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  1.    #1  
    Hi all,

    For quite some time, I've been stressing quality over quantity should be how people & the media should be looking at app totals for each platform.

    Having never tried an Android smartphone, I am posting this and taking the opinion of the author.

    Please see the link for the entire article.

    take care,

    Jay

    Quality of Apps for Android Is "Pathetically Low" Says Developer
    The paucity of good apps for Android means the platform can be lucrative for developers who aren't turning out junk, says one studio

    Quality of Apps for Android Is "Pathetically Low" Says Developer - Technology Review

    Mika Mobile makes a compelling game, Battleheart, that has been a big hit on both the iOS and now Android platforms. Having watched their app succeed on both platforms in succession, the team behind it has learned a few things about the level of competition on the Android platform.

    As one of the Mika Mobile team members noted in a recent blog post: "I'd go as far as to say that a polished, high quality product is more likely to be embraced on Android than on iOS because the quality bar on the android market is so pathetically low."

    Evidence to that effect comes from the fact that a) Battleheart is rated even more highly on the Android app store than on iTunes, despite being exactly the same game on both platforms, and b) Battleheart earned that rating despite what the team estimates is a failure-to-install rate on Android of between 1-3 percent, leading many customers to demand their $3 back.

    Overall, the Mika Mobile design team has found that the paucity of quality games on Android means they are earning on Android fully 80 percent of the revenue they're currently earning on the iTunes app store, and all of that solely through word of mouth.

    That said, there are two big problems with Android, say the team: First, iTunes handles payments so developers don't have to, but on Android, all developers are vendors on Google Checkout, which means they get to resolve payment disputes on their own.

    Second, a significant proportion of apps simply fail to install correctly on Android devices, through no fault of the developer. "Third party mods, or the device's download cache, a corrupted temp file on the SD card, or the cached data of other apps interfering with normal download behavior is the root cause of 99% of the correspondence I get, and it's fairly tiresome."

    As if we needed it, here is yet more evidence that the Android app store is in its early days, and that Google isn't paying attention to the care and feeding of its developers the way Apple is. It appears that every day it's more lucrative to deal with these headaches, however, and since developers generally follow the money, it seems inevitable that the Android app ecosystem will continue to close in on parity with the iOS app ecosystem.

    Whether or not that game of catch-up will ever end in Android surpassing the quality and scope of apps on iOS -- that's anyone's guess.
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
  2. #2  
    "That said, there are two big problems with Android, say the team: First, iTunes handles payments so developers don't have to, but on Android, all developers are vendors on Google Checkout, which means they get to resolve payment disputes on their own."

    I didn't realise this. For small hobbyist developers that could be a big deal.
  3. #3  
    They still have more quality apps then webos so this doesn't help your quality over quantity argument. App totals are merely a measure of just that the sheer number of apps. It's also an indication of variety of choice in the app stores. Nobody is claiming any platform has all quality apps and no crap ones. But honestly it's been more then a year since anything has come out that interests me for webos.

    the quality vs quantity thing is like an argument with nobody. Nobody is ever arguing that a mere raw number of apps in an app store means its better. Nobody is ever arguing that having 100k bad apps and zero good ones is a good thing. But when nobody but hobbyists are releasing apps for a platform while android gets hbo go, watch espn radio, and in just the last week or so they got apps from starbucks https://market.android.com/details?i...cks.mobilecard , hulu plus http://www.androidcentral.com/hulu-p...ones-initially , zipcar http://www.androidcentral.com/zipcar...comes-out-beta and Quickoffice with EDITING http://www.androidcentral.com/androi...uickoffice-pro, i find it extremely hard to, with a straight face, sit back and say yeah, webos' app catalog is better or that the Androids somehow suck. I mean bottom line the webos catalog has both less apps and lacks the apps above and i think that stuff is all quality. It may not be 100% quality but no store is. And in my opinion, it just flat out isn't even a contest.

    Another thing. I mean if you've never tried and Android phone i don't see the point of posting the article. To make the statement that it's quality over quantity? well yeah but if you've never tried android, how can you claim it's not quality? Don't get me wrong, you can post anything you want for discussion. i just find it strange. Anyways. That's just my two cents.
    Last edited by SnotBoogie; 06/23/2011 at 01:37 AM.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    They still have more quality apps then webos so this doesn't help your quality over quantity argument. App totals are merely a measure of just that the sheer number of apps. It's also an indication of variety of choice in the app stores. Nobody is claiming any platform has all quality apps and no crap ones. But honestly it's been more then a year since anything has come out that interests me for webos.
    But, Mr Snotboogie, the difference is in the webOS development community. For example, devs that have been here Homebrewing for ages until they app catalog debut, have refined their apps to such a degree that they are HIGH QUALITY, HIGH CALIBER apps.
    Since they take suggestions from a lively active and eager community looking for those quality apps.

    Take for example the app What's for Dinner: http://developer.palm.com/appredirec...icationid=1661

    Which was developed HERE for webOS its a very high quality app

    When he added the app to android, he had taken an refined polished app that is making him even more.
    https://market.android.com/details?id=com.srb.app.wfdp

    The fact that apps are so so dry here, demand even Higher quality, as opposed to being a medium quality app amongst hundreds of thousands where you might never get noticed.

    To me, EVERY dev should start here just so they can refine their app so much, that its bound to do EXTREMELY well on other platforms as well .

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by sketch42 View Post
    But, Mr Snotboogie, the difference is ...
    I don't really see your point. regardless, i'm not a developer. I'm a consumer. So what you say may be true but it doesn't concern me in the slightest.. Plus it doesn't change the fact that if you're comparing app catalogs Android has tons big name apps that interest people then webos. Homebrew is fine for what it is but it's not a replacement for a big company releasing an app. There's no homebrew app that streams espn or hbo or that does exactly what a cnn app does for cnn content. I used homebrew it early on, but as of now i don't think I even have any homebrew apps on my phone. And what i'm Starbucks and HBO, ESPN, etc, those sorts of apps are never gonna be home brew apps.

    That's fine that a cookbook app came out of homebrew. But i'd much rather have an app from Foodtv. look at the apps i listed, most came out just last week. If what you want is homebrew and hobby developers that's fine. But me personally, i want Hbo, espn radio, espn go, etc. That's quality to me. The recipe app may be made well. But it's not useful to me. And that's the problem. i have no use for or interest in the bulk of the webos catalog. I look at the android catalog and it's full of big name apps that i'd download in an instant.

    people are just unwilling to face reality, the webos catalog needs a lot of work and needs much much greater support from mainstream major companies. Not just hobbyist and small developers because they are not always an adequate replacement for big name company apps.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  6. #6  
    Side note - I will be calling the next driver that cuts me off "Mr. Snotboogie"

    ---- This might be exactly why there are so many "free" apps on Android. Slap ads on them and make your money by cleverly placing them so as to make people inadvertently tap on them. That way, you get paid via Google AdSense and don't have to worry about Google Checkout or issue resolution.
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  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    I don't really see your point. regardless, i'm not a developer. I'm a consumer. So what you say may be true but it doesn't concern me in the slightest.. Plus it doesn't change the fact that if you're comparing app catalogs Android has tons big name apps that interest people then webos. Homebrew is fine for what it is but it's not a replacement for a big company releasing an app. There's no homebrew app that streams espn or hbo or that does exactly what a cnn app does for cnn content. I used homebrew it early on, but as of now i don't think I even have any homebrew apps on my phone. And what i'm Starbucks and HBO, ESPN, etc, those sorts of apps are never gonna be home brew apps.

    That's fine that a cookbook app came out of homebrew. But i'd much rather have an app from Foodtv. look at the apps i listed, most came out just last week. If what you want is homebrew and hobby developers that's fine. But me personally, i want Hbo, espn radio, espn go, etc. That's quality to me. The recipe app may be made well. But it's not useful to me. And that's the problem. i have no use for or interest in the bulk of the webos catalog. I look at the android catalog and it's full of big name apps that i'd download in an instant.

    people are just unwilling to face reality, the webos catalog needs a lot of work and needs much much greater support from mainstream major companies. Not just hobbyist and small developers because they are not always an adequate replacement for big name company apps.
    I'm talking about how quality apps show up on a device, there are plenty of big name devs that don't necessarily put out a good product. And third partyers pick up that slack. How do they do that ? They start with homebrew and graduate to the catalog.. Not just release a half baked attempt at an app.

    That's all I'm saying.

    Is Hp app catalog lacking apps? Definitley are there a lot of high quality apps? (eBooks aside) yes there are, why? Because most started here on precentral

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by pogeypre View Post
    Side note - I will be calling the next driver that cuts me off "Mr. Snotboogie"

    ---- This might be exactly why there are so many "free" apps on Android. Slap ads on them and make your money by cleverly placing them so as to make people inadvertently tap on them. That way, you get paid via Google AdSense and don't have to worry about Google Checkout or issue resolution.
    Hey i'm a darn good driver. I check my blind spots. lol. Free is good. As a consumer. I got no complaints.

    Quote Originally Posted by sketch42 View Post
    I'm talking about how quality apps show up on a device, there are plenty of big name devs that don't necessarily put out a good product. And third partyers pick up that slack. How do they do that ? They start with homebrew and graduate to the catalog.. Not just release a half baked attempt at an app.

    That's all I'm saying.

    Is Hp app catalog lacking apps? Definitley are there a lot of high quality apps? (eBooks aside) yes there are, why? Because most started here on precentral

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums

    i think we're talking past each other. Because that's not really what i'm talking about. Because if the catalog is full of stuff that doesn't interest me i don't care how fancy it looks. And homebrew stuff largely doesn't interest me. Most of the stuff in the app catalog doesnt' interest me. And most that does came out around launch. To me if it is only a high quality app if i want to use it. I don't want to use much of anything in the webos catalog. So i don't find much quality in it. I'm a mainstream consumer. i'd prefer not to homebrew at all. I'd like to not use patches and stuff. I didn't buy a phone for that stuff. but this line of reasoning that the webos catalog is good cause its' full of quality i find bogus cause, today, there's very little in the catalog i want. That's not quality to me.
    Last edited by SnotBoogie; 06/23/2011 at 05:00 PM.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  9. #9  
    The article is valid, as it covers what a developer on Android systems has indicated, from his point of view - so posting it here, in this forum, is appropriate.

    As for "quality over quantity", well, perhaps Jay does or doesnt know first hand android app quality, but, he certainly has a right to make a comment about the idea - and this article absolutely speaks to that, so, I don't see how you can question his posting this.

    And, finally, I dont think anyone would argue that more applications is better for any OS; I'd venture to say that many, MANY applications on both Android and iOS are repeated over and over again, and some, pretty darned useless for most people, BUT, its the choice that all of those applications provides to any end user that is important.

    WebOS is just starting out of the gate, again, with HP behind them, and new hardware with a brand new OS and Enyo to develop with...

    I say, lets see how this all plays out in a few months, shall we: perhaps WebOS will only have 15,000 applications by years end, but, maybe, just maybe, they will ALL be great quality and highly desired ones!

    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    Hey i'm a darn good driver. I check my blind spots. lol. Free is good. As a consumer. I got no complaints.




    i think we're talking past each other. Because that's not really what i'm talking about. Because if the catalog is full of stuff that doesn't interest me i don't care how fancy it looks. And homebrew stuff largely doesn't interest me. Most of the stuff in the app catalog doesnt' interest me. And most that does came out around launch. To me if it is only a high quality app if i want to use it. I don't want to use much of anything in the webos catalog. So i don't find much quality in it. I'm a mainstream consumer. i'd prefer not to homebrew at all. I'd like to not use patches and stuff. I didn't buy a phone for that stuff. but this line of reasoning that the webos catalog is good cause its' full of quality i find bogus cause, today, there's very little in the catalog i want. That's not quality to me.
    but youre associating quality with a service you would use... and that doesnt make much sense.

    For example i dont use Netflix (=O) but does that mean the service is not a quality service?

    and just because the service they provide may be a quality service doesnt mean an app by them will be a Quality app (quality meaning not as is if there is a want for the app but rather is the app of a caliber that ones that will use it find it a joy to use)

    and again you are missing the point of what im saying. Im NOT saying that CONSUMERS should homebrew.
    I AM saying that devs should start their apps within the homebrew community, so when they do PUBLISH to CONSUMERS they , the consumers, will be receiving a app that is worth buying
    Last edited by sketch42; 06/23/2011 at 05:34 PM.
  11. #11  
    He should keep his game on iOS if he hates Android so much.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    He should keep his game on iOS if he hates Android so much.
    Irony is that he will most likely make more money from the android market than the app store. If your not a well known dev on ios you have a hard time getting your app noticed. A combination of that and Android having a higher market share would make android a hug priority.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by sketch42 View Post
    but youre associating quality with a service you would use... and that doesnt make much sense.

    For example i dont use Netflix (=O) but does that mean the service is not a quality service?

    and just because the service they provide may be a quality service doesnt mean an app by them will be a Quality app (quality meaning not as is if there is a want for the app but rather is the app of a caliber that ones that will use it find it a joy to use)

    and again you are missing the point of what im saying. Im NOT saying that CONSUMERS should homebrew.
    I AM saying that devs should start their apps within the homebrew community, so when they do PUBLISH to CONSUMERS they , the consumers, will be receiving a app that is worth buying
    no i'm associating the quality of the app catalog with the amount of apps that appeal to most consumers. I don't care about how well it's coded or something. Webos just has a ton less good apps then Android. Where's the mainstream apps? they are not on the platform today in large numbers. Like a well coded fart app or soundboard isn't quality to me. It's useless. It may impress devs but i'm not a dev.

    i understand what you're saying. i'm saying it's not really relevant to my point, (thats's why i said we were talking past each other.) My point was to rebutt ilove's assertion that somehow android lacks quality and from everything i've read from him webos has much more quality. That's just not true. This article may be relevant to the problems of developers but it's ludicrous to infer that Android catalog somehow has less quality the webos catalog. He didn't outright say it. But i take that to be what he's implying.

    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    As for "quality over quantity", well, perhaps Jay does or doesnt know first hand android app quality, but, he certainly has a right to make a comment about the idea - and this article absolutely speaks to that, so, I don't see how you can question his posting this.
    Well, he said he's never so i take a bit of issue with bashing something you've never used. I wouldn't be happy if people based webos but never used it. I've use a pre. I think i can comment on it's quality. But the other reason is as he's said "stressing quality over quantity should be how people & the media should be looking at app totals for each platform." Well i've read some of those post and the tenor of his argument tends to be that app "quality over quantity and thus webos has more quality and is better." Now i'm paraphrasing but i just totally disagree. Because don't find much of anything in the webos catalog that's useful to me. someone else may but i think most people are closer to me then the webos denizens that are thrilled to preware and homebrew and basically just want a twitter app. I don't think this article shows that.

    maybe that will change in the coming months, no pun intended. I hope so but as of now, that title also applies to webos. It could easily read "Quality of Apps for webos Is "Pathetically Low." And in my opinion it has been for two years.
    You come at the king. You best not miss.
  14. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by SnotBoogie View Post
    no i'm associating the quality of the app catalog with the amount of apps that appeal to most consumers. I don't care about how well it's coded or something. Webos just has a ton less good apps then Android. Where's the mainstream apps? they are not on the platform today in large numbers. Like a well coded fart app or soundboard isn't quality to me. It's useless. It may impress devs but i'm not a dev.

    i understand what you're saying. i'm saying it's not really relevant to my point, (thats's why i said we were talking past each other.) My point was to rebutt ilove's assertion that somehow android lacks quality and from everything i've read from him webos has much more quality. That's just not true. This article may be relevant to the problems of developers but it's ludicrous to infer that Android catalog somehow has less quality the webos catalog. He didn't outright say it. But i take that to be what he's implying.



    Well, he said he's never so i take a bit of issue with bashing something you've never used. I wouldn't be happy if people based webos but never used it. I've use a pre. I think i can comment on it's quality. But the other reason is as he's said "stressing quality over quantity should be how people & the media should be looking at app totals for each platform." Well i've read some of those post and the tenor of his argument tends to be that app "quality over quantity and thus webos has more quality and is better." Now i'm paraphrasing but i just totally disagree. Because don't find much of anything in the webos catalog that's useful to me. someone else may but i think most people are closer to me then the webos denizens that are thrilled to preware and homebrew and basically just want a twitter app. I don't think this article shows that.

    maybe that will change in the coming months, no pun intended. I hope so but as of now, that title also applies to webos. It could easily read "Quality of Apps for webos Is "Pathetically Low." And in my opinion it has been for two years.
    Last thing =P .. I find no quality in part apps/soundboard/public ebooks ... Those are one off apps.

    I, like you, am talking about the quickoffice/kindle/time/banks/shazam/whatsapp/kik/wordpress etc.. The ones that have yet to show their face in the meager online portal we call the app catalog.

    But does that mean that what we do have, again excluding silly fart apps and the like, as neither me or you are talking about them, is sub par ? I don't think so. And this may be where we would agree to disagree.

    Are there many apps that I wish where here? Yes, are they coming? IDK, but I honestly hope so.

    Can the mainstream develops take cue from some of the non mainstream devs, to create a pleasurable experience for the end user, 10000% .

    I'm not sure if we're talking apples and Horses or just talking chinese and french..

    Either way I think we can ALL agree that HP needs to get more First party mainstream publishers asap!

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  15. #15  
    I'm about to find out for myself how good/bad Android is. Gf's picking up her Incredible S today. Just got my 6th Pre yesterday..... I'm a "little" hard on phones...couple blown speakers, couple physical breaks & one faulty keyboard...this should tide me over until Pre3 drops in price a bit. Looking forward to it actually, & i'll try to report back (sure it's been done before) as objectively as possible.

    FWIW, My non-existant VKB experience.... I was pretty good in the store, better than I thought I'd be.

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