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  1. #61  
    Quote Originally Posted by shotyme View Post
    webOS has more going on in the background then any other OS, which taxes the CPU, in addition to the GUI. For that you need good hardware. You need both a faster processor and for the GPU to render the UI.
    That only speaks to OS inefficiency. Smart OSes (and developers for those OSes) have only what is needed running in the background, not 'more.' Android 2.0+ doesn't have this problem yet it can have just as many background processes (and typically more, in my experience) than the Pre.

    Using the GPU to render the OS is a start, but introduces it's own inefficiencies since a large portion of the OS is non-graphical in nature. Again, it takes some real thought to avoid brute-force patterns in code - like how the current version of WebOS still deals with graphics.
  2. #62  
    Quote Originally Posted by shotyme View Post
    webOS has more going on in the background then any other OS, which taxes the CPU, in addition to the GUI.
    I would disagree. I typically have many more processes/applications running in the background on my EVO than my Pre. It amazes me how people continue to make statements like this based of the visual perception of webOS multitasking and some ignorance of other mobile OS's.

    I won't delve into the GPU issue because I think it is absurd that the situation is still as it was over a year ago.

    Also, people tend (in general) to complain loudly with regards to hardware issues... because something is obviously broke/not working correctly/etc...
    Where as people (generally) will grumble/gripe (more quietly) about software issues. Especially just "lack of features" or sometimes "slow" responses.
    I think if you look around you will see a fair amount of this with regards to software concerns.

    EDIT:
    Quote Originally Posted by shotyme View Post
    webOS is a graphic rich interface
    BTW how is webOS any more of a "graphic rich interface" than say a Android, iOS or WM device?
    Just because it uses a visual card system for multitasking?
    Last edited by gmanvbva; 08/25/2010 at 09:49 AM.
  3. #63  
    Quote Originally Posted by gmanvbva View Post
    I would disagree. I typically have many more processes/applications running in the background on my EVO than my Pre. It amazes me how people continue to make statements like this based of the visual perception of webOS multitasking and some ignorance of other mobile OS's.

    I won't delve into the GPU issue because I think it is absurd that the situation is still as it was over a year ago.

    Also, people tend (in general) to complain loudly with regards to hardware issues... because something is obviously broke/not working correctly/etc...
    Where as people (generally) will grumble/gripe (more quietly) about software issues. Especially just "lack of features" or sometimes "slow" responses.
    I think if you look around you will see a fair amount of this with regards to software concerns.

    EDIT:

    BTW how is webOS any more of a "graphic rich interface" than say a Android, iOS or WM device?
    Just because it uses a visual card system for multitasking?
    Bingo.

    Android has a hell of a lot more going on in the background than WebOS does at any given moment.

    Now here's where it gets really embarrassing :

    Android is run inside a Virtual Machine, which generally means, it's going to run slower than native code designed for a specific piece of hardware, ie, Palm/Apple.

    What Clutch is failing to understand is, with a custom OS written for a particular piece of hardware, ie, Pre, should be much faster across the board than a JackofAllDevices OS like Android.

    To take it back on topic :

    All of the Palm updates have been incremental @ best, and quite frankly, haven't even addressed 50% of the issues with WebOS.

    Until Palm gets a freaking SDK out and allows access to specific parts of the hardware, the apps will suck and be leaps and bounds LESS functional than Apple or Google counterparts.

    To be honest, if you stack the updates side by side, It's pretty embarrassing for Palm.
  4. ChanceNC's Avatar
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    #64  
    Quote Originally Posted by slydog43 View Post
    I think the real question (if your on VZ or at&t) is if Android is taking up all the Carrrier bandwidth for updates. I think that VZ doesnt care enough about WebOS to let our update go through until most of the Android phones are updated. I know that the HTC Incredible is waiting for 2.2. I just want my VZ 1.4.5 Please, please, please.
    Excellent point which I hadn't given any thought...totally plausible.
  5. #65  
    If that was the case, ATT would have the update out, no?
  6. #66  
    Carriers have the option – free of charge – to use Google's servers for OTA updates if they want, and I believe many do.
  7. #67  
    What is irony? Start off with a critique of posts stating they are unfounded theories and the fact they they are not "objective"...
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    ok. It amazes me how comparisons between the speed of android os and webOS are being "objectively" with out testing them both on the same exact hardware. I can read all of these posts knocking webOS speed in comparison to android...but with out an unbiased test comparing the two... It's all a bunch of theories to me.
    ...state your own non-objective comparison...
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    I just loaded the updated uberG1 kernel on my wifels phone...and her pre is flying. Put webOS on an evo and compare both ....then lets talk about pro's and cons.
    ...and finish with one's own unfounded theories.
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    if evo users had the option of running webOS on evo... You would have thousands of evos running webOS today.if you could have all of your favorite android apps portedto webos... The amount of users running webOS on an evo would be a major embaressment to google.

    if android was an option to load on pre...you would have a few curios geeks loading it for giggles...then wiping and loading webOS. Mo
    Great stuff.

    Here are some unfounded theories of my own:
    1. webOS fans would likely flock to an EVO with webOS because they are tired of the crap hardware that is the pre.
    2. Android fans would likely NOT flock to a pre with Android because not even webOS fans want the crap hardware that is the pre.
  8. #68  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    I apoligize if I missed this on this thread. In an attempt to bring it back ontopic.... What was the latest update google pushed to the G1 handset?

    also, I would love to see a thread comparing the palm pre to the google G1.
    preferably... One of the smartphone os experts on this thread posting it.
    any takers? I honestly think it would be an intersting comparison.
    It probably would be interesting but I'm not sure how useful. The problem is people don't care about how a new product compares to the initial version of the product it is trying to replace (compete against). They care about how it compares to the current version of the product it is going up against.

    Pre vs iPhone 1 makes no difference in the current market. The same goes for Pre vs G1 and any other Pre vs [old 1st gen device]. It really just doesn't matter.
  9. #69  
    Quote Originally Posted by taharka View Post
    What is irony? Start off with a critique of posts stating they are unfounded theories and the fact they they are not "objective"...
    ...state your own non-objective comparison......and finish with one's own unfounded theories.Great stuff.

    Here are some unfounded theories of my own:
    1. webOS fans would likely flock to an EVO with webOS because they are tired of the crap hardware that is the pre.
    2. Android fans would likely NOT flock to a pre with Android because not even webOS fans want the crap hardware that is the pre.
    You missed #3:
    3. EVO users with WebOS on their device would become frustrated with WebOS' lack of functionality, APIs, and apps and would switch back to Android.
  10. #70  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    Put webOS on an evo and compare both ....then lets talk about pro's and cons.
    Ok. For fun and since we are being ridiculous...

    EVO with webOS

    Pro's
    webOS runs "better" with a 1GHz processor.
    webOS looks "better" on a 4" screen.
    Battery life is slightly improved due to a 1500mah battery.

    Con's
    You can't type anything because webOS does not have a virtual keyboard (and the EVO does not have a physical one)
    ____ does not work.
    ____ App is not available.
    ____ feature is not available.

    etc...
  11. #71  
    BTW (honest question). A bit off topic... but how is battery life on the new uberkernel?
    Previous versions did very little to help battery life in my experience.

    EDIT: Nevermind... I see that Uber1G was just released today... Probably not a whole lot of data on battery life yet.
  12. #72  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    YOU, and others on this thread are harshly criticizing Palm and webOS for its shortcomings on its first gen device running its new mobile OS.
    No, Palm is criticized for the shortcomings of its curren device running its current mobile OS. The world (market) does not care if it is the first gen or 100th iteration. Perhaps we should just celebrate the success Palm OS used to have rather that looking at what is currently happening.
  13. #73  
    Don't get the scenario, Clutch. Are you saying if we take all of the advantages of WebOS, fix the disadvantages, then combine it with all of the advantages of Android, but on top-notch Android hardware...that Android users would want to "switch"?

    As for the G1, it's crappy that it got pushed to the back of the line, and both Google and T-Mobile should take some heat for that.
  14. #74  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    No. im saying that if you took webOS in current form, throw a good virtual keyboard on it... on get it to run on an evo... thousands of current evo owners would do exactly that and it would be all over these forums.
    Why would they want to give up an OS that actually has applications and improves at a breakneck pace?
  15. #75  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    No. im saying that if you took webOS in current form, throw a good virtual keyboard on it... on get it to run on an evo... thousands of current evo owners would do exactly that and it would be all over these forums.
    If by "thousands", you mean the pre-existing WebOS people who defected to Evo because they had a Sprint Premier upgrade and no news from Palm, then I might agree to some extent.

    But WebOS is leaking people to Android, not the other way around, and hardware is just part of the problem. The fact is both Apple and Android users would have to give up a lot to come onboard WebOS in any hardware form. A whoooooooooole lot. That's a considerable barrier to entry.
  16. #76  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    If by "thousands", you mean the pre-existing WebOS people who defected to Evo because they had a Sprint Premier upgrade and no news from Palm, then I might agree to some extent.
    I don't know if I'd even agree with that. Android (and iOS, actually) is pretty good at doing the things WebOS does well. WebOS isn't very good at the things Android does well and Gingerbread is shaping up to lap WebOS completely.
  17. #77  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    I don't know if I'd even agree with that. Android (and iOS, actually) is pretty good at doing the things WebOS does well. WebOS isn't very good at the things Android does well and Gingerbread is shaping up to lap WebOS completely.
    Yeah, but people who stuck around WebOS long enough to get an Evo generally liked the OS, so Palm stands a god chance of reeling them back in with a much beefier, more responsive 2.0 flagship handset.

    The only platform that really has any sort of lock-in at this point is iPhone, and that is due to their successful ecosystem and the money you sink into it to play with it.
  18. #78  
    We've been over this before....

    ~6 months after the G1 was released. The myTouch 3G was released with Android 1.5/1.6.
    ~12 months after the G1 was released. There were several handsets (Droid, Hero, Moment, MyTouch, etc.) released with Android 1.5/1.6. And SDK was released in this time frame.
    ~15 months after the G1 was released the Nexus One was released with Android 2.1/2.2.
    ~18 months after the G1 was release numerous Android 2.X handsets are on the market and selling very well.

    Android as an OS was progressing pretty well. There was a huge difference from Android 1.0/1.0 to 1.5/1.6 and another large advancement from 1.5/1.6 to 2.1/2.2.
  19. #79  
    Quote Originally Posted by gmanvbva View Post
    We've been over this before....

    ~6 months after the G1 was released. The myTouch 3G was released with Android 1.5/1.6.
    ~12 months after the G1 was released. There were several handsets (Droid, Hero, Moment, MyTouch, etc.) released with Android 1.5/1.6. And SDK was released in this time frame.
    ~15 months after the G1 was released the Nexus One was released with Android 2.1/2.2.
    ~18 months after the G1 was release numerous Android 2.X handsets are on the market and selling very well.

    Android as an OS was progressing pretty well. There was a huge difference from Android 1.0/1.0 to 1.5/1.6.
    Agreed.

    The thing to remember, Clutch, is that Google really can only control the update frequency of the updates to the Nexus One. Even stock devices like the G1 and Droid that are made by other manufacturers are subject to delay from the manufacturer and/or the carrier. The Evo - with Sense - had Froyo before the stock Droid did. Sprint and HTC were veeeeery motivated with Verizon launching new Droids to get the Evo up to the latest.

    But as for putting out timely and substantial updates for Android...Google is doing it. At that point, it's up to the carrier and/or manufacturer.
  20. #80  
    Another side-by-side comparison:



    Looks like the WebOS releases are more often but with smaller incremental changes while Android releases are more spread out but greater magnitude changes. It makes the Android release schedule seem more measured/deliberate while the WebOS release schedule, especially early on, seems more reactive/haphazard.
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