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  1. #41  
    I just sketched the outline of the size of an Evo using a ruler, and put my Pre inside the drawing...

    As attractive as it is, holy god that phone is big.
    August 2009 - January 2011. Thank god I'm no longer a Pre user!

  2. miata's Avatar
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    #42  
    I wonder how people's expectations for phone size changes if the iPad and other tablet like devices get adopted. I have a Pxi Plus today and if I had an iPad tethered to that phone I would probably be more than happy with the phone screen size. Right now the big problems I have with the small screen size is when trying to do email or web surfing at an airport or on a plane while traveling. The Pixi Plus screen is sufficient for doing most things in a pinch, but it a little limiting for continuous use.

    If someone has an iPad, they will be less likely to want a big phone.
    Pilot Pro -> Pilot Vx -> Kyocera 7135 -> Treo 650 -> Treo 680 -> Pre -> Pixi Plus -> Pre2 + TouchPad -> BB 9930 -> Pre3+ Playbook
    Verizon -> Cingular -> ATT -> Sprint -> Verizon -> ATT
  3. #43  
    Quote Originally Posted by foosball View Post
    Here let me explain it to you in simple terms:

    Alot of Pre users find the iphone obnoxiously large. The Evo is only making matters worse and is that much more outlandish...but hey if you read the large print edition of your favorite magazine then it could be the phone for you. To each his own.
    I just looked at the measurements above and converted millimeters to inches.

    Again - ignoring the iPhone altogether - if a device being less than ONE INCH taller and not even ONE HALF OF ONE INCH wider than the Pre makes it "obnoxiously large", I question your perception of size.

    It's fine if you love the size and form factor of the Pre. But increasing its height less than an inch and width by a quarter hardly makes it "unpocketable" by any stretch of the imagination. I wear normal pants (slacks and jeans) as a tall, but otherwise normal-sized man. The Pre, in its sleeping bag, flops around comfortably into every left pocket I have. Many, many, MANY people also pocket iPhones quite easily. Even with cases around them to add bulk.

    If you don't care to carry a phone that size, great. But right now, that aesthetic isn't in vogue. It does not make a device some unpocketable, outlandish monster simply because you don't personally care for it.
  4. #44  
    For front pocket, pocketability, thickness is by far the most important factor. Width being second, as if you get wide enough eventually it will start to get annoying.

    To me anything over .5" thick gets to be a bit annoying (pixi is perfect just under that number), with the droid being acceptable but a little thicker than optimal. I'd imagine the evo, which is thinner than the pixi, would be quite pocketable, but I'd have to hold one to see if the width was just too much(doubtful). Also the pixi adds pocketability because of its curved edges, reduces the outline of the phone in pocket.

    -Lots of people either don't put phones in front pockets anymore, or wear ginormous pants, so size is a minimal factor for a lot of people.
  5. #45  
    Quote Originally Posted by Complex Pants View Post
    Here are some measurements to consider. Some of them surprised me, in particular how thin the Galaxy S is.
    Source = Cell phone reviews, news and specs - Phone Arena

    Palm Pre Plus: 100.5 x 59.5 x 16.9mm
    Palm Pixi Plus: 111 x 55 x 10.8mm

    HTC EVO: 122 x 66 x 13mm
    Samsung Galaxy S: 122.4 x 64.2 x 9.9mm
    Google Nexus 1: 119 x 55.8 x 11.5mm
    Motorola Droid: 115.8 x 60 x 13.7mm

    Apple iPhone 3GS: 115.5 x 62.1 x 12.3mm
    I did some volume calculations and found this interesting:

    Evo 104.68 cubic centimeters
    Pre 101.06 cubic centimeters
    iPhone 88.222 cubic centimeters

    Now I know volume isn't the be all end all. It's just one factor. I was surprised to find that the iPhone has less volume than the Pre. Although this isn't taking the rounded shape of the Pre into account, which definitely skews the Pre's volume calculation considerably.

    Some of you seem really hot and bothered and even offended by others opinions on what the size of the next Pre should be. Personally, I don't give a as long as the hardware is a considerable step up from the current Pre. Happy bickering!
  6. cdjh's Avatar
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       #46  
    it's not that a larger phone is such a terrible thing that anyone needs to bicker. But it wasn't that long ago when small was everything. Remember when everyone had those rediculously small nokia phones. I still remember how cool it was to see that you could get a phone without an antenna sticking up.

    if you asked people what one feature they want in the next pre, it seems like most people around here would say "a bigger screen". Make the screen as big as you can by having less bezel. Add more pixels for sure. I just don't get the need for such a big device. the evo MIGHT still be pocketable, but it is definitely pushing the limit.

    I wouldn't say I wear skinny jeans. But there are some days when you gotta go a little snug to show off what you've got, ya know. Is that an evo in ur pocket or....
  7. #47  
    Quote Originally Posted by octoberorange View Post
    I just sketched the outline of the size of an Evo using a ruler, and put my Pre inside the drawing...

    As attractive as it is, holy god that phone is big.
    mind taking a picture and posting it i'm interested in seeing the size comparison
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       #48  
    Quote Originally Posted by 063_xobx View Post
    mind taking a picture and posting it i'm interested in seeing the size comparison
    +1
  9. #49  
    I agree with you. And when you think of it, the Pre has one of the larger screens for a phone with a full qwerty... As long as I have pinch to zoom, it works for me. Although, not everyone is like me so I can see the appeal to other devices.
  10. #50  
    I love the size and feel of the Pre, its just comfortable. My son just got the Hero and it feels so less comfortable, of course I had the HTC Diamond, hated that phone and it look so much like it.

    Anyway, the only thing I would change is the screen size. If they lopped off some of the bottom gesture area, the screen could be made bigger with no size change. Or even have it slide out horizontally, giving us landscape abilities with a larger keyboard would be an idea.

    I need glasses to read it sometime, so big screens are important to me, but I will never watch movies, tv, or play games, so its size is more important to me. I have a netbook if I need to see things, I want a multi purpose phone that feels like one, not a weight.
  11. #51  
    Why are people so against on-screen keyboards? Am I missing something. I use a multitouch on-screen keyboard for my iPod Touch and I can knock out paragraphs with ease and virtually no finger strain. Keep in mind I say multitouch. The one currently available through Preware is not multitouch which makes typing on it a "peck by peck" input compared to being able to type multiple letters at once.

    I wish Palm would get their head out of their behinds and realize physical keyboards are not the answer. I think one of Palm's officials said that physical keyboards will be what distinguishes them from the competition but I seriously think they need to rethink that strategy seeing how they are about to loose everything if they keep living in the past when it comes to hardware.

    So no, I don't like small devices anymore because I need enough room for a multitouch keyboard asap. It doesn't have to be EVO 4G big but at least bigger and thinner than what we have now. I'm not picky. So please PALM...GET RID OF THE PHYSICAL KEYBOARDS. Mainstream consumers can handle on-screens. Look at the iPhone, Nexus One, iPad, most of the current Androids. You don't hear, "Oh I wish I had a mini Qwerty like the Pre", maybe a thin slide out like the Droids, but that can be looked at in the future.

    For now, give us a Rectangle, SEXY Thin Metal Slab, with a 1gz processor, long battery life and you can have my money along with every user on this forum guaranteed. For the rest of the public, it depends on when you deliver because when the iPhone HD comes out, which is said to tout a front facing camera, more speed, a bigger screen, and the mother of all features...Multitasking, that will probably sink you guys to a new low. But at least you will have us loyal forum members.
  12. miata's Avatar
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    #52  
    The problem with slab form factor is that you are competing directly with the iPhone which has tons more momentum -- marketing, applications and users. I don't see how Palm would compete head on with the iPhone. Sure there is a small group of folks like you and I who appreciate the nuances of webOS over the iPhone, but at the end of the day Palm will get lost in the rat race.

    A phone with a nice keyboard and multi-touch gestures is a lot easier to differentiate than just another slab.
    Pilot Pro -> Pilot Vx -> Kyocera 7135 -> Treo 650 -> Treo 680 -> Pre -> Pixi Plus -> Pre2 + TouchPad -> BB 9930 -> Pre3+ Playbook
    Verizon -> Cingular -> ATT -> Sprint -> Verizon -> ATT
  13. #53  
    I would like to have a webOS device with the screen size of the Pre and the one piece form factor of the Pixi. I don't want a virtual keyboard.
  14. #54  
    Quote Originally Posted by miata View Post
    The problem with slab form factor is that you are competing directly with the iPhone which has tons more momentum -- marketing, applications and users. I don't see how Palm would compete head on with the iPhone. Sure there is a small group of folks like you and I who appreciate the nuances of webOS over the iPhone, but at the end of the day Palm will get lost in the rat race.

    A phone with a nice keyboard and multi-touch gestures is a lot easier to differentiate than just another slab.
    Palm is already competing with Apple, every smart phone manufacturer is competing with Apple because Apple is King. People have been leaving the iPhone for the Pre for many reasons. Multitasking and openness are some of the reasons. More would come if Palm stopped treating WebOS like some chick phone which detours women and men equally. If Palm wants to survive they have to compete, they have to look at the iPhone, even other smartphones from Android, RIM, and even Symbian. They need to pick up where those fail and somehow market to those consumers as such effectively.

    People are sick of the iPhone but they stay with it because of the tons of Apps, sturdy strong hardware, and stability. Palm doesn't offer any of those major selling traits and that's why they are where they are now. When an average Joe picks up the Pre, they don't see WebOS first, they see the device, they feel it, they try and imagine it falling and wonder what it would look like in a month. The Pre feels cheap and not worthy of WebOS. Its like putting a Ferrari Enzo engine into a Ford Focus. Palm knew they were wrong for doing this but somehow they still don't care and they still keep trying to throw that hardware at other carriers.

    An oval shaped, plastic slider qwerty doesn't signal smart phone to the mainstream. To the mainstream slider phones are not cool anymore I don't care what anyone says. If you like a physical keyboard keep your Pre but for the majority (majority: meaning the large iPhone user base) we want something sexy with no room for wiggle or oreo effect.

    Quote Originally Posted by hrminer92 View Post
    I would like to have a webOS device with the screen size of the Pre and the one piece form factor of the Pixi. I don't want a virtual keyboard.
    Can you tell me the reason you prefer a physical keyboard. I really would like to know what people see in them.
  15. #55  
    Quote Originally Posted by likeobama View Post
    Can you tell me the reason you prefer a physical keyboard. I really would like to know what people see in them.
    Physical keyboard + Universal Search
    Hold 1 button down -> instant speed dial
    Start typing whatever you want->immediate(well besides the lag) options to open what you want
    -It is just really fast to get where you want. Plus, for me I'm terrible on virtual keyboards, so a physical keyboard is needed if I want to type a sentence.
  16. #56  
    Quote Originally Posted by ninjab View Post
    Physical keyboard + Universal Search
    Hold 1 button down -> instant speed dial
    Start typing whatever you want->immediate(well besides the lag) options to open what you want
    -It is just really fast to get where you want. Plus, for me I'm terrible on virtual keyboards, so a physical keyboard is needed if I want to type a sentence.
    Speed dialing doesn't justify a keyboard to me. Universal search and instant typing can be implemented the same way for on-screen keyboards. In regards to typing better on a cramped qwerty (if you own a Pre) compared to a more widely spaced multitouch on-screen, I would suggest you try again, maybe with an iPhone or iPod Touch. I think you would seriously like them more after you start typing paragraphs with a lot more ease.
  17. #57  
    Virtual keyboards eat screen space and have no tactile feedback. Physical keyboards allow for "no look" typing which is just plain faster and a better experience.

    Virtual keyboards will attempt to emulate physical keyboards with varying degrees of success but they are always stuck trying to recreate the physical experience.
  18. #58  
    Quote Originally Posted by likeobama View Post
    Speed dialing doesn't justify a keyboard to me. Universal search and instant typing can be implemented the same way for on-screen keyboards. In regards to typing better on a cramped qwerty (if you own a Pre) compared to a more widely spaced multitouch on-screen, I would suggest you try again, maybe with an iPhone or iPod Touch. I think you would seriously like them more after you start typing paragraphs with a lot more ease.
    universal search with a multitouch would first require you to bring up the on screen keyboard, so it takes more steps. I still use my phone as a phone first, so if it takes me more than a couple presses to call someone I get annoyed. And with physical keys I can honestly not even look most of the time when I need to call someone while driving (really helpful since webos still doesn't have voice dialing). I've tried an iphone and I couldn't even put in a wifi password, sure I could probably adapt with a few days on it, but I still like tactile response (I have a pixi they aren't mushy keys).
  19. #59  
    Quote Originally Posted by foosball View Post
    Virtual keyboards eat screen space and have no tactile feedback. Physical keyboards allow for "no look" typing which is just plain faster and a better experience.

    Virtual keyboards will attempt to emulate physical keyboards with varying degrees of success but they are always stuck trying to recreate the physical experience.
    Maybe on the weaker Pixi but for a lot of Pre users, the slide out keyboard does more harm than good. An onscreen keyboard is what the majority wants and haptic feedback can always be added to help ease the transition. For the techies that enjoy a physical keyboard, Palm can keep selling you guys its large stock of left over Pixi's and Pres. To stay in business they need a flagship device that can compete directly with the current and future iPhones, Androids, Win7s and eliminating extra bulk (eg. keyboard), giving us a larger screen, a front-facing camera, faster processor, larger battery will do that.

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjab View Post
    universal search with a multitouch would first require you to bring up the on screen keyboard, so it takes more steps. I still use my phone as a phone first, so if it takes me more than a couple presses to call someone I get annoyed. And with physical keys I can honestly not even look most of the time when I need to call someone while driving (really helpful since webos still doesn't have voice dialing). I've tried an iphone and I couldn't even put in a wifi password, sure I could probably adapt with a few days on it, but I still like tactile response (I have a pixi they aren't mushy keys).
    I don't consider the Pixi to be in anyway related to Palm's success or future. The Pixi is a nice phone for people that are comfortable with candybar style phones. Heck, I loved my Centro for years and I still do but Palm needs to move forward and stop relying on tactics of the past. Look at what's out there. Go to engadget and scroll through the posts. Ever device making money lacks a keyboard, has a larger screen, and is getting faster and faster.

    WebOS is a serious OS in your hand but we are stuck using hardware that prevents it from moving with the best of them. In regards to how it can be implemented and whether it would be easier or harder, a double tap in the gesture area could always pop up a keyboard, a home button held could do it too. There are many ways it can be done, so I implore Palm to stop wasting time and get these types of devices out before its too late.
  20. miata's Avatar
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    #60  
    Quote Originally Posted by likeobama View Post
    Palm is already competing with Apple, every smart phone manufacturer is competing with Apple because Apple is King. People have been leaving the iPhone for the Pre for many reasons. Multitasking and openness are some of the reasons. More would come if Palm stopped treating WebOS like some chick phone which detours women and men equally. If Palm wants to survive they have to compete, they have to look at the iPhone, even other smartphones from Android, RIM, and even Symbian. They need to pick up where those fail and somehow market to those consumers as such effectively.

    People are sick of the iPhone but they stay with it because of the tons of Apps, sturdy strong hardware, and stability. Palm doesn't offer any of those major selling traits and that's why they are where they are now. When an average Joe picks up the Pre, they don't see WebOS first, they see the device, they feel it, they try and imagine it falling and wonder what it would look like in a month. The Pre feels cheap and not worthy of WebOS. Its like putting a Ferrari Enzo engine into a Ford Focus. Palm knew they were wrong for doing this but somehow they still don't care and they still keep trying to throw that hardware at other carriers.

    An oval shaped, plastic slider qwerty doesn't signal smart phone to the mainstream. To the mainstream slider phones are not cool anymore I don't care what anyone says. If you like a physical keyboard keep your Pre but for the majority (majority: meaning the large iPhone user base) we want something sexy with no room for wiggle or oreo effect.



    Can you tell me the reason you prefer a physical keyboard. I really would like to know what people see in them.
    I would argue that one of the reasons that Palm is taking customers away from Apple -- if at all -- is due to the physical keyboard. In case you have not been following users are very happy with their iPhones.

    The less Palm competes directly with the iPhone the better.
    Pilot Pro -> Pilot Vx -> Kyocera 7135 -> Treo 650 -> Treo 680 -> Pre -> Pixi Plus -> Pre2 + TouchPad -> BB 9930 -> Pre3+ Playbook
    Verizon -> Cingular -> ATT -> Sprint -> Verizon -> ATT
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