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  1. #81  
    Quote Originally Posted by meyerweb View Post
    The lack of 3rd party launchers will be a major issue for me, if true. For such a "21st centry" and "revolutionary" device, scrolling rows of icons is positively medieval. I've left the standard palm launcher way behind, but even it is more flexible than the iPhone's.
    The iPhone greatest asset is its user interface. After all, themes copying it have appeared on the palm os, windows mobile, and blackberry. I doubt you will see anyway to change this with 3rd party launchers, and my bet is most people will not care.
  2. #82  
    Personally I'd like to be able to set a desktop background (only to distinguish between the various home subscreens - I'm not one of those guys who skins things left and right). Having alternate "launchers" would also allow things like a launcher that devotes some screen space to "today screen"-like information (to-do, calendar appointments, etc.) or allows dynamic modification (change images/colors depending on whether you have unread information, etc.). Some people might prefer a nested architecture, where, for example, the front screen has an icon for "webapps" and then clicking on it opens a screen of related icons. Some people might want to move their "dock" icons to the top, or to have multiple rows.

    I can think of lots of reasons I'd like a launcher, even though I think the basic UI of the iphone launcher is good (the look of it, the way you can scroll around, the size of the icons, etc.
  3. #83  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    The iPhone greatest asset is its user interface. After all, themes copying it have appeared on the palm os, windows mobile, and blackberry. I doubt you will see anyway to change this with 3rd party launchers, and my bet is most people will not care.
    I think it's the graphic component that has been copied the most as Garnet has basically had a similar launcher forever but very dated graphics...

    The launcher on the iPhone is hardly great though once you move to more than 20 apps--then it looses it ease of use causing you to "scan" through dozens of icons, whereas SPB Mobile Shell2 has a much more organized system, imo.

    WMExperts: News, Reviews & Podcasts + Twitter
  4. #84  
    From a user interface perspective, iphone's launcher is certainly interesting. First, it eliminates hierarchy. From the perspective of those of us used to organizing things into sub-directories or folders, this is bad, but hierarchy always raises the issue of navigation and losing your position within the overall "tree."

    The fact that they quantize the multiple screens (that is, they have snap positions that align with pre-defined screens rather than scrolling smoothly as if on a large plane with a moving viewport) is also interesting. The fact that there is no wrapping from the last-to-first page is also an interesting decision (probably, again, relating to being able to keep track of where you are).

    Judging by the quantity and types of people I've seen using the iphone, I suppose these are good design decisions, but I'd certainly be very interested in a launcher than added back in some of these features (particularly hierarchy or categorization).
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by meyerweb View Post
    I doubt that Apple's lawyers wouldn't have been told to craft such specific language if Apple didn't intend to enforce it.
    One would think so....but then again I would guess MS lawyers wouldn't have written in that you must have a qualifying copy of Windows XP installed in order to install "Windows Vista Upgrade" package. Too bad MS programmers made a big oops and no qualifying copy of XP is actually req'd to install Windows Vista on a empty HD.
  6. #86  
    As for the title, 28 % market share in 8 months with just one model and on only one carrier is a failure ? Wow, if that's a failure, I feel sorry for all the WM vendors who not only combined all together, but combined on all carriers fell short of that number. Failure to meet one individual's or one teeny market segment's fantasy feature list hardly constitutes a failed product launch.

    There's such a thing as having too many features: The Swiss Army Knife (See Image below, and yes, it's worth seeing) only cost $1400 and does a lotta things, but I don't see a large amount of people buying it.

    http://www.wengerna.com/browse/produ...&sub_cat_id=23

    Well anyway, so I don't have to start another thread, Here's some excerpts from TomsHardware on iPhone 2.0 Upgrade.

    "1. The iPhone 2.0 Upgrade and Microsoft Exchange

    The most surprising news may come in the form of yet another agreement between Microsoft and Apple: Microsoft has agreed to license its ActiveSync and Exchange server technologies for use with the iPhone......

    Schiller went on to list ten items that prospective enterprise customers have requested. These Include “push” email (meaning that the data can be sent automatically from the server), calendars and address books, plus enhanced networking and security, and the ability to remotely wipe an iPhone if it’s lost or stolen."

    2. The iPhone 2.0 Upgrade and Developers

    As part of the iPhone 2.0 Software upgrade, Apple has made the same iPhone SDK (Software Development Kit) that it uses available to developers, free of charge. How excited are developers about the iPhone SDK? Even though it can be freely downloaded (after free registration) from the Apple site (http://developer.apple.com/iphone/sdk1/), the site has been hit so hard and downloads delayed so long that copies of the free SDK are showing up in places where “non-free” files are usually traded, simply because so many developers want copies, that Apple has had issues keeping up with the demand....

    If Forstall’s description of the iPhone platform as essentially a miniaturized, optimized version of Mac OS X is accurate, his “years ahead” comment may well be right on the money. And speaking of money, venture capital firm KPCB (http://www.kpcb.com/) is investing $100 million to fund the next generation of applications for the iPhone. With that kind of investment, the iPhone, which has already captured 28% of the smart phone market in just 8 months of existence, may well be unstoppable."

    "3. The iPhone 2.0 Upgrade and Games

    Gamers, if you think the gaming capability of the iPhone and iPod Touch will be limited to two-dimensional Pac Man and Tetris styled games, Apple has plans that they want you to know about: Apple is integrating OpenAL, OpenGL, and Core Animation technology into the June software upgrade.

    Scott Forstall spoke about the gaming technologies in the software upgrade: “OpenAL is an industry standard audio API, that’s used to efficiently render three dimensional. multichannel positional audio. This is great for game developers-it allows them to take and render sounds and special effects in three dimensions, around a player in a game.” As you might expect, the OpenAL audio language is usually behind the convincing explosions, gunfire, waterfalls, and other lifelike audio effects heard in games that feature OpenGL graphics language programming.

    Scott Forstall smiled and seemed visibly excited as he talked about the integration of OpenGL into the software upgrade: “It is an absolute screamer for 3D graphics on the iPhone.“ Forstall went on to demonstrate a 3D game called “Touch Fighter“, which he said was built in just two weeks on the new platform.

    “My next question is, I don’t have a joystick here or any four-button toggle control, so how do I steer? Well, we’ve got a full, three-axis accelerometer built in, so all I do is move the phone around, and now I’m steering it.” Steering the spaceship in real time just by tilting the iPhone brought applause from the audience.

    Forstall also demonstrated that as he tilted and moved the iPhone, the OpenAL responded by altering the sound of the ship’s engine, making it sound as though the ship was moving in response to the iPhone’s movements."


    The only comment I will make is that for those that use their phones primarily as something to play with or as a multimedia device, a large % of even this audience judging by "6 Most Essential Apps" thread, I don't think many will look past the iPhone....it's a super-gameboy with Wii controller, IPod, phone and ultimate portable browser all rolled onto one.

    I'm still not giving up my Treo, it does everything I want it to do and does it well. But it is really freakin unbelievable that Apple have grabbed 28% of the market with just one single model, on one single carrier in only 8 months. And with $100 million in venture capital behind new apps, they have certainly put out a challenge to all the other players out there.

    Which can only mean good things for us......Competitors are gonna have to work all that much harder and instead or pushing out marginal upgrades each year, they gonna have to go all out to keep up. Unfortunately, buy the time Palm gets outta the gate again with their Linux based unit, I have to wonder if they will they have gone the way or Atari and Commodore.
    Attached Images Attached Images
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    Unfortunately, buy the time Palm gets outta the gate again with their Linux based unit, I have to wonder if they will they have gone the way or Atari and Commodore.

    Proud owner of an Amiga 500, 2000, and 1200...........and 755p. God, save our souls!
  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    The Phone Diva ,

    That "list" is actually not correct and Sony confirmed with Engadget last week that Xperia is still slated for Q3/Q4 of this year...
    We'll see. Z750a is all I'm going to say. SE sometimes has release problems, they won't admit it but they do.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  9. #89  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Why should an apple fan care?
    Because Sony can kick Apple's *** with Xperia, that's why!! They already have triband 3G phones! This one is quad band, BTW. It also has a free use OS. Of course if they don't get it out on time, Apple can kill them with a comparable model, especially since there are so many WM haters out there. Although it's not likely that the Apple 3G model will be quad band 3G, even if they put out a triband 3G which can at least be used in Europe and parts of Asia, that's a big step forward for the iPhone(although you will probably still have to unlock it for overseas use).

    I'm a fan of both companies BTW. Let's see how it plays out.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    The iPhone greatest asset is its user interface. After all, themes copying it have appeared on the palm os, windows mobile, and blackberry. I doubt you will see anyway to change this with 3rd party launchers, and my bet is most people will not care.
    Screen, THEN user interface.
    A big clear screen does wonders for the eyes.

    BTW, Blackberry has a similar user interface in terms of how it deals with icons for apps(just not touchscreen). And BB has been out for a while. So who copied who, I wonder?

    P.S. Mal you're right, Garnet does have a similar launcher also. I haven't used it in so long, I forgot, LOL!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  11.    #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    The only comment I will make is that for those that use their phones primarily as something to play with or as a multimedia device, a large % of even this audience judging by "6 Most Essential Apps" thread, I don't think many will look past the iPhone....it's a super-gameboy with Wii controller, IPod, phone and ultimate portable browser all rolled onto one.

    I'm still not giving up my Treo, it does everything I want it to do and does it well. But it is really freakin unbelievable that Apple have grabbed 28% of the market with just one single model, on one single carrier in only 8 months. And with $100 million in venture capital behind new apps, they have certainly put out a challenge to all the other players out there.

    Which can only mean good things for us......Competitors are gonna have to work all that much harder and instead or pushing out marginal upgrades each year, they gonna have to go all out to keep up. Unfortunately, buy the time Palm gets outta the gate again with their Linux based unit, I have to wonder if they will they have gone the way or Atari and Commodore.
    28% of smartphones, but if you are comparing it to multi-media phones there are plenty of other phones with similar capabilities which dilute the market pretty much. The LG Voyagers for example with media capabilities, and the Helio phones with exchange Activesync.

    Also 28% of smartphones in USA, but USA has always been an odd cellphone market. Look at the success of the Treo or even Blackberry for example.

    Surur
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by surur View Post
    Also 28% of smartphones in USA, but USA has always been an odd cellphone market. Look at the success of the Treo or even Blackberry for example.

    Surur
    And the lack of success of Symbian/Nokia, lol.

    That's what happens when you have your carriers dominate the playing field so much--favorites get in, newbies don't (hello i-Mate!). Palm (Handspring) has deep ties with the carriers, espeically Sprint, hence their success here. Apple obviously got AT&T to give them the world on a platter and in turn between their ads running 24/7 and the affluent youth, it's almost no wonder.

    WMExperts: News, Reviews & Podcasts + Twitter
  13. #93  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    BTW, Blackberry has a similar user interface in terms of how it deals with icons for apps(just not touchscreen). And BB has been out for a while. So who copied who, I wonder?

    P.S. Mal you're right, Garnet does have a similar launcher also. I haven't used it in so long, I forgot, LOL!
    Dont see many iPhone users wishing to get their homescreens to look more like a blackberry or treo though.
  14. #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    And the lack of success of Symbian/Nokia, lol.

    That's what happens when you have your carriers dominate the playing field so much--favorites get in, newbies don't (hello i-Mate!). Palm (Handspring) has deep ties with the carriers, espeically Sprint, hence their success here. Apple obviously got AT&T to give them the world on a platter and in turn between their ads running 24/7 and the affluent youth, it's almost no wonder.
    Lets not forget that the e61 release on the AT&T network was a horrible device. My company supported it for awhile. Almost everyone that we gave one out to, asked to go back to their blackberry or windows mobile device after awhile.
  15. #95  
    Wow...openAL and openGL on the iPhone could be huge! If the thing only had buttons that alone would make me tempted to buy one.
    Visor Edge + VisorPhone -> Samsung i300 -> Treo 300 -> Treo 600 -> Treo 700p -> Treo 755
  16. #96  
    I thought I would hate not having buttons, but so far I've found it to be fine. Replacing the single button with a rocker would do wonders, though. (Games, program each direction for quick launch, etc.)
  17. #97  
    Quote Originally Posted by mobileman View Post
    Dont see many iPhone users wishing to get their homescreens to look more like a blackberry or treo though.
    Just wait...

    They don't want another launcher now for a few reasons
    1. You really can't change it now anyways
    2. You don't have enough programs to warrant a change

    When iPhoners start having 20, 30 + apps that springboard won't be so convienent. It's fine now because there's just not much to actually launch

    WMExperts: News, Reviews & Podcasts + Twitter
  18. #98  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Just wait...

    They don't want another launcher now for a few reasons
    1. You really can't change it now anyways
    2. You don't have enough programs to warrant a change

    When iPhoners start having 20, 30 + apps that springboard won't be so convienent. It's fine now because there's just not much to actually launch
    Agreed.

    I still don't want it to LOOK LIKE a bb or palm, though. I'm guessing Apple is already looking at ways of allowing access to applications in a hierarchical manner. Personally, I would love something like the ability to put things in folders, but I would make the folder icons large enough to cover the space of 4 application icons (2x2). The first screen could hold four of these in a 2x2 array. Clicking on one explodes out into the next screen, etc.

    Anyway, I assume apple has something up their sleeve, but I really hope they "allow" third-party launchers.
  19. #99  
    Quote Originally Posted by Malatesta View Post
    Just wait...

    They don't want another launcher now for a few reasons
    1. You really can't change it now anyways
    2. You don't have enough programs to warrant a change

    When iPhoners start having 20, 30 + apps that springboard won't be so convienent. It's fine now because there's just not much to actually launch
    How is it less convenient than on a blackberry when I have to use the little trackball to scroll to any icon I need. Never really used replacement launchers on the palm, but I did make separate application folders to put my apps in. Not sure that was anymore convenient than swiping the iphone homescreen left or right.

    Why wont the springboard be convenient with 20 apps? Its one swipe to move the screen to the next page.
  20.    #100  
    Quote Originally Posted by cmaier View Post
    I thought I would hate not having buttons, but so far I've found it to be fine. Replacing the single button with a rocker would do wonders, though. (Games, program each direction for quick launch, etc.)
    Scrolling through long web pages and lists get old very fast. The iPhone could do with a D-pad.

    Surur
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