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  1. #41  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    Yes, there are at least five smartphone markets:

    XS <3"
    S 3"
    M 3.5"
    L 4"
    XL 4.3-4.5"+

    It's like shoes. Pick what feels right to you. That's why each ecosystem needs options in each size.
    I like L, just like my shirt size. hehe
  2. #42  
    [
    Quote Originally Posted by cnote1287 View Post
    Ok, new approach. Can we agree that there are (at least) 2 markets for smartphones.....one for larger smartphones and one for smaller smartphones?

    NOW answer this, which market would you say is bigger? The one for larger smartphones, or the one for smaller smartphones?
    As to what is selling the most, go to amazon.com and look at the best selling list:

    S 7. LG Octane Phone (Verizon Wireless) 2.6" Featurephone
    M 3. HTC Freestyle Phone (AT&T) 3.2" Featurephone
    L 4. Motorola Atrix 4G Android Phone (AT&T) 4.0" Android
    L 6. HTC DROID INCREDIBLE 2 Android Phone (Verizon Wireless) 4.0" Android
    L 8. T-Mobile G2x 4G Android Phone (T-Mobile) 4.0" Android
    L 10. Samsung Epic 4G Android 4.0" Android
    XL 1. HTC ThunderBolt 4G Android Phone (Verizon Wireless) 4.3" Android
    XL 2. HTC Inspire 4G Android Phone (AT&T) 4.3" Android
    XL 5. Motorola DROID X Android Phone (Verizon Wireless) 4.3" Android
    XL 9. Samsung Infuse 4G Android Phone (AT&T) 4.5" Android

    All five market segments have demand but 8 out of the top ten are 4" or larger displays. All 8 smartphones are 4"+.
    Last edited by milominderbinder; 05/25/2011 at 01:54 PM.
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    [As to what is selling the most, go to amazon.com and look at the best selling list:

    S 7. LG Octane Phone (Verizon Wireless) 2.6" Featurephone
    M 3. HTC Freestyle Phone (AT&T) 3.2" Featurephone
    L 4. Motorola Atrix 4G Android Phone (AT&T) 4.0" Android
    L 6. HTC DROID INCREDIBLE 2 Android Phone (Verizon Wireless) 4.0" Android
    L 8. T-Mobile G2x 4G Android Phone (T-Mobile) 4.0" Android
    L 10. Samsung Epic 4G Android 4.0" Android
    XL 1. HTC ThunderBolt 4G Android Phone (Verizon Wireless) 4.3" Android
    XL 2. HTC Inspire 4G Android Phone (AT&T) 4.3" Android
    XL 5. Motorola DROID X Android Phone (Verizon Wireless) 4.3" Android
    XL 9. Samsung Infuse 4G Android Phone (AT&T) 4.5" Android

    All five market segments have demand but 8 out of the top ten are 4" or larger displays.
    I agree that the jumbo-phones command a significant portion of the demand, but I don't think a sample set confined to Amazon.com is very useful. I think most of us agree that HP is going after dumbphone converts with the Veer, and while I don't have data to back this up, it's my guess that a lot of people still carrying dumbphones aren't the kind of people who do a lot of internet shopping.

    </sweeping generalization>
  4. #44  
    Quote Originally Posted by VCI_Cell View Post
    ...I think most of us agree that HP is going after dumbphone converts with the Veer, and while I don't have data to back this up, it's my guess that a lot of people still carrying dumbphones aren't the kind of people who do a lot of internet shopping.

    </sweeping generalization>
    We actually do have data to back that up. Gartner and Canalys both show that dumbphones far outsell smartphones especially in third world countries.

    There were almost a billion dumbphones sold last year vs. 400 million smartphones. Even at Best Buy, 9 of their top 25 phones are dumbphones 3.2" or under:
    Samsung Rugby II 2.0" feature phone
    Samsung Convoy 2.0" feature phone
    Samsung Evergreen 2.0" feature phone
    Sanyo Taho 2.5" feature phone
    Samsung SCH-U370 3" feature phone
    LG Encore 3" feature phone
    Samsung Eternity II 3" feature phone
    LG Rumor Touch 3" feature phone
    LG Rumor Touch Blue 3" feature phone
    HTC Freestyle 3.2" feature phone

    The Veer is a brilliant phone to sell to someone who is used to a dumbphone. HP needs to hire point of sales temps to man AT&T and Best Buy stores.

    The problem is that the typical store rep is all about showing his favorite YouTube videos, Facebook, and the internet. They are all about high-end phones. They just can't hide how much they love their iPhones and Androids.

    The dumbphone battlefield is hand-to-hand at the store level. These are customers who have phones because they are necessary evils. Show them how a Veer is every bit as tiny and simple to use as what they have.

    If the HP temps spent a couple weekends in the stores, the BB and ATT reps would see that the Veer is a no-brainer sale to a dumbphone owner.
  5. #45  
    Thanks for the data.

    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    The Veer is a brilliant phone to sell to someone who is used to a dumbphone. HP needs to hire point of sales temps to man AT&T and Best Buy stores.

    If the HP temps spent a couple weekends in the stores, the BB and ATT reps would see that the Veer is a no-brainer sale to a dumbphone owner.
    Based on the Craigslist posts unearthed in a few other threads, I think that's exactly what HP is going to be doing.
  6. #46  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    Yes, there are at least five smartphone markets:

    XS <3"
    S 3"
    M 3.5"
    L 4"
    XL 4.3-4.5"+

    It's like shoes. Pick what feels right to you. That's why each ecosystem needs options in each size.
    You forgot the XXL size for 5"

    XXL Dell Streak 5 Android Phone (AT&T) 5" Android
  7. ogeneo's Avatar
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       #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    We actually do have data to back that up. Gartner and Canalys both show that dumbphones far outsell smartphones especially in third world countries.

    ...

    The Veer is a brilliant phone to sell to someone who is used to a dumbphone. HP needs to hire point of sales temps to man AT&T and Best Buy stores.

    The problem is that the typical store rep is all about showing his favorite YouTube videos, Facebook, and the internet. They are all about high-end phones. They just can't hide how much they love their iPhones and Androids.

    The dumbphone battlefield is hand-to-hand at the store level. These are customers who have phones because they are necessary evils. Show them how a Veer is every bit as tiny and simple to use as what they have.

    If the HP temps spent a couple weekends in the stores, the BB and ATT reps would see that the Veer is a no-brainer sale to a dumbphone owner.
    One problem... the Veer requires a data plan and as a consumer, if I'm paying for a data plan, I want a better experience than what the Veer offers.

    Also, i think a "dumb phone" owner wants to keep it simple and the touchscreen dialpad may not fit that requirement. Try selling the Veer to any 50+ where their eyesight isn't what it was when they were 25
  8. #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    The problem is that the typical store rep is all about showing his favorite YouTube videos, Facebook, and the internet. They are all about high-end phones. They just can't hide how much they love their iPhones and Androids.
    Most sales reps are young and this is the generation they are used to..It's hard to appeal to the "dumbphone" market to sell them a phone. I can understand why reps do this, you go with what's easy and natural to you.

    It's easy to sell someone on something you know and understand.
    Ex HP webOS Tech Support

    5Ts: Five ways to get your webOS tablet working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/5Ts

    6Ts: Six ways to get your webOS phone working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/6Ts
  9. #49  
    Quote Originally Posted by genearch View Post
    Try selling the Veer to any 50+ where their eyesight isn't what it was when they were 25
    Is 50+ HP's target?
    Just call me Berd.
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       #50  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle View Post
    Is 50+ HP's target?
    No, but who do you think is the demographic of the dumb phone?

    As the previous poster suggested, Palm could convert dumbphone users, I see it as doubtful.

    Youth + required data plan = reduced opportunity for the Veer
  11. #51  
    Quote Originally Posted by genearch View Post
    No, but who do you think is the demographic of the dumb phone?

    As the previous poster suggested, Palm could convert dumbphone users, I see it as doubtful.

    Youth + required data plan = reduced opportunity for the Veer
    Why do we conclude the youth are the only dumb-phone users?
    I'd say 90% of my friends and associates between the age of 25-50 use dumb-phones.

    I've said much in this thread and in other threads; I see the 25-40 year old business professionals who will also be carrying a Tablet.
    Now that they have a tablet, there won't be a need for big phone.
    Just call me Berd.
  12. #52  
    I'm starting to like all the speculation!

    There is the "This is what HP's target audience is and who they are selling X device to" and then there is the "This is what HP's target audience should be and who they should be marketing X device to."

    It's starting to make life interesting for me.
    Ex HP webOS Tech Support

    5Ts: Five ways to get your webOS tablet working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/5Ts

    6Ts: Six ways to get your webOS phone working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/6Ts
  13. #53  
    And to clarify my statement about their "generation."

    If you are working in a cell phone store and between the age of 20-35 you are likely not using a dumb phone.
    Ex HP webOS Tech Support

    5Ts: Five ways to get your webOS tablet working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/5Ts

    6Ts: Six ways to get your webOS phone working again: http://www.hpwebos.com/6Ts
  14. #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by genearch View Post
    One problem... the Veer requires a data plan and as a consumer, if I'm paying for a data plan, I want a better experience than what the Veer offers.

    Also, i think a "dumb phone" owner wants to keep it simple and the touchscreen dialpad may not fit that requirement. Try selling the Veer to any 50+ where their eyesight isn't what it was when they were 25
    Keep in mind that it's also the same plan that a feature phone "requires " right now. If you're using one of those feature phones and don't like the monsters that saturate the current smartphone market, than this could easily appeal to you.
  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by Orion Antares View Post
    Keep in mind that it's also the same plan that a feature phone "requires " right now. If you're using one of those feature phones and don't like the monsters that saturate the current smartphone market, than this could easily appeal to you.
    No the Premium Data charge specificly is for activating smartphones not feature phones.

    "The Premium Data add-on charge is required for smartphones...Sprint smartphones currently are: Android, BlackBerry, Palm, Instinct and Windows Mobile phones..."

    "If you would like an unlimited data plan, for a lower rate, and avoid this charge, you may want to check out some of our feature phones which do not require the $10 Premium Data add-on charge."


    The only exception is the special offer on the Samsung Replenish waiving the $10 fee:
    Meet the Replenish | Introducing the new Samsung Replenish™

    A "free" Replenish from Best Buy also saves $10 a month compared to other smartphones.
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by milominderbinder View Post
    No the Premium Data charge specificly is for activating smartphones not feature phones.

    "The Premium Data add-on charge is required for smartphones...Sprint smartphones currently are: Android, BlackBerry, Palm, Instinct and Windows Mobile phones..."

    "If you would like an unlimited data plan, for a lower rate, and avoid this charge, you may want to check out some of our feature phones which do not require the $10 Premium Data add-on charge."


    The only exception is the special offer on the Samsung Replenish waiving the $10 fee:
    Meet the Replenish | Introducing the new Samsung Replenish™

    A "free" Replenish from Best Buy also saves $10 a month compared to other smartphones.
    Sprint doesn't have the Veer.
  17. #57  
    Quote Originally Posted by Orion Antares View Post
    Keep in mind that it's also the same plan that a feature phone "requires " right now. If you're using one of those feature phones and don't like the monsters that saturate the current smartphone market, than this could easily appeal to you.
    What carrier are you talking about? milo knows that the veers not on sprint.

    A feature phone DOES NOT required data.

    Selling my Palm things: just make an offer: http://forums.webosnation.com/market...nd-offers.html
  18. #58  
    My daughter's Samsung Alias2 requires data, I pay $10/mo. My wife's LG Voyager requires data, I go with PPGB. she never uses the web. It depends on the carrier what requires data.

    IMO, there is a market for the veer. I think that there is a case to be made, which others have stated. I will adopt the wait and see, since it's on AT&T. I personally want a pre3 and am waiting for it to drop on Verizon. I finally decided not to burn my upgrade on a pre2.
    IIIXE>Clie:N710C>N760C>NX60>Treo[600>650>700]>Centro>Pre+>Pre2&Touchpad 32GB
    webOS Themes: star-trek-universe star-trek-future Future Trek for Tpad

    My CV: http://visualcv.com/egadgetguy
  19. #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by finngirl View Post
    But at 40+ I just can't see the screen.

    If I hold it away from my face to read it, it is too far away to read. If i bring it near, I can't read it without glasses, but I don't always have my reading glasses, unless I am reading.
    Your problem is that you are in the between stage. Just wait another year and then you will need your glasses ALL of the time and this issue will be rolved!
  20. #60  
    Young Professional:
    'Yeah, I'm here to buy the Touchpad.'

    Rep:
    'I see you're using a basic phone.
    For only 50 cents a day we can get you into a phone that will keep everything you do on your Touchpad in perfect sync.
    That way everything you do on your TP will be on your phone.
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