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  1. #21  
    I assume even though the OS is the same version, it has some newer applications? Versamail, for example, crashed constantly on my treo 650, and was even responsible for OTHER programs crashing; disabling it and switching to chatter made my phone much more stable (that being relative, of course).
  2. #22  
    A couple more notes on the article.
    BBToday is a free Today screen app. Pretty good for free and a close approximation to the Treo Today screen.

    SlingPlayer and DocsToGo aren't available for the BlackBerry yet. Should be before end of 2Q pending the next BBOS release.

    The Blackberry is much slower to reboot (3-4 minutes). Thankfully you almost never have to do it. For me, only when a new installed app requires it.

    POS apps in general make much better use of the SD card. I'm not positive why it isn't that way on the Blackberry and can only guess it has something to do with the OS or API.

    From my experience, it doesn't appear that apps can automatically register themselves to start after a reboot - or at least it's not very common. On POS, each app could register to be accessed during the boot sequence so they could reregister for automatic/periodic updates (e.g. OnDemand, WorldMate). It seems a much more common feature for those apps.

    The POS Calculator has advanced/scientific mode. The BB one is basic math with metric conversion.

    No video recording on the BB yet. Supposed to be in 2Q08 OS update.

    Can dial 800-BEST-BUY (800 alt B alt E alt S alt T, etc) on the BB. Can't do that on the Treo.

    MP3 ringtones aren't supposed without 3rd party sw on the Treo. Natively supported on the Blackberry.

    Date/time/device status shown in a bar across the top of many screens on the Blackberry. Just on Phone, Calendar, and Launcher on the Treo. Makes it a little easier to see the time at a glance.
    Palm Pilot-->Handspring Visor-->Treo 300-->Treo 600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700p+E62-->Treo700p+Curve (8300)-->Curve (8330)
  3. #23  
    Quote Originally Posted by tomvb2000 View Post
    RIM is definitely behind the times without html email support - supposed to be in the next OS release due Real Soon Now.

    "POS effectively dead" "premature"? Well perhaps given your Centro comments. However, I think you'd agree that it's extremely limited for any future development like true multitasking, WiFi, or 3G. That and because Palm is focused on Nova is why I say "effectively dead". That's a comment just on the OS, not the company, although the company has certainly lost momentum over the last two years and squandered a leadership position.
    Re: HTML email in BB, sorry to be breaker of bad news but it has been pretty much pulled from the next update I do think it's criminal in 2008 that RIM has not enabled this feature officially (I've hear there are 3rd party options) but true, it will be there eventually.

    Correct about the limited development of Garnet, which is something even Palm would agree about which is why the Centro/Garnet is sort of a "bargain basement" mobile OS now (my words, not there's)--having said that, it's still amazing in 2008 that such an old OS is still so compelling even with things like the iPhone, BB and WM on the market. As a hardcore WM user, I find the Centro can easily do 95% of what my WM devices do (including 3g, but not on GSM of course). From what I understand, the Centro and Foleo teams have both been reassigned to Nova.
    Quote Originally Posted by cmaier View Post
    I assume even though the OS is the same version, it has some newer applications? Versamail, for example, crashed constantly on my treo 650, and was even responsible for OTHER programs crashing; disabling it and switching to chatter made my phone much more stable (that being relative, of course).
    So I know for a fact that BT Manager and Versamail have been updated--it would be interesting to try and document any others. I'm also pretty positive Marc Blanc has been improving upon Versamail, just a strong hunch--Palm had an update for Gmail IMAP within a few months, which was surprising. I'm actually surprised how stable and reliable it is on the Centro, it's a very nice built in email client and seems to handle my mail fairly well. It's not perfect, but any issues I have they are not ones that cause "system wide" issues, including resets.

    Over at Treonauts, a list was compiled with other "software enhancments" on the Centro from previous devices which is also informative.

    I dunno, there's just something fun and cool about the Centro and I highly recommend taking it for a trial run (within your return policy), espeically those jaded by Palm in the past (a reasonable position)--it's probably the single reason right now that I have a smidgen of hope left for Palm, lol.
    Last edited by Malatesta; 03/14/2008 at 09:22 AM.

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  4. #24  
    Sounds like the Centro would have done Palm a world of good had it only been produced 18-24 months sooner.

    I agree with you re: Marc Blanc. Though Palm does have a history of obtaining great resources and squandering them...
  5. #25  
    Hi All.

    I am a smartphone user from way back. Kyocera 6035, 7035, several versions of backberry, etc etc. I am a "power user" as I worek remotely, have over 10k contacts across several 1000 companies and am a heavy email user

    of all the devices, I have enjoyed the backberry the most since I am so outlook, calendar and email driven.

    At my most recent company, I came on board and gthey are using Zimbra whicih is an exchange alternative. (no blackberry support)
    So I dropped my blackberry and got a treo 700wx (verizon)

    Thank g-d my company has switched ot exxhange. I am back on Blackberry.

    The TREO just does not cut it. The contacts are not indexed well. if I do a search based on company (which you actually havew to switcth modes to do ) a query can take up to 10 minutes. ie seacrh on IBM.

    This is not a memory issue either. I had several calls with Palm senior techs.
    It is the way they set up database. it is just plain bad.

    The Blackberry 8830 may not have some of the bells and whistles of the TREO but I will take A BB over a TREO .
  6. #26  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Re: HTML email in BB, sorry to be breaker of bad news but it has been pretty much pulled from the next update I do think it's criminal in 2008 that RIM has not enabled this feature officially (I've hear there are 3rd party options) but true, it will be there eventually.
    Yea, knew about that but had unconsciously blocked the bad news Can only hope it comes out in 4.6 (early 3Q08?). I did a trial of Empower which is a 3rd-party BB HTML renderer which integrates nicely into the BB Messages app. It was very well done but I haven't decided if it's worth the $30 to me to purchase it. I may be able to hold off until 4.6.

    .... --having said that, it's still amazing in 2008 that such an old OS is still so compelling even with things like the iPhone, BB and WM on the market. As a hardcore WM user, I find the Centro can easily do 95% of what my WM devices do (including 3g, but not on GSM of course). From what I understand, the Centro and Foleo teams have both been reassigned to Nova..
    True that. We can only hope the success of the Centro can buy enough time for Palm to recover from their past mistakes. I was tired of dumping money down that hole, so the Centro was never compelling as an upgrade to my 700p. I fully expected it to have some of the same 700p/755p issues and it didn't offer anything anything to me to make it competitive with the Curve for my needs.
    Palm Pilot-->Handspring Visor-->Treo 300-->Treo 600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700p+E62-->Treo700p+Curve (8300)-->Curve (8330)
  7. #27  
    My new company is very BB centric and I am still holding on to my Sprint 755p. They are also exclusively using Verizon.

    A couple of questions.

    1) Is there a way, on a BB, to download a spreadsheet, update it and send it back to another person via the email app?

    2) My BB coworkers seem to have problems processing meeting invitations from their BB to Outlook. An accepted meeting does not update Outlook. Is that generally true or is it some other possible problem?
  8. #28  
    1. Not yet. When OS 4.5 comes out Real Soon Now, it's supposed to include DataViz DocsToGo. Rumors are rampant but most seem to point to April/May.

    2. I've never seen or heard about that problem. There can be a few minutes lag since both the BB and Outlook periodically sync with their respective servers and those servers have to sync with each other.
    Last edited by tomvb2000; 03/18/2008 at 09:42 PM. Reason: sp
    Palm Pilot-->Handspring Visor-->Treo 300-->Treo 600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700p+E62-->Treo700p+Curve (8300)-->Curve (8330)
  9. #29  
    Quote Originally Posted by jdil View Post
    It feels that the author's main gripe with Treo vs BB is with its email capabilities.
    Unfortunately, for the sake of comparison, he did not try Snappermail. I believe his view on stablity, functionalities, and ease of use would have been largely changed by the use of SM.

    The treo's fundmentally poor support of BT, though, even when supplemented by other software for ADCP, remains.
    While your bluetooth and email statements may be true for the Treo line (definitely for the 700p, don't know about the 755p), I would vehemently disagree if made towards the Centro. Having used the Centro now for several months, I can say hands down the bluetooth is completely stable for me. I also own the 700p and can tell you I was furious at Palm for the poor quality of the device. Although their belated ROM update did help greatly, the Treo 700p is still nowhere near the stable device that the Centro is. I use my bluetooth headset Mon-Fri from 8a-5p every day, and usually have at least one phone call each day during that timeframe that lasts for almost an hour. I have never received a bluetooth disconnect, and call quality has been great.

    As for email, I haven't tried Snapper but I have read it's very good. Versamail is much better on the Centro (at least the Sprint Centro). Although it is still not really feature rich like ChatterEmail, the Exchange plugin works great. I sync push style with mail2web.com.

    One more point about the Centro: to date, I have had zero resets based upon the device. I have had a few that occurred right after installing a particular piece of software, which was easily isolated. I removed the offending software, and device returned to stable status. It is still a good idea not to install multiple programs at once, as not all software is written as well as the next, and this allows for easy isolation, followed by removal of the poorly written app. Oh, and Blazer is much quicker on the Centro than the 700p.

    I just hope Palm continues to bring out stable products like the Centro, so that the crap they put out (700p) can become a distant memory.
  10. wpwoodjr's Avatar
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    #30  
    Quote Originally Posted by tomvb2000 View Post

    No video recording on the BB yet. Supposed to be in 2Q08 OS update.
    The BB Pearl 8130 and BB Curve have video recording.

    I LOVE the Pearl - the form factor is fantastic and the Suretype predictive typing works very well. The trackball is fantastic - much better than the 5-way on Treo. It has the stereo bluetooth profile, so when I get in my car I don't need to wire the BB up to the car system, just turn it on and start playing - very nice! I do miss streaming wma radio stations which Treo could play using Kinomo and BB cannot, but with ORB I can transpose streaming wma to a format the BB can decode.

    For me, coming from a Treo 700p to the BB Pearl 8130, I noticed right away a key difference - the BB multi-tasks. So, you can leave one program, run another, and come back to the first exactly where you left off. This is a huge difference in practice. No more waiting for web pages to redraw that I had just been looking at 5 minutes ago, easy to switch between mail, calendar, and web and retain context.

    The integration on BB between PIM programs is really good to. Its hard to describe, but usually if you think something like, "I would love to add this phone number on this web page to my address book", you just hit the menu button and there's the option to do it.

    Tethering is much faster on BB - I routinely get 700+kbs over EVDO. The web browser is faster too and never runs out of memory like Blazer does.

    I do miss the SMS threaded chat on Treo. The BB has it but the interface is horrible.

    GMail and GMaps work much better on BB.

    The BB has the wonderful feature that it shuts off when you put it in your case/holster - no need for Keyguard.

    In short, unless Palm pulls a rabbit out of the hat, I'm never going back - I love the BB!
    Last edited by WPWoodJr; 03/19/2008 at 01:18 PM.
  11. #31  
    Quote Originally Posted by WPWoodJr View Post
    The BB Pearl 8130 and BB Curve have video recording.
    You're right, I should have said the Pearl 8110/20/30 does because those ship with OS 4.3. However, the 8100 doesn't.

    None of the current Curve models 8300/10/20 have video recording yet since OS4.3 hasn't been released for those models (other than the beta version some folks have played with).
    Palm Pilot-->Handspring Visor-->Treo 300-->Treo 600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700p+E62-->Treo700p+Curve (8300)-->Curve (8330)
  12. wpwoodjr's Avatar
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    #32  
    Quote Originally Posted by tomvb2000 View Post
    You're right, I should have said the Pearl 8110/20/30 does because those ship with OS 4.3. However, the 8100 doesn't.

    None of the current Curve models 8300/10/20 have video recording yet since OS4.3 hasn't been released for those models (other than the beta version some folks have played with).
    OK, thanks for the correction. OS 4.3 has some nice user interface improvements over earlier versions - fonts are nicer, the media player is better, the web browser is better, it has video recording, etc.
  13. #33  
    Now you've gone and made me jealous

    For those of us patience-challenged, being on the forums is a two-edged sword. 'Come on RIM, show us Curve addicts some 4.3 love!
    Palm Pilot-->Handspring Visor-->Treo 300-->Treo 600-->Treo 650-->Treo 700p+E62-->Treo700p+Curve (8300)-->Curve (8330)
  14. #34  
    I have run 680 using custom ROM 1.12. For months, only 1 soft reset (it is because of MUH). Installed around 100 apps. So, stable treo in fact is really possible.
    I think, when you have BB, then you have mobile phone. Compare this stability with Nokia. It is the same, because their limitation on customization!
    But, when you have palm, then you have personal secretary, personal assistants, which much more rich features rather than phone function. The drawback of course its stability because not all developers create 'healthy' palm softwares.

    Quote Originally Posted by neurocutie View Post
    1) Palm screwed up PalmOS 5.X and from a software standpoint, PalmOS is in fact no longer stable, intrinsically. Perhaps in porting over to ARM... or new features, etc.
    2) PalmOS is actually intrinsically very stable, but the Treo hardware platforms are flakey and so the instabilities are actually due to hardware issues.
    3) (the ever popular) Software apps that he runs, or that are commonly run make PalmOS unstable. The article suggests that this possibility is discounted as the author tried to run a stripped down config of PalmOS, still with crashes, but stripped down for him may still include problematic apps.
    4) He (and others) have defective Treos. This possibility also seems discounted since he used several Treos, and of course many others have reported similar issues.

    I know some Centro users report that their Centros are very stable, but can they really say that their Centro doesn't crash for months at a time ? (if so, great... and it supports the flakey hardware theory)

    So I'd like to hear what people think as to what causes the huge disparity between PalmOS being capable of being stable vs the common Treo experience of instability... particularly focussing on #1 and #2... (my bet is on the hardware being flakey).
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