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  1. cmahy's Avatar
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    #21  
    Thanks for the article. I get a bit worried about the part where they say "Since webOS is so refined...." --> as much as I want that to be the case, I know it's not yet (particularly since the touchpad will be the first on WebOS 3.x).

    Always better to outshine the expectations vs. deliver short.
    Palm History: Sony Clie T615C --> T|X --> Pre+ --> Pre3 Aspirations -->
  2. #22  
    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    While I believe, STRONGLY, that HP will wind up suing RIM over thier IP infrignement, I'm not sure that RIM will lose market share because of this, and I am sure that RIM couldnt care any less what their peers think of this - they care about what their customers think of this.
    There are many more reasons why they are going to lose marketshare, but I think losing respect from the industry would eventually trickle down to consumers thinking RIM just does cheap knockoffs.

    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    Despite the media trashing the Playbook for the lack of core applications, the hardware and features do seem to be incredibly well done, and the hands on reviews all seem to state just that.. with the new updates rolling in to add those core applications, they may have a complete tablet in that 7" formfactor by midsummer, with no one else competing at that size- you have to believe that there will be a real demand for that amongst the current BB users.
    Seeing how they rushed the Playbook to market, they'll probably have those updates in this summer. However, isn't HP supposed to be coming out with a 7" tablet this fall? If that is the case, HP's 7" tablet would pose a direct threat to the Playbook. It would have webOS refined from a few months of tablet webOS on the market.

    Quote Originally Posted by LCGuy View Post
    BTW, I just saw a review with their chat application, and it looks and behaves SO much like the TouchPad's implementation, its scary.

    I'm of the opinion that if you expect something, it's not scary. I expected RIM to continue copying webOS in their Playbook, so seeing their chat application look so much like the Touchpad's implementation is not scary.
  3. samab's Avatar
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    #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by rsanchez1 View Post
    There are many more reasons why they are going to lose marketshare, but I think losing respect from the industry would eventually trickle down to consumers thinking RIM just does cheap knockoffs.
    That's because the people that are dissing RIM really have no idea what they are talking about.

    RIM can copy everybody easily --- why? Because QNX is a POSIX-certified Commercial Off the Shelf RTOS. It is meant to be used in a standardized and interchangeable environment. We are not talking about Microsoft advertising Windows 2000 to be POSIX subsystem "compliant" --- QNX is actually POSIX-certified, a huge difference.

    Today's demo of Playbook running Android apps via a Dalvik compatible vm --- is the direct result of having a POSIX certified COTS operating system. If you have an OS that is certified to known standards and you have the software engineers who know what they are doing --- then it is not that difficult to port a AIR/Flash vm, java vm, and a dalvik vm onto your OS.

    But nobody can copy the Playbook at all --- simply because none of the other mobile OS'es are RTOS'es. Your video will stutter in the background. Simple as that. Hell, my desktop pc will stutter my videos every time I launch my word processor.

    It is a very simple concept to understand and if these people don't understand it --- then their respect is not needed.
  4. #24  
    RTOS = Real Time Operating System

    For those who didn't know.
    "The more I learn, the more I realize just how little I really do know!" -Albert Einstein

  5. #25  
    Akitayo and ilovedessert for posters of the year. These 2 always have good stuff....keep up the good work guys!
  6. ogeneo's Avatar
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    #26  
    Interesting read, but this is a bit of a stretch

    Once the TouchPad is released, it's going to compete directly with Apple's iPad since its screen size, battery life, and form factor are virtually identical to the iPad, albeit a bit heavier and bulkier. And we all know how well the iPad is selling
    They are somehow inferring that the TouchPad will compete with and sell like the iPad.

    Not happening....

    They may get a niche, but I'd be surprised to see it sell more than the current Android offerings
  7. #27  
    The Touchpad will primarily compete with the iPad anyway, simply because HP did away with what differentiates WebOS from other OS'.... the gesture area.

    I played with the Playbook today and the gesture area made for a wonderfully smooth, easy to use interface. Then i played a video that was preloaded on the device and the clarity and seemlessness of the video bested any portable device ive seen.

    HP is going backwards with its innovation if you ask me. I only hope that the 7 inch version brings the gesture area back. It was one "novelty" feature that i literally never got tired of.
  8. #28  
    I saw the Playbook commercial and was amazed. They have a gesture like our minimizing our cards. Swipe from the bottom "gesture" area up and it gives you a small card view. I just saw that and was amazed!

    They also seemed to steal the Android pull down menu/notification type deal. At least from what I've viewed in the commercial.

    Blackberry used to be a leader... And now they're copying everything? That's unfortunate..

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
    Sprint Love
  9. #29  
    Heres my tweet just minutes ago

    http://twitter.com/sketch42_/status/65577006825340929

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  10. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by samab View Post
    That's because the people that are dissing RIM really have no idea what they are talking about.

    RIM can copy everybody easily --- why? Because QNX is a POSIX-certified Commercial Off the Shelf RTOS. It is meant to be used in a standardized and interchangeable environment. We are not talking about Microsoft advertising Windows 2000 to be POSIX subsystem "compliant" --- QNX is actually POSIX-certified, a huge difference.

    Today's demo of Playbook running Android apps via a Dalvik compatible vm --- is the direct result of having a POSIX certified COTS operating system. If you have an OS that is certified to known standards and you have the software engineers who know what they are doing --- then it is not that difficult to port a AIR/Flash vm, java vm, and a dalvik vm onto your OS.

    But nobody can copy the Playbook at all --- simply because none of the other mobile OS'es are RTOS'es. Your video will stutter in the background. Simple as that. Hell, my desktop pc will stutter my videos every time I launch my word processor.

    It is a very simple concept to understand and if these people don't understand it --- then their respect is not needed.
    Just because the Playbook can copy everyone else, should it? Shouldn't it use COTS, POSIX certification, RTOS, and all that other technical jargon to make a unique operating system, instead of taking bits and pieces from everyone else, with the cards system being the most blatant knock-off?

    I'll tell you the real reason nobody can copy the Playbook: there's nothing to copy, there's nothing there that someone else hasn't already done.
  11. knsnik's Avatar
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    #31  
    oohhhhh you are soooo right...that is just wrong! [QUOTE=sketch42;2952777]Heres my tweet just minutes ago

    [url]

    [i]-- Sent from my Palm Pre using [url=
  12. samab's Avatar
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    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by rsanchez1 View Post
    Just because the Playbook can copy everyone else, should it? Shouldn't it use COTS, POSIX certification, RTOS, and all that other technical jargon to make a unique operating system, instead of taking bits and pieces from everyone else, with the cards system being the most blatant knock-off?

    I'll tell you the real reason nobody can copy the Playbook: there's nothing to copy, there's nothing there that someone else hasn't already done.
    Your scenario works only if you are a Microsoft size monopolist (and Apple lately) and use your size to boss the whole world around by using your proprietary technology as defacto standard. You have Microsoft rejecting java and Apple rejecting flash. RIM has both java and flash.

    The real reason nobody can copy the Playbook --- you have to yank out the general purpose kernel and put in a RTOS kernel. Simple as that. There is really no magic on how the Playbook can do their version of multitasking.
  13. #33  
    RTOS isn't always magic but QNX has got pretty good credentials. Windows CE is also an RTOS so don't forgot that when you talk up RTOS that an RTOS alone does not make for a great user experience. All that RTOS really does is make jitter less of a problem and make performance more predictable. The alternative is to have non-predictable lag and jitter like most OS's - and that's acceptable to a point as long as the system is fast enough that the casual user doesn't notice.
  14. #34  
    HI,

    the more that I looked at this article I was sure I had read it before....I had at the following threat about a week ago....well at least I'm not totally nuts, LOL,...only partly nuts...

    take care all, Jay
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
  15. lumens's Avatar
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    #35  
    I just watched the commercial today. I was really astounded how much it looked like Web OS. It's just a blatant ripoff.
  16. #36  
    Quote Originally Posted by ilovedessert View Post
    HI,

    the more that I looked at this article I was sure I had read it before....I had at the following threat about a week ago....well at least I'm not totally nuts, LOL,...only partly nuts...

    take care all, Jay
    Yea I couldve sworn you posted this last week

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
  17. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by sketch42 View Post
    Yea I couldve sworn you posted this last week

    -- Sent from my Palm Pre using Forums
    Hi,

    I may have lost my mind but I'm not crazy...am I?? LOL!

    Take care,

    jay
    Please Support Research into Fibromyalgia, Chronic Pain and Spinal Injuries. If You Suffer from These, Consider Joining or Better Yet Forming a Support Group. No One Should Suffer from the Burden of Chronic Pain, Jay M. S. Founder, Leesburg Fibromyalgia/Resources Group
  18. samab's Avatar
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    #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by Unclevanya View Post
    RTOS isn't always magic but QNX has got pretty good credentials. Windows CE is also an RTOS so don't forgot that when you talk up RTOS that an RTOS alone does not make for a great user experience. All that RTOS really does is make jitter less of a problem and make performance more predictable. The alternative is to have non-predictable lag and jitter like most OS's - and that's acceptable to a point as long as the system is fast enough that the casual user doesn't notice.
    As I said it earlier, there is no magic to it.

    All it means is that the software designers can figure it out what is the %age of CPU usage for doing a particular task and the OS can guarantee to give that %age of CPU time to that particular task. That task for phones is usually the baseband radio --- no matter how you play with your phone, you are never going to be allow to starve the baseband radio of CPU time and cause the dropping of a phone call. RIM just extended that to the video player for the Playbook. No magic to it.

    Windows CE, Nokia's OS, and "legacy" blackberry OS are all RTOS'es that are custom made and very strip down. That's the big problem --- they are missing key pieces in their OS'es that prevent them to put desktop-type software on it. They can operate the baseband radio with no drop calls, but consumers demand more than that.
  19.    #39  
    Is RIM Going to Be the Mobile Industry’s Next Palm?

    This article is different about the topic we are talking about here , give us a clue where is RIM going to: The writer compared actual RIM situation with the before Palm, and not with the current HP webOS.

    However in some way supports this thread: RIM 'Approximated' webOS. Lost some respect in the industry, we are discussing about.

    Quote:

    “But the worry is that RIM is losing market share and that these new product offerings won’t have a meaningful impact on carriers or customers, both of which are increasingly shifting away from RIM products.”

    If you are a RIM BB customer , you are welcome to get HP webOS products and to these forums.

    Link:http://blogs.forbes.com/erikamorphy/...rys-next-palm/
  20. #40  
    Quote Originally Posted by Unclevanya View Post
    RTOS isn't always magic but QNX has got pretty good credentials. Windows CE is also an RTOS so don't forgot that when you talk up RTOS that an RTOS alone does not make for a great user experience. All that RTOS really does is make jitter less of a problem and make performance more predictable. The alternative is to have non-predictable lag and jitter like most OS's - and that's acceptable to a point as long as the system is fast enough that the casual user doesn't notice.
    Exactly, I've never noticed bad lag and jitter in most OS's I've used, and when I have, it wasn't anything some extra RAM couldn't fix. This guy keeps pushing RTOS as a magic bullet, and it makes me think he has no idea what he's talking about (well, maybe he only knows about POSIX, RTOS, COTS, etc. but then you know what they say, if all you have is a hammer, everything starts looking like a nail).
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