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  1. #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Please tell me why anyone would want to go from Windows 7 on a tablet into a webOS VM in order to do something (not that you can do anything on webOS on a tablet right now). In order to flick around cards?
    win 7 for power productivity....compatibility with other services... To name a couple

    webOS for superior touchscreen interface, elegance...webOS experience period.


    how about you reasons why you would not want the option?
    ilike options... You?
  2. #82  
    Quote Originally Posted by dandbj13 View Post
    Let me suggest something that will surely get me flamed. But don't worry, I've got my asbestus suit handy, so I can take it.

    Palm needs to stop trying to compete. Yes, I really think they cannot compete with the Pre, and probably not the Pre 2 whenever that is released. That does not mean they should fold. Let me explain:

    Palm's best days with the Pre was with Sprint. The reason is because they had no competition on Sprint at the time. Sprint was just as pathetic as Palm. They were good for each other. But there was only so many units that could be sold on Sprint, and Palm reached that limit in a hurry. Verizon got the Droid before it got the Pre, and the Verizon launch went downhill from there. Incidentally, the Droid was successful because the iPhone was exclusive to AT&T. Verizon had nothing to offer either.

    My point is that when the Pre tried to compete with another modern smartphone head to head, it couldn't do it. People soon started crying for the Pre to go to AT&T so that it could compete directly with the iPhone. The logic was that those few AT&T customers who didn't want an iPhone would get a Pre by default. Palm could pick up the crumbs that fell from the iPhone's table. No dice! Again, head to head competition is not the Pres strong suit. Even on Sprint, the Pre can't compete against the EVO: Sprint's new, main squeeze.

    What's left for Palm? They should find a home where they do not have to compete with modern super-phones. Perhaps it is time to think about prepay vendors like Boost, and other second and third tier carriers. Palm could absolutely own that space. After all, that is where the fat market of non-smartphone users live. Palm once wanted to provide the starter smartphone for that market. Why not go where they are.

    One thing is for certain; the EVOs, Droids, Galaxies, and iPhones of the world will never follow them there. Palm would have that market all to themselves, which is kind of what they need: a market where they are the only reasonable option.
    why not try them all? Hp is not palm... They don't have to pick one niche and get it right. They have the scale and resources to create several phones..one for each category.
    they can evaluate later which consumers to go after...
    HP is huge. They recent qtr's have been very profitable. This is one piece of a very big pie.
    as some have claimed...they are a bit late in the game...so my guess, they will come out strong with phones and tablets...and refine from there
  3. #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    win 7 for power productivity....compatibility with other services... To name a couple

    webOS for superior touchscreen interface, elegance...webOS experience period.


    how about you reasons why you would not want the option?
    ilike options... You?
    my belief is that HP bought Palm and webOS so that it could control its pad look and feel, the way Apple does -- while not being forced to pay the M$ per device tax.

    I also think that HP felt that M$ has shown that it was incapable of producing a viable competitive pad OS -- at a time when all OEMs are fixated on Apple's dominance of this iPad category.

    Were there not such powerful, successful, and dominating existing mobile phone platforms, I could have foreseen HP possibly pursuing a synergistic webOS phone together with a webOS PalmPad. Creating 2 devices that could mutually support their webOS ecosystem (the way Apple has wisely done with its iPhone, Touch, and iPad).

    Unfortunately though, for webOS, the barriers to entry in the current mobile phone market are nearly insurmountable -- and too costly to justify the investment or the risk.

    HP will if anything, attempt to make a go of webOS on its PalmPad. If it finds consumer enthusiasm and success there, then possibly later launch a mobile phone off of that PalmPad base.
    Last edited by BARYE; 08/03/2010 at 05:12 PM.
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  4. #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    win 7 for power productivity....compatibility with other services... To name a couple

    webOS for superior touchscreen interface, elegance...webOS experience period.


    how about you reasons why you would not want the option?
    ilike options... You?
    In other words...fire up a WebOS VM to flick around cards, as UntidyGuy said?
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    In other words...fire up a WebOS VM to flick around cards, as UntidyGuy said?
    ok... I see we have some limited thinking going on here...
    if you had an ipad... And you could fire up mac os... Would you want that option?

    if you wanted to switch from win 7 format... To webo
    gestures
    cards
    apps
    webOS period...
    you could launch into webOS and do that.
    so... Oncw again... Why not?
    if you are sugesting that the only adavntage to running webOS vs win7 is flicking cards..... Well are you?
    Last edited by clutch1222; 08/03/2010 at 06:58 PM.
  6.    #86  
    Would you support including an Android emulator in your HP Windows 7/webOS tablet? Android is free. Then, of course, someone would immediately install Classic into the webOS emulator to run Windows, webOS, Android, and Palm OS on the same tablet. Sounds like a geektastic dream machine. It would run four different kinds of software - none of which are designed, in any way, for use on a tablet.

    I'm sure there are plenty of examples of hardware that came with emulators pre-installed to run software from other platforms. I just can't think of any because few people talk about them and nobody buys them. I seem to recall about a decade ago there was some significant discussion of a Palm OS emulator to run on Pocket PC. Anyone remember the name of that particular vaporware? It was before StyleTap which nobody has heard of in the consumer space either.
    Last edited by UntidyGuy; 08/03/2010 at 07:14 PM.
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    ok... I see we have some limited thinking going on here...
    if you had an ipad... And you could fire up mac os... Would you want that option?

    if you wanted to switch from win 7 format... To webo
    gestures
    cards
    apps
    webOS period...
    you could launch into webOS and do that.
    so... Oncw again... Why not?
    if you are sugesting that the only adavntage to running webOS vs win7 is flicking cards..... Well are you?
    But see, when you're running Windows 7 on your mythical HP tablet, you have an OS with a superset of the features WebOS supports. The only benefit to virtualizing WebOS on top of Windows 7 might be a more touch-friendly UI, but even that would be offset by the footprint that type of setup would require on a system that's inherently resource constrained.
  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    my belief is that HP bought Palm and webOS so that it could control its pad look and feel, the way Apple does -- while not being forced to pay the M$ per device tax.

    I also think that HP felt that M$ has shown that it was incapable of producing a viable competitive pad OS -- at a time when all OEMs are fixated on Apple's dominance of this iPad category.

    Were there not such powerful, successful, and dominating existing mobile phone platforms, I could have foreseen HP possibly pursuing a synergistic webOS phone together with a webOS PalmPad. Creating 2 devices that could mutually support their webOS ecosystem (the way Apple has wisely done with its iPhone, Touch, and iPad).

    Unfortunately though, for webOS, the barriers to entry in the current mobile phone market are nearly insurmountable -- and too costly to justify the investment or the risk.

    HP will if anything, attempt to make a go of webOS on its PalmPad. If it finds consumer enthusiasm and success there, then possibly later launch a mobile phone off of that PalmPad base.
    I am surprised at your opinions. Phil Mckinney has been quoted, on more than one occasion , that they're are interested in the smartphone market.

    Other than the actual release of the smartphone itself... what else does he need to say to kill the skepticism?also, Do i need to post all of the quotes stating their interest in smartphones? this precentral... and it has been covered extensively.
  9. #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    But see, when you're running Windows 7 on your mythical HP tablet, you have an OS with a superset of the features WebOS supports. The only benefit to virtualizing WebOS on top of Windows 7 might be a more touch-friendly UI, but even that would be offset by the footprint that type of setup would require on a system that's inherently resource constrained.
    resource constrained? really?
    2 Ghz processor has already been developed for smartphones and tablets... along with 2 Gb of ddr2 as well.. stckable up to 8Gb.

    1 tablet cant run both ? why not?

    it can be offered as an option.. at first , until webOS has enough apps and fully matures. Win 7 will have the Office 2010 compatibility... along with all of the other features that come with it... and webOS can be launched as an option.
    Once webOS gains both popularity and maturity... it could be launched with out win7

    tablet options :
    Win7 / webOS
    webOS
    Win 7

    custom builds... shipped out in 2 weeks.
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    I am surprised at your opinions. Phil Mckinney has been quoted, on more than one occasion , that they're are interested in the smartphone market.

    Other than the actual release of the smartphone itself... what else does he need to say to kill the skepticism?also, Do i need to post all of the quotes stating their interest in smartphones? this precentral... and it has been covered extensively.
    most everyone is well past the vague promises and "interest" of an underling -- especially when their CEO declares that he didn't get Palm for its phones, that he cares primarily about an OS for pads, and about the IP.

    When there are 2 current in the flesh robust well liked smartphone OSes shipping and in the wild, its going to take a heck of alot more than pretty demos on youTube, sneak peeks at specs on Engadget, and snazzy leaked pictures to Gizmodo to get most folks to give a hoot.

    Bottom line: if it ain't shipping, they can promise the moon and its hardly worth the interest ...
    755P Sprint SERO (upgraded from unlocked GSM 650 on T-Mobile)
  11. #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    resource constrained? really?
    2 Ghz processor has already been developed for smartphones and tablets... along with 2 Gb of ddr2 as well.. stckable up to 8Gb.

    1 tablet cant run both ? why not?

    it can be offered as an option.. at first , until webOS has enough apps and fully matures. Win 7 will have the Office 2010 compatibility... along with all of the other features that come with it... and webOS can be launched as an option.
    Once webOS gains both popularity and maturity... it could be launched with out win7

    tablet options :
    Win7 / webOS
    webOS
    Win 7

    custom builds... shipped out in 2 weeks.
    HP already does that with the Envy line. It has the instant-on OS they got when they took over Voodoo.

    Hardly anyone bothers because Windows 7 works just fine once it's booted. It IS instant-on if you just shut the lid of a notebook or netbook (or put the slate to sleep).

    Plus, with Intel doing Meego and Google doing Chrome, you'd be able to dump ANY OS on any Windows 7 machine.
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    HP already does that with the Envy line. It has the instant-on OS they got when they took over Voodoo.

    Hardly anyone bothers because Windows 7 works just fine once it's booted. It IS instant-on if you just shut the lid of a notebook or netbook (or put the slate to sleep).

    Plus, with Intel doing Meego and Google doing Chrome, you'd be able to dump ANY OS on any Windows 7 machine.
    ok.
    so replacing instant on with webOS would not be a positive?

    my wife has a hp dm3... got it for for $499. It has instant on....
    If i could load webOS, flip the screen and close it.... swipe/Flick/ get my webos on.......major bonus.



    HP does that already... just not nearly as well.

    HP is rumored to add touchscreen( invented multitouch 1983) as a $25 option.....
    You can keep finding ways for HP to fail... I will keep finding ways for them to succeed. If im wrong... i will be the first to admit that.
  13. #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    Unfortunately though, for webOS, the barriers to entry in the current mobile phone market are nearly insurmountable -- and too costly to justify the investment or the risk.
    I don't think that's true at all. Palm showed it could launch carriers with the pathetic resources it had.

    When HP introduces its handset, it really needs to leapfrog somewhat to get some attention. Having the highest res screen would be a good choice. Preferably a 4" slab. Getting netflix or hulu apps would be a good thing too as they need to answer the media end. As well as a nav app ready to use such as tomtom or navigon that's fully integrated.
  14. #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by UntidyGuy View Post
    Please tell me why anyone would want to go from Windows 7 on a tablet into a webOS VM in order to do something (not that you can do anything on webOS on a tablet right now). In order to flick around cards?
    Who will want to run Windows 7 on a tablet?
  15. #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by BARYE View Post
    most everyone is well past the vague promises and "interest" of an underling -- especially when their CEO declares that he didn't get Palm for its phones, that he cares primarily about an OS for pads, and about the IP.

    When there are 2 current in the flesh robust well liked smartphone OSes shipping and in the wild, its going to take a heck of alot more than pretty demos on youTube, sneak peeks at specs on Engadget, and snazzy leaked pictures to Gizmodo to get most folks to give a hoot.

    Bottom line: if it ain't shipping, they can promise the moon and its hardly worth the interest ...
    a promise is one thing.... Stating your vision over and over again... becomes the mission .

    Former Palm CEO Jon Rubinstein, now with HP, spoke at the Fortune Magazine Brainstorm tech conference recently and had this to say:
    "We're working a wide variety, as Todd said, smartphones definitely, slates, netbooks, working with the guys in the printer group. webOS [...] will have a unified user interface across all of these, will have a unified developer environment, and it's all based on the foundation that we build in webOS from day one. When we developed webOS, we thought about making this scalable across a variety of mobile devices; that's what we'll be delivering going forward."
    If you choose not to believe it "till it Ships"... thats your prerogative.

    I have been hearing this out of the HP camp for months now. I believe its what they are working on right now.
    Once they have the devices ready... they will release them as a product line .

    my guess - October 2010
    This would give them almost 2 months of advertising before Black Friday... the start of the Holiday Shopping Season
    The opinion that sooner is better is really getting old. Im a positive they are working their a. s. s. off to get this line of products ready... tested... and some killer apps to announce as well. making all of this happen takes time... its much more than releasing 1 smartphone.
    Last edited by clutch1222; 08/04/2010 at 09:57 AM.
  16. #96  
    Quote Originally Posted by clutch1222 View Post
    I have been hearing this out of the HP camp for months now. I believe its what they are working on right now.
    Once they have the devices ready... they will release them as a product line .
    my guess - October 2010
    You would think that if you've been hearing this out of the HP camp for months now, HP would be on the verge of releasing (or at least announcing) something new.
  17. #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by ADGrant View Post
    Who will want to run Windows 7 on a tablet?
    With the right hardware specs... I do

    Im sure that was already obvious though ;-)

    I want to run

    filezilla

    Bit Torrent

    XBMC

    Quicken

    FireFox

    etc......

    On a tablet... then launch webOS when ever the hell i feel like it...
  18. #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    You would think that if you've been hearing this out of the HP camp for months now, HP would be on the verge of releasing (or at least announcing) something new.

    No ... I wouldnt think that after 34 days after acquiring webOS and Palm.

    YOU think that.
  19. #99  
    It's clear they were working on this for months, alright...but as we saw with the shape WebOS is currently in, it's slow going with not a lot of results. HP is hopefully not going to ramp up and announce things until WebOS is in a polished, finished state that is hardware-accelerated and lag free.

    When that is.....anybody's guess.
  20.    #100  
    I'm kind of wondering what a smartphone hardware manufacturer does for over a year if they don't design, manufacture, and release new hardware? Assuming that the Pre was designed sometime before CES 2009 followed shortly thereafter by the Pixi, there should have been more activity on the hardware side other than designing the Pre Plus without a button. I mean, we've had two versions of the Droid since then and a Nexus One that has come and gone.

    Something must have been in the works for this Summer that was aborted by HP. Smartphone product cycles are pretty important. To let the Pre stagnate on the Sprint network without a logically timed refresh for loyal users is pretty bad.
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