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  1.    #1  
    Hiy'all,
    I'm not sure if I want to rant, since I do not have enough insight, so I would be happy for any clarification one can give me:

    With the 1.4.5 update of WebOS palm introduced the fstab bug, which causes some PDK apps not work correctly, since the cannot save to /media/internal. Thanks to Rod Whitby we have a workaround and that is -out of the question- the reason why I love and stick to Palm: the engaged homebrewers and patchers.

    Now, Palm said, that they would like to fix it, but cannot ATM, because it would involve another approval process with the carriers, hence delaying the long awaited update even more to US customers.

    Being in the smartphone sector only for 8 months (and maybe because I am not living in the USA), I simply do not understand, why the network providers have so much power over what firmware runs on the devices, they are only offering a connection for. Ok, they sell the handsets and they are subsidized by them (which however you pay them back by being tied to their service and monthly fee for quite a while).

    If I would put the analogy into the desktop market, then my ISP would hold the power of what is inside the firmware running on my subsidized DSL/cable router. Haven't seen that before: universal updated firmwares are being offered by the manufacturer on the wabsite. The last mandatory internet access software I can recall was AOL and we all know, where that went.

    So why do carriers get this approval process? Yes, there have to be APNs in the firmware, so that the phone can connect with the carrier, but those could be implemented by palm. Yes, every carrier has got special apps (Sprint TV, VZ Navigator) that are only available on their network. Those could have been programmed with the SDK/PDK, which was already available mid may, sent to palm and integrated there.

    So please, shed me some insight. Palm introduced the bug, wants to fix it, but cannot at this moment due to carriers. My logic simply does not suffice, why carriers have this power, how they have gotten it and why manufacturers play along, when in the ISP world this is not the case.
    'til we meet again.
    THL
  2. #2  
    Quote Originally Posted by THL View Post
    Hiy'all,
    I'm not sure if I want to rant, since I do not have enough insight, so I would be happy for any clarification one can give me:

    With the 1.4.5 update of WebOS palm introduced the fstab bug, which causes some PDK apps not work correctly, since the cannot save to /media/internal. Thanks to Rod Whitby we have a workaround and that is -out of the question- the reason why I love and stick to Palm: the engaged homebrewers and patchers.

    Now, Palm said, that they would like to fix it, but cannot ATM, because it would involve another approval process with the carriers, hence delaying the long awaited update even more to US customers.

    Being in the smartphone sector only for 8 months (and maybe because I am not living in the USA), I simply do not understand, why the network providers have so much power over what firmware runs on the devices, they are only offering a connection for. Ok, they sell the handsets and they are subsidized by them (which however you pay them back by being tied to their service and monthly fee for quite a while).

    If I would put the analogy into the desktop market, then my ISP would hold the power of what is inside the firmware running on my subsidized DSL/cable router. Haven't seen that before: universal updated firmwares are being offered by the manufacturer on the wabsite. The last mandatory internet access software I can recall was AOL and we all know, where that went.

    So why do carriers get this approval process? Yes, there have to be APNs in the firmware, so that the phone can connect with the carrier, but those could be implemented by palm. Yes, every carrier has got special apps (Sprint TV, VZ Navigator) that are only available on their network. Those could have been programmed with the SDK/PDK, which was already available mid may, sent to palm and integrated there.

    So please, shed me some insight. Palm introduced the bug, wants to fix it, but cannot at this moment due to carriers. My logic simply does not suffice, why carriers have this power, how they have gotten it and why manufacturers play along, when in the ISP world this is not the case.
    Easy. The consumers have given the power to the carriers by choosing heavily subsidised locked contracts.

    If everyone bought full-price unlocked GSM devices, the carriers would become the simple network pipes that they should be.

    -- Rod
    WebOS Internals and Preware Founder and Developer
    You may wish to donate by Paypal to donations @ webos-internals.org if you find our work useful.
    All donations go back into development.
    www.webos-internals.org twitter.com/webosinternals facebook.com/webosinternals
  3.    #3  
    If it's really THIS easy, why doesn't it apply to the ISP market? Every non-geek I know uses the hardware the ISP subsidized for them (the geekier ones buy a Netgear router and put openWRT on it ^^), still those aren't locked down in any way and they do not need special modified firmware for their router to work on that ISP.
    'til we meet again.
    THL
  4. #4  
    the carrier takes 90% of the support calls and there is a back-end process that gets developed for every version and/or change.

    that used to apply to broadband modems, years ago.

    look at the pain and stock drop apple is experience over their current issue. Users are merciless when an update breaks something, and the carrier is the one taking the calls. Even they can't release new code without at&t testing and acceptance. No phone maker can test and create support scripts for the specific carrier because only the carrier can create a test bed and roll-out process that duplicates the actual network and environment of a carrier. Bug found by one get fixed by palm and the each carrier has to start over. It's a very complicated thing. Desktop pc's would not ne a good comparison.

    look at how many android phones haven't been given the latest code yet, with some being 2 or more releases behind newer models.

    frustrating, but better than the chaos of the alternative.
  5. #5  
    Phones are much more integrated into the carrier/cell network than a cable/dsl/sat modem.

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