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  1.    #1  
    Interested article from the guys over at Tom's Hardware.

    HP Buys Palm? - 8 Reasons Why Apple Should Fear HP/Palm - Tom's Guide

    Anyone one want to contribute 8 reasons why they should not?
    I am not Bashing Apple. I am a supporter of WEBOS. Some People find it hard to believe that others honestly consider WEBOS the Better option for OS. They call it many adjectives... but its just an honest support of what they believe is better. So, defend it or discredit. I like contributing discussions that make people support their own ideas and agendas. We all learn from each other when debating these topics.
    So much talk of dreaming and speculating from webos users. Apple users frown on the speculation. But honestly, how can you not? There are so many possibilities. Most of us tune into precentral for the next big announcement. These days... very few are coming our way. We must wait until At least after june 25th... most likely as late as july 31st for big news
    Until then... Dream, Speculate and Anticipate.
  2. urkel's Avatar
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    #2  
    There is A LOT to love about WebOS and the potential with HP is huge but to list the way they handled Voodoo as a positive is just sick. Voodoo was better off as a niche player rather than scrapped for parts in HP's confusing lineup. I really hope they keep things simple with WebOS and just release 1 Tablet and 2 Phone choices. But to be honest, I don't trust HP enough with such a potentially good product in their hands.
    Last edited by Urkel; 06/22/2010 at 08:57 AM.
  3. #3  
    I always enjoy reading positive palm-related articles. The part I hope becomes a reality (aside from new hardware of course) the most is when the author was discussing the possibilities of productivity/business features and desktop syncing.

    Either way, I've been counting down the days till the 31st. I can't wait to hear what hp has planned!
  4. #4  
    Choosing Sprint as an exclusive Pre and Pixi carrier was a huge misstep. If the hardware had launched on Verizon or AT&T instead, then Palm might have great phone sales and solid quarterly figures instead of under-performing numbers.
    He doesn't seem to be dissing the concept of exclusives because he mentions they should've launched on AT&T or Verizon instead. This is mainly Sprint bashing and lowers any credibility of the author.

    Palm got off to a great start but couldn't keep any momentum. I attribute this to bad marketing, the Pre not really having the greatest build and a webOS with growing pains. Bit of a niche form factor as well when people were craving slabs especially when the Hero hit Sprint.

    In the conclusion, he also mentions releasing before the 3GS, Palm shot themselves in the foot. More nonsense. Palm had Sprint to itself.

    He goes on to say the biggest complaint of webOS is sluggishness. Wasn't my biggest complaint and we've seen what some overclocking can do which suggest better hardware would cure some ills. But i fully expect Palm to integrate its pdk across its core apps anyways which they've indicated long ago that they will do.

    I would also take issue with his attitude that HP can bring the third party apps possibly getting apple app store like numbers. I've always felt the best way to build an app mall is getting anchors in there. Big names. Which means being aggressive and spending what it takes. Then the rest will follow. We'll have to see how committed HP is.
  5. #5  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    He doesn't seem to be dissing the concept of exclusives because he mentions they should've launched on AT&T or Verizon instead. This is mainly Sprint bashing and lowers any credibility of the author.
    It's a silly what-if that keeps getting batted around, and Rubinstein is just as guilty. People keep thinking of the device, OS, and app catalog that launched on Verizon this January when they present this scenario. None of that stuff was there in June of 2009, and if the 8GB, 256MB of Ram, no hotspot, crappy build Pre launched on Verizon with a threadbare app catalog and repellant Borg Queen marketing from Palm...it would've made just as bad an impression as it did on Sprint. No amount of "Pre does" marketing would change the fact that Palm positioned it to better an iPhone that was shelved and blown away by the 3GS just two weeks later.

    Furthermore, the idea in the article that HP will "steer" Palm to better carrier relationships is a joke. Sprint was and still is the ideal Palm partner. Verizon has no love for Palm, T-Mobile has no relationship with Palm whatsoever, and AT&T is indifferent. Meanwhile, what great carrier relationships are HP smartphones utilizing right now?

    Also silly is this idea that anyone will build an app catalog to "challenge" the App Store. That's an untouchable standard for the forseeable future, and money isn't going to change that.
  6. #6  
    I think its an ok article but I have been saying the same thing. AT&T and Verizon are better partners for HP then Sprint. Not saying it will not be on Sprint but I personally think there a bad partner. Not that VErizon is a better one . My best bet is AT&T. They seem to have a good relations ship with AT&T with the Pre Plus etc and AT&T is losing exclusive right to Iphone after next year. be good for AT&T to be the carrier for the new HP Web os Phone. again just my opinion but I have been saying that for months. Either way it will be interesting to see what HP has in 2011 for there new devices , Slats or smartphones.
  7. urkel's Avatar
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    #7  
    This isn't a slam, just something to consider. But which carriers will support the next WebOS device?

    -Sprint made it their flagship device thinking it would rescue their company but it turned out to be a support disaster because of shoddy hardware.
    -Verizon got in late and tossed in a FREE hotspot function and even at the unplanned price drop to $29 nobody will buy it.
    -ATT just got the GSM version and dropped prices but who would buy this over a $99 iPhone?

    Even if Palm has a product out then no carrier would accept the risk the bad publicity for yet another Palm device that may or may not deliver? Regardless of people's opinion on Android or WinMo7 devices, they're a much easier sell than Palm.


    I think The future of WebOS lies in tablets. It's a new(er) market where users will be more forgiving with slow updates and unexpected problems. And without any required carriers then HP can utilize it's distribution channels to get WebOS tablets in every retail store out there.
  8. #8  
    I doubt Apple is in fear of webos they probably don't even know it exists, I think android is more of a thorn in the side then webos.
    have you reseached the pie charts? http://www.precentral.net/webos-proj...ket-share-2012
    http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/29/s...pace-but-andr/
    http://www.businessinsider.com/why-w...-winner-2010-4
    Help a guy thats down and out on his luck..
  9.    #9  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    He doesn't seem to be dissing the concept of exclusives because he mentions they should've launched on AT&T or Verizon instead. This is mainly Sprint bashing and lowers any credibility of the author.

    Palm got off to a great start but couldn't keep any momentum. I attribute this to bad marketing, the Pre not really having the greatest build and a webOS with growing pains. Bit of a niche form factor as well when people were craving slabs especially when the Hero hit Sprint.

    In the conclusion, he also mentions releasing before the 3GS, Palm shot themselves in the foot. More nonsense. Palm had Sprint to itself.

    He goes on to say the biggest complaint of webOS is sluggishness. Wasn't my biggest complaint and we've seen what some overclocking can do which suggest better hardware would cure some ills. But i fully expect Palm to integrate its pdk across its core apps anyways which they've indicated long ago that they will do.

    I would also take issue with his attitude that HP can bring the third party apps possibly getting apple app store like numbers. I've always felt the best way to build an app mall is getting anchors in there. Big names. Which means being aggressive and spending what it takes. Then the rest will follow. We'll have to see how committed HP is.
    great observation. Most of those were points made that i disagreed with in the article as well.. This is a great critic of his article. I think the sprint bashing call was a bit harsh. It is an opinion. To say it lowers the any of authors cred is also harsh. He felt it would have launched on a bigger scale on a more reputable network ( at that time). I also disagree with him. I am a big supporter of Sprint. Did you find any of the strengths he presented as feasible?
  10. urkel's Avatar
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    #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by cardfan View Post
    Palm got off to a great start but couldn't keep any momentum. I attribute this to bad marketing, the Pre not really having the greatest build and a webOS with growing pains. Bit of a niche form factor as well when people were craving slabs especially when the Hero hit Sprint.
    I think the marketing angle to Palms failure is overblown because it takes away from the failures done by Palm in every other category.

    When introduced in Feb09 then WebOS had all the attention of the tech industry because they had a product that really did make itself stand out against the iPhone. But I think that Palm pretty much emptied it's basket at CES and had absolutely nothing else to show users/media in order to maintain the excitement. So by the time launch came then the Pre "felt" dated and any attempts to show it off was just regurgitating the same demo we saw 4mo ago. (Which is why it's silly when people here dismiss exclusive Apps as being too "ordinary" to acknowledge, people want to see something "new" which is why Apps are so important. Having MLB or Kindle is just as important a feature as having a camera flash.)

    Sure, marketing was a small factor here but mixed in with the immediate hardware issues and the industry moving away from small form factors then Palm just seemed like too little too late.
  11. #11  
    Quote Originally Posted by VaccPalm View Post
    I think its an ok article but I have been saying the same thing. AT&T and Verizon are better partners for HP then Sprint. Not saying it will not be on Sprint but I personally think there a bad partner. Not that VErizon is a better one . My best bet is AT&T. They seem to have a good relations ship with AT&T with the Pre Plus etc and AT&T is losing exclusive right to Iphone after next year. be good for AT&T to be the carrier for the new HP Web os Phone. again just my opinion but I have been saying that for months. Either way it will be interesting to see what HP has in 2011 for there new devices , Slats or smartphones.
    Just for perspective, the Palm Pre Plus on AT&T sells for a penny at Amazon, and despite that, it's still the FOURTH best selling AT&T smartphone, despite the iPhone not being sold there.

    Yes, the Motorola Backflip and HTC Tilt 2 are bigger sellers. The Pixi isn't even in their top 100 for all carriers. You really think AT&T is counting on a WebOS device to make up any part of the margins lost when iPhone goes to another carrier?
  12. #12  
    [QUOTE=Urkel;2518985]This isn't a slam, just something to consider. But which carriers will support the next WebOS device?

    -Sprint made it their flagship device thinking it would rescue their company but it turned out to be a support disaster because of shoddy hardware.
    -Verizon got in late and tossed in a FREE hotspot function and even at the unplanned price drop to $29 nobody will buy it.
    -ATT just got the GSM version and dropped prices but who would buy this over a $99 iPhone?

    Even if Palm has a product out then no carrier would accept the risk the bad publicity for yet another Palm device that may or may not deliver? Regardless of people's opinion on Android or WinMo7 devices, they're a much easier sell than Palm.


    I think The future of WebOS lies in tablets. It's a new(er) market where users will be more forgiving with slow updates and unexpected problems. And without any required carriers then HP can utilize it's distribution channels to get WebOS tablets in every retail store out there.[/QUOTE]

    I agree. HP should focus on making a big push in the tablet space. It's closer to their core expertise in desktop and laptop PCs. They can/should still dabble a bit in the smartphone world - but the bulk of investment should be in tablets.
  13. urkel's Avatar
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    #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by mikah912 View Post
    Just for perspective, the Palm Pre Plus on AT&T sells for a penny at Amazon, and despite that, it's still the FOURTH best selling AT&T smartphone, despite the iPhone not being sold there.

    Yes, the Motorola Backflip and HTC Tilt 2 are bigger sellers. The Pixi isn't even in their top 100 for all carriers. You really think AT&T is counting on a WebOS device to make up any part of the margins lost when iPhone goes to another carrier?
    Exactly. We all like webos but from a business perspective then when ATT loses iPhone exclusivity then WebOS is a risk that most carriers wont want to take... Again. Going to the current hot Android or WinMo device would be the more obvious move.
    Last edited by Urkel; 06/22/2010 at 11:09 AM.
  14. #14  
    Its a silly article filled with unrealistic assumptions. HP does not have a history of buying companies and enhancing them. Look what happened to Compaq. With the exception of HP-UX, HP mostly sells hardware with Intel CPUs running Windows. For mobile devices they won't be able to compete with RIM in the enterprise space or Apple in the consumer space.
  15. #15  
    [QUOTE=Really mobile;2519022]
    Quote Originally Posted by Urkel View Post
    This isn't a slam, just something to consider. But which carriers will support the next WebOS device?

    -Sprint made it their flagship device thinking it would rescue their company but it turned out to be a support disaster because of shoddy hardware.
    -Verizon got in late and tossed in a FREE hotspot function and even at the unplanned price drop to $29 nobody will buy it.
    -ATT just got the GSM version and dropped prices but who would buy this over a $99 iPhone?

    Even if Palm has a product out then no carrier would accept the risk the bad publicity for yet another Palm device that may or may not deliver? Regardless of people's opinion on Android or WinMo7 devices, they're a much easier sell than Palm.

    I think The future of WebOS lies in tablets. It's a new(er) market where users will be more forgiving with slow updates and unexpected problems. And without any required carriers then HP can utilize it's distribution channels to get WebOS tablets in every retail store out there.

    I agree. HP should focus on making a big push in the tablet space. It's closer to their core expertise in desktop and laptop PCs. They can/should still dabble a bit in the smartphone world - but the bulk of investment should be in tablets.
    Apple just announced 3 million ipads sold. Thats phenomenal, HP will certainly have its hands full trying to sell a product in a market in which Apple is once again dominating and set the bar for. The bonus for HP is ..... No one is locked into contracts with th iPad.
  16. #16  
    [QUOTE=barkerja;2519476]
    Quote Originally Posted by Really mobile View Post

    Apple just announced 3 million ipads sold. Thats phenomenal, HP will certainly have its hands full trying to sell a product in a market in which Apple is once again dominating and set the bar for. The bonus for HP is ..... No one is locked into contracts with th iPad.
    The other bonus is that there is no strong #2 option yet. That's the spot HP could aim for (as Android did in the smartphone space).
  17.    #17  
    [QUOTE=barkerja;2519476]
    Quote Originally Posted by Really mobile View Post

    Apple just announced 3 million ipads sold. Thats phenomenal, HP will certainly have its hands full trying to sell a product in a market in which Apple is once again dominating and set the bar for. The bonus for HP is ..... No one is locked into contracts with th iPad.
    that is impressive. The ability to market and sell a product is impressive... I am always amazed at the crap the millions buy off of late night infomercials. Ipad is a beauty..but I am not interested in one... At all.
    Ipad is being called a consumption device.
    anyways....i am interested in the potential of a new hp webos slate.
    just because something is marketable, popular, does not make it better.
    I know no one on this thread is making that assumption...but I have gotten that impresion from apple fans.
    as far as HP having their hands full marketing... The biggest thing they need to focus on is quality and execution. If they build it... And it is impressive...they will buy. Do they need to sell 3 million to stay in biz...no. Do I want more options to choose from that better suit me... Yes.
    a world in where only ipads and iphones existed would suck. HP.... Needs to step up to apple quality and execution in order to compete....we shall see. I think we all hope they come through... For the sake of competition if nothing else.
  18. #18  
    >>just because something is marketable, popular, does not make it better.


    Better than what? Imaginary specs on products not yet delivered?

    I am sure something will come out that bests the iPad - none of the current tablets do, i am assuming you agree with that - but until now, its hard pressed to say there is a tablet that is better.
  19. #19  
    Apples touchscreen technology is superb compared to my Palm Pre's screen. I feel if Apple keeps putting out awesome technology they are going to stay on top.
  20.    #20  
    [QUOTE=finngirl;2519696]>>just because something is marketable, popular, does not make it better.


    Better than what? Imaginary specs on products not yet delivered?

    I am sure something will come out that bests the iPad - none of the current tablets do, i am assuming you agree with that - but until now, its hard pressed to say there is a tablet that is better.[/QUOTE

    Take it for exactly what it states... Just because "something" sells and is popular, does not make it better...period.
    you read into it to assume I meant ipad vs webos slate.
    wow finngirl... You love your drama.
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