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  1. #81  
    No, I'm talking about the way AT&T treats customers overall. And not just their cellular division.

    Anyway, did you you see how many people online jumped at the price alone? It's only when others pointed out they will actually be paying MORE for the plan, that things calmed a bit. I do think the average customer will think they're getting a deal. They already have people yelling on Craig's List that since the new phone is $200, there's no more need to buy the old ones. Except they must not know that the new one is even more restricted than the old one, so the old one actually still has value. You can still use the old one without even going through AT&T or Apple, if you know how to jailbreak and unlock it(software is free online for this and not that hard to do).

    P.S. I need to clarify that I mean the average customer will think he/she's getting a deal on the price of the new iPhone, while possibly not realizing the back end cost is more.
    Last edited by The Phone Diva; 06/18/2008 at 07:03 PM.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  2. #82  
    so i take it that you believe whatever you read on these forums and craigs lists put together....

    it's a bigger world out there.
    Blackberry Pearl (AT&T), Apple 3G iPhone,
    owned and used: Treo 750 (WM5, Cingular)
    T680 unlocked (T-Mo), T700wx, T700w, T650, T600
    ppc6600, i730, htc mogul, BB Bold, Curve
  3. #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob-C View Post
    When you say you are sick of the $200 price cut complaint, it sounds like you are implying that everyone should have no problem throwing $200 around as if it were spare change.
    This argument suffers from a fundamental logical flaw, or a lack of understanding of economics.

    No one "threw $200 around as if it were spare change." Apple sold a device at a price. People looked at the price, looked at the device, decided if the price was worth it to them, and purchased the device if it gave them enough utility to do so. In other words, if the price was worth it to them, they bought it. The worth to them may have been due to pure functionality, psychic benefit from exclusivity or snobbery, an addition to shiny things, or a preferenc for the colorscheme. What's important is, at the point of time when they made the purchase, they were willing to spend that amount of money.

    If they were not willing to spend the money, they didn't make the purchase. In fact, I purchased TWO at that first, high, price.

    A later price drop doesn't change the fact that on the day people made their purchases, the device was worth, to the purchaser, at least the price they paid.

    Your argument parallels the irrationality demonstrated by the famous economics experiment where it was learned people would rather earn $100,000 if it meant they earned the most in their social circle than earn $300,000 if it meant they earned the least.

    Your argument is "even though it was worth $X to them, if they had only waited they could have paid <$X." So what. Ever buy a car? Think you couldn't have paid less? Ever taken a plane flight? Think no one on the plane paid less than you? Ever go to a garage sale?

    Commerce isn't built on how little you can pay; it's built on the hope that at the moment you pay, you get something in return that's at least as valuable to you as the money you gave up.

    To get back to your quote: if someone didn't want to "throw around the $200," or, more accurately, if the phone was not worth that extra $200 to that person, presumably that person didn't buy the phone.

    One other comment, regarding your strawman battery argument: I've had two iphones, each for about a year, and each gets exactly the same battery life as it did when I got it. So your "year or two" argument is based on a faulty premise. Apple's specs also indicate that the battery will have significantly more than 50% of its charge-holding capacity after several years. Since the average cellphone is owned for significantly less time than the battery will live, it's not a bad engineering decision. (In exchange for the not-easily-replaceable battery once gets a thinner phone with a larger battery, and greater structural rigidity and impact resistance). For those who keep phones for significantly longer than 2 or 3 years, then presumably this is a factor to be taken in account; however, this doesn't screw customers. Customers were aware of this when they made the purchase, and I haven't seen ANY flood of complaints on the net anywhere about customers with dying phone batteries, despite the dire predictions of certain people over a year ago.

    And finally, "scrapple" isn't clever because its double-meaning is irrelevant to your point. A loaf made of spare scraps of meat has nothing to do with your argument. Perhaps "crapple" would have been slightly more clever. Probably not. Puns, unless exceptionally clever, are hardly the most impressive type of humor.
  4. #84  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    No, I'm talking about the way AT&T treats customers overall. And not just their cellular division.

    Anyway, did you you see how many people online jumped at the price alone? It's only when others pointed out they will actually be paying MORE for the plan, that things calmed a bit. I do think the average customer will think they're getting a deal.
    This is just crazy logic. I am no fan of AT$T, but if a customer signs a phone contract without knowing the monthly costs, then they have nobody to blame but themselves.
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
    so i take it that you believe whatever you read on these forums and craigs lists put together....

    it's a bigger world out there.
    You know what? I'm sick your insults. You belittle anyone who doesn't agree that the device you're in love with at the time is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I remember you were in love with the underpowered Treo 700w and made excuses for the 32MB memory, and you were the same then.

    BTW, Craig's List DOES have real world people. They are looking at the $200 price when trying to buy the iPhone. You have people wanting $300-$400 when the new one is $200. People looked on Apple and saw the new $200 phone, and YES they are from the real world as real world consumers who check prices, but don't necessarily know the whole picture.
    Last edited by The Phone Diva; 06/18/2008 at 12:34 PM.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  6. #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    This is just crazy logic. I am no fan of AT$T, but if a customer signs a phone contract without knowing the monthly costs, then they have nobody to blame but themselves.
    But did you see all the drooling over the $200 price? Since it appears cheaper at first glance on the front end, many people got really excited until they learned of the plans. I'm just reporting what I've been seeing all over the internet, and it does seem people are reacting to the front end price. Which I'm sure Apple predicted.

    BTW, some places are now predicting the actual iPod will suffer now. What do you think? I'm not sure.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    You know what? I'm sick your insults. You belittle anyone who doesn't agree that the device you're in love with at the time is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I remember you were in love with the underpowered Treo 700w and made excuses for the 32MB memory, and you were the same then.

    BTW, Craig's List DOES have real world people. They are looking at the $200 price when trying to buy the iPhone. You have people wanting $300-$400 when the new one is $200. People looked on Apple and saw the new $200 phone, and YES they are from the real world as real world consumers who check prices, but don't necessarily know the whole picture.
    relax...i just don't agree with much of what you say and the drama that you attach to it. hec, if no one disagreed with you they might actually believe you.

    your whole $200 price argument/opinion is silly in my eyes, and that my friend is just my opinion. but since you want to cast much doubt on Apple/AT&T and their pricing methodologies then someone should also have the chance to question your thought process as well.

    i wonder who these people are that you're "reporting" on (to quote you above).....are they teenagers? is english perhaps a second language for them? have they ever purchased a cell phone before? you treat the subject as though Apple/AT&T are criminals and i personally get a kick out of it.
    Blackberry Pearl (AT&T), Apple 3G iPhone,
    owned and used: Treo 750 (WM5, Cingular)
    T680 unlocked (T-Mo), T700wx, T700w, T650, T600
    ppc6600, i730, htc mogul, BB Bold, Curve
  8. #88  
    They aren't criminals, just the usual corporations. I've been an AT&T customer for while(and not only cellular) and I see what they do to sneak in hidden fees. You really need to examine your bills thoroughly if you're with them.

    I never said people SHOULDN'T get the new iPhone, but I do think they need to not just look at the front-end price, but the whole picture. I still wonder how many people actually know there will be no online sales, no leaving the store without activation, and no buying iPhones for others(unless they're in the store to activate). As for the plans, many new people may or may not research the old plans(but when informed of the old plans, they do take another look to see if they really want to get the new iPhone.), but exisiting customers who get the new phone do need to be made aware that there's an increase in their rates.


    BTW, here's one actual CL complainer for you. He does seem to be looking only at the price, but not the restrictions(unless he just doesn't care). Many people on CL looking for iPhones want the old one so they can unlock and jailbreak them easily, but he's not really looking at that, just price alone.

    I need to leave for a while, but I may have time to search for some more posts later that show people are looking at the price, but not always the whole picture.


    And why should we pay more now? - $199 (The Web)

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Reply to: removed by me
    Date: 2008-06-14, 3:44PM CDT


    With the new iPhone G3 around the corner, somebody explain the logic of these ads for 1st gen iPhones selling for $300-$400 (sometimes more). I mean I understand the "trend setter" status of paying obscene prices for the latest technology just so you can boast. But come on now, realty should had set in by now. Apple will be selling the NEW iPhone 8GB for $199 and probably cheaper deals can be made with the approved carriers. Why should anyone pay more for your used phone just because you did. Kind of a rhetorical question. Lower the prices and you might be able to sell yours to someone.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  9. #89  
    Here's 2 people commenting on the increased AT&T rates(read top 2 posts). Like I said, when people know of the old ones, quite a few aren't too chipper anymore. Smartphone people know the rates are normal for smartphones, but not so for long-time "regular" phone customers.

    http://forums.macnn.com/103/ipod-iph...es-other-than/
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  10. #90  
    jeezus...please don't turn into Surur and post a hundred pages of drivel related to the iPhone.

    we definitely don't need two of him around here

    Blackberry Pearl (AT&T), Apple 3G iPhone,
    owned and used: Treo 750 (WM5, Cingular)
    T680 unlocked (T-Mo), T700wx, T700w, T650, T600
    ppc6600, i730, htc mogul, BB Bold, Curve
  11. #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
    jeezus...please don't turn into Surur and post a hundred pages of drivel related to the iPhone.

    we definitely don't need two of him around here
    I was wondering how we get just one less oalvarez.
  12. #92  
    nah, if that was the case you'd be in agreement all of the time, and that's no fun for anyone.

    try something new, you might just like it.

    enjoy yours
    Blackberry Pearl (AT&T), Apple 3G iPhone,
    owned and used: Treo 750 (WM5, Cingular)
    T680 unlocked (T-Mo), T700wx, T700w, T650, T600
    ppc6600, i730, htc mogul, BB Bold, Curve
  13. #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
    nah, if that was the case you'd be in agreement all of the time, and that's no fun for anyone.
    Oh, you're probably right. I'm pretty sure we wouldn't all be in agreement, but it's always good to have a negative example floating around to make the rest of us feel better about ourselves. So I take it back - we should keep 1 oalvarez as our poster child with the phrase Lest We Forget across the bottom of that poster.
  14. #94  
    I miss archie :-)
  15.    #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by cmaier View Post
    I miss archie :-)
    I miss Archie too. Zirconia!!!



    Surur
  16. #96  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    Here's 2 people commenting on the increased AT&T rates(read top 2 posts). Like I said, when people know of the old ones, quite a few aren't too chipper anymore. Smartphone people know the rates are normal for smartphones, but not so for long-time "regular" phone customers.

    http://forums.macnn.com/103/ipod-iph...es-other-than/

    This post frightens me. It reminds me of the constant negative postings of the apple launch by a fellow forum member here (to protect his identity I will not give his name).

    Phone Diva, you were able to figure out the new iPhone plan, why do you think most people wont?
  17. #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Oh, you're probably right. I'm pretty sure we wouldn't all be in agreement, but it's always good to have a negative example floating around to make the rest of us feel better about ourselves. So I take it back - we should keep 1 oalvarez as our poster child with the phrase Lest We Forget across the bottom of that poster.
    if you really think about yourself and some of the others you're the negative example. to you, apple can only do wrong, and by teaming with all others against anything apple you gain a sense of safety and security. i like the apple products, and blackberry especially, but when you speak negatively about them it appears ok to do so, and the opposing side quickly become the minority or the one in the wrong.

    the hundreds of pages full of negative apple drivel posted by one of the members here was positive? never intending to induce arguement? not considered flame-bait in the least? you see, that was ok to so many of you, but if one takes the other side to any of those postings one was quickly labeled argumentative and the like.

    it's all laughable really, at least that's how i look at it.

    but in the end, i hate everything Treo, so we're even i suppose.
    Last edited by oalvarez; 06/19/2008 at 09:52 PM.
    Blackberry Pearl (AT&T), Apple 3G iPhone,
    owned and used: Treo 750 (WM5, Cingular)
    T680 unlocked (T-Mo), T700wx, T700w, T650, T600
    ppc6600, i730, htc mogul, BB Bold, Curve
  18. #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
    if you really think about yourself and some of the others you're the negative example. to you, apple can only do wrong, and by teaming with all others against anything apple you gain a sense of safety and security.
    I love generalities - they're so ... general. Makes me wonder why I own all this Apple stuff (including stock) if I believe "apple can only do wrong."

    Quote Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
    the hundreds of pages full of negative apple drivel posted by one of the members here was positive? never intending to induce arguement? not considered flame-bait in the least? you see, that was ok to so many of you, but if one takes the other side to any of those postings one was quickly labeled argumentative and the like.
    Nothing wrong with arguing. Disagreeing just to be disagreeable, well now, that's another matter altogether. Here - will take you to an instructional video on arguing. Two gentlemen are debating the finer points of argument. Take note: once they are seated, the gentleman on the left is who you should strive to be rather than the gentleman on the right whom you most often imitate. I hope this helps.

    Quote Originally Posted by oalvarez View Post
    but in the end, i hate everything Treo, so we're even i suppose.
    How sad - hating an inanimate object seems like a waste. Do you do this with many inanimate objects? Do you point your rage at people too?
  19. #99  
    must have hit a nerve....sorry.
    Blackberry Pearl (AT&T), Apple 3G iPhone,
    owned and used: Treo 750 (WM5, Cingular)
    T680 unlocked (T-Mo), T700wx, T700w, T650, T600
    ppc6600, i730, htc mogul, BB Bold, Curve
  20. #100  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    (oalvarez) You know what? I'm sick your insults.

    You belittle anyone who doesn't agree that the device you're in love with at the time is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

    I remember you were in love with the underpowered Treo 700w and made excuses for the 32MB memory, and you were the same then.

    I think this post had to hit a nerve...

    I've never seen the phone diva go off so hard... it was awesome... She is always so nice and peaceful... I was a bit surprised.

    This thread has went to hell.

    iPhone vs. Windows.... the epic battle of iEvil vs. Evil
    Last edited by theog; 06/20/2008 at 07:09 AM.
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