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  1. #81  
    People who talk about WAP sites have not seen real WAP sites. mobile treocentral is not a WAP site for example.

    This is a WAP site.



    I wonder what people are calling the now numerous iPhone specific websites these days? iWAP?

    Good mobile sites are just well written HTML, and they should be lauded for making the effort.

    Surur
  2. #82  
    I have. T-Zones=WAP all the way! Bare bones! I can't stand it, it's so bland! Media Net's looks way better!

    MSN and CNN have good mobile sites, IMO. I have never seen TC's.
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  3. #83  
    I started using Opera Mini 4 rather than blazer, just because blazer renders the pages so slowly. Also Opera Mini lowers the quality of the images (depending on what you set it to) so that the rendering is faster.

    Took a bit of JVM settings tweaking to get it stable but so far so good.

    I just don't like how you can't really hotkey or change the start page though. Also downloads load Blazer to do the download (kinda annoying).
  4. #84  
    I have ever has a problem with Edge speeds because on a 2" screen, I am not going to spend a whole lotta time looking at it. If I am going to be on line for more than 5 minutes, unless I am out of civilized area, I'm heading for a hotel kiosk, free PC in a client's office or anything with a real screen and KB.

    Thumb boards and 2' screens don't work in a sentence with the word "productivity" in it. I mean, I thought it was cool responding to e-mails and searching the web on my Treo, it just isn't very practical if you are ata ll concerned about anything else other than passing time. Like in Shawshank Redemption the dude chipped his way outta prison with the little teeny hammer but I don't have that kinda time.

    I'm not giving up my 650 anytime soon but I have been quite impressed by the iPhone. One night when my 650 / Seidio GPS combo just decided it didn't feel like working, when totally lost in Brooklyn, my son fired up his iPhone, it pinpointed our location and got us the hell outta there.

    Ya gotta give Apple it's due.

    2.32 million units in 1st quarter of 2008.

    That's incredible. Apple took a brilliant approach of not going head to head with the core business smartphone user outta the gate. Instead they went after an untapped market which included everyone from high school kids to soccer moms to anyone who never bought a smartphone cause they were too complicated. And let's not forget that even this audience here at Treo Central does not "need" a Treo.....if they did, I'd expect the number one must have Treo application among Treo Central members wouldn't be "P-Tunes".
  5. #85  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    I have ever has a problem with Edge speeds because on a 2" screen, I am not going to spend a whole lotta time looking at it. If I am going to be on line for more than 5 minutes, unless I am out of civilized area, I'm heading for a hotel kiosk, free PC in a client's office or anything with a real screen and KB.
    Translation: "I don't have time to wait for something to take forever to load on my browser." That certainly makes sense to me. Luckily, this isn't a problem with 3G-capable devices.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    Thumb boards and 2' screens don't work in a sentence with the word "productivity" in it. I mean, I thought it was cool responding to e-mails and searching the web on my Treo, it just isn't very practical if you are ata ll concerned about anything else other than passing time. Like in Shawshank Redemption the dude chipped his way outta prison with the little teeny hammer but I don't have that kinda time.
    Translation: "I don't have a need for a responsive, readily available, mobile, functional email service." Luckily, those of us who need this capability have choices.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    Apple took a brilliant approach of not going head to head with the core business smartphone user outta the gate. Instead they went after an untapped market which included everyone from high school kids to soccer moms to anyone who never bought a smartphone cause they were too complicated.
    Agreed. Smartphones are not for the fainthearted - or more appropriately, for the casual phone user. Many a casual phone user has tried to jump into the smartphone world only to be disillusioned and frustrated by the (comparative) complexity. Apple's excellent interface enables those same casual phone users to do a whole lot more with their feature-rich phone.
  6. #86  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    Thumb boards and 2' screens don't work in a sentence with the word "productivity" in it.
    you mean you don't use your Treo to get excel spreadsheet work done?
    Blackberry Pearl (AT&T), Apple 3G iPhone,
    owned and used: Treo 750 (WM5, Cingular)
    T680 unlocked (T-Mo), T700wx, T700w, T650, T600
    ppc6600, i730, htc mogul, BB Bold, Curve
  7. #87  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    Translation: "I don't have time to wait for something to take forever to load on my browser." That certainly makes sense to me. Luckily, this isn't a problem with 3G-capable devices.
    I have never had an issue with speed, it's a non issue. It's a problem with real estate .....

    -Who is more productive, the person using all his fingers or the one using just 2 of them ?
    -Who spends more time scrolling, the person looking at a 1920 x 1200 screen or the one looking at 320 x 320 ....or 240 x 240 on Windoze.

    Actual translation: Pretending to be productive is not the same as actually being productive.

    Translation: "I don't have a need for a responsive, readily available, mobile, functional email service." Luckily, those of us who need this capability have choices.
    Joe Rogan puts it best when he says "Who invented putting a walkie talkie in a cell phone ... couldn't fit any more useless technology in there like maybe smoke signals ? .... and people text me, what the ^%$#@% is that all about, I want to tell someone something, I will call them, I'm not gonna press a button 4 times to get an "S".

    Simply put, if I want my wife to bring home milk and bread, calling her is far easier than e-mailing her. I can do it while I am driving. In the year I got my Treo, in addition to running my own engineering business, I was President of the state professional engineering society and on the national legislative commitee. With 3,000 members and a steady stream of communication to do I found many "excuses" to use my Treo e-mail and web. I traveled at least weekly but the places I was traveling to are "in the civilized world".

    So when I would travel up to Albany or Washington DC to meet with legislators on various issues, I often found myself in offices and hotels with "time to kill" which I used stoically thumb typing out e-mail responses for 45 minutes or so during my down time. Then I started thinking.....hmmmm.....let me try it another way. I'd open up my laptop, walk over to the hotel business center or just cozy up to an unoccupied PC in whomever's office I was in and use a full size KB and screen and I'd finish that same amount of work in 20 minutes. That left me time to read the paper or maybe grab a beer at the hotel bar.

    Yeah I certainly do find occasion where the Treo is a better solution.....like when I have 10 minutes between flights after walking over to the connecting gate and I can knock off an e-mail or two by the time the laptop boots but those instances are very few and far between. I found it nice that I "could" do it if I needed to on the little bugger but over time I found it just more practical to use full size tools. So much so that I just canceled data service on the Treo as the last time I accessed my e-mail on it was October.

    Even on construction sites when I need revised drawings, specs and construction details sent to me....sure I can have the files sent to my phone and have 4 guys huddle around and stare at my 2" x 2" screen ..... or I can walk over to the job trailer and get 24" x 36" drawings, specs on 8.5 x 11 paper and hand out copies to all parties involved.

    Yes, you can clean a latrine with a toothbrush but it's not generally the tool of choice .... well unless you are a Drill Sargeant. It's certainly not the best tool for getting the job done quickly. Download speed is not the issue .... well maybe it is if you sending u-tube like videos back and forth to your friends ..... the bottleneck is interfacing with what you get on a 2" screen and inputting on a thumboard.
  8. #88  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    Yes, you can clean a latrine with a toothbrush but it's not generally the tool of choice .... well unless you are a Drill Sargeant. It's certainly not the best tool for getting the job done quickly.
    So are you saying email on a phone is a waste? Web too? How about dynamically downloadable maps? Real-time driving directions? Location services? Commercial phone number lookup? Small instant messages (like SMS which makes a great pager)? Clearly no single function is better than that same function on a laptop (except voice communications, of course), but the combination of those "second-rate" services, at your fingertips, regardless of location (except maybe a classified vault or two), in real time, with little weight, zero bulk, comparatively long battery life, at high data speeds still makes a nice smartphone the device of choice when I'm on the move.

    Oh, and you can use that smartphone for your high-speed internet connection (while it remains in your pocket) for those laptop moments when there's no free wi-fi around (i.e. most of the time). Somehow, you've given me the picture of you stalking around buildings with a laptop in one hand, power brick and ethernet cable in the other, hunting for a place to "get some work done."
  9. #89  
    It certainly doesn't take me TWICE as long to respond to emails on my Treo. I'd say the difference in time is somewhere between 5-10 pct. I wouldn't look at plans or spreadsheets or Flash-enabled sites on my Treo but everything else is fair game and quite usable, actually IMO.

    Even the web is extremely usable with OperaMini and a multi-tasking OS.

    And this is with a 240x240 screen. Once Sony coughs up the 800x480 Xperia running a real OS w/ third party apps and a phyiscal keyboard, things will only get better.
    A new Avatar to commemorate Silly Season.
  10. #90  
    Quote Originally Posted by Kupe View Post
    So are you saying email on a phone is a waste? Web too? How about dynamically downloadable maps? Real-time driving directions? Location services? Commercial phone number lookup? Small instant messages (like SMS which makes a great pager)? Clearly no single function is better than that same function on a laptop (except voice communications, of course), but the combination of those "second-rate" services, at your fingertips, regardless of location (except maybe a classified vault or two), in real time, with little weight, zero bulk, comparatively long battery life, at high data speeds still makes a nice smartphone the device of choice when I'm on the move.
    I am not arguing against smart phones. I still have my Treo. I am just stating that the case for e-mail and web access is a bit overblown. I use my Treo for GPS driving and when "out of civilization" (read no full size KB / screen available) there is no other option.

    Somehow, you've given me the picture of you stalking around buildings with a laptop in one hand, power brick and ethernet cable in the other, hunting for a place to "get some work done."
    Not really, when traveling, laptop is usually in my briefcase, or hotel room. I had my epiphany sitting in a hotel lounge thumb typing away when a colleague said hello from behind and said he'd join me in a few minutes. I got up and followed him into the hotel business center and we sat chatting while he was accessing his e-mail (crackberry in shirt pocket) and I continues thumb typing.....after a few minutes I felt kinda silly as his method was obviously quicker than what I was doing.

    I like having a swiss army knife in my pocket....comes in handy when I need to open a beer, cut a runaway thread on my suit or get out a screw in pinch. However, if I gonna use my swiss army knife when I'm tending bar, helping my kid with his class project or hanging sheetrock I'm not going to be very productive. My Treo is my swiss army knife; it's a tool that's always available when a better tool isn't.
  11. #91  
    Quote Originally Posted by skfny View Post
    It certainly doesn't take me TWICE as long to respond to emails on my Treo. I'd say the difference in time is somewhere between 5-10 pct.
    If an e-mail contact requires an answer of a few words, a voice call is my usual response. If it requires a lengthy response, I will usually respond via e-mail. Now if I only typed on a full size KB with 4 fingers, I'd expect to be able to go almost twice as fast as I could with my 2 thumbs. With all the fingers on both hands available, I'm thinking at least 3-4 times as fast......I can't quite figure than 5-10%.

    Even the web is extremely usable with OperaMini and a multi-tasking OS.
    OK, let's say it's 7:40 pm on Monday, January 21st.....time how long it takes you to find out when is the next ferry leaving Port Jefferson on the Bridgeport Port Jefferson Ferry.

    Took me 21 seconds to start the stopwatch on my Treo, and then using my laptop (30 Mbps connection, 1900 x 1200 screen and full size KB), open browser, type in "Bridgeport Port Jefferson Ferry" in Yahoo, find the ferry web site, find the schedule link, scroll the page to find directions on what schedule to look at, and read the time of the next ferry.

    That same procedure used to take me about two minutes on a smart phone with the major difficulty being scrolling back and forth to find the schedule link, scrolling back and forth to find the what schedule to read .... but the biggest part is that the table comes in all jumbled and the column headings don't fit on the same screen as the times at the end of the day.

    I haven't looked at the site in a while on the Treo cause I just gave up. Perhaps by now they have done some formatting for mobile usage to make it easier. But that was my major frustration with the thing. Sites that are not optimized for mobile access can be just unbearable.

    So just curious, what time did ya come up with for the next ferry and how long did it take you ?
  12. #92  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    If an e-mail contact requires an answer of a few words, a voice call is my usual response. If it requires a lengthy response, I will usually respond via e-mail.
    Interesting - that's precisely counter to how I deal with things. If someone writes me for a quick 5 word response, I take the ten-thirty seconds needed to reply by email. Unless I just want an excuse to talk to someone, I'd rather not dial their number, wait for the connection, wait for the voicemail message, leave the voicemail, later on answer my phone for the return call thanking me (or send the call straight to voicemail because I'm still in that original meeting) to accept the person's acknowledgement of my response I left on voicemail...or I call them yet again as a follow up to make sure they got my original response (whew!). All that for a short reponse! I prefer: Open email, type 5 words, send (with acknowledgment marked), done.

    The "long response" communications are typically that way because there's more discussion needed so a phone call is definitely in order. Instead of finding an internet source, booting up, opening/downloading email (again - it's already on your phone), and composing a comprehensive answer, only to have the original sender write you back 10 minutes later with, "Sure, but what about the Miller account too?", I prefer to find out what the asker is really asking - and the context surrounding the question. From that point the appropriateness of voice or email communications can be ascertained.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    OK, let's say it's 7:40 pm on Monday, January 21st.....time how long it takes you to find out when is the next ferry leaving Port Jefferson on the Bridgeport Port Jefferson Ferry.
    It's Thu, 13 Mar, it took me ~40 seconds to take my Pearl from my pocket and display the schedule you describe here. It took me ~90 seconds using my MacBook (from standby, but not in my briefcase) with my Pearl as my reliable, constant, internet access source (~8 seconds to connect - measured speed 434kbps at the moment). I like the phone way better in that example.

    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    So just curious, what time did ya come up with for the next ferry and how long did it take you ?
    I guess 21 Jan used the holiday schedule, so the next ferry outbound from Port J after 7:40pm would be 8:00pm (although admittedly I could have overlooked one of the other 37 caveats in your example ). I used my laptop to find the time (took about 5 minutes of deciphering the various conditions). When I looked back at my Pearl, I saw how they have formatted the page for small screens, and it's actualy much easier to understand! Now that's funny - The Bridgeport and Jefferson Steamboat Company understands the preeminence of these little devices!

    SUMMARY: Faster to find on the phone, more information available on the laptop screen, easier to decipher on the phone. Counterintuitive, isn't it?
  13. #93  
    Well the reason I knock off the quickies by phone is I am usually driving....and typing while driving is likely to get me killed .... I prolly shudn't be even reading but when I get stuck at a light or traffic stops, I just look at who sent me and I call and say "Whaddya want ? .... I'm driving and I ain't gonna type you back". But yes, when I had hands available I also would do the quickies on the Treo. But most of my short stuff is:

    "Let's discuss Gaia Project"

    "what do you want to discuss ?"

    "How we handling 100 year flood issues, Env. Impact Statement, water budget, etc"

    "OK, if we do this by e-mails, it's gonan take 6 weeks, call me."

    I haven't looked at the site in at least a year..... I was always like "Hey dudes, ain't ya thinking peeps are in the interstate driving to you when they want this info ?" I even called them up a few times suggesting it. I will have to have my son try it on his iPhone. That shouldn't be too bad as you can see whole page and move right to links area on home page.

    The way it used to format the tables was horrendous.....columns didn't line up at all and there was no way to have column heading and time on same screen.
  14. #94  
    Quote Originally Posted by JackNaylorPE View Post
    Joe Rogan puts it best when he says "Who invented putting a walkie talkie in a cell phone ... couldn't fit any more useless technology in there like maybe smoke signals ? .... and people text me, what the ^%$#@% is that all about, I want to tell someone something, I will call them, I'm not gonna press a button 4 times to get an "S".

    Simply put, if I want my wife to bring home milk and bread, calling her is far easier than e-mailing her. I can do it while I am driving. In the year I got my Treo, in addition to running my own engineering business, I was President of the state professional engineering society and on the national legislative commitee. With 3,000 members and a steady stream of communication to do I found many "excuses" to use my Treo e-mail and web. I traveled at least weekly but the places I was traveling to are "in the civilized world".

    So when I would travel up to Albany or Washington DC to meet with legislators on various issues, I often found myself in offices and hotels with "time to kill" which I used stoically thumb typing out e-mail responses for 45 minutes or so during my down time. Then I started thinking.....hmmmm.....let me try it another way. I'd open up my laptop, walk over to the hotel business center or just cozy up to an unoccupied PC in whomever's office I was in and use a full size KB and screen and I'd finish that same amount of work in 20 minutes. That left me time to read the paper or maybe grab a beer at the hotel bar.

    Yeah I certainly do find occasion where the Treo is a better solution.....like when I have 10 minutes between flights after walking over to the connecting gate and I can knock off an e-mail or two by the time the laptop boots but those instances are very few and far between. I found it nice that I "could" do it if I needed to on the little bugger but over time I found it just more practical to use full size tools. So much so that I just canceled data service on the Treo as the last time I accessed my e-mail on it was October.

    That's all well and good if you have a laptop handy all the time. I do too for the most part, but I can still appreciate the need for email and text on a phone.

    Like when I DON'T have my laptop but still need to check and answer email or texts. There are times when I do not want to drag a laptop around.

    Also, not everyone can take calls all day. I'd rather text or email, than disturb people around me. I also hate hearing everyone's personal business, they need to just text!!
    HP has officially ruined it's own platform and kicked webOS loyalists and early TouchPad adopters to the curb. You think after you drop it like a hot potato and mention it made no money and is costing you money, anyone else wants it??? Way to go HP!!

    And some people are fools to keep believing their hype. HP has shown they will throw webOS under the bus and people are still having faith in them??? News flash: if it's own company won't stand behind it, it's finished!
  15. #95  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Phone Diva View Post
    That's all well and good if you have a laptop handy all the time. I do too for the most part, but I can still appreciate the need for email and text on a phone.
    I don't have a laptop always available but the hotels I stay in have a business center and all the offices I visit have PC's.

    Also, not everyone can take calls all day. I'd rather text or email, than disturb people around me. I also hate hearing everyone's personal business, they need to just text!!
    Peeps should be more careful when doing that. I just terminated a sub today. 2nd time he was playing with his crackberry under the table during a meeting. Damnit, when you're on my dime, I expect people's full attention.

    I don't use a phone when someone else is within earshot. I also turn it off, completely off, when with a business client. But again, I am not saying everyone's situation is the same as mine. I am saying people tend to "overuse" a new toy. Sometimes a little tool just won't do the job.....see image

    Ok trying again on image....
    Attached Images Attached Images
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