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  1. #21  
    Originally posted by foo fighter

    An HS branded PocketPC is the next logical move.
    Hmm. Why not develop a PalmOS device powered by a StrongARM? Handspring has been very innovative (Springboard, 16bit), why shouldn't they make bigger changes in PalmOS and make it compatible with StrongARM?
  2.    #22  
    Originally posted by weberflo
    Hmm. Why not develop a PalmOS device powered by a StrongARM? Handspring has been very innovative (Springboard, 16bit), why shouldn't they make bigger changes in PalmOS and make it compatible with StrongARM?
    Because in order for the PalmOS to run on StrongARM or Xscale, the entire OS would need to be recompliled. Handspring can't just throw the OS on an ARM chip some Tuesday morning. That move requires a total rewrite to the OS codebase. And that is something only Palm can do. So far, they have drug their feet.
  3. #23  
    Originally posted by foo fighter


    Because in order for the PalmOS to run on StrongARM or Xscale, the entire OS would need to be recompliled. Handspring can't just throw the OS on an ARM chip some Tuesday morning. That move requires a total rewrite to the OS codebase. And that is something only Palm can do. So far, they have drug their feet.
    They would just need to create a emulator for the ARM. Isnt there
    someone already doing that for the PPC? That way, if they
    finally include flash, when OS 5.0 comes out, we wouldnt have to
    buy new pda. Wont palm need to create a emulator for OS 5 to
    run OS 4 < programs?
  4.    #24  
    Originally posted by wforde
    They would just need to create a emulator for the ARM. Isnt there
    someone already doing that for the PPC? That way, if they
    finally include flash, when OS 5.0 comes out, we wouldnt have to
    buy new pda. Wont palm need to create a emulator for OS 5 to
    run OS 4 < programs?
    It's not that simple. You can run one OS, in emulation mode, on top of the primary OS. But you can't run the primary OS in emulation. For example, MacOS X runs older apps in "Classic mode", which is OS 9. But you can't simply emulate OS X because it is running OS 9.

    Besides, neither OS 5, nor XScale (ARM) will be out until next year.
  5. mhc48#CB's Avatar
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    #25  
    Originally posted by yardie


    I would be surprise if I see Handspring come out with a PDA with built in MP3 player. Enterprise users have no use for such frills.
    My wife deals with them on a daily basis as part of her business. The IT guys don't need this, but all their users, and the managers too, want it. The idea is, "If have to carry around and use something that integrates into the enterprise for work, give me something that I can also play with on my own."

    My wife often buys pdas as "gifts" to her IT client managers. She used to buy Palms, now they all want iPaqs. That's in fact how I got mine. One of her clients wanted one, but it had a screen reversal problem that was common with the early iPaqs. He was too much of a big shot to deign checking it out and sending it into Compaq so gave it back to my wife and she bought him a new one. I mailed it in to Compaq and the next day got a replacement.

    Afterwards I bought a 128k CF card, the sleeve needed for the CF card and a Vaja case. I tried several times to carry it around and use it, but for all it's glitzy ability to play mp3 and wma files, and even movies, it's just no comparison to my Prism on a day in day out basis, for ease of use, program availability (and price) and size/weight.

    All that said, it's the enterprise where the big numbers of sales are made, and with bigger profit margins. Like WordPerfect which always was and still is better than Word, if the Palm OS loses the enterprise market because of the ease of PPCs integrating with IT systems, then Palm will slowly wither and effectively die out.
    -Michael-
  6. #26  
    Originally posted by MHCohn
    Like WordPerfect which always was and still is better than Word, if the Palm OS loses the enterprise market because of the ease of PPCs integrating with IT systems, then Palm will slowly wither and effectively die out.
    <Off Topic>
    My dad often has reason to do into Mega-Sized-Law Firms, and was surprised recently to see that many of their typing pools (yes, they're still around) still use Word Perfect 5.1. Why? It's the only thing fast enough to use decently. Everything can be done via the Keyboard with a minimum of fuss. The secretaries he's spoken to guess that it increases their productivity over the latest version of Word by at least 30%. Aya!
    </Off Topic>

    I think that Palm knows full well how high the stakes are for enterprise, seems that's all they can talk about. I bet that's why they're a big fan of Docs-to-Go, one standard app that interfaces cleanly with Office. If they're dropping the ball on flash factor lately, I think it's because they're so focused on the exectutive right now. Yes, the palm boards have fear for Palm, but I don't think they're intentionally ignoring reports...
  7. #27  
    This is going to sound really cold and selfish, but Palm was around long enough to get me my ultra-sleek 505. I consider the 505 the final evolution in the lineage of the original Palm Pilot. We all hope they turn things around. But if they aren't around long enough to roll out a thinner, faster, more vivid, A500 series, so be it. I can't burn my energy worrying about companies that don't have their rudder on straight.
    That IS a Palm III form-factor in my pocket, AND I'm happy to see you.
  8.    #28  
    Originally posted by MHCohn
    All that said, it's the enterprise where the big numbers of sales are made, and with bigger profit margins. Like WordPerfect which always was and still is better than Word, if the Palm OS loses the enterprise market because of the ease of PPCs integrating with IT systems, then Palm will slowly wither and effectively die out.
    Yep! That was exactly the same point I was making. Consumers and Pro-sumers will continue to choose Palm over PocketPC, I do. But this battle may be faught and won in the enterprise, not the consumer market. This is how the desktop PC got into homes. It started in the enterprise and migrated over to consumers. If the PalmOS loses that fight, which I believe it already has, then PocketPC will dominate the enterprise...and could, over time, migrate over to consumer space.
  9. #29  
    Originally posted by slotmachine
    This is going to sound really cold and selfish, but Palm was around long enough to get me my ultra-sleek 505. I consider the 505 the final evolution in the lineage of the original Palm Pilot. We all hope they turn things around. But if they aren't around long enough to roll out a thinner, faster, more vivid, A500 series, so be it. I can't burn my energy worrying about companies that don't have their rudder on straight.
    Dam strait and well said, skippy! Not cold and selfish at all. Take what you can get, unless we're left with just one option, and it is substandard for my needs, I'll be smilin. -->
  10. #30  
    Originally posted by foo fighter

    Ed is a friggin Palm lap dog. He will defend that company no matter how grim the sale forecast because he is biased. So take any commentary from Ed with a grain of salt and a shot of Vodka.
    And Foo Fighter has been predicting the end of the Palm OS since WinCE 2.0.
  11.    #31  
    Originally posted by John Nowak
    And Foo Fighter has been predicting the end of the Palm OS since WinCE 2.0.
    I have? That's news to me. I wasn't even into CE devices in those days. Nor am I now. Until last year when I jumped onto PocketPCs, and later left. As far as the end of the PalmOS goes, I'm not saying it will literally die, but PocketPC could become the dominant platform in the enterprise while PalmOS will be relegated to the consumer electronics market. Judging from the recent market data, that seems to be whats happening now.
  12. #32  
    Originally posted by foo fighter


    I have? That's news to me.
    I'm not in the least surprised.

    Originally posted by foo fighter

    I wasn't even into CE devices in those days. Nor am I now.
    Of course you aren't. I believe you.

    Foo, you are the guy who tried to claim that WinCE was as well supported as the PalmOS at the time PalmGear had roughly 4000 shareware apps and PocketPCGear had fewer than 200.

    Originally posted by foo fighter


    Until last year when I jumped onto PocketPCs, and later left. As far as the end of the PalmOS goes, I'm not saying it will literally die, but PocketPC could become the dominant platform in the enterprise while PalmOS will be relegated to the consumer electronics market. Judging from the recent market data, that seems to be whats happening now.
    You've been singing the same tune for some time now, and frankly I've heard it too long to take it seriously any more.
  13.    #33  
    Originally posted by John Nowak
    Of course you aren't. I believe you.
    Your a little out of date Nowak. I haven't used PocketPCs since last winter. I gave up on them and went back to a Palm IIIxe. Then early this year I purchased a Visor Edge, I was the first here to get mine, which I sent back. Now I'm using a Palm M505 which I've had for several months now.

    And this is the first PocketPC topic I have started, let alone joined, since last year.

    Your point is?

    Foo, you are the guy who tried to claim that WinCE was as well supported as the PalmOS at the time PalmGear had roughly 4000 shareware apps and PocketPCGear had fewer than 200.
    As I recall I said it was gaining support. I really don't care either way. And that was part of the reason why I left the platform. The apps just weren't there. Still aren't.

    You've been singing the same tune for some time now, and frankly I've heard it too long to take it seriously any more.
    Oh my, you really are behind. As I've said before, I haven't even talked about PocketPCs here since last year. If this is a "song" I keep singing, then its been quite a while since I have touched my Violin, thank you very much. Where have you been exactly?

    Besides, this topic wasn't about Palm vs. PockePC. It was whether or not Palm news sites were trying to avoid these market reports.
  14. #34  
    Originally posted by foo fighter


    Your a little out of date Nowak. I haven't used PocketPCs since last winter. I gave up on them and went back to a Palm IIIxe. Then early this year I purchased a Visor Edge, I was the first here to get mine, which I sent back. Now I'm using a Palm M505 which I've had for several months now.

    And this is the first PocketPC topic I have started, let alone joined, since last year.

    Your point is?
    That someone who calls other people "friggin lapdogs" should probably have a better record than you.
  15.    #35  
    Originally posted by John Nowak
    That someone who calls other people "friggin lapdogs" should probably have a better record than you.
    Oh, there's no question that my behavior in those "dark day's" was sometimes beyond reproach. But we've all suffered from gadget lust at one time or another, and I'm no different than anyone else. How many times have we seen Prism zealots beating everyone over the head with how cool their new toy is. I've made my peace, but if your still bitter towards me after more than a year..then I suggest the next time you go shopping for a new stylus or case for your Visor, you should also buy some civility while your at it. You seem to be coming up a little short.
  16. #36  
    Originally posted by foo fighter


    How many times have we seen Prism zealots beating everyone over the head with how cool their new toy is.
    I can't think of one off hand, actually.

    Originally posted by foo fighter


    then I suggest the next time you go shopping for a new stylus or case for your Visor, you should also buy some civility while your at it. You seem to be coming up a little short.
    I wonder what you'd say if I called somone a "frigging lapdog."
  17.    #37  
    Originally posted by John Nowak
    I can't think of one off hand, actually.
    Hmm..now I'm the one who's not surprised.


    I wonder what you'd say if I called somone a "frigging lapdog."
    Well how do you suggest I describe Ed? He claims that all three firms are somehow in "Microsoft's pocket". All of them? Perhaps "lap dog" was too harsh, but I would hardly characterize him as an unbiased source for news.
  18. #38  
    I think the gist off this topic is that PPC is gaining ground. They have the eye of enterprises and plan to take the consumer market by storm. Sure a PDA purist knows that an organizer doesn't have to have PPC like multimedia features but the truth of the matter is regular joe consumers want it. As Palm incorporates these features the pricing of both PPC and Palm get closer. Soon enough the iPaq starts to look attractive. Look I love the Palm platform. But they are moving entirely to slow and seem to focus on the wrong things at the wrong time even.

    Mark my words. If Palm OS 5.0 and its devices doesn't bring PPC like features (faster processors, improved audio, good video playback,Hi-res disply standard, more screen space, etc.) of today. You will see the PPC platform start to gain huge ground on Palm. You can argue all you want about cost . . . but a year from now how much do you think an iPaq will cost then (maybe $300-$350. Now ask your self what is Palm gonna charge for a Palm OS 5.0 device? (should I say $500 if its a real upgrade. Cheaper if it still doesn't have some parity to PPC platform.)
    -Mikedemo
    It's all about how you spend the money.
  19. mhc48#CB's Avatar
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    #39  
    Originally posted by dietrichbohn


    <Off Topic>
    My dad often has reason to do into Mega-Sized-Law Firms, and was surprised recently to see that many of their typing pools (yes, they're still around) still use Word Perfect 5.1. Why? It's the only thing fast enough to use decently. Everything can be done via the Keyboard with a minimum of fuss. The secretaries he's spoken to guess that it increases their productivity over the latest version of Word by at least 30%. Aya!
    </Off Topic>
    LOL, well that's part of the why. Lawyers (I guess I can say this) are cheap, and the bigger firms are notoriously the cheapest. The conservative older partners who often control those things in mega and "mid-size" firms take the view that if it ain't broke, don't fix it if it costs us money to do it and doesn't get new clients or new business from existing clients. The last place they want to spend money is on the typing pool who, to them, are often fungible, interchangable and/or nighttime workers. Plus many of the older partners are still, believe it or not, computer phobic. They have the high paid junior associates to do all that computer stuff.
    -Michael-
  20. #40  
    Originally posted by MHCohn
    LOL, well that's part of the why. Lawyers (I guess I can say this) are cheap, and the bigger firms are notoriously the cheapest. The conservative older partners who often control those things in mega and "mid-size" firms take the view that if it ain't broke, don't fix it if it costs us money to do it and doesn't get new clients or new business from existing clients. The last place they want to spend money is on the typing pool who
    Actually, in two cases the firm switched them over to Word, and the pool demanded to have 5.1 back after a month of lower productivity!
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