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  1. #21  
    does 8mp equal 1080p?

    would a 1.2mhz atom handle it?

    there ya go.
  2. #22  
    Did anyone notice Samsung's new purchase from Arm? Its a licensing deal that might put Samsung ahead of others...

    Samsung Adopts ARM’s Next Generation Mali-T604 GPU | Android Phone Fans



    Samsung Orion dual-core ARM Cortex-A9 chip spotted in the wild -- Engadget
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    does 8mp equal 1080p?

    would a 1.2mhz atom handle it?

    there ya go.
    My 1.6Ghz atom processor at home handles 1080p bluray rips just fine becaue the GPU can do the decoding...

    and yes.... 8mp can do 1080p... there are tons of devices like this that do... example:

    Amazon.com: Sanyo VPC-HD2000A Xacti 8MP High Definition 1080P (Black): Camera & Photo: Reviews, Prices & more

    http://www.beachaudio.com/Dxg/Dxg-581v-p-194831.html
  4. #25  
    We're probably looking at 720P at least screens coming next year which would eclipse apple's screen. Not 1080p. Might video record in 1080p (and probably look awful) but that's about it.
  5. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    does 8mp equal 1080p?

    would a 1.2mhz atom handle it?

    there ya go.
    Why would a well-built device rely on a CPU to perform a 100% graphics function? You realize that many phone manufacturers (Samsung especially) have figured out how to offload graphics processing to a GPU, don't you? Of course Palm wouldn't be one of those yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    1080p on a small screen would be stupid, and it would crush the CPU.
    As to your inability to figure out a reason why a portable computing device could use 1080p, I don't know what to say. I do know that there are more and more portable devices pushing HD-quality video to HD-capable monitors - full HD camcorders come to mind. Should they not have screens on those because it "would be stupid" to play back HD on such a small screen?
  6. #27  
    By the time you get the processor, memory chip, radios, camera, screen, and battery in that thin case you wont that room for any USB or earphone connectors. After reading about thin battery technology I dont think a battery is available that can power a device that thin for any length of time. The thin batteries that could be used in that small a phone cost 10 times more that conventional batteries. I dont think I can afford a smartphone like that.
    Palm m130 > Verizon Trēo 650 > Verizon Trēo 755p > Verizon Palm Prē Plus > TouchPad > Verizon Palm Prē 2
    ~ The Future's Just Not What it Used To Be ~
  7. #28  
    Quote Originally Posted by rmausser View Post
    The flood of Android devices will only help Palm and WebOS.

    Come Mid 2011, people are going to be sick of Android. Its gonna be so passe on so many devices.

    They are flooding the market. The exclusivity of the iPhone is what keeps it so popular.
    Your making no sense since the average Android users don't even know what OS they are using. My friend she has a Droid Inc and didn't know she had an Android phone. It will take a miracle to help Palm and WebOS...lets hope for your sake they can pull one off at CES.

    Sfm Evo
  8. Helidos's Avatar
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    #29  
    All this could the cpu / gpu can't keep up next year is the year of dual core Tegra 2 1ghz+ cortex A9 chips along with Nvidia graphics. Not to mention the Samsung Orion which can drive 2 displays on the device and a third through the built in HDMI 1.3a interface.

    Heres the press release from sept 7 about the Orion chip.

    Ya I see no issue with next years phones driving 1080 screens encoding/decoding etc on the go. Stop looking in the HP/Palms windows and look in the other guys too you will see what tech is headed our way.
  9. #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Why would a well-built device rely on a CPU to perform a 100% graphics function? You realize that many phone manufacturers (Samsung especially) have figured out how to offload graphics processing to a GPU, don't you? Of course Palm wouldn't be one of those yet.

    As to your inability to figure out a reason why a portable computing device could use 1080p, I don't know what to say. I do know that there are more and more portable devices pushing HD-quality video to HD-capable monitors - full HD camcorders come to mind. Should they not have screens on those because it "would be stupid" to play back HD on such a small screen?
    This isn't worth arguing about, but was is my thinking:

    I used the atom as an example because it is more powerful and available with a dual core. And yet, the dual-core atom I have even struggles sometimes with full screen 720p some times, and yes there is a GPU along for the ride. But, I also have a big freaking battery to power all that, and the notebook weighs 4 pounds. That's a lot to cram into a smartphone.

    When you think of the 1.2Ghz cpu in that supposed spec list, it's not a dual core powerhouse and it doesn't have an 8-cell battery behind it.

    Sure, the cameras (and maybe even the 1.2ghz CPU listed for that phone) can probably shoot HD at 25 or 30 frames per second. The really good dedicated "flip" cameras can shoot 60 pfs. THe crappy ones do 15 or 20 and the results stutter like an old silent movie. It wouldn't make sense to create a "flagship" phone that shoots at 15fps and requires a ton of storage for a few minutes of recording, especially when the battery would also drain rapidly. It makes far more sense to do what Apple and HTC have done, focusing on 720p and "near HD" resolutions that find the balace between the small screen and palying it again on a big screen. No one would be able to tell if it was showing higher resolution than 720p unless they were watching it on a 50" TV. And at that point, fps would impact quality much more so than more resolution.

    The HD cameras you are talking about have dedicated h.264 processors in them and are purose built for that. If you opened one up and crammed a smart phone in it you'd have something twice as big, and needing twice the battery.

    You can't assume that a camera and phone that are the same size are therefore capable of the same things. That phone may have a GPU, and it may help, but we know that h.264 takes a ton of horsepower. If you rip a standard DVD, and then use something like Handbrake to encode it as mpeg2 and then with h.264, you will see that the h.264 encoding takes much longer because it is doing much more

    I'm sure that full 1080p is on the horizon for phones and other devices, but I also believe you will see Apple leading that charge, and battery tech will need to improve greatly before that can happen.

    I could be wrong, and I frequently am. But, I believe that a phone with those specs couldn't do more than 15-20fps, and that the current practical limit is holding 720p. IMHO
  10. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    This isn't worth arguing about, but was is my thinking

    ...

    I could be wrong, and I frequently am.
    Just check out the specs/documentation on the TI OMAP 4 Processor - it's already in the hands of manufacturers for EMD. It play's 1080p natively on up to 3 displays and uses less power than the TI OMAP 3. Samsung has similar CPU/GPUs in EMD too. It's really not a reach at all - it's the next generation technology and will be standard in all the higher end phones.
  11. #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by Cantaffordit View Post
    This isn't worth arguing about, but was is my thinking:

    I used the atom as an example because it is more powerful and available with a dual core. And yet, the dual-core atom I have even struggles sometimes with full screen 720p some times, and yes there is a GPU along for the ride. But, I also have a big freaking battery to power all that, and the notebook weighs 4 pounds. That's a lot to cram into a smartphone.

    I could be wrong, and I frequently am. But, I believe that a phone with those specs couldn't do more than 15-20fps, and that the current practical limit is holding 720p. IMHO
    I have a single core atom with a GPU that plays full bitrate 1080P bluray without a hitch. Point is, with the right hardware (a GPU) and software drivers... it is possible and CPU housepower isnt necessarily required. Anyway, Kupe has mentioned this.
  12. #33  
    need to put webos on every type of phone... just like they did with android. then they will finally know that webos is the superior os.
  13. #34  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post


    The idea that HPalm is going to launch one or more superphones next year that will wow everyone is highly suspect. First of all, HP has never done that before. Second of all, it's not like the competition is standing still here. It's hard to imagine HPalm catching up and surpassing the competition when they don't even appear to be in the race. The Pre 2 looks like something that was supposed to be released about a year ago.

    I think HP is taking a cold hard look at what they can accomplish with webOS going forward and my guess is that a superphone isn't something they will be doing.
    so hp is gonna announce several new phones at ces and none of them will be a high end "super" phone? i find that very hard to believe.
  14. #35  
    the reason for 1080p is to play it on a big screen tv not just a phone.

    i think the real issue is can Palm keep up with the jones in areas where it needs to. The the bottom line is the bar is continually being raised. camera resolution is just one of many standards. Like screen resolution, etc. i listed the things i would put in a device to wow consumers. 1080p was one of my wow features. to me it's too bad palm didn't come out with it first and leapfrog the competition. But i think what's important is that the bar continually get's raised and just like hd tvs they didn't stay at 720p as the standard for long. So when Palm decides to release their superphone they should consider things like 1080p so as not to be considered behind the curve soon after. personally i think it probably varies by feature. for example 1800i may be good enough. 720p may not be. maybe to the average consumer it sounds like a lower standard and with equal devices they'll choose the 1080 one. maybe 1080p vs 1080i is a distinction without a difference to most people and thus they don't care. But part of it may be more about salesmanship. For example you can price a house at $795,000 and one at $800,500 and the former may get more people visiting cause people tend to search for homes under a certain round number.

    by the way. LG device was announced recently. with 1080p camera. Nvidia Tegra 2 series dual core processor. http://www.bgr.com/2010/11/16/lgs-fl...tegra-2-1080p/
    Last edited by blackmagic01; 11/16/2010 at 11:20 PM.
  15. jwinn35's Avatar
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    #36  
    I hate to say it but themore I'm seeing things happen the more I feel like webOS isn't going to be able to compete. Everything is moving to slow.
  16. #37  
    Quote Originally Posted by kumquatsrus View Post
    so hp is gonna announce several new phones at ces and none of them will be a high end "super" phone? i find that very hard to believe.
    I'd bet that it will be a "super phone" but likely in comparison to the Pre 2. If it it's got the best specs out there i wouldn't expect it to hold the title very long. I think they are chasing the market now.

    Actually, My gut says whatever they release will likely be a me too sort of device. That is it will only match what's out there already but won't exceed them. They'll copy they won't lead. Like When the EVO came out and the Iphone 4 they were clear leaps above the competition in terms of specs and features. I think to compete Palm has to be setting the standard rather then meeting the standard. Like i could see them announce a phone at CES that spec wise matches the iphone. Then like the pre they'll release it in June. Right when the iphone get's it's upgrade which will surpass whatever palm put out. Cause i'm sure apple, htc, motorola, etc are thinking about the next thing that will get released next year that would exceed what they put out now.
  17. #38  
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmagic01 View Post
    Cause i'm sure apple, htc, motorola, etc are thinking about the next thing that will get released next year that would exceed what they put out now.
    Not only "thinking" on it, they are likely already "working" on it.
  18. #39  
    Quote Originally Posted by taharka View Post
    Not only "thinking" on it, they are likely already "working" on it.
    yes. that is pretty much my thinking too. It's my understanding that these things take months and months to go from concept to a real phone. And that companies plan multiple years out. so i'm quite sure, they are currently working on their next big idea whatever that may be. Now Apple may slow down a bit and just tweak or spec bump but its not like we don't all know 4G is coming at some point. they typically have spec bumps after a model change. I'd bet they'll focus a bit more on the ipad. But some of it's partly predictable. For HP's sake i just wonder if while, for example Apple, is working on the next thing, HP, is currently working on what apple (or anyone else) already released. I hope not for their sake. Like if you're Mercedes you can skimp on a feature here. But i remember back in the day when Lexus and Infiiti launched. they didn't just match Mercedes, they added tons of features at no extra cost, They had ridiculous warranties and unheard of customer service. I think HP needs to do like Lexus did at that moment. Lexus now? who knows. But at the time it got them noticed and got them sales.
    Last edited by blackmagic01; 11/17/2010 at 04:25 PM.
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