to make this announcement back in Winter because if they hadn't, people's assumption would have been that HP isn't going to release any new devices at all. Don't believe me? Go check the comments section of any arbitrary news article posted last winter.

    But the whole debate won't really matter soon anyway as the Pre3 is soon to be released. Then the debate will be about why it doesn't have the top specs in any department and why you won't be able to nerdily brag with its processor.
  13. #33  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Also, it's a massive exaggeration to say the iPhone is late when people expect it to launch in june but it hasn't launched by august. Meanwhile, it's a massive let-down if people expect the Pre3 to launch in summer and it launches in summer?
    You seem to miss the major difference here: a company explicitly giving a timeframe vs one not.

    Apple never said summer, fall, 9/2, etc. they have never given launch dates for any iPhone until it's ready for launch. Those that are likely bummed that there wasn't a June/July iPhone this year are probably the same that read forums like these and understand the ordeal.

    Others, likely have no idea.
  14. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Go back a few dozen pages until november, december january and read a few threads from then, and browse the frontpage article comments sections from roughly the same time. I dunno if you weren't there, were in fact one of those people and don't want to let on, or have forgotten, but it was terrible.
    i'm not going back to read random threads looking for other people's phantom posts when they don't relate to anything i was talking about. That's you're fixation, not mine.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Absolutely.
    glad you agree they needed launch.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    No, I get it. The thing is, they announced six months ago that it'd be ready around this time. THAT is why being so let down is illogical.
    If it was ready it would be on sale. And people wanted it months ago.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    ok, ignore it. seems like you know EXACTLY how important it was for HP to do this, otherwise you'd address this
    i'm not addressing it cause it's your rant about something i wasn't talking about, that's all your own perception, it's off topic, it's not relevant.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Also, it's a massive exaggeration to say the iPhone is late when people expect it to launch in june but it hasn't launched by august. Meanwhile, it's a massive let-down if people expect the Pre3 to launch in summer and it launches in summer?
    I didn't say "to say the iPhone is late when people expect it to launch in june but it hasn't launched by august."

    I said "the idea that nobody that wanted an Iphone in June is upset and thinks it's "perfect" because it's late is nothing more then massive exaggeration."

    You're not actually responding to what i actually said. You're just writing what you think you're hear. What you wrote doesn't even accurately reflect what I said.

    Regardless, if you don't understand that people who have had pre minus for one or two years and have been waiting for a new phone where not disappointed that the pre hasn't been release you just don't get it. If you don't understand that Iphone users expect a launch at a certain time a year and didn't get and thus it's considered "late" you don't get it. And if you can't distinquish between that "lateness" and users thinking something is "perfect" ya know i can't help ya.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    There is a release date, but it's vague: summer.
    Summer is a season. It is not a date.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    it hasn't been broken yet. It is, in fact, looking as though the Pre3 is coming within the month.
    It could come tomorrow and people still, on this day, having no information have a right to be disappointed at the lack of info.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    And your big problem is that HP hasn't made a concrete day announcement half a year in advance.
    I don't have a problem with HP. You asked about why people were disappointed. I gave a reason why people are disappointed. I merely gave voice to the feelings of many Pre users that have sat around for well over a year waiting blindly. I did not say I personally was disappointed. I personally don't care when they release it. That doesn't mean i can't sympathize or see the perspective of someone that's dieing to buy a new Pre 3. But yeah, in this phone market, It's a failure to take 6 months of after announcement to release a phone. 6 months of keeping customers pretty much in the dark at that. I understand the frustration.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    Looks like HP means to keep an Apple-like secrecy.
    If they want "Apple-like secrecy" then they should do like apple and don't hold a press conference and show a device until they are ready to sell it. Or leave in a bar in San Jose.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    But the whole debate won't really matter soon anyway as the Pre3 is soon to be released. Then the debate will be about why it doesn't have the top specs in any department and why you won't be able to nerdily brag with its processor.
    Feel free to "nerdily debate" by yourself because I have little interest in specs like processors. I didn't know what it was in my pre when i bought it and I surly don't care what it is in my next phone.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  15. #35  
    okay then the next phone you get maybe it's got a 250mghz processor and you will be really happy? I kid... As long as the next phone is better than the pre- is all good.
  16. #36  
    250 mega gigahertz? That sounds wicked....
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  17. #37  
    oh I meam to say MHz lol my bad :O
  18. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    i'm not going back to read random threads looking for other people's phantom posts when they don't relate to anything i was talking about. That's you're fixation, not mine.
    The rest of your post is either useless, contentless, or essentially an extension of this part and the principle underlying it.

    HP's behaviour is a REACTION to their userbase's actions. Whether you want to ignore it or not (and you very much DO want to ignore it, for whatever reason) many, MANY people were asking HP to just give them a sign that webOS wouldn't be abandoned, so HP did give them that sign.

    You're saying that the Pre3 is a failure, not because it's going to be a bad product for the time it's released in, but merely because HP announced it too early. You yourself are saying that specs don't matter, so all that matters is how usable the Pre3 is going to be. And you will not even consider that HP HAD to announce new products early in order not to lose even more users. When I try to tell you why they had to announce early, you're sticking your fingers in your ears and singing LA LA LA LA I'M NOT LISTENING.
    And then you go and say just because I look at the situation holistically - that is, looking at how the situation started, how it progressed and how it led to where we are now - a "fixation" because apparently in your eyes, it doesn't matter how we got to where we are and because you want to be really condescending in an attempt to give your LA LA LA LA I'M NOT LISTENING a superficial sheen of authoritative self-confidence. I don't think you're being fair to me or HP.

    And I don't think it makes any sense at all to only look at any situation in light of it's current state. You always need to look at how we got here. Otherwise you can argue that the debt is Obama's fault (it isn't; he inherited a catastrophe from Bush) or that Jenson Button is the best Formula One driver because he won the last race (he isn't, because he hasn't won any other races). I hope you're just being mean and unfair because of... well, whatever the reason for your anger against HP may be, and that you aren't actually unable to grasp basic causality: the simple fact that the past shapes the future, and the resulting fact that you can't criticize the present without taking into account the past.

    If you can't, or don't want to, consider the reasons why HP did what they did how they did it, whatever the result of their behaviors may be, I'm afraid it's going to be you who will have to debate alone.
  19. #39  
    I'm actually quite unhappy that apple "missed" their delivery date. It seems like once Jobs left the office, they couldn't keep it together. This, after I've decided to switch to the iphone 5, they pick this year to screw up their release schedule.

    So no, they don't get a pass. Some of us are genuninely ****ed at having to wait another quarter. Especially since our pre- are falling apart. Get jobs back in the damn office. half dying or not.
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    You're saying that the Pre3 is a failure, ...
    I didn't say the Pre 3 was a failure. How can it be. It hasn't launched yet. You don't read well. You are arguing against points that I didn't actually make.

    Quote Originally Posted by GodShapedHole View Post
    If you can't, or don't want to, consider the reasons why HP did what they did...
    you didn't ask why HP did what it did. You ask why people were disappointed in the Pre 3. The answer is simple: it hasn't been released. You just didn't like the truth. You're just a brick wall. But there's a saying: "You can't teach algebra to first graders." But feel free to continue to senselessly rant to yourself about arguments I haven't actually made but that you seem to hear in your head.

    Quote Originally Posted by Imperator64 View Post
    I'm actually quite unhappy that apple "missed" their delivery date. It seems like once Jobs left the office, they couldn't keep it together. This, after I've decided to switch to the iphone 5, they pick this year to screw up their release schedule.

    So no, they don't get a pass. Some of us are genuninely ****ed at having to wait another quarter. Especially since our pre- are falling apart. Get jobs back in the damn office. half dying or not.
    No man. You're not. Godshapedhole says you think everything apple does is perfect. You are totally happy at everything apple has ever done. He said it so it's totally true. Stop fighting it. You have ten Newtons and a G4 Cube. lol.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
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