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    How Windows Phone 7 could succeed - Technology & science - Wireless - msnbc.com

    How Windows Phone 7 might succeed in an iPhone/Android world

    Microsoft's new smart phone platform, Windows Phone 7, actually has a fighting chance. As good looking as the phone platform is, I didn't believe that until yesterday, when Microsoft revealed the phone's Xbox strategy. And trust me, this is about more than games.
    Microsoft is the supremo underdog here. There are iPhone and Android, two adversaries battling for exactly the same customers that Microsoft is targeting, while a third, BlackBerry, corrals all the smart phone business clients who used to bear Microsoft's brand. Lately, Microsoft has a bigger track record of screwing things up (Vista, Zune, Kin) than succeeding, so there's no guarantee that this platform will ever get off the ground. Still, a comeback isn't impossible.
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    Interesting insight at the end with regards to naming it Windows Phone 7. I agree that something that was completely disassociated with WM or Windows itself may have helped marketing. Windows 7 is a huge improvement over Vista but I'm not sure that direct correlation will be more pervasive than just the general "It's just the next iteration of Windows for a phone". I know (or think) that was not their intent but I think the average consumer may make that correlation.
  3. #3  
    I don't see the logic that because someone has an Xbox, he will want a WP7 phone. A lot of people buy Xboxes because their friends have them and they want to go head to head in games like Halo (which isn't being ported to WP7 BTW).
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  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    I don't see the logic that because someone has an Xbox, he will want a WP7 phone. A lot of people buy Xboxes because their friends have them and they want to go head to head in games like Halo (which isn't being ported to WP7 BTW).
    But it will have functions that are familiar with on Xbox for windows.

    No it won't have a core Halo (yet) but it has Halo Waypoint which is a halo portal on the 360. Being able to check your halo stats and friends stats on the go is a pretty big feature.

    Did you happen to see the feature rundown?
    Xbox Live launch titles for Windows Phone 7 finally revealed, we've got the full preview -- Engadget

    It really is pretty impressive esp. at launch. Halo may be synonymous with xbox...but its not the end all be all (in fact its not even the most played xbox game these days).
  6. #6  
    Let me add....

    ITS ABOUT DAMN TIME MICROSOT!

    It took them waaaaay to long to start integrating products for leverage. Like it is an absolute no brainer that xbox/zune/mobile should all be accessible within each other. The biggest hamstring at microsoft has to easily be how seperated the divisions were....good to see its finally getting better.
  7. #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    I don't see the logic that because someone has an Xbox, he will want a WP7 phone. A lot of people buy Xboxes because their friends have them and they want to go head to head in games...
    Yup.

    Every modern smartphone allows gaming.

    M$ could leverage their Xbox live infrastructure to promote inter-handset gaming -- games that use gyroscopes and accelerometers for controls.

    This would be a killer differentiating App.

    It remains incomprehensible that this would not be available at launch.

    If WP7 does not launch big it launches dead.


    And as I said to Mantis:


    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    I have several times stated that gaming -- and most particularly XBOX live integration and head to head gaming -- would potentially be a differentiating advantage for WP7.

    Up until now they have not shown what games if any were to be available at launch.

    Supporters of WP7 no doubt should be encouraged by the lineup they've revealed -- and that those games seem to play well on the specified hardware.

    I continue to believe that "gaming" in and of itself is not much of a distinguishing feature. You are aware, I suspect, that iPhones, Androids and Pres can also game.

    As I have said previously several times, what would be a killer WP7 App would be fully integrated remote inter-handset gaming (or even possibly Xbox360 to handset gaming and interactivity).

    I am a regular Xbox live gamer. I could easily project active gamers wanting to take their Xbox Live gaming on the road -- at least against their Xbox live friends using their WP7 phones. I could see friends encouraging one another to get WP7 phones so they could play against each other.

    The iPhone already allows inter-handset gaming. It remains extraordinary that interactivity between users is not anticipated for launch. Clearly my expectations are too ambitious for M$'s capabilities.

    (BTW -- I am not especially impressed by the strength of your defense of WP7 so far ...)
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
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    this forum is a bunch of mouth breathers thinking they know the best about the mobile space (including myself).

    At this point i'll continue with my belief Windows 7 will get off to a good start...not great...but good...and it'll be a rolling effect, much like android.

    Thats my belief, you think different...thats good. But you seem very down on windows 7 while most gadget sites seem to have high hopes.

    I don't know what products launched with every feature possible at launch...(do you?) 1st gen products are always under tight time lines and there is no problem for something to grow, but you act like Windows 7 is a terrible platform right now. Mean while, to me this looks more promising than WebOS did and still does.

    I could be wrong...but so could you.
  9. #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain Mantis View Post
    this forum is a bunch of mouth breathers thinking they know the best about the mobile space (including myself).

    At this point i'll continue with my belief Windows 7 will get off to a good start...not great...but good...and it'll be a rolling effect, much like android.

    Thats my belief, you think different...thats good. But you seem very down on windows 7 while most gadget sites seem to have high hopes.

    I don't know what products launched with every feature possible at launch...(do you?) 1st gen products are always under tight time lines and there is no problem for something to grow, but you act like Windows 7 is a terrible platform right now. Mean while, to me this looks more promising than WebOS did and still does.

    I could be wrong...but so could you.

    My cynicism and skepticism is based on my observation of M$ for many decades and over many products.

    Their wealth and success has been predicated on 2 near monopolistic platforms: Windows and Office. (Xbox is so far, an unprofitable success.)

    Like kudzu they have proliferated and consumed tons of light and treasure -- not through innovation or consumer attentiveness, but through brute force.
    (I speak as a user of Windows, Xbox and other M$ products).

    Now, for the first time since the early days of DOS, M$ is in an environment where its OS dominance is not the market lever it has been for generations.

    Android and iOS are the new mobile versions of "Windows".

    I have said this repeatedly: Android is a very good OS and its free.

    If M$ expects OEMs to shovel real cash toward Redmond for the honor of renting their software, WP7 is going to have to be both damn good and popular very fast.

    My skepticism is based on doubting that either will be true.
    Last edited by BARYE; 08/18/2010 at 07:21 PM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain Mantis View Post
    I don't know what products launched with every feature possible at launch...(do you?) 1st gen products are always under tight time lines and there is no problem for something to grow, but you act like Windows 7 is a terrible platform right now. Mean while, to me this looks more promising than WebOS did and still does.
    MS is trying to compete with Apple and Android. That will be hard to do with an incomplete OS. Like Palm, they have abandoned their old user base in favor of a new incomplete replacement. Unlike Palm, they didn't even include a webkit browser or multi-tasking. Their "hook" feature seems to be XBox.

    I have to admit that I am personally tired of MS products though I use them every day at work and still do some stuff on XP at home.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by gmanvbva View Post
    Interesting insight at the end with regards to naming it Windows Phone 7. I agree that something that was completely disassociated with WM or Windows itself may have helped marketing. Windows 7 is a huge improvement over Vista but I'm not sure that direct correlation will be more pervasive than just the general "It's just the next iteration of Windows for a phone". I know (or think) that was not their intent but I think the average consumer may make that correlation.
    I think the writer is confused. Windows Phone 7 is the name of the OS. Not an actual phone or device. Microsoft doesn't make phones. HTC or whoever will come out with something and give it another name.

    But i would agree that MS needs to differentiate its mobile OS and rebrand it. I think using "phone" is the culprit.
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    what can WM7 do, that other OS's can't do? Whatever it is, it also has to be extremely in demand to the mass's.

    This is how an OS survives, it has to separate itself, be unique, and the mass's MUST want it.
  13. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    MS is trying to compete with Apple and Android. That will be hard to do with an incomplete OS. Like Palm, they have abandoned their old user base in favor of a new incomplete replacement. Unlike Palm, they didn't even include a webkit browser or multi-tasking. Their "hook" feature seems to be XBox.

    I have to admit that I am personally tired of MS products though I use them every day at work and still do some stuff on XP at home.
    The OS isn't incomplete.

    Its been proven, the only people who care about multitasking are the tech heads...how do you think apple got by 3 years without it with ridiculous sales?


    Furthermore they are working on both C&P and multi-tasking.

    Other than that, how is it incomplete? Everything built in besides those two are exactly what all phones do now...what they need now is 3rd party app support...so we won't b e able to judge that until we see whats being produced.

    But so far their development kit is getting great reviews.
  14. #14  
    And i'll add again, it doesn't have to burst through the gate...it really doesn't. Its microsoft, they have always been slow out the gate (except for windows 7 of course) and then pump money into the project to get a foothold.

    Palm didn't have this luxury.
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    MS is trying to compete with Apple and Android. That will be hard to do with an incomplete OS. Like Palm, they have abandoned their old user base in favor of a new incomplete replacement. Unlike Palm, they didn't even include a webkit browser or multi-tasking. Their "hook" feature seems to be XBox.
    That's a pretty big hook though. Windows Phone 7 is going to launch as the second best mobile gaming platform on the market -- ahead of Palm and far, far ahead of Android.
  16. #16  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    That's a pretty big hook though. Windows Phone 7 is going to launch as the second best mobile gaming platform on the market -- ahead of Palm and far, far ahead of Android.
    not gaming per se -- but rather handset to handset (or even handset to console) is their hook.

    I could have anticipated WP7 handsets being motion aware controllers of virtual "cloud" xboxes everywhere -- where players around the planet could be playing Wii-like tennis against each other, or participating in clan warfare.

    But WP7 won't do this.

    There may be a few in this forum naive enough to buy into this platform based on the features that M$ promises it will "eventually" have. But I'm guessing that most folk are going to be happy buying products based on what they can do now -- not what they might do someday.

    Games are not a killer distinguishing App.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  17. #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain Mantis View Post
    The OS isn't incomplete.

    Its been proven, the only people who care about multitasking are the tech heads...how do you think apple got by 3 years without it with ridiculous sales?


    Furthermore they are working on both C&P and multi-tasking.

    Other than that, how is it incomplete? Everything built in besides those two are exactly what all phones do now...what they need now is 3rd party app support...so we won't b e able to judge that until we see whats being produced.

    But so far their development kit is getting great reviews.
    Apple "got by" for three years because they were so much better than the competition in other areas such as the media player (iPod), app store (after the first year) and, most importantly, the first usable web browser on a phone.

    They may be working on C&P and multi-tasking (something every other platform has now) and Palm is, I am sure, working on lots of stuff too. It won't help them sell phones until its delivered. Its not just these points. For example, the email app is according to Paul Thurrot, "Functionally ********".
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain Mantis View Post
    Its microsoft, they have always been slow out the gate (except for windows 7 of course) and then pump money into the project to get a foothold.
    Windows 7 is essentially Vista 2 so I would say they were slow out of the gate with that one.
  19. #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by Brain Mantis View Post
    The OS isn't incomplete.

    Its been proven, the only people who care about multitasking are the tech heads...how do you think apple got by 3 years without it with ridiculous sales?

    Furthermore they are working on both C&P and multi-tasking.
    ...
    if WP7 were a time machine able to turn the clock back to 2007, I think you'd be right -- M$ would have a winner on its hands.

    Phone platforms have 4 audiences/customers.

    1. OEMs -- they must invest in the R&D to build the hardware and PAY M$ rental on its OS

    2. carriers -- who must decide to sell and subsidize these handsets predicated on their users wanting these phones/this platform more than say Android or iOS.

    3. end users -- whose friends are excitedly using Android and iOS devices

    4. App developers -- who want a large user base to justify writing software for


    You haven't made the case for why any of these audiences will have the endless patience that you say that M$ will have
    Last edited by BARYE; 08/19/2010 at 01:22 PM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    4. App developers -- who want a large user base to justify writing software for


    You haven't made the case for why any of these audiences will have the endless patience that you say that M$ will have
    MS has addressed 4 by paying developers to write for its new platform and providing a decent set of tools and developer phones before release (unlike Palm with WebOS)
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