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  1. #161  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    I don't think anyone here implied that Consumer Reports is lying or exaggerating their demonstration(s); I believe the only thing we're debating here is Consumer Report's trying to make it out to be an issue that it's really not.

    They don't want to recommend a device that has already proven itself time and time again and continues to sale in large numbers despite its apparent issues?

    Is it possible that millions of people are walking around with a device that's really rendered useless if they hold it a particular way and causes problem after problem? If so, why?
    this device has an issue if people are complaining about it lol its that simple . right ?
    ĦṔ-Ḷṫ-Ŧḯη
    Here is a direct link to webOS Doc for all carriers
    http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/...octor_Versions
    P.S. if i have helped you and you are thankful please hit the thanks button to the right---->
  2. #162  
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadavis08 View Post
    this device has an issue if people are complaining about it lol its that simple . right ?
    Thank you, for further proving my point.
  3. #163  
    Yes, at first it was CR just wanted hits on their site.
    Once that got disproved, we moved to different defense.
  4. #164  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle View Post
    Honestly, Consumer Reports has a great reputation for testing products.
    If they say they have the issue with the iPhone specifically, and they are making it up, they stand to hurt their reputation.
    Apple only finally admited it after enough heat was applied.
    Except, they don't give out free cases anymore.

    They didn't change the design.

    It seems the design is still the same for the most part for the Verizon iPhone.

    and most importantly of all...

    People continue to buy the iPhone 4. I'm still surprised that if a product has issues, why would so many people continue to buy it after all the media attention that the iPhone 4 got?
  5. #165  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    To prepare for the iPhone, Verizon instituted a new policy to throttle back the top 5% of their data users. Please, let's not pretend they had a network all prepared for this.

    I suppose another way to look at it is this - Verizon now has a handy excuse for those that do complain about dropped callse
    I was talking about the attenuation issue that CR and the media reported that the iPhone 4 has.
  6. #166  
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadavis08 View Post
    yes thats what ive been saying the whole time the iphone4 obviously has issues and needs a psychoanalysis or something lol ha ha ha
    Yep! Those return lines and support centers are flooded by people with issues!
  7. #167  
    Quote Originally Posted by SoFly View Post
    Except, they don't give out free cases anymore.

    They didn't change the design.

    It seems the design is still the same for the most part for the Verizon iPhone.

    and most importantly of all...

    People continue to buy the iPhone 4. I'm still surprised that if a product has issues, why would so many people continue to buy it after all the media attention that the iPhone 4 got?
    I don't doubt for a minute that Apple took a look at their options.

    • Redesign, and more importantly retool for the redesign - expensive
    • Continue to offer a case - expensive, and makes the problem appear even worse due to folks that don't have a problem asking for the case
    • Pretend the problem doesn't exist, and simply lose the few cases where it's so bad and/or the customer is so picky they return the device - cheapest overall
    Of course, chosing that last option would make it appear they just didn't care about those customers. They would then have to depend on their loyal (and, if rumors are to be believed, sometimes paid) fanbase to decry the biased reporting of Consumer Reports.
  8. #168  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    ...Okay. Maybe not rendered useless, but enough to the point where they can't recommend it. They need to be a little more transparent in their testing and their reasoning. Sure, there's an issue and they've clearly pointed that out in their testing, but is an issue that's large enough to really affect people to the point they're going to notice or care?

    Apparently not.
    Huh???? How much more transparent do you think could be? It would appear that the only acceptable recommendation would be the one that Apple's fanbase demands.

    They are under absolutely no obligation to base their recommendation on the number of units sold, or even the satisfaction of those that have bought. They didn't give McDonald's hamburgers a very favorable review either, and those guys sell billions.
  9. #169  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    It's called perspective. Not an attempt to change the topic.
    Actually it's called a Red Herring.

    Nobody is saying that the VZW iPhone is unusable. The issue is probably worse for AT&T because it was mostly a problem in poor coverage area. Verizon is known to have more extensive coverage.

    It's like a car that doesn't get gas mileage that a user expected. It might irritate the users, it might cause a few returns, but it doesn't make the car un-drivable.

    Of course it hasn't doomed the iPhone to failure. It certainly cost apple a lot of time spent dealing with the huge panic that it caused. And it was MUCH larger than any issue caused by Palm oreos or design issues. Beyond the world of sites like this... Palm got very little attention or notice.

    I am fascinated that the argument continues as to whether there IS an issue, rather than acknowledging the obvious fact that the issue exists but isn't a show stopper. The fact that CR does't recommend the iPhone only impacts the reader if the CR conclusion is based on something important to the reader. VZW has amazing coverage around here and everywhere I tend to travel, so this wouldn't slow me down much if I were interested in an iPhone. If they had with held recommendation because it didn't have a physical keyboard... that would only matter to those that have that requirement.

    Wow, reading this zombie-thread from last year has given me a major head ache.
  10. #170  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Obvioulsy, you're not going to be believed.

    Sorry, just couldn't help it.
    You should go check the Tipb forum or whatever it's called.. The moderator there at the time well I will just say he thought he was a "Bad *****" (since changed his name). He told me I was the only one in the nation having dropped calls with iphone and ATT, he got upset because he accused me making this stuff up. It's all documented there.
  11. #171  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    You seem to be ignoring the obvious. CR didn't issue a sales report - they issued a warning about a problem. Doesn't matter if folks chose to ignore the problem, it's still there.

    Cigarettes have a warning right on the box. People continue to buy them.

    People are sometimes strange.
    Dude, that's not even the same thing. People are addicted to the nicotine. If they bought a brand of cigarettes that was blocking that nicotine fix they would stop buying that brand.

    Just like if people actually could not use their iPhone 4 the why they wanted and expected it to work, they would return it and Apple would not have sold over 30 million of them so far.
  12. #172  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    Two people opened that class action. That's hardly a representation of the massive amount of iPhone users.



    Okay. Maybe not rendered useless, but enough to the point where they can't recommend it. They need to be a little more transparent in their testing and their reasoning. Sure, there's an issue and they've clearly pointed that out in their testing, but is it an issue that's large enough to really affect people to the point they're going to notice or care?

    Apparently not (or apparently so, according to CR, why else would they not recommend it?)
    im pretty sure you cant open a class action law suit against a company with just 2 complaints lol ha ha ha ha h ,lol
    ĦṔ-Ḷṫ-Ŧḯη
    Here is a direct link to webOS Doc for all carriers
    http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/...octor_Versions
    P.S. if i have helped you and you are thankful please hit the thanks button to the right---->
  13. #173  
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadavis08 View Post
    im pretty sure you cant open a class action law suit against a company with just 2 complaints lol ha ha ha ha h ,lol
    It can be requested, but a judge has to investigate and grant it "class action" status.
  14. #174  
    that status wont be granted if you have no one complaining but you and one other person lol ha ha ha you have to have a significant amount of complaints for it to go through . thats why lawyers advertise class actions suits before they file .
    ĦṔ-Ḷṫ-Ŧḯη
    Here is a direct link to webOS Doc for all carriers
    http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/...octor_Versions
    P.S. if i have helped you and you are thankful please hit the thanks button to the right---->
  15. #175  
    Quote Originally Posted by SoFly View Post
    Dude, that's not even the same thing. People are addicted to the nicotine. If they bought a brand of cigarettes that was blocking that nicotine fix they would stop buying that brand.

    Just like if people actually could not use their iPhone 4 the why they wanted and expected it to work, they would return it and Apple would not have sold over 30 million of them so far.
    Interestingly, the tobacco companies were very adament that tobacco was not addictive, much the same way that Jobs insisted this wasn't an iPhone issue.

    Without running down that rabbit-trail though, is it your position that those billions of hamburgers that McDonald's sold were also addictive?
  16. #176  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    The only thing Apple acknowledged is that there is a signal attenuation issue on a particular spot of the phone, which exists across all mobile phones. What they didn't recognize is the fact that it's an issue that will affect anyone directly.

    Dropped calls has been an inherent issue of AT&T ever since the iPhone became overly popular and saturated their network. Dropped calls have long existed since the 3G and 3Gs and across other devices.

    I've yet to see any complaints about dropped calls on the VZW iPhone. If you have a source, please, by all means, post...
    You did ask:
    Verizon iPhone: Return of the Death Grip | NBC Bay Area

    I know, I know, it's only two (on this particular link), but now you've seen at least two.

    Consider yourself to now be better informed.
  17. #177  
    Quote Originally Posted by berdinkerdickle View Post
    Yes, at first it was CR just wanted hits on their site.
    Once that got disproved, we moved to different defense.
    my personal opinion hasn't changed since the AT&T issue.

    True or not, most consumers don't care enough to not buy an iphone thus it's not a big deal.
  18. #178  
    Quote Originally Posted by blackmagic01 View Post
    my personal opinion hasn't changed since the AT&T issue.

    True or not, most consumers don't care enough to not buy an iphone thus it's not a big deal.
    Yeah, it's "not a big deal", simply because Apple has successfully swept it under the rug.

    Want a timeline on what they (most notably Jobs) did?

    How about how he originally claimed it was a software glitch.

    Then claimed it was a problem every device had, but that they would cover with the covers.

    Then claimed that wasn't as big a problem as they thought (which is really amazing, since they insisted it wasn't a problem at all)

    Now they've got the aPhans saying that it simply doesn't exist on Verizon and that it's some (apparently unexplainable) conspiracy by Consumer Reports, though people are returning their iPhones to Verizon because of the problem.

    Compare that to the reaction (and response from HP) about the promise for the 2.x upgrade.

    Seriously, this type of coverup both by Apple and the fans that follow is pathetic.
  19. #179  
    Quote Originally Posted by hparsons View Post
    Yeah, it's "not a big deal", simply because Apple has successfully swept it under the rug.

    Want a timeline on what they (most notably Jobs) did?

    How about how he originally claimed it was a software glitch.

    Then claimed it was a problem every device had, but that they would cover with the covers.

    Then claimed that wasn't as big a problem as they thought (which is really amazing, since they insisted it wasn't a problem at all)

    Now they've got the aPhans saying that it simply doesn't exist on Verizon and that it's some (apparently unexplainable) conspiracy by Consumer Reports, though people are returning their iPhones to Verizon because of the problem.

    Compare that to the reaction (and response from HP) about the promise for the 2.x upgrade.

    Seriously, this type of coverup both by Apple and the fans that follow is pathetic.
    Yet millions of iPhones continue to sell! I guess that's all that matters (to Apple and iOS developers).

    Next.
  20. #180  
    Quote Originally Posted by barkerja View Post
    Yet millions of iPhones continue to sell! I guess that's all that matters (to Apple and iOS developers).

    Next.
    If you say so. I suppose then that promise to deliver high quality products, concern for the customer and the user experience, that was all BS?

    Of course, we didn't really believe it anyway. Bottom line is the same as for any other corporation - the bottom line.

    It's cheaper for Jobs to lie about the issue, and ignore the problem of the few, than it is to acknowledge it and fix it.
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