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  1.    #1  
    iphone4 review: folders and multitasking. Watch the video.

    Did the iphone4 with ios4 cath up the Palmwebos on multitasking? What are the differences for you?

  2. #2  
    No it didn't catch up with webOS on multitasking but they did develop a resonably elegant way to multitask that will probably end the "but the iphone doesn't multitask" argument for most users. As far as folders go they beat webOS by a mile since that option doesn't exist.
  3. urkel's Avatar
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    #3  
    Quote Originally Posted by Superjudge View Post
    No it didn't catch up with webOS on multitasking but they did develop a resonably elegant way to multitask that will probably end the "but the iphone doesn't multitask" argument for most users.
    Not really. The "Grasping at Straws 2.0" upgrade went fairly well so now instead of Pre users screaming "The iPhone doesn't multitask" they now say "The iPhone doesn't multitask as good".

    I think that for the WebOS MultiTasking is by far the best out there, but MT is only one feature of a much longer feature-list. So the whole Pre vs iPhone comparisons are silly because there's clearly a line drawn on what both sides want to do with their phones. Pre people claim that multitasking is the most important thing in the world and quality apps aren't a big deal. iPhone people feel Apps are more important and MT is a nice feature but not necessarily an essential. There's very little that can be done that will sway one side to another
    Last edited by Urkel; 06/24/2010 at 01:12 PM.
  4. #4  
    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    Not really. The "Grasping at Straws 2.0" upgrade went fairly well so now instead of Pre users screaming "The iPhone doesn't multitask" they now say "The iPhone doesn't multitask as good".
    Well the Pre users would be right as far as multitasking goes but Apple's implemtation will work well enough for their users that they won't care. In fact the only people who care about the "true multitasking vs the limited multitaking" argument are techie webOS and Android users.
  5. #5  
    I have yet to hear an explanation of what MT on a Pre can do that an iPhone cannot. In practice (to the average consumer), as it relates to functionality.

    In fact, I felt on an iPhone (pre-ios4) I could app switch faster, and more successfully, coming back to a saved state, far better than I could on an unmodified Pre which either lagged or TMC'd.

    (I do now realize that a modified Pre would have changed that.)
  6.    #6  
    No cards on iphone4 ?
  7. spare's Avatar
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    #7  
    Quote Originally Posted by finngirl View Post
    I have yet to hear an explanation of what MT on a Pre can do that an iPhone cannot. In practice (to the average consumer), as it relates to functionality.

    In fact, I felt on an iPhone (pre-ios4) I could app switch faster, and more successfully, coming back to a saved state, far better than I could on an unmodified Pre which either lagged or TMC'd.

    (I do now realize that a modified Pre would have changed that.)


    see that thread for some things ios can't do. Also, I can switch apps on my stock sprint pre from a loaded 3d game to a loaded mobile web page with one swipe. No lag or tmc most times while switching. ios 4 takes multiple actions to switch and has to reload the 3d game each time you switch to it.
    Last edited by spare; 06/24/2010 at 02:51 PM.
  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by spare View Post
    see that thread for some things ios can't do. Also, I can switch apps on my stock sprint pre from a loaded 3d game to a loaded mobile web page with one swipe. No lag or tmc most times while switching. ios 4 takes multiple actions to switch and has to reload the 3d game each time you switch to it.
    I just switched from Plants vs Zombies to Safari and back again without PvZ having to be reloaded. Fast app switching really does work well in iOS4.
  9. spare's Avatar
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    #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    I just switched from Plants vs Zombies to Safari and back again without PvZ having to be reloaded. Fast app switching really does work well in iOS4.
    If it didn't have to reload, then it was still in memory. You can 't have it both ways.
  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by spare View Post
    If it didn't have to reload, then it was still in memory. You can 't have it both ways.
    Right. Hence, multitasking.
  11. #11  
    There are lines at Apple stores of people waiting and record sales projected.

    So clearly A huge chunk of smartphone consumers, a chunk much larger then say current webos users, don't care. hell most were willing to be completely without multitasking as they didn't switch. That huge chunk thinks the multitasking on apple is good enough. To say it's not as good as pre is to worry about something that isn't going to make most consumers buy a webos device or refrain from buying an iphone, blackberry, or android device.

    WebOS users can argue till the cows come home. The bottom line is the that huge chunk of potential consumers don't care about the distinction in multitasking. it may make people feel good. it's just not that important.
  12. #12  
    Quote Originally Posted by finngirl View Post
    I have yet to hear an explanation of what MT on a Pre can do that an iPhone cannot. In practice (to the average consumer), as it relates to functionality.

    In fact, I felt on an iPhone (pre-ios4) I could app switch faster, and more successfully, coming back to a saved state, far better than I could on an unmodified Pre which either lagged or TMC'd.

    (I do now realize that a modified Pre would have changed that.)
    The biggest difference is that your appps continue to work in the background when they are open. Any app that needs to constantly refresh for data(twitter for example) will not be doing that when you are not in the app. While Apple has allowed some limited background processes to run on some types off apps(GPS based apps or Pandora) many of them will just pause. You also get a live view of your app in card view as opposed to just the icon. Of course this is not true of web pages which will have to refresh if you are away from them for a minute(maybe less cause I can't remember the exact time)

    I'm not sure how many apps the iphone will keep track of in the bottom or if you can rearrange the order. I thought the order was defined by the order in which you open the apps.

    It's a very workable system and most people will be fine with it. It's not as powerful as webOS cards system but in the end it's about as effective.
  13. #13  
    Don't forget the gyroscope .. this should put anyone's doubts about the gyroscope to bed:
  14. spare's Avatar
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    #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by nappy View Post
    Right. Hence, multitasking.
    If the app was still in memory, what makes ios4 multitasking more efficient than androids?
  15. #15  
    Quote Originally Posted by Superjudge View Post
    The biggest difference is that your appps continue to work in the background when they are open. Any app that needs to constantly refresh for data(twitter for example) will not be doing that when you are not in the app. While Apple has allowed some limited background processes to run on some types off apps(GPS based apps or Pandora) many of them will just pause. You also get a live view of your app in card view as opposed to just the icon. Of course this is not true of web pages which will have to refresh if you are away from them for a minute(maybe less cause I can't remember the exact time)

    I am on a 3G, and my web pages don't need to be refreshed. Even if the browser has not been open for days. So I never understood that issue. Side by side, i could always app switch between my browser and an app on the 3G much faster than i could on my Pre.

    I do understand its not running in the background - I hadn't specifically thought of that as an advantage since I turn off anything that runs in the background, just to save battery - its not worth it to me if I can't go a full day on one charge.
  16. #16  
    No cell phone does "real" multitasking. I have a quad core desktop that does a pretty good job of it. In cell phone land, though, it is all just an approximation. What you are really talking about is a combination of backgrounding, app switching, and task completion. Palm builds all of this into the OS, but that makes for a very heavy experience that requires a significant piece of hardware to pull off smoothly. It also requires a user to move from one app at a time. Go ahead and open 20 apps, if you have enough memory. Now move from the first to the twentieth, one app at a time. At lease, Apple's (imperfect) implementation allows you to see four at a time, and move through them quickly.

    As for the rest, Apple builds in the tools, but requires developers to design their apps in a specific way to take advantage of the architecture. This is largely why Apple does not allow such tools as Flash. The apps written with those tools would not be able to take advantage of the native features of the OS.

    As for the end user, they will experience a blazing fast UI that switches tasks, backgrounds, and task completes without costing them significant battery life, error messages, crashes, or usability. Just because Palm has a prettier implementation, that does not make it better.
  17. spare's Avatar
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    #17  
    Quote Originally Posted by finngirl View Post
    I am on a 3G, and my web pages don't need to be refreshed. Even if the browser has not been open for days. So I never understood that issue. Side by side, i could always app switch between my browser and an app on the 3G much faster than i could on my Pre.

    I do understand its not running in the background - I hadn't specifically thought of that as an advantage since I turn off anything that runs in the background, just to save battery - its not worth it to me if I can't go a full day on one charge.
    Sounds like you only keep one app open at a time on the pre. You can switch between any two open apps with one swipe on the pre. It doesn't get faster than that.

    Even then, I find it hard to believe your 3g loads faster than the Pre if you are loading the exact same app (same code just slight changes for the os). What apps are you loading much faster on a 3g? There are at least a few videos comparing speed of pre vs 3g on the net.
  18. #18  
    Quote Originally Posted by spare View Post
    If the app was still in memory, what makes ios4 multitasking more efficient than androids?
    In this case? Nothing. I was just showing you that the way iOS handles fast app switching with games isn't that much different from your example with the Pre.
  19. spare's Avatar
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    #19  
    Quote Originally Posted by dandbj13 View Post
    No cell phone does "real" multitasking. I have a quad core desktop that does a pretty good job of it. In cell phone land, though, it is all just an approximation. What you are really talking about is a combination of backgrounding, app switching, and task completion. Palm builds all of this into the OS, but that makes for a very heavy experience that requires a significant piece of hardware to pull off smoothly. It also requires a user to move from one app at a time. Go ahead and open 20 apps, if you have enough memory. Now move from the first to the twentieth, one app at a time. At lease, Apple's (imperfect) implementation allows you to see four at a time, and move through them quickly.

    As for the rest, Apple builds in the tools, but requires developers to design their apps in a specific way to take advantage of the architecture. This is largely why Apple does not allow such tools as Flash. The apps written with those tools would not be able to take advantage of the native features of the OS.

    As for the end user, they will experience a blazing fast UI that switches tasks, backgrounds, and task completes without costing them significant battery life, error messages, crashes, or usability. Just because Palm has a prettier implementation, that does not make it better.
    Super mini card mode lets you see 5 cards at a time and has fast scrolling. I just opened 10 browser cards and can go from one end to the other in one swipe.
    As for all that stuff about battery life, errors, etc. I'll believe it when I see it.

    edit: oh, yeah, technically, a cpu core can only run one computation at a time in series (quickly switching between task). While an organic brain can run parallel computations, thus true multitasking at the core by processing more than one computation at the same time through the same nerves. But when people talk about multitasking on computers and phones in general, they just mean having multiple apps open.

    Quote Originally Posted by nappy
    In this case? Nothing. I was just showing you that the way iOS handles fast app switching with games isn't that much different from your example with the Pre.
    I was under the impression ios4 wants to close apps so other apps don't get bogged down but whatever.
    Last edited by spare; 06/24/2010 at 05:38 PM.
  20. #20  
    Quote Originally Posted by finngirl View Post
    I am on a 3G, and my web pages don't need to be refreshed. Even if the browser has not been open for days. So I never understood that issue. Side by side, i could always app switch between my browser and an app on the 3G much faster than i could on my Pre.

    I do understand its not running in the background - I hadn't specifically thought of that as an advantage since I turn off anything that runs in the background, just to save battery - its not worth it to me if I can't go a full day on one charge.
    Actually the 3G is refreshing the page or you are looking at old content. You can't look at CNN for example and then close the browser, open it and see the exact page you were looking at days ago. Restarting your browser is the same as refreshing your page. In webOS the browser will remain open until you close it. If you switch away, it will have to refresh the page again but it is not reopening the browser although the end result is the basically the same since it refreshes the page. Actually this was not the case in earlier versions of webOS. I can't remember which update created this function and yes I do think it is annoying but it is a battery saver.

    As far as apps running in the background, it is your personal preference whether to keep them open or not. It is an advantage if the immediate access to certain information is important to you and its not if you don''t care.

    The concept of the cards is that you can open all these programs and switch between them as you like without having to reopen them. Yes it may take longer on the Pre to open programs if you are always opening and closing the program. The chief concept with webOS is you don't have to close anything. You can keep your email, browser, twitter app, gps, music streaming app, and calender or whatever always open like a your home or laptop computer. In that sense the Pre works quite fast but its a whole different OS concept than the iphone and requires a different way of thinking about how you interact with the UI. I'm not saying you aren't cool or smart enough to use the UI effectively but if you are going to spend your day opening and closing everything, then maybe webOS isn't your thing and thats fine. In the end its all about preference. Of course running your gps and pandora all day will kill your battery quick while running other programs don't effect your battery life that much at all. You also have the option to change out your battery or the option to buy bigger batteries too and I like having those options. Since the new iphone has such amazing battery life, those options are also things you might not care about too.
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