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  1. #41  
    Originally posted by ****-richardson
    I can't stand Quicken. It limits my syncing options .
    Well, my only beef with them is that they haven't released a Linux version. But they have a version for OS X, so if present trends continue, I'll be covered when September rolls around.
    Never did the Memplug thing. Never realized I had a need for it (rather like the need I didn't realize I have for voice recording).
    I don't have a need for either personally. Voice recording is the least of the reasons I'm looking at Handera. The real audio subsystem and speaker are bigger draws because of four little letters: DTMF. The Memplug was a want addition for me. If it'd had real CF peripheral support, it might have approached need.
    I, on the other hand, do not wish to purchase another Palm Pilot for many moons.
    That's not the other hand. I don't want to purchase another PDA for quite a while either. That's why my Edge is sticking around until at least summer time (and possibly as long as Christmas). My next PDA is going to be something that'll last me longer than any of my previous three did. heheh...I think the real reason many PocketPC geeks are pissed about OS5 is that because it's ARM-based, they're drooling to flash their iPaqs.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  2. #42  
    Looking at Palm's OS5/OS6 decision again, I have to say that it was probably the best of several unpleasant choices.

    They could have released OS 5 much later, say sometime early next year; or made an interim Dragonball release with a few bells and whistles until OS 5 was out. But I think they would have really caught flack for that from the press, their customers and their retailers; and Microsoft would have loved it.

    This way, they get hardware out that can compete with Pocket PCs in areas they can't today, while keeping the same familiar Palm UI and software out there. "It's faster!", while not particularly attractive by itself to geeks like me, does do well with the buying public.

    And I assume, since the APIs are basically the same as OS 4.1, that anyone not writing Hacks is going to find it a relatively easy port. Maybe not exciting or interesting; but I've ported single-thread code to a multi-thread model, and in some cases my head hurt a lot. Maybe the lower threashold will be viewed as a "little pain, and continued income" to some software developers.

    Now, the decisions that led Palm to this situation, where they p*ssed time that could have been spent getting the port to ARM done months earlier... I think that's fertile ground for criticism.
    Last edited by bookrats; 02/07/2002 at 05:29 PM.
    Jeff Meyer

    "And he died like he lived: with his mouth wide open."
  3. #43  
    Oops -- please ignore this fine post. (Must learn to differentiate "edit" button from "quote" button.)
    Jeff Meyer

    "And he died like he lived: with his mouth wide open."
  4. #44  
    Originally posted by sowens


    I would also have to disagree with your argument that multimedia is just a
    hardware issue. Without the APIs, multimedia is a bear to program.
    I should have been more clear. Yes, it's absolutely essential to have multimedia APIs. My point was that the APIs are easy ... it's the multimedia capable hardware that takes most of the development work.


    Perhaps. I admit I haven't had as much experience with developing for PalmOS that you have, but I also can't believe that PalmSource engineers can't see the writing on the wall, either. I'm willing to wait for more info before jumping to conclusions.
    I don't think it's a matter of not seeing the problem, I think it's a matter of not yet being able to do anything about it. Palm's OS 5 development resources have clearly been focused on writing a new kernel (so they can get out from under AMX licensing restrictions) and porting to ARM. Writing a kernel and porting to a new CPU are hard! I know - I've done both The Dragonball emulator alone was no doubt a huge bit of work.

    There are only so many hours in a day so there's a limit to how much Palm has been able to do. The problem is that they should have started on API improvements a long time ago. Instead they've done little to improve the overall Palm architecture. Palm started with a big lead but they wasted it. Now they're trying to play catch-up with competitors that aren't about to slow down. I don't envy their position.
    <ul><li>Dave Kessler<br>President - Kopsis, Inc.</li></ul>
  5. #45  
    Palm started with a big lead but they wasted it.
    Well put.
    We're all naked if you turn us inside out.
    -David Byrne
  6. #46  
    Originally posted by dkessler

    Instead they've done little to improve the overall Palm architecture. Palm started with a big lead but they wasted it.
    What I find most interesting is that Palm is betraying its own principals. WinCE was widely criticized for being a "fragmented" platform running on different processors and on different types of devices. Now Palm is moving in the exact direction that Microsoft is abandoning. Let's see, we have two different processors: Dragonball, and ARM. And we have some devices with 160x160 displays, while others sport 320x320 pixel resolution...or higher. Some devices will have a fixed Graffiti space, while others will use software based input. Some devices will offer multimedia, others will not. Some devices will offer communication features. Others will be standalone devices. Hmm..this looks even worse than WinCE. I never thought I would say this, but PocketPC is becoming a far more consistent platform. Take a good look folks, your watching a dominant platform slowly hang itself out to dry.
  7. #47  
    Originally posted by foo fighter


    What I find most interesting is that Palm is betraying its own principals. WinCE was widely criticized for being a "fragmented" platform running on different processors and on different types of devices. Now Palm is moving in the exact direction that Microsoft is abandoning. Let's see, we have two different processors: Dragonball, and ARM. And we have some devices with 160x160 displays, while others sport 320x320 pixel resolution...or higher. Some devices will have a fixed Graffiti space, while others will use software based input. Some devices will offer multimedia, others will not. Some devices will offer communication features. Others will be standalone devices. Hmm..this looks even worse than WinCE. I never thought I would say this, but PocketPC is becoming a far more consistent platform. Take a good look folks, your watching a dominant platform slowly hang itself out to dry.
    For the Palm OS to survive, it needs to diversify. Certainly there is a wrong way of doing it, i.e. WinCE. I think its good that not too many changes were made to the Palm OS interface, that is what most people are used to. Its not about the OS, but about the software you run on it. Multitasking is great and all, if it is more user-friendly (read: *****-proof) than PPC 2002. But they should have paid attention to the core programs. Additional fields for the address book, hierarchial category structure, removal of memo pad limit, and categories for the datebook. All this can still be done and undercut third-party developers.

    Overall, Palm OS 5 looks great though not the world shattering update that everyone was expecting. This could end up being bad for Palm. They have built it up to being a revolutionary update, certainly creating a buzz. However, when the details come out, the new OS turns out to not be to everyone's inflated expectation. This happened with OS 4, and it looks like it will happen to OS 6 (or OS 5.5)

    Just my 2 yen.
    Did you just go near a burning hot river of lava or are you just happy to see me?
  8. #48  
    It's the consumer who will decide where Palm goes, just as the consumer has pared down wince.

    IMO, all this porting and multimedia will gain little. The damn fine Pilot just needed to evolve, not revolve - i.e. DBk4 should be standard, Address+, ToDo+, WordSmith, scientific graphing calculator, findhack, html mail support, maybe include financial software along with Avantgo, increase screen resolution purely to make the text cleaner, virtual graffiti for screen space, SD/MMC & CF expansion, one connection change from serial to USB with standard form factors ("normal" and "svelte"), possibly color across the board, more memory and faster processors as needed. Everything seems so clear from here.
    -Joshua
    I've decided to become enigmatic.
  9. #49  
    Originally posted by dkessler
    [...] Instead they've done little to improve the overall Palm architecture. Palm started with a big lead but they wasted it. Now they're trying to play catch-up with competitors that aren't about to slow down. I don't envy their position.
    *shrug* Microsoft was in the same position in late '94/'95 WRT the Internet. They were the dominant desktop player, though, and had the brand recognition. When they came out with a 'good enough' implementation for the general public which was priced better (free), it didn't matter how much the geeks liked Netscape. I'm personally waiting to see what the final products look like and what they'll cost before passing judgement. If Palm has to raise prices to PocketPC levels to get the features they're talking about, I doubt if they'll make it.
    ‎"Is that suck and salvage the Kevin Costner method?" - Chris Matthews on Hardball, July 6, 2010. Wonder if he's talking about his oil device or his movie career...
  10. #50  
    Just read PalmInfoCenter's Q&A with Michael Mace, the PalmSource CCO, about Palm OS 5.

    Good interview, and I'm impressed. Again, sounds like they took a bad situation left by their predecessors, and are making good choices given their predicament.

    I'd say he has a very realistic outlook -- which is high up on the priority list for someone in his position, and for a company in PalmSource's situation.
    Jeff Meyer

    "And he died like he lived: with his mouth wide open."
  11. #51  
    From the article:

    I know this won't be a satisfactory answer to a lot of folks, but that's why the third-party developers are here. They do a gorgeous job of extending these applications in all sorts of directions.
    While I totally agree with that statement, it's a bad move if competing with PPC is important. 'bundled' software is really the PPC main sales pitch and, unfortunately, that goes a long way when selling to the general public.
    We're all naked if you turn us inside out.
    -David Byrne
  12. #52  
    I am disappointed in Palm OS 5. It doesn't seem to have much if any "consumer" changes to it. All this anticipation for nothing. At least the Palm OS is still the best of the bunch in terms of useability.
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